cragley
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Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Fri Dec 10, 2004 6:00 pm


Heya

I just did a timetable search on Sabre and cant find the HA service from HNL to SYD. Yet when I look on their website it shows. I was checking the timetable for February.

Anyone know?


 Smile/happy/getting dizzy
 
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Fri Dec 10, 2004 6:02 pm

Yes. HA still fly to SYD, using a B763
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Fri Dec 10, 2004 6:06 pm

HA operate four times weekly HNL-SYD
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cragley
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Fri Dec 10, 2004 6:34 pm


Does anyone know what their loads are like?
 
pualani
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Fri Dec 10, 2004 7:13 pm

Our loads are decent. My recent flights were full and I have to say that Aussies are really the nicest passengers I have dealt with in my 19 year career. Our CEO is hinting that we may apply for the rights to fly to a different city in Australia. The talk around the galley is that it will be to Melbourne. Hopefully that will mean we will be acquiring more aircraft and will be recalling all furloughed F/As .
 
ei2ksea
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Fri Dec 10, 2004 7:31 pm

It would be nice to have convenient 1 stop service to Cairns from many Western US cities for the Great Barrier Reef too!

Nice to see HA emerging from the gloom.

Regards
Ph
Next Flight: DUB-BOS (EI), BOS-DEN-PDX (SWA), SEA-BOS (AS)
 
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eta unknown
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Fri Dec 10, 2004 11:54 pm

Presently there are 4 SYD flights- possibility of a 5th being introduced. Some HNL-Mainland schedules re being tweaked to allow better SYD connections (the SYD flight continues to SEA). There is now less competition- sort of- on the SYD-HNL route with AC only operating 3 767 flights SYD-HNL-YVR (not that they really sold any SYD-HNL tickets anyway) as well as a daily A340 SYD-YVR (refuel via HNL southbound).

MEL-HNL might be a disaster... CO tried it years ago and the service quickly suspended. AC also tried MEL-HNL-YVR and I think that lasted 3 months.
 
jupiter2
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sat Dec 11, 2004 5:04 am

The AC 763 flight will be daily as soon as the 340 north bound flight becomes non-stop. In the mean time there are actually 10 AC services between SYD/HNL, 3 763's and 7 340's.
As a matter of interest the HA flight due to depart SYD on the 10/12 has been delayed overnight. It is now departing at 1030 local Saturday, a rare opportunity to get the beast in daylight.
RL
 
6thfreedom
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sat Dec 11, 2004 9:57 am

Eta unknown... PLEASE get your facts straight...

MEL-HNL will not be a disaster. In fact, it would be quite profitable. here are some FACTS.

AC operated to MEL from Nov 2001 until August 2002. The service did well with cargo (as Accargo will testify), and the reason for pulling the services were broader internal issues rather than pure route profitability.

I believe AC is also considering returning to MEL

The MEL-USA sector is capacity restricted, and would welcome additional capacity. HA is well positioned to serve 10 cities in the US with one stop in HNL.

Current MEL-USA services are 9pw QF non-stop, 7 pw UA via SYD both ways, NZ 5pw same plane to LAX.

MEL has a population of 5 million, comparable to SYD. Similar population to SYD, less competition. sounds like a recipe for profitability.

QF for many years operated a same flight number, change of aircraft service MEL-SYD-HNL. QF 003 from memory. Why add the same flight number if you aren't selling HNL in the MEL market. Sounds like amarket exists to me.

My suugestion to HA -
Get your skates on and enter the market.
 
jsmith
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sat Dec 11, 2004 7:58 pm

MEL has a population of 5 million? Yeah right.
 
cragley
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sat Dec 11, 2004 8:04 pm



Last time I checked melbourne had a population of just over 3 million people.
 
minmiester
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sat Dec 11, 2004 8:08 pm

MEL's population is closer to 3.7 million, compared to SYD's 4.2 million. However, both cities also have larger-still catchment areas. QF has had a long history of neglecting MEL, and the success of non-stop services from MEL where transiting SYD is not required has shown the ability for MEL to sustain services. You have to remember that MEL is Australia's manufacturing hub (whereas SYD dominates finances and IT) and many of Australia's largest companies maintain their HQs in Melbourne, so the business market is ripe too.

Cheers

MinMiester
 
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sun Dec 12, 2004 3:22 am

6th freedom- you're a little antsey, aren't you- you must live in MEL!

Do you not remember the CO MEL-HNL operation?
AC was a pax disaster- perhaps not a cargo one.

Oh yes: QF3 MEL-SYD-HNL... the MEL-SYD sector sometimes operated with London/Nagoya/Auckland destined aircraft- the flight number is just there for CRS promo display marketing.

MEL 5 million people?!? Are you including the catchment areas of Launceston/Hobart/Adelaide/FountainGate?!?
 
RichardJF
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sun Dec 12, 2004 7:12 am

The more Hawaiian develops HNL as a hub the better they will go. They should go daily to SYD. If they flew to New York and Toronto as well they would strengthen that sort of strategy. Australia to the US is a lucrative business for QF. In the longer term bigger aircraft with greater ETOPS such as the 773ER could allow it to become the major airline between Asia and Latin America. Sort of an Emirates of the Pacific.
 
ZKOJH
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sun Dec 12, 2004 7:27 am

y don't you start flying to AKL?? would be fun to c that one happen
Vietnam time..
 
minmiester
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sun Dec 12, 2004 7:34 am

"fun" does not always mean PROFITABLE, which should of course be the airline's second concern after the safety of its employees and customers. However, I'm sure something like a CHC-AKL-HNL route might be made to work...

Cheers

MinMiester
 
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sun Dec 12, 2004 8:06 am


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Glenn Stewart

Yep, they still fly to SYD  Smile
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6thfreedom
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sun Dec 12, 2004 8:10 am

apologies. what i meant was the state of victoria has hit 5 million people, compared to new south wales, which is just over 6 million...

From The Age:

Meet Victorian No. 5,000,000

By Lucy Beaumont
December 12, 2004

His 10 fingers and 10 toes may be the most important numbers to his parents, but baby Luke Paul Matison has dibs on another special number.


Born at 12.20am yesterday, he may well be our five millionth Victorian.


Blackburn couple Jane and Richard Matison welcomed their first child yesterday, who weighed in at three kilograms, a little earlier than expected.


"I went to the clinic on Friday morning and they decided to induce me because I had a bit of high blood pressure. It all happened really quickly," said Mrs Matison, 32.


With a population of 4,972,779 at June 30 and based on the state's growth rate, we were expected to tick over the 5 million mark yesterday, whether by birth or migration.


Victorians reached 4 million in number in 1982.


The milestone came six months earlier than predicted by the Australian Bureau of Statistics, fuelled by a state growth rate that has outpaced the national rate for the first time in four decades.


"Victoria's such a good place to live," said Mr Matison, 36, who, like his new son, was born at the Mercy Hospital for Women.


"There's the multicultural side, we like the cafes, we've got good friends here.


"I've always had good continuous work, so we're optimistic about that," he said. "We can't imagine moving anywhere else."
 
dutchjet
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sun Dec 12, 2004 8:14 am

Does anyone know if Hawaiian's HNL-SYD route to date is a financial success? A post above states that HA is considering adding another flight per week, which is a good sign, but the South Pacific is a very difficult market in which to make money. CO and AA each tried it and both airlines lost lots of money, NW couldn't make it work and had all kinds of problems, UA has cut back services to the region, and Aloha just announced that it is dropping most of its services to the South Pacific islands out of HNL. The distances are far and the yeilds can be poor - and operating a network in the south pacific tends to tie up a lot of airplanes due to the distances involved and scheduling flights to depart and arrive at logical times, so I am very curious if Hawaiian is showing a profit on its new SYD route - I certainly hope that they are.

A Honolulu-Melbourne route would be interesting - as pointed out, while Melbourne is a slightly smaller city than Sydney, it still has a large population and is the financial capital of Australia......however, I do not think that HA will take a chance with a nonstop flight and, instead, we may at some point see a HNL-SYD-MEL flight operating on a daily basis. As for HNL-AKL, the market it rather small and NZ dominates: NZ does a great job connecting the Pacific islands. I dont think HA will attempt this market but I could be wrong.

Does Hawaiian still fly from HNL to Tahiti?
 
minmiester
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sun Dec 12, 2004 1:47 pm

An option could be a continuation of the SYD service into MEL to see how that works, but it would produce a false impression of the market in MEL as Melbournians are loathe to transit SYD.

Cheers

MinMiester
 
accargo
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sun Dec 12, 2004 2:07 pm

AC operated to MEL from Nov 2001 until August 2002. The service did well with cargo (as Accargo will testify), and the reason for pulling the services were broader internal issues rather than pure route profitability.

AC's cargo loads out of MEL were great and expect us back there as soon as acft become available. Right now the focus is on maximizing yield with the acft we have. Latest rumour has 3 767-300's and 2 340's coming in 2005 from various sources plus the 2 767-200 being brought out of the desert. I've heard that they would like to start the YYZ-HNL-MEL run again perhaps for winter 2005/2006 (Cdn winter that is  Smile )

Do you not remember the CO MEL-HNL operation?
AC was a pax disaster- perhaps not a cargo one.


As I recall the AC loads were decent, not fantastic but acceptable, now with the lower cost structure after CCAA I imagine it would make for a profitable route all round (pax and cargo).


 
ha763
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sun Dec 12, 2004 5:50 pm

I would assume that the SYD route is profitable. I've known that studies have shown that more Australians would come to Hawaii but there has been little marketing and a limited amount of seats available. With HA flying the route, more seats are available and more Hawaii marketing is being done.

HA still flies to PPT. HNLPPT-leaves Saturday afternoon arrives Saturday night, PPTHNL-leaves Saturday night arrives early Sunday morning.
 
minmiester
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sun Dec 12, 2004 8:49 pm

Dutchjet

"while Melbourne is a slightly smaller city than Sydney, it still has a large population and is the financial capital of Australia"

If you were referring to what I had said, I said Melbourne is Australia's MANUFACTURING hub...Sydney is now the financial hub, although 2 of Australia's "big 4" banks maintain their world headquarters in Melbourne.

I'm not sure on this, but does the current AC flight into SYD originate from YVR or YYC? If it routes YVR-HNL-SYD, it would be interesting to see how a YYC-HNL-MEL routing would work...

Cheers

MinMiester
 
dutchjet
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Sun Dec 12, 2004 11:21 pm

"while Melbourne is a slightly smaller city than Sydney, it still has a large population and is the financial capital of Australia"

If you were referring to what I had said, I said Melbourne is Australia's MANUFACTURING hub...Sydney is now the financial hub, although 2 of Australia's "big 4" banks maintain their world headquarters in Melbourne.

-------

While I was not really directly referring to your post - I was referring to what many of my Australian friends say - "Meblourne is where money is made and deals are done in Australia" and "Melbourne works while Sydney plays." I love Australia and luckily have been able to visit many times and enjoy the (friendly) competition that seems to exist between Sydney and Melbourne. Both cities are magnificent (especially through the eyes of a visitor) but Melbourne happens to be my favorite.

I do understand that many in Melbourne try anything to avoid transiting SYD when travelling and there is probably the potential for more longhaul nonstop flights out of MEL......but, back to the topic, I am not sure that HA will take a chance with a nonstop HNL-MEL flight for the various reasons, mainly risk.


 
6thfreedom
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Mon Dec 13, 2004 7:17 am

Rather than operating MEL as a tag on HNL-SYD, one option for HA would be to move to daily services, and perhaps counter-rotate services.

3pw HNL-MEL-SYD-HNL
4pw HNL-SYD-MEL-HNL.

way to go!
 
rushed
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Mon Dec 13, 2004 7:08 pm

Bring on the international services direct from melbourne! Sydney airport is nice to visit, but if you are on your way to a long flight you dont want to have to go via syd. Plus the airport noise levy makes it more expensive too!
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eta unknown
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Tue Dec 14, 2004 3:49 am

MEL used to be the financial capital of Australia, but after a series of bank collapses in the late 80's/early 90's, many large companies relocated their headquarters to SYD. According to the Australian Bureau of Statistics, NSW's population stands at 6.7 million and Victoria's 4.9 million.

HA flights are doing OK, mainly because the US$ has dropped and Australians find travelling to the USA a less expensive option now. About 75% of HA's pax are SYD originating. Back in the heydey of SYD-HNL oversupply (AA, CO, NW, UA) the Aussie dollar was trading very low at about 55-60 cents on the USD... now it's about 75-78 cents.

With regards to the fares, HA business class SYD-HNL-LAX doesn't compare with QF/UA; however, the price reflects that- the cost is about $1500 cheaper.
 
flyinghighboy
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RE: Do HA Still Fly To SYD?

Tue Dec 14, 2004 8:09 am

how do the Y class fares to LAX compare to QF/UA now?