teahan
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Some Airbus A350 Bits & Pieces From Flight Intl.

Tue Dec 21, 2004 10:48 am

A few interesting articles on the A350 in this week’s Flight International. Key points:

- The A350 will be certified as a variant of the A330.
- Increased use of lightweight materials such as composites, aluminium lithium and titanium resulting in (minus the engines) an 8t empty weight reduction compared to the A330. Including the heavier engines and strengthened structure, there is still a “small improvement” compared to the present aircraft.
- A350 wing is “dimensionally similar” and almost entirely composite with carbon fibre used on certain areas.
- Aerodynamic reductions will generate a 1% reduction in cruise drag, A380 style “droop nose” instead of inboard slats leading to a 3% drag improved for take-off/landing.
- A second engine supplier, probably RR but possibly P&W.
- Design freeze by mid-2005.
- 50 orders by the Paris Air Show; leading candidates include Qatar Airways, Singapore Airlines and Northwest.

Specifications
-800 -900
Weights (t)
Max take-off 242 242
Max landing 182 189
Max zero fuel 170 177
Max fuel (litres) 139,100 139,100
Engine thrust (lb) 72,000 72,000
Performance
Range (km) 15,900 13,900
Pax (three-class) 245 285

Service entry H1 2010 H2 2010
List price ($m) 153.5 170.5

(Flight International 21/12/2004)

Jeremiah
Goodbye SR-LX MD-11 / 6th of March 1991 to the 31st of October 2004
 
BlueSky1976
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RE: Some Airbus A350 Bits & Pieces From Flight Intl.

Tue Dec 21, 2004 10:54 am

Northwest - very possible. Singapore - given their "always go for the most modern aircraft available" policy - not likely. They'll go for 7E7, but they will use A350 card to get the price waay down. If Boeing plays this one the right way, they'll have the order.
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dalecary
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RE: Some Airbus A350 Bits & Pieces From Flight Intl.

Tue Dec 21, 2004 11:15 am

9t heavier than the existing 330s to provide the extra range. Hard to see how a heavier beast can win at SQ against the much lighter 7E7 and at airlines like QF, where a large domestic 763 fleet needs to be replaced sooner or later.
Qatar very possible and ditto with NW. To me, it looks like Airbus has targetted their existing 330/340 customer base and gone for the long range model. Will be interested to see which way AC goes. To me, with a large 762/3 fleet to be replaced, the obvious choice is the 7E7.

Dale
 
0A340
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RE: Some Airbus A350 Bits & Pieces From Flight Intl.

Tue Dec 21, 2004 4:52 pm

To me the 350-8 and 350-9 are designed as follows:

A350-8: a 332 with a lot more range, more than the 346 and just a bit less than the 345 (up from 12,500 to 15,900Km vs 16,700Km for the 345!). All this with just 8t more weight, and same fuel capacity, an indication that this craft is more economic. Targets the 7E7-9 competition and the A332 segment.

A350-9: a 343 with more range (14,100Km vs 13,700Km for the 343), same fuselage length, thus same pax and cargo capacity. All this with 33t LESS weight, and a bit less fuel capacity. Targets not just the 343 but also the 772ER replacement market. The 4-engines-4-long-haul motto is kept only for the 388/346/345.

What is missing? a smaller/lighter craft to provide some competition for the 7E7-300 and the 7E7-800. These segments are not met by the two current versions of the A350.
 
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scbriml
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RE: Some Airbus A350 Bits & Pieces From Flight Intl.

Tue Dec 21, 2004 5:53 pm

9t heavier than the existing 330s to provide the extra range.

All this with just 8t more weight


Er, I suggest you both try reading that again!

Discounting engines, the A350 is over 8t lighter than the A330. Even with the much heavier engines, and associated strengthening, the A350 is just lighter than the A330.

What is missing? a smaller/lighter craft to provide some competition for the 7E7-300 and the 7E7-800. These segments are not met by the two current versions of the A350.

It's Airbus opinion, and has been publicly stated by airlines like EK and QR, that the 7E7 is just a shade too small. Thus the A350 is targeted at the top-end of the 7E7 and lower end of the 777 families. Airbus has also stated that it sees the need for a completely new short-range widebody to replace the A300/A310, and expects to launch this (they've called it the A305) by 2010.
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scbriml
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RE: Some Airbus A350 Bits & Pieces From Flight Intl.

Tue Dec 21, 2004 5:57 pm

Will be interested to see which way AC goes. To me, with a large 762/3 fleet to be replaced, the obvious choice is the 7E7.

I'm afraid I don't see what's so obvious about AC selecting the 7E7. With a large Airbus fleet, as long as the A350 meets their needs, I would have though it would stand just as much, if not better, chance as the 7E7.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!
There are 10 types of people in the World - those that understand binary and those that don't.
 
0A340
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RE: Some Airbus A350 Bits & Pieces From Flight Intl.

Tue Dec 21, 2004 7:19 pm

Which weights are we comparing?
MTOW
A330-200 233t
A330-300 233t
A350-800 242t
A350-900 242t
I've been reffering to MTOW, although I believe that we should have been comparing OEWs.
OEW
A330-200 121.5t
A330-300 124.3t
A350-800 119.2t
A350-900 122.3t





 
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scbriml
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RE: Some Airbus A350 Bits & Pieces From Flight Intl.

Tue Dec 21, 2004 7:45 pm

I've been reffering to MTOW, although I believe that we should have been comparing OEWs.

The original post did say empty weight!  Smile
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teahan
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RE: Some Airbus A350 Bits & Pieces From Flight Intl.

Wed Dec 22, 2004 2:23 am

One likely A350 customer not mentioned above is Aer Lingus.

A small piece on the aircraft by AFP:
http://www.air-cosmos.com/AFP/preview.asp?xml=041221163430.llmp6uqf.xml

Jeremiah
Goodbye SR-LX MD-11 / 6th of March 1991 to the 31st of October 2004

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