NYC777
Posts: 5065
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 3:00 am

1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 5:54 am

Opinions... With one day left to get to 200 7E7s will Boeing make it? If so who is next and for who many? Thanks!
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
 
BoeingDrew
Posts: 45
Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2004 12:43 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 6:04 am

Is 50 more all that is needed? What is the exact number of orders placed to date? I doubt they will make it but who know maybe we will have another surprise order like the CO one!  Big thumbs up

-Drew
You can't build a reputation upon what you are GOING to do, but rather upon what you HAVE done!
 
Korg747
Posts: 502
Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2003 5:18 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 6:05 am

I think boeing was depending on the chines order to be completed before year end. So I would say it's impossible now.
Please excuse my English!
 
NYC777
Posts: 5065
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 3:00 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 6:09 am

So far they have 122 so they're 78 away from it. the Chinese order could still happen. The ban is on any contracts where aircraft will be delivered in 2005 above and beyond those already approved. It doesn't effect 2006 deliveries and beyond or contracts that are presently in negotiation.
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
 
capri
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Sep 20, 2003 1:32 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 6:10 am

I was talking to a maintenance guy for RAM, and said that they are contemplating 7E7 as it fits their profile, B777 too big for them, B763ER too small, so the surprise order could come from RAM as they were talikng about an A330, and recently Morocco and USA signed a free trade agreement, you never know what's cooking?
 
DfwRevolution
Posts: 8548
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 7:31 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 6:13 am

I think boeing was depending on the chines order to be completed before year end. So I would say it's impossible now.

Yeah the China order was probably the critical mass Boeing was counting on to push the 200 threshold. In any event, the December orders and two blue-chip customers means that Boeing's claim that early delivery slots were going fast wasn't that inappropriate.

Boeing now has three very well-respected international carriers (ANA, JAL, CO), a small order from another respected airline (Air NZ), and three LCC/Charter carriers. Not a bad start IMO....

Is 50 more all that is needed?

I think it's more like 60-70
 
2H4
Posts: 7960
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 11:11 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 6:18 am


From the Associated Press:

There's not much of 2004 left, but officials at aerospace giant Boeing Co. said Thursday they weren't giving up on a goal of securing 200 orders for the planned new 7E7 jetliner by the end of the year.

"We haven't backed off from that goal," spokeswoman Susan Bradley said Thursday from the company's Seattle offices, where its commercial airplanes operation is based.


Full text at http://www.dfw.com/mld/dfw/business/10531878.htm?1c


2H4


Intentionally Left Blank
 
BoeingDrew
Posts: 45
Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2004 12:43 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 6:18 am

"Never say never"  Big grin

Seriously though, the Chinese weren't even planning on buying more than 50. That leaves 18 AFTER the Chinese order. If they were to get 200 they would need 2 orders (the Chinese and another one). Who knows what Boeing's got up their sleeve though.
You can't build a reputation upon what you are GOING to do, but rather upon what you HAVE done!
 
elcapi1980
Posts: 204
Joined: Tue Apr 06, 2004 12:31 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 6:22 am

I think that with the actual sales of the Boeing 7E7 they must be very happy, archeiving 60%(122 units)+ porcentage of sales compare to the objective which was 200(100%) planes in less than one year of a new product is very difficult, I must say, Congrats Boeing !!!!
I love you barranquilla!!!!!
 
Leskova
Posts: 5547
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 3:39 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 6:22 am

Was Boeing talking of 200 firm orders, or 200 LOIs resp. announcements?

If it's the latter, then they're at 122 - if it's the first, then they're at 56 (according to Boeing's release regarding CO's order), so they're either 78 or 144 short...

It'll be difficult, but not impossible.

Regards,
Frank
Smile - it confuses people!
 
NYC777
Posts: 5065
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 3:00 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 6:27 am

If it's the latter, then they're at 122 - if it's the first, then they're at 56 (according to Boeing's release regarding CO's order), so they're either 78 or 144 short...


That's immaterial as those MoUs (notably JAL, CO) will become firm orders within the next 3-4 months. To get this kind of interest less than a year after launching the development is still astounding.
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
 
DeltaGuy
Posts: 3965
Joined: Wed Sep 12, 2001 5:25 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 6:29 am

I think the CO order takes the cake for the surprise order of the year...Gordo sure did give em a good parting gift.

Only bigger shocker would be NW ordering some, and some 717's too Big grin

DeltaGuy
"The cockpit, what is it?" "It's the little room in the front of the plane where the pilot sits, but that's not importan
 
DfwRevolution
Posts: 8548
Joined: Sat Jan 09, 2010 7:31 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 6:31 am

Seriously though, the Chinese weren't even planning on buying more than 50

The original China order was to be split over several airlines totaling 70+ plus options. If China is still going to squeeze their order in on December 31, I doubt it will be on the scale they planned in August, but who knows...

Who knows what Boeing's got up their sleeve though.

Indeed.... I heard the first wiff of a JAL order about 12 hours before Boeing announced it, and heard nothing of an impending CO order. The Boeing sales team can obviously keep a secret if they so chose  Big grin

Was Boeing talking of 200 firm orders, or 200 LOIs resp. announcements?

I think they said orders, but in all their written press statements they have said "commitments." They further define commitments as firm orders + announced LOI.
 
Popfly
Posts: 38
Joined: Thu Dec 30, 2004 3:01 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 7:55 am

"Only bigger shocker would be NW ordering some, and some 717's too."

Say DeltaGuy, I like that rumor. Where'd you get that info?
 
Rj111
Posts: 3007
Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 9:02 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 8:29 am

In my disgustingly cynical opinion, i present the reason the announcements have been so unexpected other the last few days....

"Oh Mr JL, pretty pretty please announce your commitment to the 7e7 before new year, you were never going to buy an Airbus anyway and it'll save us from public embarrassment and plummeting share prices, we'll make it worth your while."

"Oh Mr CO, pretty pretty please announce your commitment to the 7e7 before new year, you were never going to buy an Airbus anyway and it'll save us from public embarrassment and plummeting share prices, we'll make it worth your while."

So who else fits the criteria AA, DL, they could 'order' tomorrow I guess.

I cannot deny they have done well with the number of orders they have currently though.

[Edited 2004-12-31 00:32:51]
 
BlueSky1976
Posts: 1605
Joined: Tue Jul 20, 2004 9:18 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 8:33 am

Well, if SQ or Chinese carriers have made up their mind and went ahead with order, we'll hear about it in a few hours as it is early morning there right now. If somehow, someway KLM and Northwest decided to go for the join order and Delta and American somehow, someway found some ca$h to buy them, it might still happen. Right now it's a 50/50 chance. If we will not hear about a big Asian order in next 6 to 12 hours, then it will not happen and Boeing will say bye-bye to whoever came up with that imho stupid PR stunt.
POLAND IS UNDER DICTATORSHIP. PLEASE SUPPORT COMMITTEE FOR DEFENSE OF DEMOCRACY, K.O.D.
 
BR715-A1-30
Posts: 6525
Joined: Thu May 30, 2002 9:30 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 8:45 am

I hear Northwest will DEFINETELY not order the 717... Reason is this...

The DC9 is usually flown by the older guys... 40-50 yrs. When these guys retire, so does their bird... The new guys are being trained on the Airbus, so that when the older guys retire, and the 9s retire, the new guys will then be the Older guys flying their A320s, ETC... More like a process of elimination... The new guys on the new planes, when they retire, their birds retire as well.. The captain of Flt. 967 on 7/17/04 I believe retired when 9152 was retired (He had to have been pushing 60)
Puhdiddle
 
MEA-707
Posts: 3661
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 1999 4:51 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 8:50 am

I guess Airbus spoilt the party for Boeing by throwing in the A-350 quite unexpectedly. Some airlines which were likely to be an early customer for the 7E7, like KLM/NW and Singapore for instance, have waited and are now comparing the A-350 specifications and performance.
nobody has ever died from hard work, but why take the risk?
 
RCS763AV
Posts: 3645
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2004 1:22 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 11:39 am

Vietnam just ordered 4 7E7-8!

Here´s the topic:

http://www.airliners.net/discussions/general_aviation/read.main/1884133/
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 12:14 pm

Pretty old news. That order was already announced.

N
 
AvObserver
Posts: 2392
Joined: Sat Apr 06, 2002 7:40 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 12:17 pm

"If we will not hear about a big Asian order in next 6 to 12 hours, then it will not happen and Boeing will say bye-bye to whoever came up with that imho stupid PR stunt."

HIGHLY unlikely they'll meet the goal of even 200 provisional committments, never mind the firm orders the sales and marketing yahoos predicted, in the next day. However, I don't think any of those guys will be sacked because of it. The A350 was indeed an unexpected wild card thrown into the foray that has muddied the waters and slowed 7E7 potentials from signing on by the hoped for target date. That doesn't mean BCA has lost many of these sales, just that it won't gain them as quickly as it had hoped because they must first take the prudent step of evaluating a previously unanticipated competitor. Setting that goal may have been a stupid PR stunt but that's what sales and marketing guys do. It's not really their fault the A350 showed up. What 7E7 committments they have already are quite impressive and it should not be too long into the new year before they do hit that number in both firm and MOUs, the latter of which should firm up within a few months. No big deal they couldn't meet that admittedly rather unrealistic goal.




 
antares
Posts: 1367
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2004 4:49 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 1:10 pm

Its 3.10 pm on the last day of the year on (nearly) the roof of Australia.

Antares Airways stands ready to order 90 7E7s today if Boeing will PAY $40 K non-refundable per production slot. The cash can be deposited at the Beechworth branch of the Commonwealth Bank.

 
RCS763AV
Posts: 3645
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2004 1:22 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 1:27 pm

Antares Airways???????????????????
 
PVG
Posts: 460
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 7:39 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 1:50 pm

Maybe they put the 200 order out there to force Airbus's panicked hand so that they know what they're up against instead of having to wait. There's alot more that goes into the decision for a publicly listed company making that kind of announcement. They either have/had the orders and/or are playing a cat & mouse game with their competitor to draw them out.
 
greaser
Posts: 1040
Joined: Wed Jan 14, 2004 5:55 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:13 pm

Antares Airways???????????????????
It's Sarcastic, there's no such airline...  Yeah sure

Maybe they put the 200 order out there to force Airbus's panicked hand so that they know what they're up against instead of having to wait

It was more of a case of regaining some credibility in the PR department after someone* blurted out 200 orders. It was not impossible, but the SQ order set them back from the start and along with the absence of a Chinese Order. Basically, the bet the house and lost 1/3 of it... However if they did pull it off, it would have been a fantastic blow to the A350 program...

I guess Airbus spoilt the party for Boeing by throwing in the A-350 quite unexpectedly. Some airlines which were likely to be an early customer for the 7E7, like KLM/NW and Singapore for instance, have waited and are now comparing the A-350 specifications and performance.

Boeing did realise that Airbus will counter the 7E7, but they only didn't know exactly when. So, Boeing set out to gain as many orders as soon as possible before any murmurs on the A350 at Airbus began. They are still in discussions with dozens of airlines, and before the deals were closed Airbus jumped out of the box proclaiming the A350...So a whole new dimension was added to the foray...

Now you're really flying
 
CRPilot
Posts: 298
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 8:37 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:20 pm

"Maybe they put the 200 order out there to force Airbus's panicked hand so that they know what they're up against instead of having to wait"

Unlikely, Boeing has more to benefit from discretion. It's pretty obvious the effect that the announcement of the A350 had on the numbers. The 200 mark was used as a promotion tool or PR based on the projections the Boeing team did, which I believe included China in the equation.
Flying is a privilege!
 
User avatar
HAWK21M
Posts: 29867
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2001 10:05 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:22 pm

Very Unlikely.
You think the Deadline might be Extended.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
atmx2000
Posts: 4301
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 4:24 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:32 pm

It's a goal, not a deadline. Boeing won't turn into a pumpkin at 12am CST, Jan 1st, 2005 if they haven't gotten 200 commitments.
ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
 
BlueSky1976
Posts: 1605
Joined: Tue Jul 20, 2004 9:18 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:45 pm

Look at it this way: during one year from the launch Boeing gathered over 120 firm orders for 7E7. It is still two years before the first flight. SQ order is GUARANTEED to happen, since they have the policy of going after "latest, greatest" product. There will be a Chinese order sometime within next two years. And when US carriers get their act together, watch out for a HUGE order from DL and AA. Those 767s won't be flying forever and they won't replace them with 737-900X (if that project even still exists)!! Add Continental to the mix - something tells me that eventually they'll end up with more than 10 frames...

Realistically, I'm guestimating somewhere between 300 and 400 frames on firm order at the time of the rollout...
POLAND IS UNDER DICTATORSHIP. PLEASE SUPPORT COMMITTEE FOR DEFENSE OF DEMOCRACY, K.O.D.
 
PVG
Posts: 460
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 7:39 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:47 pm

They've done it before when they wanted to collaborate on a large plane a few years ago and then decided to back out after they saw what AB had in mind. Again, a publicly traded company has to be very careful with information that they make public. I don't think that the legal department at Boeing would let that kind of announcement get through without proper vetting, especially with all of the other legal problems that Boeing has had this past year.

With regard to discretion. Do you really think that Airbus didn't know who Boeing was/is talking to and that there was/is a real possibility of this happening? Why do you think that they made such a quick decision to go ahead with the A350? They knew that it was a real possibility that Boeing was going to wipe the cream off their business (A330 being their cash cow) and that they had to make a move. Who commits 5 billion dollars like that for no reason? Don't you think that they would have preferred to wait until the got the A380 off the ground and delivered before having to worry about their next project and marketing campaign? They may not get exact details from every buyer, but you can bet that many airlines call the Airbus guy the second that the Boeing guy leaves and vice versa with a semi-BS story of what a great deal their competitor has offered and that they need to match or beat it to get the biz. I can assure you that the Chinese, Singaporeans, and Taiwanese operate this way. Are any of you guys in business? Have you ever negotiated a multi-million dollar contract? I don't know about you, but I know almost everything that my competitors are up-to. How else can you run a proper business and marketing operation and plan out your production and future investments? You need to know what your customers want, what your competitor is offering, and how you can beat them to the punch! There are only two competitors in this game and they know who the customers are and more or less what they want. Now, what is your main competitor doing about that?
 
CRPilot
Posts: 298
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 8:37 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 2:55 pm

"You think the Deadline might be Extended?"

I believe Boeing released a statement saying that they were confident that they would meet the goal in the first quarter if they were not able to meet it by the 31st. It was in a forum, you may want to check the data base.


Flying is a privilege!
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 3:12 pm

SQ order is GUARANTEED to happen, since they have the policy of going after "latest, greatest" product.

SQ announced they were done considering it in several publications, and that they "couldn't make the numbers work".

Surprises the hell out of me, you'd think the 7E7-3 would be perfect for many of their operations.

Then again, they also confused everyone with their order for 777s as regional aircraft.

N
 
JoFMO
Posts: 1840
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:55 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 3:24 pm

If international negotiations have a fixed deadline but they can't find a solution in the given time, they halt the clock at before midnight.

How long will boeing hold the clock?
 
antares
Posts: 1367
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2004 4:49 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 3:43 pm

Dear PVG,

Its a pleasure to read your posts.

Good fortune in both New Years.

Antares
 
atmx2000
Posts: 4301
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 4:24 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 3:57 pm

Given that the SQ has plenty of choices in the 200-300 pax market, and given that there is a long time to go before the aircraft enter the market, maybe they will hold off to see what market conditions are like in their neck of the woods. Or at least they will do so until they think delivery slots they might want will be gone.
ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
 
DeltaWings
Posts: 1234
Joined: Fri Aug 13, 2004 4:06 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 4:07 pm

I was talking to a maintenance guy for RAM, and said that they are contemplating 7E7 as it fits their profile, B777 too big for them, B763ER too small,

Sound like the perfect size for the 7e7-9, since the 7e7-8 is more or less the same size as the 763.

DeltaWings
Homer: Marge, it takes two to lie. One to lie and one to listen.
 
PRGLY
Posts: 387
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 5:55 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 4:43 pm

I did not read Boeing statement, but may be chinese lunar year was mentioned?????
just fly - it is nice
 
soaringadi
Posts: 452
Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2004 4:56 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 5:11 pm

***"With one day left to get to 200 7E7s will Boeing make it?"***

If they just have to make it... I'll order 70 of them today and then cancel it on 2nd. jan.  Smile
If it ain't Boeing, I'm not going !
 
BN747
Posts: 5344
Joined: Thu Mar 28, 2002 5:48 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Fri Dec 31, 2004 6:59 pm

I'm surprised no one mentioned this yet...

http://www.atwonline.com/indexfull.cfm?newsid=4854

JAL picks 7E7 to replace 767s and A300s

Dateline:  Thursday December 23, 2004 
   
In a significant morale boost for Boeing, Japan Airlines placed an order for 30 7E7s to be delivered from 2008.
JAL ordered both the long-range dash 8 model and the short/medium-range dash 3 variant and will use the aircraft to replace its fleet of 58 767s and A300s. The 7E7-3s will be configured to seat 300 and the 7E7-9s with 250 seats. The carrier also took options on 20 aircraft. Engine choice has yet to be made.....


BN747
"Home of the Brave, made by the Slaves..Land of the Free, if you look like me.." T. Jefferson
 
Thrust
Posts: 2584
Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2003 12:17 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Sat Jan 01, 2005 2:04 am

I'd have to say even if Boeing is unable to make the 200 goal they had planned, they should be proud of what they accomplished. Nearing the end of the year, they had an outbreak of 7E7 orders. To get an order from their first U.S. carrier is a significant achievement. More than likely, now that CO has ordered them, I would expect AA to possibly place their first orders sometime later this year, and NW to begin accelerating their decision making process between the 7E7 and A350. 122 orders is not too bad. Not bad at all.
Fly one thing; Fly it well
 
Newark777
Posts: 8284
Joined: Thu Dec 02, 2004 6:23 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Sat Jan 01, 2005 2:12 am

I'd have to say even if Boeing is unable to make the 200 goal they had planned, they should be proud of what they accomplished

I have to agree to that. The 7E7 project is heading in the right direction, and Boeing is in good shape for the coming year. Just because they didn't reach 200 orders doesn't mean the year was a failure, they just have more to sell next year.  Big thumbs up

Happy New Year!
Harry
Why grab a Heine when you can grab a Busch?
 
zvezda
Posts: 8891
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 8:48 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Sat Jan 01, 2005 2:14 am

Boeing is not desperate to meet this goal of 200 by year-end because the consequences are insignficant. Therefore Boeing will not offer better pricing on the condition that the sale be announced this year. The Chinese may, for this own reasons, want to announce an order before the end of the year.

I don't doubt that SQ will place an order within the next year. SQ needs this airplane, but they are posturing for a better deal.
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
Joined: Fri Nov 08, 2002 10:25 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Sat Jan 01, 2005 2:27 am

In a significant morale boost for Boeing, Japan Airlines placed an order for 30 7E7s to be delivered from 2008.
JAL ordered both the long-range dash 8 model and the short/medium-range dash 3 variant and will use the aircraft to replace its fleet of 58 767s and A300s. The 7E7-3s will be configured to seat 300 and the 7E7-9s with 250 seats. The carrier also took options on 20 aircraft. Engine choice has yet to be made.....


That snippet makes no sense. First it talks about ordering -8s and -3s, but then talks about how the -9s will be configured.  Smile/happy/getting dizzy

250 seats in a 7E7-8 is a lot for a comfortable intercontinental plane.

N
 
Hamlet69
Posts: 2460
Joined: Thu Mar 09, 2000 2:45 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Sat Jan 01, 2005 3:17 am

"250 seats in a 7E7-8 is a lot for a comfortable intercontinental plane."

Depends on if it is 3-class or not. I would imagine that JL will configure the -8's with a business/economy layout, similar to their current 763ERs (30c/207y).

Regards,

Hamlet69
Honor the warriors, not the war.
 
backfire
Posts: 3467
Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2006 8:01 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Sat Jan 01, 2005 5:52 am

Boeing 7E7 Deadliner... Big grin
 
AAplatnumflier
Posts: 958
Joined: Wed Sep 15, 2004 1:40 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Sat Jan 01, 2005 5:55 am

Let me tell ya they may not make that number but their stock is up 30%!!
 
jsnww81
Posts: 2294
Joined: Mon Jan 28, 2002 3:29 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Sat Jan 01, 2005 6:31 am

I was initially very skeptical about the 7E7 program (certainly more so than the A350), but it does seem like Boeing has secured enough orders to get the program well on its feet.

It'll be interesting to see if the Continental order might prod some other US carriers to grudgingly order a few frames - most of them can't afford it, but with international routes taking center stage, it might behoove them to get their hands on some "latest and greatest" material. That's a discussion for another thread though.

They didn't quite meet the 200 mark, but I'm definitely feeling much more bullish on the 7E7's prospects now. I'm eager to see a few more carriers into jump into the fray. After all, the 737 and 757 order books started out pretty empty too.
 
Boeing7E7
Posts: 5512
Joined: Sat Jul 31, 2004 9:35 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Sat Jan 01, 2005 8:15 am

Of course, an announcement just before midnight Chicago time would be a hell of a way to kick of the new year at a certain Boeing party. Watch that stock price rocket on day one of trading.
 
Planesmart
Posts: 1716
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 3:18 am

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Sat Jan 01, 2005 8:54 am

Define firm orders in 2005?

When B was the dominant manufacturer, an order, even for a paper plane, mean't serious dollars changed hands. The dollars were non-transferrable & non-deferrable (although this did happen from time to time, especially when it suited the manufacturer) and non-refundable.

Airlines could take options - small dollars, transferrable, deferrable and refundable.

In 2004, orders have seemed more like options used to be.

Five tests for all these A & B paper plane orders:

1. The next tranche / payment probably falls due within the next 12mths. This should appear as a current liability in the airlines financials. Further payments will appear as term / long-term liabilities. Details should be available in notes.

2. Non-US based airlines will have foreign exchange contracts and/or swaps for the exchange risk. Maturities of these will give a good idea of payment timings / certainty of orders. Check published financials notes.

3. All airlines will have taken out interest rate swaps and/or secured funding well before taking delivery. Another way to confirm certainty of orders. Check published financials notes.

4. All airlines placing firm orders will reveal contingent liabilities for the value of the order less deposits paid, and these will appear in their financials.

5. If you are a shareholder, attend an AGM, and ask a question. What models & engines, irrevocable orders or options, etc.
 
antares
Posts: 1367
Joined: Fri Jun 18, 2004 4:49 pm

RE: 1 Day Left For 200 7E7s, Will They Make It?

Sat Jan 01, 2005 2:22 pm

Full marks to Boeing for its efforts to market the 7E7 in adverse industry circumstances.

Less than full marks for not delivering on the hype on the big windows, flying-work-of-art and sky lights, although we do get the humidified air provided everyone drinks and sweats enough to make this a reality in conditions of higher pressurisation within the cabin.

Exclamation marks are in order for firm orders of only 56, out of the 100 or more production slots that have been booked.

Much more is needed before any sane board of directors would press the go-into-prolduction button, a view I also hold for the current order book for the A380.

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: a320fan, aircountry, Baidu [Spider], Brit312, dk44, eidvm, Google [Bot], hunter58, kaitak744, klwright69, mwalker89, olle, qf789, ryanrap1, shamrock350, skipness1E, SonOfABeech, StTim, tvh, washingtonflyer, zkanz and 335 guests