gkirk
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Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 8:59 am

http://www.rte.ie/news/2005/0102/ryanair.html

FFS, They could have least shown some humanity, despite it being against their policy?
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
jasepl
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 9:02 am

Sometimes low cost = low class.

Still, we don't know the whole story and €1,100 to do LON-DUB seems a bit much on any carrier. How big was his family anyway?
 
godbless
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 9:04 am

The day will come when FR will realize that they are not alone on the market of LCC and people will always choose any other option, alone for the fact that Ryanair will treat them like cattle, not only so inside the plane, while others add humanity to their service.

Max
 
gkirk
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 9:08 am

Sorry, to b fair, dont know much about it, only read about it on Pprune. Perhaps the topic is misleading, I dunno.
Pe@rson, care to comment?
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
Pe@rson
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 9:08 am

"You can change your booking online up to 12 hours prior to scheduled departure. Between 12 and 3 hours prior to your scheduled departure you can change your booking by contacting your local Ryanair reservations centre, subject to call centre opening hours."

Evidently this family did not comply with the clearly stated rules, so were not entitled to change the flight times or anything else. FR could, of course, have used its discretion, but that would result in other people saying 'Oh, but you did it for them...' What would FR have received if it allowed these people to fly without them purcashing new tickets? Nothing - it would not have even been in the newspapers. It think it is important to differenciate between business and giving unnecessary hand-outs. If, of course, FR was to offer a financial donation to help rebuild areas or for food and drink or whatever, then that would be different: it would get the publicity.
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
aloges
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 9:17 am

reason #962 to boycott Ryanair if in any way possible
Don't cry because it's over, smile because it happened.
 
gkirk
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 9:20 am

The way I see it:
The family were returning home late from a natural disaster hit area. Ryanair acted unfairly.
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
hiflyer
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 9:44 am

welcome to lcc and no service....everyone is voting with their wallet...and full service flying is a dinosaur.....do NOT expect full service rule bending on a LCC...
 
RayPettit
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 9:50 am

Its not because they are a LCC.

Its because they are Ryanair.
 
BAxMAN
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 9:53 am

Ryanair acted with the rules, no doubt about it; and the passengers failed to utilise the online options available to them whilst they escaped from an incredible disaster area. Obviously, this is not FR's fault and, as far they are concerned, the pax are booked LGW-DUB. Anything else is irrelevant.

But have all FR's employees at LGW had their hearts removed? At times like this, no rightminded individual or company would resort to this kind of behaviour.
I need to get laid
 
Seamus
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 10:08 am

"Policy is no substitute for good judgement".

 
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mariner
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 10:42 am

You're all so ready to criticize Ryanair, why not take a trip over to "site-related" here on a.net and read a locked thread entitled: "deleting tsunami threads".

Judge for yourselves. But I wouldn't be so quick to condemn Ryanair until you're sure your own house is in order.

cheers

mariner
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QuestAir
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 10:43 am

No window shades, no reclining seats, no safety card... now this?
'Do we carry rich people on our flights? Yes, I flew on one this morning and I�m very rich.' - Michael O'Leary
 
PacificWestern
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 1:18 pm

And why is anyone surprised this happened with Ryanair???
 
N754PR
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 2:23 pm

Add me to the list of those that will never fly Ryanair. Not because of this but all the other stupid things the airline is doing.... not to mention their boss being a total $%@*%#.
Bush, your a sad, sad man.
 
Bronko
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 2:47 pm

Mariner is correct. I made my point before it was locked fortunately.
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lincoln
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 2:50 pm

You know, I won't comment on Ryanair, but something doesn't make sense to me here:

A Dublin family which survived the tsunami disaster has criticized Ryanair after it was charged more than 1,100 to fly home from London last Thursday.

The Murtagh family said two other airlines did not charge extra when flying them home early from Thailand


So were they flying Ryanair or "two other airlines"? Or were they doing a "Do-it-yourself interline" where Ryanair had no knowledge of their true point of origination? (Which seems to happen relatively frequently state side with WN).

If it was the DIY Interline -- at least applying US airline thoughts to the situation -- there was no reason for Ryanair to reaccommodate the family because as far as Ryanair knows they are local London-Dublin pax and not Thailand-London-Dublin pax and the Tsunami, in therory, had nothing to do with them. It would be like me going to WN for LAX-MDW and trying to change my reservation because I had just flown in from Thiland on (insert carrier here)...WN has little way to validate my story.

Had I, on the other hand, purchased a ticket on a single (non LCC) carrier (or at least purchased something that was truly an interline ticket) Thiland-LAX-MDW (or whatever) I would expect the carrier to understand and accomodate me.

Basically if you try to beat the system and you get s****ed....

The other part of the story that doesn't make sense is if they came home early and what's stated in reply #4, why didn't they just call Ryanair res and change their booking?

Maybe its just the UK way of doing things that I don't understand...

Lincoln
[And no, I don't think 1,100 local currency units is unreasonable as a walkup fare for a "family", even on an LCC -- assuming 4 people that's only 275/pax]
CO Is My Airline of Choice || Baggage Claim is an airline's last chance to disappoint a customer || Next flts in profile
 
usa4624
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 2:55 pm

The wording of this news blurb is very vague, and there are not enough details for me to make a devision. Did the family return to the UK, then decide to take a trip? Were they enroute to the UK from Thailand?
 
bullpitt
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 4:29 pm

I Bet when he booked originaly he was so proud about how smart he was and how much money he saved.

You get what you pay for nothing more nothing less.

Sometimes LCC can be very expensive.
These are my principles but if you don't like them I have others
 
ZKSUJ
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 5:12 pm

Well at least they survived. And Ryanair in this case were sticking to company policy. From the article, FR sounds like the bad guy, but in reality I can't say as I have not heard the other side of the story (yes a story usually has 2 sides to it  Big grin )
 
trident2e
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 5:53 pm

I'm no fan of Ryanair, but I really can't see what all the fuss is about. If you read the RTE article it clearly states that the person concerned has said if Ryanair refund the money he will double it and donate it to charity. Clearly then the money is not the issue and this is just a publicity stunt. If he can afford to donate 2200 Euros to charity what the heck is he doing flying on Ryanair!
 
777ER
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 6:40 pm

GKirk

Please don't tell me that your surprised at FRs attitude.
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GuyBetsy1
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 6:48 pm

Surviving a disaster does not automatically make one become a VIP and all airlines should make all sorts of amendments just to accomodate them. It is up to the descretion of each airline and some will say yay and some will say nay.
 
L410Turbolet
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 6:51 pm

I had a sort of similar experience with Swiss. It cost me no money, but a little bit of compassion and understanding from their staff would help a lot and saved some 36 hours of travel.
Here's the story:
August 2002, I'm flying back from India (DEL-ZRH-TXL) with Swiss. At that time the bad floods were at its worst, the border between Germany and Czech Rep. with the exception of one crossing completely shut down, Dresden area under water completely, no train service, only local residents were allowed in the area. Here I am arriving to ZRH early i the morning wondering how am I going to get from Berlin home (400km), because there's no way someone can come over pick me up, renting a car makes no sense either, trains, buses are impossible. So I went to the Swiss desk, explaining the lady my unusual situation and asking whether it would be possible to put me on a (half-empty) Swiss flight to PRG instead of TXL, which would help me tremendously and the only reason I'm asking about it is because of the floods. She said it's "impossible" and offered me a 450 CHF one-way ticket to PRG. I was nearly broke after my travels so it did no good to me being offered the ticket roughly as expensive as rt TXL-DEL. After spending over 24 hrs in Berlin I managed to get on a Eurolines bus, which was the only service at that time and after big detour of the flooded areas get home a day and half later.
I know that rules are rules, but sometimes a bit of understanding from the airlines' staff, particularly in times of trouble would help.
 
737-990
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 6:56 pm

While not coming to the defense of Ryanair, this is a very poorly written article. No specifics or details are provided for nor an attempt made to get a comment from Ryanair. Before everyone jumps the gun more information should be provided. For example, how may people were traveling? All it said was his family, so how are we to judge if 1,100 Euros was a fare charge? It could have been 11 people for all we know, in which case 100 Euros per person would not have been bad.

Working at the front line at the airport you unfortunately become very skeptical as people will say anything to avoid paying change fees or excess baggage weights. You'd be surprised how often people will flat out lie just to save a few bucks.
Happiest is a man who has his vocation as a hobby
 
jorge1812
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 6:59 pm

@Trident2e
I totally agree with you, that's what I thought first.

Another point is:
Were should FR draw a line for changing tickets without charging due to personal circumstances. Very often people have to travel earlier or later because of accidents, diseases, death of friends or something else. When it's raining very heavy and the streets are flooded and Ii won't make it to the airport in time, it's nearly the same like you have to change travel plans because of a nature catastrophe.

Think about the real victims of the Tsunami and don't act like "I survived and lost all my luggage where is the interviewer and where can I get something for free?"

Bye, Georg.
 
BestWestern
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 7:07 pm

Guys, are any of us really that surprised by this... With Ryanair you get what you pay for. 90% of the time Ryanair travel is OK, but with the 1-10% of the times when something goes wrong with either you or your travels you are screwed.

Ryanair is a successful airline and their rules are rigid. Take it or leave it, but dont go moaning afterwards.

Personally, I leave it. I prefer to pay more to fly on an airline that cares, but I'm lucky I can afford that.
You are 100 times more likely to catch a cold on a flight than an average person!
 
teva
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 7:15 pm

Lincoln, unfortunately (or luckily, for such a long flt) FR doesn't fly to Thailand.
However, 275 Eur is bloody expensive for such a short flt, especially when it comes in addition to what you have already paid. (Last year, Aer Lingus charged me around 75 Eur for the same trip....
Pearson, as you say, FR could have used its discretion (and common sense).
But in what you say, there is a contradiction. You say there would have been no publicity, then no reason for FR to do it. That is just cynical and disgusting, but not surprising frm the MOL gang.
In the same time, you say " but that would result in other people saying 'Oh, but you did it for them..."
So , do they know, or not?

Teva
Ecoute les orgues, Elles jouent pour toi...C'est le requiem pour un con
 
trident2e
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 7:49 pm

737-990: 1,100 Euros was definitely a fare charge, but might not have been a fair charge!
 
NumberTwelve
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 7:50 pm

@Pearson: Rule number 5 means: we want to earn money,
rule number 6 means: no humanity, no heart.

German train company Deutsche Bahn has N O T H I N G to do with the disaster, no business partners, nothing! But they changed their rules for cheap tickets too, when a conductor sees a passenger ticket from that area, the super saver tickets are valid for each train (customer must come from that area and his ticket is valid then).

It has something to do with humanity, maybe FR should add a rule for that word?
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BestWestern
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 8:54 pm

Ryanair dont care. Simple. Dont ever expect anything more from Ryanair.
You are 100 times more likely to catch a cold on a flight than an average person!
 
Pe@rson
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 9:07 pm

Businesses exist to make profit. They are not there for the sheer fun of it. Accordingly, why should FR - or any other firm, for that matter - assist when they would get nothing in return, except the potential gratitude of a few people? They should not.

HOWEVER, I am a big believer in SUPPORTING or SPONSORING a worthwhile cause, which would have two consequences: 1) the charity would receive extra money and be widely publicised; 2) the firm would receive extra publicity and would be seen as being kind and caring. That is WORTHWHILE.

A business 'with a heart and with humanity' will only be in its interest if it is publicised.

It's odd, actually: I am a kind, caring, sweet person in my personal life, but when it comes to business things I am ruthless and have my priorities, like them or not, in place. It's the same for 2 of my uncles - they're chief executives of large multinational firms but their 'business minds' are completely different than their 'personal minds.'

I am to establish a small, part-time business (it will be operational from September), which should generate, all being well, around 10,000 GBP or slightly more in 1 year for less than 100 hours' work.

To illustrate my point about supporting a worthwhile cause, I will shortly begin negociations with a student-based charity, which is called Back To Mine, and I will, when I get up and running, support them by giving a certain amount of the income of the total seats sold on evenings arranged by the charity to them (I will be providing the transport). So they win and so do I.

On all my leaflets, I will put 'EzyPull supports Back To Mine' (catchy, eh?) and they will put my business name on their advertisements and so forth. So for a small amount of money, I will get lots of extra publicity while being seen as being kind and caring.

Now that is worthwhile - it will be very cheap but effective and the financial assistance will genuinely help.

And then there's the tacky, but extremely important, publicity stunt: I will be photographed with the charity's boss, a fellow student, and present him with a cheque. This, along with commentry from both of us, will appear in the university newspaper plus on his charity's and my business's websites.

[Edited 2005-01-04 13:36:16]
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
777ER
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 9:12 pm

Ryanair dont care. Simple. Dont ever expect anything more from Ryanair. Wow, and thats coming from an Irish.
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UK_Dispatcher
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 9:33 pm

Don't forget that FR do not have a presence at LGW. They use Servisair as a full handling agent. If Servisair had done anything outside of the rules, FR would have spotted it and Servisair would have been on the recieving end. Maybe they were just fulfilling their obligation to Ryanair...

As others have said, if you are going to attempt a D.I.Y un-published connection, you have to be prepared to be screwed if it doesn't work out. I've seen it at MAN several times with passengers flying in on a scheduled flight, hoping to connect to a charter or lo-co flight. When that first flight goes wrong, you are stuffed.
 
BestWestern
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 10:07 pm

Ryanair think of only one thing profit. What ever drives profit is the only thing on FR's radar. Anything that gets in the way of profit is ruthlessly eliminated, be it staff, inconvenienced customers, politicians, airports, etc.

Just like Pearson's example above, Ryanair will only give to charity when the benefits of that charity giving outweigh the actual cost of the donation.

Again, when everything works - ryanair is great, but if anything goes wrong, Ryanair doesnt care less - on your back be it.


You are 100 times more likely to catch a cold on a flight than an average person!
 
olympicbis
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Tue Jan 04, 2005 11:55 pm

Why finally write and talk so much about Ryanai in an Airline - related forum ? Has Ryanair to be considered as an airline ??????
 
EZYcrew
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 12:15 am

Wouldn't their travel insurance cover the cost of returning home after a disaster anyway? Or maybe they didn't have insurance....

That's also a problem when you're travelling on separate tickets. To bring the cost down, this family obviously bought LON-HKT/BKK-LON tickets, and purchased DUB-LON-DUB tickets separately with FR. The airlines involved in the ticket to/from Asia are more or less obliged to accomodate its customers affected by the tsunamis. Ryanair is not. Sure it's not very nice of them, but what if someone walks up to your desk at LGW and claims that he's a tsunami survivor and therefore requests free tickets/penalty waiver to DUB? Again, if they have insurance, then it's not up to FR to cover their costs.
 
BestWestern
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 12:44 am

Travel Insurance doesnt cover acts of God.

Travel insurance is void for any country that is on the government no visit list. Indonesia from the UK, for example.

You are 100 times more likely to catch a cold on a flight than an average person!
 
Pe@rson
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 12:49 am

"Has Ryanair to be considered as an airline ??????"

The definition of a scheduled airline is, according to Dictionary.com, ‘A system for scheduled air transport of passengers and freight.’ Ryanair, which flies both (in terms of freight, it only carries luggage and, on STN-KIR, coffins - but nothing else), thus fulfils the requirement of a scheduled airline and consequently is very much an airline. However, what it does not do - thank God - is conform to the silly, pretentious nonsense of being an old-fashioned carrier which flies only the rich and privileged.

[Edited 2005-01-04 16:50:50]
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
EZYcrew
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 1:00 am

In case of natural disasters, Travel Insurance does cover Assistance and Cancellation costs. Assistance includes repatriation. (have just checked Switz. biggest Travel ins. website http://www.elvia.ch)
 
NumberTwelve
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 1:01 am

Ok, guys, FR is not forced to help people.

Why didn't they cancell the old flights,
why didn't they make reservation for new flights in time?
Why didn't they send message to FR and fill out a form for rebooking?

WHY DID THEY BOOK CRAP INSTEAD OF AIRLINES WHO HELP WITHOUT BIG BUREAUCRACY AND WITH HEART FOR STRANDED PEOPLE?
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Seattle Ops
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 1:22 am

Seamus couldn't have said it better. They cancelled my flight from STN to PIK and inconvenienced me and a friend, but would they let us stand by for an earlier flight back, noooooo. They can inconvenience, but they cant be inconvenienced by customers
 
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mariner
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 1:30 am

I see a lot of people are still jumping to "bash Ryanair" conclusions - without knowing all the facts.

All the article says is that the family "survived the tsunami". It doesn't say if they were on one of the affected islands, and in harm's way. For all we know, they could have been staying at the Bangkok Hilton.

Thousands upon thousands of westerners were in Thailland and "survived the tsunami."

All those folk on vacation at Pataya, gosh, they had a couple of days of overcast weather, should they get free air fares home, too?

cheers

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
Shamrock_747
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 1:55 am

It looks like Ryanair did nothing wrong and were simply following the rules.

Despite the fact I don't like FR and have no intentions of flying on them I don't see why they should act like a charity. Some other airlines may kindly waive fees but they are most certainly not obliged to.
 
jmc757
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 3:22 am

Ryanair acted within their policies, fair enough. But surely a bit of compassion here? I agree they are there to make a profit, but helping these people out wouldn't have sent the share price crashing down. I don't neccesarily agree that Ryanair should have flown them for free, but EURO 1,100 for 3 people LGW-DUB is absolutely disgusting. Even more so considering the circumstances. Remember these people had paid for a Ryanair flight, albeit at a later date, so couldnt Ryanair just have charged some sort of admin fee and transferred them.
 
olympicbis
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 3:31 am

"...what it does not do - thank God - is conform to the silly, pretentious nonsense of being an old-fashioned carrier which flies only the rich and privileged"

Nowadays, you do not have to be rich or privileged anymore to fly on REAL airlines. If you would book reasonably in advance even through their web sites, you have a VERY good chance to get a fare which will not be so much higher than RYANAIR's. I went recently from Brussels to Rome for € 88 return on SN. It is far from being an old-fashioned carrier and at least, I know that whatever happens, they will take care of me. Did not have to depart fom the middle of nowhere or land in the middle of nowhere. Got a fantastic inflight service. I have nothing against LCCs, even fly Virgin Express several times a year. To me, Ryanair through its policy is not even an LCC anymore, more like a " sub LCC" . At least O' Leary can boast that he has invented something, which probably and unfortunately won't moderate his arrogance.....
 
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mariner
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 3:56 am

Jmc757:

"Even more so considering the circumstances,"

Considering what circumstances? All we know from the article is that "they survived the tsunami".

Yeh, so did I - but then I was in California. And it is not unusual for people to try and con an airline in situations like this.

Do you have more information? Were they in harm's way? Why do you condemn Ryaniar - or any airline - until you know the whole story?

Maybe you do know the whole story - in which case, share it with us.

cheers

mariner
aeternum nauta
 
ltbewr
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 4:05 am

Probably with the structure of Ryanair, as well as many other airlines, there is the fear, to use a popular USA saying, "If you give them an inch, they will take a mile". It isn't uncommon in the USA for people to try for a 'greivence/funeral' fare just to get a cheaper rate, but are stopped by some of the conditions required.
There should have been some flexibility here of course if indeed they had been personally affected by the Tsunami disaster and could prove it. I would also suggest that maybe the flights they wanted to take were fully booked up and people would have to be bumped for days on end.
 
VSCaptain
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 4:11 am

strike me of the list to fly Ryanair again.
AP321 - Oxford Aviation Academy
 
jmc757
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RE: Ryanair: No Care Over Tsunami Disaster Family

Wed Jan 05, 2005 4:18 am

Mariner, I do not know the full story, no one here does, whichever side people are arguing on. What we know is that these people were on holiday in the area affected by the Tsunami. They were affected to the extent that it was neccesary to cut their holiday short. Whether this was their descision or they were forced nobody knows. I understand that Ryanair are not a charity, and don't fly people around for free. My point is that Ryanair sold them tickets for the flight they wanted at an extortianate price. The least Ryanair could have done was transfer their tickets for an admin charge.

Ltbewr, the flights the family wanted were not fully booked, because Ryanair sold them tickets for EURO 1100.