aa757first
Posts: 3140
Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2003 11:40 am

Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 3:24 am

How often do these happen? How is it possible with all of the procedures taken to prevent these accidents, such as cross-checking, always checking the status of the door before opening it, the red armed strap and automatically disarming doors on many aircraft? What happens to flight attendants or ground crew members if they deploy a slide?

Thanks,
AAndrew
 
NWAFA
Posts: 1843
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 10:30 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 3:26 am

Not all carriers have the red armed strapped. We don't at Northwest and we actually have one of the lowest slide deployments in the industry. Southwest has the lowest and from 2003 stats American had the highest.

I have been on a crew where one of the FAs blew a slide. Actually my best friend blew on late 2003. There were many factors that happend...He is still employed with NWA.
THANK YOU FOR FLYING NORTHWEST AIRLINES, WE TRULY APPRECIATE YOUR BUSINESS!
 
SATL382G
Posts: 2679
Joined: Sat Aug 14, 2004 12:02 am

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 3:36 am

An AF1 steward blew the slide at L1 a few years ago. My guys had to adjust stairs and meeters/greeters to L2, cameras flashing. Clinton was amused.

We felt bad for the steward. Bad enough to screw up, but to screw up and have it on the front page the next day......

Wish I had the pictures....
"There’s nothing quite as exhilarating as being shot at and missed" --Winston Churchill
 
N405MX
Posts: 1156
Joined: Sat May 01, 2004 1:46 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 3:37 am

Depends on several factors, but like many other things, you get used to your work and pay less attention to minor details, time ago a flight attendant almost blew me a slide when she oppened the door, without checking that the slide was disarmed, fortunately the captain ask for the cross check before she oppened the door.
Life is what happens when you have other plans.....
 
aa757first
Posts: 3140
Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2003 11:40 am

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 3:38 am

Not all carriers have the red armed strapped.

I noticed that. Why would you not have one? They can't be that expensive.

Southwest has the lowest and from 2003 stats American had the highest.
Where could I find these statistics?

Thanks,
AAndrew
 
NWAFA
Posts: 1843
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 10:30 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 3:42 am

AAndrew,

Not sure if they are posted anywhere. I get them through our Flight Attendant Union (which I am very involved in). Each carrier when a slide is blown is required to report that to the FAA.

As far as the red strap, I go back and forth on the idea. If a Flight Attendant is truly "focused" then they are not needed. At NWA we don't crack the door for the agents like other carriers do...all of our aircraft, with the exception of the DC9's will disarm when opened from the outside.
THANK YOU FOR FLYING NORTHWEST AIRLINES, WE TRULY APPRECIATE YOUR BUSINESS!
 
USrampleadSTL
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 1:04 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 3:44 am

We (rampers) had to watch a safety video "Stop. Look. Disarm." Our Airbus and Embraer 170 aircraft have doors that automatically disarm when you open them from the outside, but the 737s in the fleet have to be disarmed from the inside. There's a red flag in the window if it's unsafe to open the door. There's also a safety bar that prevents the door from being opened at all until the FA disarms it. Complicated stuff; I like the Airbus way better--don't worry about disarming it from the outside, and it's just one single pull from the inside to disarm.
02C14MARPHLFCOMM1 - FLY THE FLAG!
 
luisca
Posts: 1530
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2001 11:37 am

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 3:47 am

In Copa Airlines I dont know the stats, but all doors have the red straps and it is tthe captains responsability to request a crosscheck before the doors are opened, and he does it in the PA and the lead FA confirms back over the PA, so I dont think it is very easy to forget to disarm before oppening
If it ain't Boeing (or Embraer ;-)) I ain't Going!
 
NWAFA
Posts: 1843
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 10:30 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 3:50 am

I hate hearing all that over the PA..it just is so unprofessional. Drives me nuts on HP, F9 and WN when I hear it. Pick up the interphone and do over the line and not the PA.
THANK YOU FOR FLYING NORTHWEST AIRLINES, WE TRULY APPRECIATE YOUR BUSINESS!
 
Airbus_A340
Posts: 1439
Joined: Sat Mar 11, 2000 8:41 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 4:03 am

"Pick up the interphone and do over the line and not the PA."
What if you're on a 747, call all 12 doors? When they say it over the PA I don't think pax really mind, they probably think "oh that sounds important"
People. They make an airline. www.cathaypacific.com
 
NWAFA
Posts: 1843
Joined: Wed Dec 31, 2003 10:30 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 4:05 am

NWA does it over the interphone even on the 744s'! it is a quieter more professional environment. The Purser does the "all call". Starts with the aircraft left, starting at door 1 down the back then it crosses over to a/c right starting at door 5 working the way up to the front ending with the Upper Deck doors.

Trust me the elite passengers know when the improper announcement is made!

[Edited 2005-01-17 20:11:10]
THANK YOU FOR FLYING NORTHWEST AIRLINES, WE TRULY APPRECIATE YOUR BUSINESS!
 
LongbowPilot
Posts: 526
Joined: Mon Jan 17, 2005 4:16 am

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 4:08 am

I was working the Gate one day and was meeting a MD-88 and the F/A forgot to disarm the door. She gave me the thumbs up and I opened the door. "THUD!" I about passed out. Thankfully I positioned the jetway right and it didn't fall far enough to cause it to deploy. Lets just say it was a Significant Emotional Event.

THere was a time in ATLANTA when a Cabin Service crew opened the rear door of a 777 and poof. It about toppled the cabin service truck over too... Thankfully all they had to do was replace the 100,000 dollar slide.

Chris
 
aa757first
Posts: 3140
Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2003 11:40 am

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 4:17 am

, but all doors have the red straps and it is tthe captains responsability to request a crosscheck
Doesn't the lead flight attendant usually do this?

I hate hearing all that over the PA.
Haha, look at my signature. They always do it over the PA a US Airways.

AAndrew

[Edited 2005-01-17 20:36:58]
 
Midway2AirTran
Posts: 847
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2003 7:34 am

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 4:49 am

Had one accidently deployed at a station I worked at on a terminating aircraft. The door was left armed and a station agent opened it carelessly w/o observing it, deploying the slide. He kept his job, though got fired later for "other reasons" shortly afterward. Not sure if the FA crew was disiplined in anyway, but probably so.

That night the airline had to charter an aircraft for the mx crew to get there with a new slide so the a/c would be ready for the fully booked originator at 6am.
"Life is short, but your delay in ATL is not."
 
242
Posts: 495
Joined: Tue Oct 24, 2000 1:10 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 7:32 am

THere was a time in ATLANTA when a Cabin Service crew opened the rear door of a 777 and poof. It about toppled the cabin service truck over too... Thankfully all they had to do was replace the 100,000 dollar slide.


When was this? The 777 doors will automaticly disarm the slides when opened from the outside.

 
PyroGX41487
Posts: 246
Joined: Sun Oct 31, 2004 3:06 am

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 7:48 am

Trust me the elite passengers know when the improper announcement is made!

Elite passengers should just get over themelves and freaking deal with it unless they'd rather flap their arms to get to their bloody destination.


There's no problem with pilots announcing this over the PA. What kind of idiot makes a fuss over the pilots talking to their crew? Theres alot more of a chance that the FAs will hear.


 
USrampleadSTL
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 1:04 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 8:08 am

Oh, in additional answer to the original question, a ramper that deploys the slide will probably at least be suspended; if it's in the probationary period, terminated. Accidentally deployed slides are real nightmares. Not sure about discipline for FAs.
02C14MARPHLFCOMM1 - FLY THE FLAG!
 
petazulu
Posts: 683
Joined: Fri Jan 31, 2003 3:32 am

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 8:08 am

NWAFA,
I wonder how you get through your day with so much bitterness towards LCC's. Your 'unprofessional' suggestion is ridiculous at its very core. You disregard any non LCC that makes this announcement, and you back up your feeling with absolutely zero fact. I have never in all my life heard anyone say anything at all about that announcement either in the positive or negative sense! It's funny that you have put so much thought into this! ha ha.
 
USrampleadSTL
Posts: 96
Joined: Tue Jan 11, 2005 1:04 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 9:14 am

We at US have the annoucement over the PA, and I have to agree with NWAFA - it sounds unprofessional. Passengers don't need to hear that the doors are disarmed, especially when all they hear is "one l one r." I was on a 757 between PIT and PHL where the FA said "Four L" but then couldn't get out "Four R" without tripping on the two R sounds in a row. Besides, Petazulu, this isn't a statement that demands factual backing, it's pure opinion. But I think it's worth something coming from someone who would actually have to announce the disarming.

I personally would feel kind of silly saying code like that over the PA.
02C14MARPHLFCOMM1 - FLY THE FLAG!
 
lincoln
Posts: 3133
Joined: Mon Nov 01, 2004 11:22 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 9:52 am

Out of curiosity, what is the financial/time impact when a slide gets blown?

(How long is an A/C out of service [if at all], how much does a slide cost, etc.)

Also, when a slide gets blown is it replaced or just deflated, rolled back up and a new canister (or what ever actually does the "blowing") put in?

Sorry for the questions -- thanlfully, I have little first-hand knowledge of anything related to a slide.

Lincoln
CO Is My Airline of Choice || Baggage Claim is an airline's last chance to disappoint a customer || Next flts in profile
 
xaphan
Posts: 90
Joined: Wed Apr 02, 2003 11:09 am

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 10:35 am

In 1970, I was working for DL in ORD in operations. At the time we had no gates that could handle our 3 747-132 roundtrips a day. Two went to MIA and the last one, at 2100 went to ATL to spot equipment. DL had an arrangement with AA to ground handle our widebodies, using their adjacent gates in K concourse. At about 1930, our last inbound MIA-ORD flight landed and pulled into either K 7 or K 9. It was set to depart to ATL at 2100, and was being crammed with all leftover cargo to make up for the light pax load the flight usually had. Sometime during the loading, a new FA decided to open the door on the upper deck lounge for reasons surpassing understanding, since that door was NEVER opened. The slide deployed (a VERY LONG ONE), and the longest night of my professional life began.
DL did not have a spare chute in stock. AA needed their gate back asap since they had a bank of flights coming in, and DL had no gse equip to deal with the monster. I was assured by our STM that there was NO WAY we would ever have to work the behemoth. AA dragged the 747 over to our gate area and dropped it off, thereby shutting down 2 of our 5 gates in H concourse. We borrowed one loader from TWA and four LD 3 transporters from someone else. The reworking of that flight, flight control had decided to send it NS to MIA as a ferry, resembled a Rubic's Cube. Individual LD 3's were unloaded from the aircraft, unloaded with ATL cargo and reloaded with MIA cargo, then reinserted in the holds as others were shuffled out one at a time. By 0500 we were finished, when some Son of Darkness in flight control decided to send it instead to DTW! It went, loaded to the gills with MIA cargo.
Remember the "little engine that could?" We had the medium size jet tug that almost didn't. Finally it rolled down the runway and rotated at dawn. My crew stood watching, waving and gesturing as it headed to Motown with a fresh set of nightmares for them. If I could have found a liquor kit, I think I would have been more than tempted.
 
travatl
Posts: 1943
Joined: Sat Mar 03, 2001 4:57 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Tue Jan 18, 2005 10:45 am

I like hearing something from flight attendants that implies there's more than pointing at exits and serving cokes.

Travis
 
aa757first
Posts: 3140
Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2003 11:40 am

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Wed Jan 19, 2005 11:28 am

Out of curiosity, what is the financial/time impact when a slide gets blown?

(How long is an A/C out of service [if at all], how much does a slide cost, etc.)

Also, when a slide gets blown is it replaced or just deflated, rolled back up and a new canister (or what ever actually does the "blowing") put in?

Sorry for the questions -- thanlfully, I have little first-hand knowledge of anything related to a slide.


If the aircraft is in a hub or maintenance base, as little as an hour. Slides cost at least $8,000 and go up to about $27,000. Slides must be replaced after inflated.

AAndrew
 
lincoln
Posts: 3133
Joined: Mon Nov 01, 2004 11:22 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Wed Jan 19, 2005 11:55 am

Thanks AAndrew, so really, then, slides are not that expensive (not something I'd want to go blowing on a daily basis but not quite as shocking as the $100K that I saw thrown out earlier)

I'm assuming slide cost is directly proportional to aircraft size/height off the ground (and thus, length of the slide)?

And, assuming you were at a MX base it's conceiveable that aside from a (short-ish) "MX delay" the outbound pax would never be affected?

Really, it's not too bad, then... (Again, I wouldn't want to spend the $$$ replacing one, nor, from the sound of it would I want to be in the path of one)

Thanks,

Lincoln
CO Is My Airline of Choice || Baggage Claim is an airline's last chance to disappoint a customer || Next flts in profile
 
aa757first
Posts: 3140
Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2003 11:40 am

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Wed Jan 19, 2005 12:58 pm

Pretty much, Lincon. But remember:

- Try blowing a slide in PTY or AUA or SXM or another place like that and your in trouble, since A) you have an aircraft scheduled to fly trips the next day stuck in at an airport, B) you have to re-accommodate passenger ["We're sorry, your flight attendant just broke the airplane"] and C) you have to somehow figure out how to get the replacement slide down their.
- 28k to airline like US right now is a hell of a lot of money.
- How embarrassing! Can you imagine a flight attendant deploy a slide. You see a slide inflate, which you know isn't supposed to happen. The flight attendant is probably crying/cursing. Ground crew is yelling at the flight attendants because they could have just died. Other flight attendants are laughing/upbraiding at the flight attendant that just made that mistake. Ect.

AAndrew
 
User avatar
Crosswind
Posts: 2536
Joined: Sat Nov 25, 2000 4:34 am

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Wed Jan 19, 2005 1:44 pm

A slide being blown accidentally is a pain

If it happens downroute with little prospect of getting a new slide and an engineer to fit it in a reasonable time, the flight can return to base with the relevant exit "inop"

The MEL provides for such a situation - for example on the B757-200 the maximum passenger load is 165, the fact that the exit is inoperative must be mentioned in the safety demonstration, and passengers should be seated away from the inoperative exit as far as possible.

So you can often get situations where 50+ passengers have to be found alternative flights - where this will prove very difficult the decision is often to make the whole flight wait until the new slide arrives.

Once a slide has been blown it can be re-used. It must be returned for maintenance, repairs if required, testing and re-packing - the slide can then be released back into service.

The standard procedure for any flying staff who deploy a slide is suspension from duties pending investigation, and usually refresher training on door procedures in the cabin trainer.

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © José Ramón Valero - Iberian Spotters
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Peter de Groot



MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © Ringo Chui
MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © Ringo Chui


As the database shows, it isn't that uncommon - for most airlines it will happen several times over the course of a year.
Regards
CROSSWIND
 
MD11Engineer
Posts: 13916
Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2003 5:25 am

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:04 pm

Replacing a slide package can take as little as 30 minutes (for an A320 or 737) up to 2 hours (MD-11 freighter 1R door, with a galley in the way and just a basic slide package in stock without quick change container. The MD package weighs about 70-80 kgs and the space at door 1R is very limited, only enough for one person. Youl have to remove the slide shroud, no problem, just two quick release fasteners and some velcro tape, then disconnect the wire of the remote pressure indication (one plug), put in the safety pin, remove the girt bar from it´s fixtures on the door and then after pulling two pins, lift out the slide package with it´s container. If the new slide comes already pre-assembled, strapped to the aluminium container, changing it doesn´t take much time, but we had to remove it from the container and strap the new one in place, including moving the girt bar from the old one to the new one. Strapping and assembling the new unit is like packing a parachute, and you´ve got to be carefull that you do it correctly, else the slide won´t deploy in an emergency.)

Jan

[Edited 2005-01-19 06:05:08]
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
User avatar
HAWK21M
Posts: 29867
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2001 10:05 pm

RE: Accidental Slide Deployments

Wed Jan 19, 2005 2:54 pm

Its Important to concentrate & Check the Position of the Slides [Arm/disarm] prior to opening the door.
Even during Mx,while replacing an Escape slide Mechanism,the Lock to the Nitrogen Cylinder is in place to prevent accidental tension on the lanyard activating the Slide.
There was an occasion when one of our B737 slides arrived from a Foreign vendor through Customs & We got a call that the Inquesitive Customs guys accidentally deployed the slide,When it started to deploy the people had ran away so quickly that the Area on the Customs floor was empty in seconds.It was a sight we did not get to notice,which Im sure would be amusing.

However we had to get to the location to deflate the Slide & ensure its repacked for shipping back.

regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: airtechy, caaardiff, flydia, GianiDC, Google [Bot], Google Adsense [Bot], LazarosK, legacyins, LFW, MAH4546, mildaiv, panair, Yahoo [Bot] and 331 guests