bowen0614
Posts: 131
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 3:39 pm

New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 8:50 am

i have just heard a news saying that there is a new hong kong based low cost carrier which is called "oasis hong kong airlines". the focus of this carrier is long haul including hong kong to europe and north america. in the early stage, they will lease 3 boeing 747-400 or airbus a340-300. they will not provide any in-flight entertainment and meal to the customers. the customers have to pay for their meal. the price range will between hkd$4000 - hkd$5000 to europe from hong kong. they think that they can launch their first flight in november 2004.

how do you guys think about that?

bowen chau

[Edited 2005-02-03 00:52:14]
 
Stratofish
Posts: 1033
Joined: Mon Sep 24, 2001 6:38 am

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 8:56 am

Well, I found nothing on google about that airline.

" they think that they can launch their first flight in november 2004."

They failed.  Big grin

Btw, no IFE on long-haul? No chance with my business!
The Metro might be the Sub(optimal)way
 
bowen0614
Posts: 131
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 3:39 pm

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 8:59 am

Opps, sorry for a typo, it should be november 2005
 
Carfield
Posts: 2027
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2003 5:49 pm

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 8:59 am

You must be kidding me. That concept does not seem to work and how cheap does it need to me? No entertainment... you have to pay for meals... we are no longer talking a two hours hop to BKK or three hours flight to Singapore... we are talking about fourteen hours long flight and you have to pay for meals. Logistically, how much food you are doing to load? Will you make money and you can't recycle food on this length of light especially hot meals have to be provided? About entertainment, I don't think most Asian passengers can accept that. Backpacking folks will be interested in this, but not that many in Asia... especially if CX or other European airlines launch a similar campaign. They will be crushed within months.

That is not viable at this stage.

But we will see...

Carfield
 
bowen0614
Posts: 131
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 3:39 pm

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 9:02 am

Carfield,

i am totally agree with you.
for me, i will not travel with oasis hong kong airlines if they don't provide any meal and IFE. i really think that LCC is not a good idea for long-haul routes.

just my 2 cents.

bowen chau
 
brightcedars
Posts: 751
Joined: Wed Nov 10, 2004 6:18 pm

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 9:35 am

Sounds like that usual Canadian scam website that appears with a different shape and different news once in a while. Don't take it seriously.
I want the European Union flag on airliners.net!
 
xwizard
Posts: 91
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2004 10:05 pm

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 10:31 am

I seriously doubt this is anything to do with the "usual Canadian scam website" (whatever that means) as the story is the lead article on the front page of this morning's Business Post (the business section of Hong Kong's South China Morning Post - a highly reputable newspaper, if that's not an oxymoron!).

It would appear to have pretty sound backing - investors are cited in the US and locally, and its proposed Chief Executive is Steve Miller, who is reported as having being in charge of Hong Kong's No. 2 airline Dragonair before it was taken over by CX.

The article also notes that unlike a "normal" LCC they are targeting travel agencies and tour operators, which is a big sector ex-HKG, and they are looking at destinations such as London (Stansted), Berlin, Vienna, along with other cities in Switzerland, Italy and Central Europe.

The article notes that the pricing has been set to be comparable to airlines such as EK and GF, which offer lower "sixth-freedom" fares through the middle east, but with a change of plane.

There's no mention of a lack of IFE or food in this article - but it is a business newspaper after all.

An interesting development in this part of the world where the LCC have been late in coming...
 
Lufthansa
Posts: 2303
Joined: Thu May 20, 1999 6:04 am

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 10:48 am

Guys Guys Guys Guys

the LCC concept doesn't work well with long haul (and I mean real long haul, non of this 4 or 5 hr british charter airlines type thing).

Why? Simple. The economics of the whole operation change. LCC works well because it enables a very high level of aircraft utilisation. When you examin the actual costs involved in long haul, cutting out things such as meals etc doesn't do much to improve your overall Cost per ASM. Things such as fuel burn of your aircraft, the cost of capital (and hence what you pay for the use of that aircraft on that flight) and labor are the real concerns.

If you dont believe me, why does SIA have such a reasonable seat mile costs and offer such outstanding service? It's due to the fact most of there flying is min of 7hr flights, with a great deal a lot longer than that. Hong Kong to Europe is going to be at least 12 hrs...... spending another $50 per passenger to pamper them isn't going to do much to their seat mile costs (think about it...$50/ 10 000km = 0.005.... there for 1 ASM is increased by half a cent!!!!!...... but what is going to be the effect on revenue by everybody knowing you've got shit service for really long legs?)
 
malaysia
Posts: 2615
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 1999 3:26 am

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 11:43 am

Yes this will do HKG-NRT-IAD more likely over Oasis

There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
 
bowen0614
Posts: 131
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2001 3:39 pm

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 1:23 pm

Well, I don't think that is so called "usual Canadian scam website" since this article is posted on MingPao, one of the major newspaper in Hong Kong. So, I really think that's a real move.

However, I don't think LCC can work on long haul, believe me~
 
agmyvr
Posts: 136
Joined: Thu Sep 27, 2001 8:45 am

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 3:41 pm

hm....it's really interesting to have LCC long-haul carrier in HKG, another FIRST from HKG...

If this LCC can carry cargo as well will it help?

WestJet in Canada does carry cargo
 
alexchao
Posts: 665
Joined: Fri Aug 24, 2001 12:35 pm

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:51 pm

Wow. I just saw the news report from a Taiwanese source.

Initial planned destinations include Germany, France, England, Switzerland, Italy, and the U.S. (specifically California).

There was no mention about food and entertainment. However, if this airline is several hundred U.S. dollars cheaper than its competition, I would invest in a nice iPod and lots of packaged food.

Will the airline be in an all-Economy configuration? Wouldn't the extra weight from the passengers decrease the range?
 
Leskova
Posts: 5547
Joined: Wed Oct 08, 2003 3:39 pm

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:58 pm

HKD4000 to 5000? Would that be for a oneway or for a return? Because HKD4000 is, with the current exchange rate, around EUR390, HKD5000 is around EUR490: with a return fare, they'd indeed be at the low end of fares, but if those were oneways, that would put them at EUR780: there are rather few times a year when it's not possible to get a fare at, or below, that level on CX, BA, AF, TG, SQ, LH, CI or anyone else who flies there...

So, at least if those are oneway-fares, I really don't see them having much success...

No IFE? I know it's important for many, I, myself, couldn't care less - and I'm hardly the "backpacking folks" type. But I do see quite a bit of a problem in the pay-for-meals-concept on routes of this length.

Regards,
Frank
Smile - it confuses people!
 
Spike
Posts: 1110
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 1:08 am

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 5:05 pm

The guy that would be running Oasis - Mr. Steve Miller, hasn't been involved in running an airline for almost 20 years. Wonder why he has decided to jump in with a world first (long-haul LCC) from one of the most expensive and competative markets in Asia (HK)? I would have thought that he would base it in Macau and focus on India or somewhere. Stange.
 
xwizard
Posts: 91
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2004 10:05 pm

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:19 pm

One of the reasons cited for starting up now after such a long gap is the growing liberalisation of air travel here in HKG - its still got a long, long way to go, but the start has been made.

Whilst MFM is currently grabbing a lot of attention this, along with the growing threat from other airports in the Pearl River Delta (CAN, SZX) appears to have given the management of HKG airport a bit of nudge to start seriously trying to attract some of the LCCs to HKG - the most recent being Jetstar Asia (3K).

An LCC operating into India might seem like a great idea, but rights are currently heavily restricted with the major players very keen on getting their hands on any additional slots that may or may not become available.

The lack of IFE shouldn't be a problem - major carriers like LH survive pretty well without it (despite the constant moaning about the lack of it from some a.net regulars). Food might be a different matter, but I'm sure they thought about that.

 
malaysia
Posts: 2615
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 1999 3:26 am

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Thu Feb 03, 2005 10:25 pm

what if someone overbuys and someone in back wanted to buy a meal!!! oh man no more meals left for 14 hours aaaah!
There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
 
Avianca
Posts: 5270
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Fri Feb 04, 2005 4:10 am

why not, they would be not the first not serving meals at Long Houl flights.

For example Air Madrid, now way for including meals (including only in business class)

Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
PHX Flyer
Posts: 534
Joined: Tue Apr 17, 2001 9:52 pm

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Fri Feb 04, 2005 5:50 am

<< Guys Guys Guys Guys

the LCC concept doesn't work well with long haul >>

Well, I am curious how many airlines you have successfully launched in your professional life? The guy behind Oasis did at least one before, so I certainly trust his expertise more than yours. H
Here's an official news report from a reputable agency on the project:


Associated Press
Reports: New Airline Planned for Hong Kong
02.02.2005, 11:54 PM

A former executive at Hong Kong's Dragonair plans to launch a new budget airline that will fly long-haul routes rather than the short hops preferred by other discount carriers, local media reported Thursday.

The new carrier, Oasis Hong Kong Airlines, plans to begin services to European cities by the end of 2005, with Berlin, Vienna, Cologne and Milan cited as possible locations, the South China Morning post said. Service to the North American market could come in 2006.

Steve Miller, a founder of Dragon Airlines Ltd., will serve as chief executive of the new carrier.

"It's been 20 years since I founded Dragonair, and I had never thought of starting another airline in Hong Kong until now because the timing wasn't right and the government's attitude wasn't right," Miller was quoted as saying by the Post. "But now is the time."

The airline plans to operate a small fleet of Boeing 747-400 or Airbus A340-300 aircraft, starting with three planes and expanding to five within two years, the paper reported.

The Ming Pao Daily News quoted Miller as saying that roundtrip fares to Europe would cost between 4,000 Hong Kong dollars (US$512, euro393) and HK$5,000 (US$641, euro492).
 
vr-hkg
Posts: 224
Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2001 7:32 am

RE: New Hong Kong Based LCC - Long Haul LCC

Wed Feb 09, 2005 1:02 am

Was about to post this separately as a few searches of the forum and industry news found nothing, but luckily the 'similar threads' feature saved me! I've just heard about Oasis Hong Kong Airlines (being launched by one of the founders of Dragonair), wondered what anybody else had heard?

Here's what I've found thus far:

Hong Kong Standard:
http://www.thestandard.com.hk/stdn/std/Front_Page/GB03Aa02.html

International Herald Tribune:
http://www.iht.com/articles/2005/02/03/news/travel4.html

Luchtzak Aviation:
http://www.luchtzak.be/article7557.html

SINA.com:
http://english.sina.com/taiwan_hk/1/2005/0203/20334.html

Payload Asia:
http://www.payloadasia.com/News/news_0205.htm

Associated Press:
http://biz.yahoo.com/ap/050202/hong_kong_new_airline_1.html

I also heard a rumour of another budget airline to be based in either Hong Kong or Macau, and tentatively called "Wow Macau", to be launched by a former Cathay Pacific exec. Any info on that one?

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