art
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A350 A Silly Idea?

Tue Feb 08, 2005 2:54 pm

With the B787 pushing airliner technology into a new era, does it make sense for Airbus to risk 5 billion euros or so to produce an A330 derivative aircraft that will trail behind Boeing's offer technologically, compromise A330 sales and possibly lose Airbus billions?
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Tue Feb 08, 2005 3:00 pm

As has been said so many times before, and as the 737NG proves.... it doesn't always take a new design to successfully compete with another new design.


However, it can also be argued that Boeing's innovative technology may cause a gap to great for Airbus to overcome without a cleansheet design, were it all to live up to Boeing's optimum forecasts. Only time will tell.
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
atmx2000
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Tue Feb 08, 2005 3:20 pm

But it should probably also be said that there is a lot more room for performance and efficiency improvements on a large long haul jet than a small short haul jet. Also the 787 is pushing materials technology much further than the A320 did.
ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
 
AvObserver
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Tue Feb 08, 2005 4:44 pm

It's probably the right thing for Airbus to do at this time; the greater expense an all-new design so soon after the huge A380 effort, along with periodic updates for other models, would stretch Airbus finances and likely also incur greater launch aid, a measure in dispute right now. Doing an all new airplane would also take longer to bring to market and Airbus didn't want Boeing to have too much of a headstart getting its plane to market. But, as ConcordeBoy and a recent Flight International editorial pointed out, there's risk in going the derivative route to try to outpoint a clean-sheet design. Boeing's own problems attempting to do this against newer Airbus models should be cause for some concern in Toulouse although, at this stage, they probably had no choice but to pursue this course. Indeed, only time will tell if it was the correct choice; the number of orders the A350 secures over the next few months prior to its expected mid-year formal launch may provide a reasonable barometer of how well it will actually do against the 787.
 
CHRISBA777ER
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Tue Feb 08, 2005 8:28 pm

I see the A350 as a variation on a winning design like the 747-400 was to the 747 Classic. New avionics, slightly different wing, new engines, much more range, greater MTOW, better CASM, and generally a better aircraft in all respects. The family makes sense now - moving down the list in terms of capacity. (assuming that the A300/310/330/343 are all discontinued)
A389
A388
A346
A345
A359
A358

A321
A320
A319
A318

With the 757-200 sized gap in the middle there - its not difficult to see where the shorter range 787 orders are going to come from.

Makes you wonder if Airbus havent missed the bus (pardon the pun) on the 757-sized replacement. Could we see a stretched (and re-engined) A322 perhaps? Add winglets for range?
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
Pe@rson
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Tue Feb 08, 2005 8:34 pm

I should think the R&D people of Airbus are in a far better position to determine what is and what is not necessary than any of us.  Smile
"Everyone writing for the Telegraph knows that the way to grab eyeballs is with Ryanair and/or sex."
 
CHRISBA777ER
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Tue Feb 08, 2005 10:57 pm

I said it makes you wonder Pearson - for what its worth i think theyve got it right (as anything thery produce in that size range will only ever be as good as and not better than the 787) - i certainly am not playing armchair CEO.

Im a commercial aviation business analyst by trade, which gives me some leeway to make opinions - but thats all they are mate, and thats all i was stating.
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
astuteman
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 5:47 am

I wish Boeing well with the All Carbon Fibre aeroplane - no doubt that it is a step change in technology.

Having said that, given many of the advances in materials technology in other areas, can anyone out there provide informed commentary about the relativeperformance difference between Carbon fibre, the latest Al-Li alloys, GLARE etc?

Could an A350 made out of a combination of these latest materials have a suffucuently small gap in structural performance relative to the 787 to male other fsactors the primary consideration?

Astuteman
 
su184
Posts: 248
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 6:47 am

The details released so far from both manufacturers about the extensive use of composites in both designs make them almost piers in this aspect ( 787 will use more ), Shark tail fin for the 787 wouldn't make the great difference, Airbus is refining the aerodynamics too, so most of efficiency that's expected to give edge to Boeing is the bleedless engines, but with most of the aircraft's systems relying on electric power, there would be enormous generators required for normal electric power, anti-ice, airconditioning, brakes... What would be the requirements of the regulatory authorities for redundancy here, in all the designs till now, if a generator fails several actions are done including the shedding of high load items like the galleys, but here what will happen, can you lose an aircondtioning pack due to a generator fault, can anybody give some light here.
 
lazybones
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 6:56 am

SU184, I guess back-up generators come to mind but this also sheds light on another point. These all electric generators would surely need more power more weight etc, doesn't this eat into the overall efficiencies?? We might need oldAreoGuy for this one....
 
su184
Posts: 248
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 7:12 am

That is exactly what I was thinking of, to many backups and you end up with no big differences, and I don't think Aribus would go spend 5b$ to build a handicapped aircraft from day one...
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 7:17 am

I should think the R&D people of Airbus are in a far better position to determine what is and what is not necessary than any of us.

Development groups misjudge and mistake configurations all the time.

can anyone out there provide informed commentary about the relativeperformance difference between Carbon fibre, the latest Al-Li alloys, GLARE etc?

Aluminum lithium alloys have been around for a while, but their application and complexity has been rising in the past few decades. The 744 made significant use of Al-Li alloys, but even newer (lighter) alloys are now available.

GLARE is a hybrid of aluminum and fiberglass. Large portions of the A380 fuselage are made of this material

Carbon laminate are strands of carbon fiber soaked in epoxy that are wound around a form, i.e. fuselage barrel, then autoclaved at very high temperature. The form is removed, creating the desired structure. Carbon can also be woven into a fabric, layered, then baked in a simmilar process. GE makes the GE90/GEnx fan with this method....
 
pilotaydin
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Joined: Tue Sep 07, 2004 12:30 am

RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 7:27 am

Well...look at it like this...in the old old days...companies would make planes and then the airlines would buy them...

as time goes on, the airlines and manuf. have molded into one, and they work together...im sure there are a couple of companies that are already planning flights with the A350 and although i havent seen it yet, a luanch customer etc etc, will all appear soon to the naked eye, business plans and actions are a LOT more detailed/complicated than just...let's make a plane guys..
The only time there is too much fuel onboard, is when you're on fire!
 
avek00
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 7:29 am

Airbus has no choice but to press ahead with the A350 - the A300/310/330 niche has proven to be the only niche where Airbus has consistently held an advantage over Boeing, and that would go completely down the pissoir if the 787 goes unchallenged.
Live life to the fullest.
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 7:34 am

I guess back-up generators come to mind but this also sheds light on another point

That would be called the APU  Big grin

These all electric generators would surely need more power more weight etc, doesn't this eat into the overall efficiencies??

No they wouldn't. Bleedless systmes are more significantly lighter than bleed-air systems.

A bleed-air aircraft has heavily insulated ducts running through the airframe to divert the air. This will all be replaced by lightweight electrical wiring. Bleedless systems are also easier to maintain. The biggest savings are here (maintenance) and reduced fuel burn is a secondary benefit...
 
airways6max
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:02 pm

I think that the A350 in its current form is an also-ran aircraft.
 
lazybones
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:26 pm

DfwRevolution,

Are you suggesting just one APU would do the job of backup to the generators? Surely for the first all electric plane they would consider 2 APU's. Especially since the APU's are known to fail.

Airways6max, err what do you mean exactly??  Confused
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:42 pm

Are you suggesting just one APU would do the job of backup to the generators?

How should I know, I'm not a Boeing engineer. I would suspect so as most commercial aircraft only have a single APU.

Surely for the first all electric plane they would consider 2 APU's.

Why... they are used for ground power and rare emergency situations only? If there is a complete loss of electrical power, the aircraft will still have a ram-air turbine as another back-up, as all large commercial aircraft have. Boeing is also buidling the 787 to allow the APU to be replaced by a fuel cell at a later date.

Airways6max, err what do you mean exactly??

He means a stop-gap, i.e, not a long-term/competitive solution
 
ConcordeBoy
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 12:50 pm

the A300/310/330 niche has proven to be the only niche where Airbus has consistently held an advantage over Boeing

um... huh  Confused
Faire du ciel le plus bel endroit de la terre c'est impossible sans Concorde!
 
greaser
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 1:22 pm

the A300/310/330 niche has proven to be the only niche where Airbus has consistently held an advantage over Boeing

I share with ConcordeBoy's HUH????????
The A300/310 is not a financial sucess. I dont think the program has even been repaid for, given the huge R&D costs to the A300. Ok, the A330 has an advantage, but not for long.
(p.s, if you're talking abt the A300's cargo cap., then, it does have an advantage over the 767..)
Now you're really flying
 
CORULEZ05
Posts: 1250
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 1:24 pm

Of course it makes sense.....it is called COMPETITION....Boeing comes out with something and Airbus has to compete with them....and vice versa....business mi amigo
Fly jetBlue today!!!!!!!
 
nudelhirsch
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 1:40 pm

The 350 is most likely going to be a success, as Airbus has good sales strategies and loyal customers.
The only part about it is, that no design is nailed down. But hey, why nail down a design if your target (787) is not even a prototype yet?

The 350 could well become a 350NG, with different size options, trying to match Boeings 787-capacities. Plus, it will be a known fact how well the 787s new technologies will work out and they can focus on the important points.

It is a good way to announce a new product, but to wait until the competitor is out, to match exactly what is important to be matched.

So far, the 350 is only a sales stunt, but a good one.

It would be awesome to know, what managements all over the world are thinking now, if they consider 787 or 350... Big grin
Putana da Seatbeltz!
 
CORULEZ05
Posts: 1250
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 1:44 pm

"it is a good way to announce a new product, but to wait until the competitor is out, to match exactly what is important to be matched."

VERY TRUE....not only match but exceed it in some way...make it better than the competitor.......makes me wonder, will Boeing do the same with regards to the A380....develop something better.....
Fly jetBlue today!!!!!!!
 
nudelhirsch
Posts: 1371
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 1:52 pm

the 380 is a niche product.
The market is not big enough for 2 types.
Boeing will though jump in and fill the gaps Airbus leaves open.

The Concorde, SST, 380, ... all niche products.
The 380 sells fine, but it is open, how the future will be, it might be possible, that Airbus has reached close to max sales of the 380, or at least major sales figures are already down. Maybe I am wrong... We will see...

That is what Boeing will do.
Airbus has, IMO, major orders down for the 380, a number still to go, but major down, so why should Boeing waste years and Billions to come up with a plane that enters service in maybe 2012-2014 to compete with the 380? Does not make sense in a niche market.
They already have several 777 to match the 340 quite well and the 744 on top, including freighters (744F and 772LRF...) and there is still a gap which might be exactly a niche as the 380, or a big market, but it is very likely there is a market for something in between 380 and 744.

Also, Boeing will have to focus on a 737-thing, the 320 is quite old by now (which means, it can be easily targeted by a new product). So the 787 brings technology for the future. The 350 is just a match. If Boeing focusses on developing future technology and not just meeting today's demands, they will have some nice days coming up, some bottles of Moet will be opened here in the West Loop... Big grin
Putana da Seatbeltz!
 
Airportgal
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 2:48 pm

So far, the 350 is only a sales stunt, but a good one.

it's all part of the strategy....
 Yawn
 
StickShaker
Posts: 620
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 7:11 pm

Its worth keeping in mind that the 350 will be built in 2 versions - one competing with the 787-9 (358) while the other competes with the 772 (359).
Airbus has no planned competitor to the 787-3.
Even then the 359 does not duplicate the complete mission profile of the 772ER in terms of high loads at max range.
The 787 and 350 product range have some overlap in terms of capacity and mission profiles but there are just as many areas where they compete outside the range of the other.
Its not quite a head to head competition.

Cheers,
StickShaker
 
atmx2000
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 7:17 pm

It is also possible that Boeing will offer something that will be in the same class as the A359. They have hinted that they are considering it.
ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
 
avek00
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 09, 2005 10:55 pm

"the A300/310/330 niche has proven to be the only niche where Airbus has consistently held an advantage over Boeing

I share with ConcordeBoy's HUH????????
The A300/310 is not a financial sucess. I dont think the program has even been repaid for, given the huge R&D costs to the A300. Ok, the A330 has an advantage, but not for long.
(p.s, if you're talking abt the A300's cargo cap., then, it does have an advantage over the 767..)"

I should have clarified further - I didn't mean that the 300/310/330 necessarily held a sales/financial advantage over Boeing equivs (tho the 330 has outsold its Boeing counterparts), but rather that those three planes represent the only instances where Airbus has consistently held an operational/technical advantage over Boeing within a given niche/mission profile.
Live life to the fullest.
 
art
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Thu Feb 10, 2005 4:37 am

Given that B787 seating has been increased to match that of the A350 and the B787 has bleedless engines / higher cabin humidity / higher cabin pressure, will the A350 be of interest to any client that is not already operating Airbus? List price is lower, too, IIRC.
 
lehpron
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Thu Feb 10, 2005 5:02 am

I honestly thought A350 was a bluff to make Boeing wet their shorts. Boeing would have thought that Aribus put all it's resources into A380 and their market research would show that a 787-like product would go take the cake.

Now they have to go back and re-research any minor impact A350 might have on the projected sales of 787 -- forcing Boeing to spend resources.

I don't know anymore, guess just wait and see. When is the targeted roll-out for the A350?
The meaning of life is curiosity; we were put on this planet to explore opportunities.
 
Areopagus
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Thu Feb 10, 2005 5:32 am

Maybe the 350 will be like Abraham Lincoln's axe. An all-new cfrp wing now, with new engines and lighter materials substitution in the fuselage. Later comes an all-new cfrp fuselage, financed from sales of the original 350 configuration. This approach would the money rolling in with less severe peaks in engineering requirements.
 
Planesmart
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Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 3:18 am

RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Thu Feb 10, 2005 10:13 am

If B launch the 747ADV there will almost certainly be an A36 version of the A35, to put the squeeze on the 747 niche.

At least 4 airlines have received information on possible A36 derivatives as part of their A35 presentations.
 
Aviationhack
Posts: 105
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Thu Feb 10, 2005 10:30 am

the A300/310/330 niche has proven to be the only niche where Airbus has consistently held an advantage over Boeing.

I'm not positive on the numbers, but I don't think that the 300/310/330 has any advantage over Boeing when considering orders and deliveries for comparably sized aircraft.

The only frame that I would say has had an advantage lately has been the 320 series.

If I'm wrong, flame away, have been flamed for miss-spelling things here  Smile
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Thu Feb 10, 2005 10:40 am

If B launch the 747ADV there will almost certainly be an A36 version of the A35, to put the squeeze on the 747 niche.

May I ask how? There is no plausible way to stretch 8-abreast to enter the 747-Adv's niche, any stretch beyond the A346 is frankly insane.

At least 4 airlines have received information on possible A36 derivatives as part of their A35 presentations.

Where the hell did the A360 come from?

I honestly thought A350 was a bluff to make Boeing wet their shorts.

Airbus must develop an answer to the 787. They simply can't afford not to do anything. Whether today's A350 is anything like the production A350, they could end up very different concepts.
 
Sjoerd
Posts: 350
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Thu Feb 10, 2005 10:42 am

At least 4 airlines have received information on possible A36 derivatives as part of their A35 presentations.

Wouldn't these A360s have the size of the A346 ?

Sjoerd
Flanders + Wallonnia + Brussels = the UNITED STATES of BELGIUM
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Thu Feb 10, 2005 10:48 am

Wouldn't these A360s have the size of the A346 ?

Then how is it a 747-Adv competitor and not a 773ER competitor? The whole point of the 747-Adv is Boeing's (attempt) to assert that there is a market between the 360 seat 773ER/A346 and 550 seat A388.
 
Planesmart
Posts: 1847
Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2004 3:18 am

RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Thu Feb 10, 2005 11:00 am

Key words - 'squeeze 747ADV niche'. Presume purpose would be to erode the size of the 747 niche, not occupy it, just as A38 could do similar at the upper end.

You are right - an A36 wouldn't be the same size. Same size as two proposed A35 versions.
 
StickShaker
Posts: 620
Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2004 7:34 pm

RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Fri Feb 11, 2005 1:34 pm

So far, the 350 is only a sales stunt, but a good one.

I honestly thought A350 was a bluff to make Boeing wet their shorts.


Its interesting that some still see the 350 program in this light. If you have worked hard to capture market share in a particularly segment and your major competitor launches a revolutionary product (quantum leap in technologies) to compete in that segment then you either come up with a worthy competitor or wave goodbye to your market share.

If B launch the 747ADV there will almost certainly be an A36 version of the A35, to put the squeeze on the 747 niche.

Sounds very interesting - any more info available.


Then how is it a 747-Adv competitor and not a 773ER competitor?

Had the same thought myself.


Cheers,
StickShaker


 
StickShaker
Posts: 620
Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2004 7:34 pm

RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Fri Feb 11, 2005 2:12 pm

Key words - 'squeeze 747ADV niche'. Presume purpose would be to erode the size of the 747 niche

Wouldn't these A360s have the size of the A346 ?


747 size might be a bridge too far but 346 size would have to be plausible.

A twin engined version of the 346 would certainly be an interesting move.
No doubt Airbus has been watching the recent sales success of the 773ER.
If this were to occur then where does this place the 346HGW project - on the back burner or abandoned.
A 360 twin of 346 capacity using all the new technologies of the 350 would have to make a lot of sense - much of the development cost would be covered by the 350 program.
Such an aircraft would have to be a far more formidable competitor to the 773ER than the 346HGW could ever hope to be. With Li-Alloys etc it could be expected to be significantly lighter than the 773ER.
A 350/360 product line would certainly provide significant competition to the 787, 772 and 773.

Seems Airbus might have learnt a thing or two from Boeing.


Cheers,
StickShaker

 
lehpron
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:51 am

Let me reiterate by what I meant in this comment ("I honestly thought A350 was a bluff to make Boeing wet their shorts.")

Like Airbus is pulling a rope-a-dope, like the boxing term, to make the competition do something thinking you are doing something in that direction.

That way they use up resources, so when you are going to do something, they've either got the wrong idea or have to wait to get started.

787 is an attack on the A33x planes, I'm guessing that Boeing assumed Airbus would not attempt a whole new plane (whether or not) because they have spent their resources on A380. Well now Airbus is starting with A350, so in reaction Boeing is attacking A380 turf with 747Adv.

IMO, it's a bluff war designed to cause a rush of blood to the head among A/B exec's. In the end, 787/A380 will exist and A350/747Adv will not.

But if the A350 ends up flying...well...ain't that a trip.  Smile
The meaning of life is curiosity; we were put on this planet to explore opportunities.
 
avek00
Posts: 3166
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Sat Feb 12, 2005 6:00 am

"But if the A350 ends up flying...well...ain't that a trip."

The A350 basically HAS to fly at this point - if it doesn't, Airbus will only be a seller of A320-family aircraft with an occasional 5 A380s rolling off the lot.
Live life to the fullest.
 
mham001
Posts: 4343
Joined: Thu Feb 03, 2005 4:52 am

RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Sat Feb 12, 2005 6:09 am

A announced this morning they have picked Goodrich to produce the 350 landing gear. I'd bet they go through with it, rather than dicking their contractors over a ghost project.
 
lehpron
Posts: 6846
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2001 3:42 am

RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Sat Feb 12, 2005 6:29 am

>>"Airbus will only be a seller of A320-family aircraft with an occasional 5 A380s rolling off the lot."<<

What about their other planes? A30x/A31x/A33x/A340x?
The meaning of life is curiosity; we were put on this planet to explore opportunities.
 
Ken777
Posts: 9101
Joined: Thu Mar 11, 2004 5:39 am

RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Sat Feb 12, 2005 6:44 am

The 350 is a pretty good decision on A's part. They had to respond to the 787 in order to protect their 330 customer base. The 350 achieves that goal (to some degree) at a minimal price, and gives A some time to develop the technical knowledge B has developed with the 787.

Airbus is in a tight spot, however, as the 350 will be a replacement for the 330. They may argue against that, but I doubt if the airlines will believe them. There is a lot of work ahead for A to maintain good relations and sales in the 330 market.

Airbus also needs to be able to respond to a 737E, requiring some significant investments in the 32X line. Their work on the 350 will help them - just as B's work on the 787 will help them with the 737E.

Boeing has picked a pretty good time to throw competitive challenges at Airbus. While the 380 is ready to fly there will still be a huge engineering investment in moving it to the first delivery. The 737NG is putting pressure on the 32X line and the 777 is doing well. Now comes the 787 which can cause a lot of pain for the 330 and the 787 will have advanced technologies that can rapidly be transferred to the 737E. While the 737E program is considered to be a long way off I believe that B would love to announce it as soon as possible - like when WN says "lets do it". That would but even more intense pressure on Airbus, which wouldn't break B's heart at all.
 
CON207
Posts: 284
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Sat Feb 12, 2005 7:49 am

The A350 is just a stretched version of the A330. I think Airbus would be quite happy to see Boeing reduced to just building aircraft engines.
Just another battle on the front line between these two manufacturers in my eyes... but we'll see what happens in the future.
Its going to be a couple of years before both the A350 and the 7E7/787 are in service. Technology has to move forward .
Everyone has their preference in the aviation industry. Airlines will choose what will meet their needs best.

 Insane
Sue
Being ill sucks. Never take life for granted!!
 
gigneil
Posts: 14133
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Sat Feb 12, 2005 7:52 am

The A350 is just a stretched version of the A330.

Christ, no, no it is not.

The A350 is precisely the same dimensions as the existing A330 from front to back.

N
 
CON207
Posts: 284
Joined: Mon Dec 08, 2003 4:33 am

RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Sat Feb 12, 2005 8:01 am

Give it time N... its still on the "blueprint". Anything can happen between now and when it starts to actually take shape.
Looking at the variants of the A330's and A340's... you can see the differences.. if you have a keen eye.
I may be a woman.. but i aint stupid.

CON207  Pissed
Being ill sucks. Never take life for granted!!
 
greasespot
Posts: 2955
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RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Sat Feb 12, 2005 8:21 am

"I think Airbus would be quite happy to see Boeing reduced to just building aircraft engines."


Ummm Boeing does not build any engines. Neither does Airbus....


GS
Sometimes all you can do is look them in the eye and ask " how much did your mom drink when she was pregnant with you?"
 
CON207
Posts: 284
Joined: Mon Dec 08, 2003 4:33 am

RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 16, 2005 12:58 am

GS!


Anyone knows that!!

In other words Airbus would probably be very happy if they were the only ones building aircraft. Both AB and BOEING make damn fine aircraft . The A350 and the 787 are going to be competing against each other.  Insane

Gegneil.

Ok the words I should have used " A350 is an UPGRADED version" .

Carry on !
Regards
CON207




[Edited 2005-02-15 17:04:56]
Being ill sucks. Never take life for granted!!
 
avek00
Posts: 3166
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2004 5:56 am

RE: A350 A Silly Idea?

Wed Feb 16, 2005 1:08 am

">>"Airbus will only be a seller of A320-family aircraft with an occasional 5 A380s rolling off the lot."<<

What about their other planes? A30x/A31x/A33x/A340x?"

If the 350 doesn't come to fruition or meet expectations, and the 787 does, Airbus won't be able to GIVE A300s/310s/330s/340s away, much less sell them. This is why Airbus is expending the effort for the 350 - to do nothing is unacceptable from a business standpoint.
Live life to the fullest.

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