qqflyboy
Posts: 1615
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 1:47 pm

UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 3:08 am

The TSA was to take action several weeks ago on a mandate to add matches and lighters to its prohibited items list, but failed to take action. Effective February 28, 2005, matches and butane lighters will be prohibited, and strict enforcement will begin April 15, 2005. This will give the TSA time to inform the traveling public of the new regulation.
The views expressed are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect my employer’s views.
 
flyibaby
Posts: 717
Joined: Wed Aug 25, 2004 5:23 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 3:12 am

Since most people carry matches in their pant pockets anyway, I don't see how they will be adequately able to search for matches. I understand the thought on butane lighters, but really..matches? The sulfur is readily detecable when lit, and someone trying to light one kind of sticks out like a sore thumb.
 
cedarjet
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RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 3:15 am

At the rate they're going, they'll ban another inflight danger soon: passengers.
fly Saha Air 707s daily from Tehran's downtown Mehrabad to Mashhad, Kish Island and Ahwaz
 
ANCFlyer
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RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 3:22 am

I said it before, I'm saying it again . . . and I'll keep on saying it . . .

It's stupid, stupid, stupid. Unenforceable. Waste of time.

Anyone thinks they're safer now than before, well, come on back down to earth and refill your prozac prescription . . .

The TSA is a waste of money . . . "Thousands Standing Around" is an understatement.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
Go3Team
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RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 3:28 am

Is that for only carry on, or both carry on and checked baggage?

I guess airports that now have smoking areas, can now eliminate them.
Yay Pudding!
 
MaverickM11
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RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 3:42 am

"It's stupid, stupid, stupid. Unenforceable. Waste of time.
"

You think that matters to the mafia *ahem* I mean TSA? If anything that's more of a reason to extract money from passengers/airlines *ahem* I mean enforce safety.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
NLINK
Posts: 301
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2003 3:20 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 4:35 am

The TSA didnt pass this, congress attached it to a bill, which requires TSA to enforce this new rule.
 
pilottj
Posts: 274
Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2004 1:23 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 6:14 am

Looks like the Tobacco Lobby has too many lawsuits going on to keep Congress's pockets full anymore.
God was my copilot, but we crashed in the mountains and I had to eat him...
 
srbmod
Posts: 15446
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2001 1:32 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 6:34 am

Quoting Go3Team (reply 4):
I guess airports that now have smoking areas, can now eliminate them.



I hope they do, as I despise going anywhere near the ones @ ATL. I work on Concourse E and three of the shops I stock are right near the smoking lounges, and one of them is right next to the door for one of them, and it always reeks of cigarette smoke.

The City of Atlanta is in the process of looking at a citywide indoor public smoking ban with one loophole, the airport. Hopefully the statewide ban currently on the table in the State Legislature will kill the smoking lounges if the TSA doesn't do it first. Getting rid of the smoking lounges could actually mean extra money for the airport. Turn them into retail shop space and make some extra rent money. The sale of cigarettes isn't too big of a thing for the newsstands anyway, as many people balk at paying $7 a pack.
 
elwood64151
Posts: 2410
Joined: Fri Feb 08, 2002 10:22 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 6:48 am

I have no problem with banning smoking in public buildings. However, if I'm a business owner and wish to allow people to smoke in my establishment, I should be able to make that decision for myself and my business. As a consumer, I should demand a separate (and I mean SEPARATE) area for non-smokers. Let's face it, the original regulations regarding smoking and non-smoking areas were basically ignored for as long as they've been around.



That said, someone who smokes or otherwise might need a lighter (some of us use them to deal with loose threads!) should not be forced to buy a new one every time they travel by air. And the potential danger from these instruments in not only limited but by all accounts infinitesimal.



At LC's Hamburgers in Kansas City, there is a sign that clearly states: "This Is A Smoking Establishment."

Do I like to smoke? No. An occasional cigar, maybe, but I'm the first one to say that regular smoking is one of the stupidest things you can do. Do I like to be around cigarette smoke? No. It disgusts me. Do I want to pay for people's cancer treatment when they turn 50, find out they have lung cancer and don't have health insurance? No. It's their own fault and they should have to deal with the consequences of their actions. What they spent on tobacco probably would have paid for their health problems, anyway.

But if they want to smoke, then let 'em friggin' smoke!
Those who fail to learn history are doomed to repeat it in summer school.
 
ANCFlyer
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RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 8:37 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (reply 5):
You think that matters to the mafia *ahem* I mean TSA? If anything that's more of a reason to extract money from passengers/airlines *ahem* I mean enforce safety.


Hell no Mav . . .doesn't matter to them at all! You and I are probably in agreement as we see eye to eye about most things - it's bullshit, you know it, I know, and I'd bet good money that TSA knows it . . . they just don't care!

Quoting NLINK (reply 6):
The TSA didnt pass this, congress attached it to a bill, which requires TSA to enforce this new rule.


I wouldn't give a damn if Dubya himself authorized it - it's still stupid, unenforceable. Period.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
NLINK
Posts: 301
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RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 8:56 am

It might not be 100% enforceable at the checkpoint but if you get caught doing it once you are inside the secure area expect a fine and it to be confisicated then.
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
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RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 9:32 am

Quoting NLINK (reply 11):
It might not be 100% enforceable at the checkpoint but if you get caught doing it once you are inside the secure area expect a fine and it to be confisicated then.


When I was a smoker I had lighters and matches everywhere . . . I had matches from places I didn't even know I'd visited . . . I suspect that unless one is traveling with NEW luggage, they'll find some eventually.

It's a stupid rule, passed with ignorance, that won't prevent a damn thing, and simple adds justification to the job of the TSA Nazis who aren't generally worth a shit. Period.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
September11
Posts: 3293
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RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 9:46 am

You see big change

Example:

American Airlines
Chicago O'Hare - Los Angeles

before (1980): "free" matches offered by airlines onboard
before (1975): smoking OK

after: (2005) smoking NO
after: (2005) TSA prohibits matches

What are the causes and effects of the change?
Airliners.net of the Future
 
bennett123
Posts: 7424
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RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 9:54 am

I am sure that I will be flamed, but here goes.

Did'nt you try prohition before, (with alchohol). I understand that it was not a total success.

As for matches and safety, I know that Richard Reid to set fire to his shoes, but I expect them to try something different next time.

The problem is that we can not afford to rely on them being morons, (If he had gone to the toilet and locked the door.....). Just as well he was a dope.
 
POR2GAL
Posts: 61
Joined: Fri Feb 11, 2005 9:49 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:05 am

So, I guess no more smoking in flightdecks?!?

 Wink/being sarcastic
Spotters, Inc.
 
legendDC9
Posts: 458
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RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:21 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (reply 12):
It's a stupid rule, passed with ignorance, that won't prevent a damn thing, and simple adds justification to the job of the TSA Nazis who aren't generally worth a shit. Period.


Why is there such a "jihad" on the TSA? They don't make up any rules, just enforce what they are told to by homeland security. I agree that the whole thing is a joke, but it's not any TSA employee's fault... they are only following orders (j/k)
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:36 am

Quoting LegendDC9 (reply 16):
Why is there such a "jihad" on the TSA? They don't make up any rules, just enforce what they are told to by homeland security. I agree that the whole thing is a joke, but it's not any TSA employee's fault... they are only following orders (j/k)


Legend, you're half right. They made up MOST of the rules. And they do a half assed job of enforceing them. One hand of the TSA knows not what the other is doing . . . **

Hand wanding babies and little old ladies?

No profiling? I carry a badge for a living and get hit with Secondary Inspection all the time! Why, lots of my travel is last minute - sometimes I have to buy a ticket and go, so I get the infamous SSSSS on the Boarding Pass. It's bullshit!

**Example: Boarding HP flight to PHX in MRY two years ago (before I quit smoking). NO lighters allowed. They take my bic. Screw it, I'll get another. Oooops, HP flight cancelled. Move to UA, different gate. TSA gives us back our lighters.  Smile Get to UA, new TSA crew, ready to go, offer up my lighter since I've already been told it's a no-no. "Oh, those lighters are OK sir, you can keep it". WTF? One gate is less than a hundred feet from the other, and there are different rules?

Example again: As far as I know, this is the only country that makes you remove LapTops from your case. What the hell is that all about?

Example still: Take you Shoes Off - but you don't have to. If you don't I damn well guarantee, 100%, you're going through additional screening, I don't care if you wearing flip flops - you're going to additional screening. That's so the fat ass at the counter can check you off as an additional random screening.

It's all bullshit, you know it, I know it, anyone that has any common sense knows it.

Perhaps I'd feel different if the operators at TSA looked and acted like they had any fuckin' sense at all . . . . when I see a dozen or so fat ass losers standing around laughing and joking and talking, and there's a line of a hundred people and one blasted port to enter, that's just wrong. Have you talked to any TSA idiots? Overpaid, underworked, ignorant losers.

If my Department ran like the TSA the city council would have our ass on a platter Right Now . . . from the Chief to the lowest widget.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
PDXFlyer
Posts: 30
Joined: Fri Feb 04, 2005 5:12 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:39 am

Agreed. TSA did not make this rule, they simple are required to enforce it. I bet they find it equally humorous.

Never underestimate the power of the anti-smoking movement, especially when certain government groups feel they can extract large sums from the tobacco industry (and perhaps deservedly so).
 
11Bravo
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RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:43 am

ANCFlyer,

What do think is a better solution? I personally think that airport security is going to be a hassle no matter what, but it was my experience that the rent-a-cops we had before 9/11 were even more inane and incompetent.
WhaleJets Rule!
 
bennett123
Posts: 7424
Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2004 12:49 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:52 am

If they are Overpaid and underworked you would think that they would get better candidates.

The problem is that nobody knows what they are looking for.

I remember many years ago management saying that in the event of a threat that we should check the immediate area and then evacuate.

Given that we were expected to check within 30 seconds and that management could not tell us what the threat would look like, the
entire idea became a farce.

You need quality staff and then allow them some initiative.
 
legendDC9
Posts: 458
Joined: Sun Nov 21, 2004 9:24 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:57 am

I know and live the frustrations as well, fortunately for me I guess, I never had anything happen that would make me feel as strongly about it...

Quoting ANCFlyer (reply 17):
No profiling? I carry a badge for a living and get hit with Secondary Inspection all the time!


Doesn't that prove that there is no profiling? Look at my flag, trust me, I know what airport profiling is. All your experience shows is that the system makes no sense.


Quoting ANCFlyer (reply 17):
Example still: Take you Shoes Off - but you don't have to. If you don't I damn well guarantee, 100%, you're going through additional screening, I don't care if you wearing flip flops - you're going to additional screening. That's so the fat ass at the counter can check you off as an additional random screening


This was true right after 9/11. since then, and I fly all the time as well, sometimes I take my shoes off, sometimes I don't, if I know they don't beep. I have yet to be pulled aside for not beeping in at least 2.5 years.

I am not looking for a silly argument here, TSA is what it is, a government entity with it's own bureaucracy and morons and unreasonable decisions. However, the folks that work for them, may do it for the wage or maybe because they actually like it. They draw heat because they are visible and disorganized, but look, people here post horror stories of airlines ruining their vacations, making stupid decisions and stomping on passenger dignity. With all that, I have never seen anyone use such strong language towards them, when they did more than take a lighter away or made them take their shoes off. Just something to think about.
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 10:58 am

Quoting 11Bravo (reply 19):
What do think is a better solution? I personally think that airport security is going to be a hassle no matter what, but it was my experience that the rent-a-cops we had before 9/11 were even more inane and incompetent


Consistent, common sense rules. Get the fat asses off their fat asses and working somewhere. I can assure you, at ANC, I can could 2 losers standing around or on break for every 1 I see at the checkpoint. Guaranteed.

Let me ask you there Grunt (11Bravo - it's a term of endearment from an old tanker):

How much sense does ex-raying someones sandals make to you?

How much sense does seizing a pair of knitting needles (which are legal now - I know) as opposed to the writing instrument in my briefcase?

How much sense does it make to SSSS everyone that bought a ticket yesterday? I mean, shit, going to Granny's funeral and you have to deal with the TSA horseshit because you bought the ticket yesterday?

Common Sense there Bravo . . . that's what I ask. And get the lard asses working instead of standing around. There were no fewer than thirty at C Checkpoint at ANC yesterday, and twelve of them were working . . . including the X-ray (3 people X 2 machines), the Secondary wanding (3 more), at the portals (2), and one widget counting and checking off a checklist. Explain to me what the other 18 were doing . . . . and make it good, because I watched for fifteen minutes while they laughed and joked and stood around . . . .

Like I said, if my department ran like the TSA the city would have our asses on a platter.

And I thought we wasted a lot of time and resources in the Army - boy, howdy, was I way, way wrong!
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
BR715-A1-30
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RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 11:01 am

Well, I do, and don't agree with this... I don't agree, because as mentioned above, no one should be forced to buy a new lighter everytime they land at an airport. I do agree with this, because any terrorist can take toilet paper, and light the lavatory garbage cans on fire, and ATTEMPT to bring down the plane... But how will they be able to tell if I have a book of matches in my pocket... what if they are in my underwear, or what if I am hiding them on the bottom of my sock, and walking on them.. Sure, take your shoes off, but they never say take your socks off. So many loopholes to get through.
Puhdiddle
 
sllevin
Posts: 3312
Joined: Wed Jan 30, 2002 1:57 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 11:11 am

If they can ban smoking in pubs in Ireland and make it stick, believe me, the end is coming.

As far as allowing one's own business to allow smoking, the question is...does that mean that one's own businessn shouldn't have to support disabled access? Or equal opportunity?

That becomes a slippery slope, to which the world has alredy answered that they don't wish to go down.

Steve
 
navairjax
Posts: 478
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2003 2:54 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 11:22 am

To clarify, the rule only applies to certain lighters on your person and prohibits them altogether in CHECKED baggage.
http://www.tsa.gov/public/interapp/e...al_multi_image_with_table_0099.xml
 
11Bravo
Posts: 1678
Joined: Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:54 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 12:17 pm

Quoting ANCFlyer (reply 22):
Common Sense there Bravo . . . that's what I ask.


A lot of what you're talking about here I would put under the category of professionalism, or more specifically a lack there of. I'm a federal employee (Wildlife LEO) and I'm expected to treat the public with respect, cheer, and professionalism. I’m also expected to work hard and be competent. If I spent my time screwing around sitting in my rig eating doughnuts, I would find myself unemployed in short order. I think Homeland Security would like to do the same, but they will have to change their stripes a fair amount to get there.

They need effective and competent leadership at the middle and lower levels to do that, and that is expensive and takes time. How many APD Sergeants get paid $12.00 an hour? So far, Homeland Security has tried to do this all on the cheap. As the saying goes “You get what you pay for”.

Banning matches and putting shoes through x-ray machines and other retarded stuff like that tells me that they are very afraid of explosives and they’re not quite sure what to do about it. There are effective technological solutions that could be put in place to seriously deal with explosives, but again that’s expensive and a pain in the ass.

If the American public wants serious professional security at airports, TSA has to spend the money to hire serious professional people and shell out the big bucks for quality gear. If the Administration, and especially the Congress, wants to change this, they need to get out the checkbook. If they don’t, well then, I think we can all expect to see more of the mickey-mouse amateur hour at the airport, and at some point we can probably also expect to see an airliner get blown up.

[Edited 2005-02-26 04:20:18]
WhaleJets Rule!
 
mattbna
Posts: 280
Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2003 2:24 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 12:24 pm

Quoting Go3Team (reply 4):
I guess airports that now have smoking areas, can now eliminate them.



The rumor at BNA is that a bank of 12v automotive lighters will be installed in the walls of the smoking lounges in the terminal (which are all inside "security")...


Matt

--
Canon EOS 7D & 40D -- 100-400mm L IS -- 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II -- 28-135mm IS -- 10-22mm -- 18-55mm EF-S
 
FLAIRPORT
Posts: 3863
Joined: Thu Oct 26, 2000 10:46 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 12:33 pm

Quoting Bennett123 (reply 14):
I am sure that I will be flamed

Pun intended?


After reading the clarification on the TSA website as I prepare for my journey in 6 days to NYC...I have noticed that it is actually a very fair rule that, however, with the limitations, is not really inforcible...

fear not smokers, it looks like you will still be able to smoke in the terminal! And match collectors, just remember that you can only collect 4 matchbooks on your trip!
NEXT FLIGHT: FLL-ATL-HPN on FL
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 12:38 pm

Quoting LegendDC9 (reply 21):
Doesn't that prove that there is no profiling?


Profiling is GOOD! Might not be politically correct, but it's okay in my book, and damned necessary. If Tommy Tentpeg looks like a fuckin' bad guy, he gets the once over, period. Don't care if he's Jewish, Protestant, Black, White, Green, Muslim, Athiest, whatever. And I don't care if they have already "processed" ten folks fitting that description today - and that's their limit - if Tommy Tentpeg fits the bill, smoke his ass. I'd make a good bet Granny ain't gonna do anything with those knitting needles, but the asshole that doesn't get a secondary and has a knife someone missed is an issue. Yup - we need profiling.

Quoting LegendDC9 (reply 21):
This was true right after 9/11. since then, and I fly all the time as well, sometimes I take my shoes off, sometimes I don't, if I know they don't beep. I have yet to be pulled aside for not beeping in at least 2.5 years


Haven't flown thru ANC have you? Oh and thanks for proving my point on consistency by the by. . . . in ANC you'd damn sure get the secondary. Period.

Quoting LegendDC9 (reply 21):
I have never seen anyone use such strong language towards them, when they did more than take a lighter away


If you think this is just about the lighter, Legend, you miss the point entirely my friend.

Quoting 11Bravo (reply 26):
APD Sergeants get paid $12.00 an hour?


None  Big thumbs up

Quoting 11Bravo (reply 26):
So far, Homeland Security has tried to do this all on the cheap. As the saying goes “You get what you pay for”.


You should check their pay scale then, cause if you think they're getting paid "cheap" you missed something somewhere. Try $16+ an hour for the widgets. Most of the idiots they retained after 9/11 that went federal got a 200% raise. And they're still the same dumbass losers they were on 9/10/01, they simply have a big, fat federal paycheck and lots more horsepower now. . .

Quoting 11Bravo (reply 26):
I'm a federal employee (Wildlife LEO)


I didn't realize you were a fish cop . . . cool.

Quoting 11Bravo (reply 26):
If I spent my time screwing around sitting around in my rig eating doughnuts, I would find myself unemployed in short order


Ditto here, so explain the TSA and how they manage to do this day in and day out, in plain view of the public, and nothing is done?

Quoting 11Bravo (reply 26):
I think we can all expect to see more of the mickey-mouse amateur hour at the airport, and at some point we can probably also expect to see an airliner get blown up.


Agreed. I said this before - if you think we're any safer today than yesterday or 9/10/01, you're smoking crack . . .(some probably are anyway  Smile ) . . . we're just forking over a lot of money for nothing.

Quoting 11Bravo (reply 26):
They need effective and competent leadership at the middle and lower levels to do that,


It starts at the top. If your leader is an idiot likely your subordinates shall be as well . . . wouldn't want the underlings showing up the boss . . . it's natures way in the federal packing order.

What TSA needs is competent leadership to get out in the field and have a look, have the ability to shit-can someone on the spot for being an idiot, incompetent, lazy. Send some UCs out, not with phony bombs and guns and all that crap - just to sit and watch . . . . then go point and say, you, you , you, you're fired. Get the fuck out. Losers. First person to be fired will be the supervisor for allowing it to happen in the first place.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
sprout5199
Posts: 1681
Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2005 8:26 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 12:40 pm

Quoting Navairjax (reply 25):
To clarify, the rule only applies to certain lighters on your person and prohibits them altogether in CHECKED baggage.
http://www.tsa.gov/public/interapp/e...9.xml


Damn, and I was gonna set up a shop just outside the arrivals point and sell lighters.

Dan in Jupiter
 
UA772IAD
Posts: 1269
Joined: Sat Jul 10, 2004 7:43 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 12:50 pm

I agree that it's a little rediculous that congress spent time litigating this bill, but....
So what? Your not allowed to smoke on planes anyways, so what do you need a lighter for?
 
malb777
Posts: 443
Joined: Thu Jul 08, 2004 5:53 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 1:21 pm

This may get me a few pissed of replies but here goes.
What is wrong with the USA at the moment, do you honestly think that by baning lighters and matches on aircraft you are making the skies safer? time to let the paranoia be overriden by common sense here people
If a terrorist wants to bring down an aircraft they will no matter what you try to do to stop them, we all saw the results of that on 9/11 and I hope that we never see anything like that again. After that event all knives and forks on aircraft were changed to plastic, here's a test for you, snap the blade of a plastic knife down the centre and see what damaged you can do with the point you have left, it is a lot sharper than any knife I have ever used on a plane before.
So now on flights to the US from Australia we will not be able to carry lighters or matches for that eagerley awaited first smoke, cant stand in a group near the toilets incase we are planning something terrible, when in fact all we are doing is stretching after sitting on our butts for the last 12+ hours, and I am sure there are more but as I havent bothered to fly to the US in the last 6 years I am not aware of them all but I bet there are some beauties out there.
As a side note when I was in the Phillipines last year , catching a domestic flight back to Manila I was informed then that lighters were not allowed on the aircraft, after I spoke to my sister inlaw it turns out the guards sell them in town along with single cigarettes as an extra revenue earner and safety on the aircraft is the last thing on there minds.
My $0.02 worth
thank god i was not born a bird. this type of flying is much better
 
11Bravo
Posts: 1678
Joined: Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:54 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 1:26 pm

Quoting ANCFlyer (reply 29):
You should check their pay scale then, cause if you think they're getting paid "cheap" you missed something somewhere. Try $16+ an hour for the widgets.


The TSA widgets use Federal Pay Band D which starts at $11.30/hour. I'll admit though, that is more than many of them deserve.

Fish cop. LOL. That must be an Alaska thing. The only other time I heard that was from an Alaska Trooper when I worked up there in 1998 on TDY. We got a call near Tok and there was this dude with eleven dead bald eagles in the back seat of his Honda Civic.

Sir, …could you please step out of the vehicle.
WhaleJets Rule!
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 2:05 pm

Quoting 11Bravo (reply 33):
Fish cop. LOL. That must be an Alaska thing.


Yup, it is . . .  Big thumbs up We have a fish thing up here. Lots of them.

Favorite Alaska Bumper Sticker: Homer Alaska, A Quaint Drinking Village with a Fishing Problem.

Quoting 11Bravo (reply 33):
Sir, …could you please step out of the vehicle.


Sorta brings the whole license and registration and insurance thing to a halt doesn't it.  Nuts
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
ckfred
Posts: 4694
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2001 12:50 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sat Feb 26, 2005 2:06 pm

Here are some of my pet peeves about TSA:

1. Don Carty, former CEO of AA, said some time ago that he would like to submit passenger information and have it run through appropriate databases, such as FBI, CIA, Interpol, MI-6, Mossad, etc., to see if that person is on any watch list. If so, the reservation will be flagged, and that person will get extra screening. If not, than the person doesn't get wanded, patted down, etc., unless circumstances call for it.

2. If a passenger is properly screened, why can't he have matches or a lighter? If screening shows that he doesn't have any explosives, then he should be able to light up as soon as he gets outside the terminal. Seems like to me this is just going to increase sales of disposable lighters.

3. Why is it suggested that everyone take off their shoes? If one is wearing hiking boots or cross-trainers with a thick sole, then running them through x-ray is probably a good idea. But if someone is wearing Bass Weejuns, like me, why bother? There is no way I could put enough plastic explosive in the heel to do much damage. It simply isn't thick enough.

4. Why do laptops have to come out of the case? I put a PDA, cell phone, and electric shaver in my carry-on, and the screener seems to be able to look and tell if there is anything suspicious.

5. I can understand why TSA doesn't want people lining up at the lav by the cockpit door, but what makes the difference in the coach section? On a 4-hour flight, some people just feel like shooting the breeze with the F/As and standing for a few minutes. Again, if people have been screened, and their names compared to watch lists, they shouldn't be a threat.
 
qqflyboy
Posts: 1615
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 1:47 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sun Feb 27, 2005 9:11 am

The TSA was supposed to enact the ban on February 15, 2005, which was mandated by a bill passed in Congress. The whole reason the TSA did NOT act on the mandate on the 15th was because they knew they'd have a hard time enforcing it, especially the matches part of the mandate. I don't know what has changed since the 15th and now, but as mentioned above, they are required by law to enact the ban, and are doing it now.

It will be a headache for them just as much as it will be a headache for those who require matches/lighters.

As for "light anywhere" matches, they're different from normal matches. They can be lit in just about any condition, including high winds and rain. They are very popular among campers.
The views expressed are mine alone and do not necessarily reflect my employer’s views.
 
F9Animal
Posts: 3637
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2004 7:13 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sun Feb 27, 2005 9:38 am

First off I totally disagree with it.

It is a right that is being taken away. For people that choose to smoke, it is harsh. This is not a smoker versus non smoker debate. The only person that loses is the smoker. Several places in the airports around the US will be affected. PHX has a bar/grill that is a one drink minimum, and I see tons of smokers running for the place. If this is true, then they are going to take a bad hit on business. How many other establishments will suffer because of it?

Now for those that despise smoking, you win. For those that smoke, I guess smuggling a pack of matches is the only way to go!

Another freedom being taken away.
I Am A Different Animal!!
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sun Feb 27, 2005 9:57 am

Quoting QQflyboy (reply 36):
they knew they'd have a hard time enforcing it, especially the matches part of the mandate. I don't know what has changed since the 15th and now, but as mentioned above, they are required by law to enact the ban, and are doing it now.


Lighters are easy . . . but unless they hand search every single person, they're screwed . . . . I have this feeling this won't last. Ya know, I can't wait until some TSA dumbass arrests Granny Schmedlap for having a twenty year old book of matches stuffed way down in her handbag that she got a casino in 1985, and thought perhaps they'd come in handy someday. She doesn't remember they're there - but they are, and she's going to get fucked over by an overzealous systems that is screwed from the top to the bottom.

I will never let up on the TSA, they are useless, as useless as the bunch of idiots they replaced.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
NLINK
Posts: 301
Joined: Sat Nov 15, 2003 3:20 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sun Feb 27, 2005 12:24 pm

Yah, kindi reminds me of the local level cop that likes busty everyones nuts over speeding 5 miles an hour over the speed limit or the same cop that is ticket happy and just wastes peoples time over stupid stuff.
 
airgeek12
Posts: 725
Joined: Tue Oct 26, 2004 8:02 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sun Feb 27, 2005 12:38 pm

I agree with alot of the posts in here. I can see how they could easily detect butane lighters and whatnot as they're made of metal. But most matches are made of wood and cardboard; things that cannot be easily detected.

geek
 
AirplanePeanut
Posts: 407
Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 12:00 am

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Sun Feb 27, 2005 1:14 pm

Quoting Srbmod (reply 8):
Quoting Go3Team (reply 4):
I guess airports that now have smoking areas, can now eliminate them.



I hope they do, as I despise going anywhere near the ones @ ATL


OH MY GOD! The ones in the FL C part smell like crap. Uh i come off a nice flight to see my grandparents and smell something that makes me wanna vomit.

Have a nice a day.
..
 
navairjax
Posts: 478
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2003 2:54 pm

RE: UPDATE: TSA Prohibits Matches/lighters

Wed Mar 02, 2005 12:48 pm

Apparently according to most press releases today, is that matches are still allowed and all lighters are not. (Of course the f***ing TSA still hasn't updated their site regarding the issue last I checked) supposedly it will take effect on April 14. As a smoker myself I'm wondering if I should even bother taking a lighter with me on Friday when I take my next flight. What really gets me about this pathetic ban is that it was passed almost two years after the whole Richard Reid incident, one in which a lighter wasn't even used (and wouldn't have worked anyway). Thanks alot you a**holes on capital hill.................Okay done venting for now.

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