rootsair
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Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Thu Mar 31, 2005 9:54 pm

La paz is currently bolivia's biggest city. However I see that most international flights depart from and arrive to Santa Cruz


The altitude of La Paz is 3,600 m. I think that must be the reason why not many international flights fly there .I think its difficult for airplanes to land and take off at such altitude (why ?? )

Nevertheless there are still many flights to and from La Paz so it can't really be the real reason.
Would anyone be able to clarify my dilemma


Regards
A man without the knowledge of his past history,culture and origins is like a tree without roots
 
ACDC8
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Thu Mar 31, 2005 10:11 pm

Quoting RootsAir (Thread starter):
The altitude of La Paz is 3,600 m. I think that must be the reason why not many international flights fly there .I think its difficult for airplanes to land and take off at such altitude (why ?? )

Due to the airports elevation, the air is not as dense as it is at sea level resulting in a loss of performance. The engines need to work much harder with less air then they usually need to under normal conditions, that's why La Paz also has a fairly long runway, 13 000ft I believe. So I guess there are not many international flights there because their weight restrictions wouldn't make it worth while.
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OB1504
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Thu Mar 31, 2005 10:53 pm

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 1):
Due to the airports elevation, the air is not as dense as it is at sea level resulting in a loss of performance. The engines need to work much harder with less air then they usually need to under normal conditions, that's why La Paz also has a fairly long runway, 13 000ft I believe. So I guess there are not many international flights there because their weight restrictions wouldn't make it worth while.

This also why many carriers that serve Bolivia serve, say XYZ-LPB-VVI-XYZ, for similar reasons to KLM (in the "KLM Cruel Triangle Flights" thread), so that from LPB to VVI not much fuel is needed, and the aircraft can depart fully loaded to its final destination from VVI, which is at a lower elevation.

[Edited 2005-03-31 14:54:11]
 
Mason
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Fri Apr 01, 2005 9:55 am

This is puzzled me as well. The closest major international city to La Paz is Lima, which is only served via TWO daily non-stop flights, one on LAB (727) and one on TACA (A319). Flights to other cities are sparse. I have no idea why there are only two daliy non-stop flights between LPB and LIM. I am flying there next month, and have to connect in CUZ to avoid spending 10+ hours in LIM. My first time to Bolivia, so I'm excited.
 
Mason
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Fri Apr 01, 2005 9:58 am

BTW, since when does KLM serve Bolivia? To my knowledge, the only non-southamerican airline serving Bolivia is AA from MIA (752). Correct me if I'm wrong.
 
airbazar
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Fri Apr 01, 2005 10:02 am

Could it also be something as simple as not enough demand? I've never been to La Paz so I'm not familiar with its economics but, how much business is there in La Paz to justify air service to anywhere else other than a few flights here and there?
 
miguel0881
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Fri Apr 01, 2005 10:11 am

I've flown from LPB many times, and flights to Lima are very often near empty, so I don't think more frequency are needed there. And AA flights to LPB from MIA are not really that much more than to LIM, so it's not that difficult to get there from North America at least if you want, and most Europeans can connect with only one connection via MIA.
 
COSPN
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Fri Apr 01, 2005 10:13 am

Aero Peru used to fly the 727 LIM-Cuzco-LaPaz...

SOmeone can look it up but a few people have died upon de pressurization of flites in LaPaz Just cant take the pressure change...

Also no Fires there (Like a Building) not enough oxgen to burn but they have fire stations wow..can someone confirm these stories...thanks  Smile
 
ACDC8
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Fri Apr 01, 2005 10:17 am

Quoting COSPN (Reply 7):
SOmeone can look it up but a few people have died upon de pressurization of flites in LaPaz Just cant take the pressure change...

Now that you mentioned it, I remember reading an article in a magazine about La Paz and that due to the elevation, non local pilots (people who are not used to the high altitudes and thinner air) are supposed to wear their oxygen masks during that landing.
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OS-A330
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Fri Apr 01, 2005 6:07 pm

Quoting COSPN (Reply 7):
SOmeone can look it up but a few people have died upon de pressurization of flites in LaPaz Just cant take the pressure change...

This isn't really common though or is it?
Up to my knowledge CUZ is even at 3.700 m and I don't think depressurization is an issue there.
 
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airkas1
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Fri Apr 01, 2005 10:08 pm

Quoting Mason (Reply 4):
BTW, since when does KLM serve Bolivia?

They don't I think. He was just using it as an example in his comment about triangle flights.
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latinaviation
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Fri Apr 01, 2005 10:48 pm

Quoting ACDC8 (Reply 8):
Now that you mentioned it, I remember reading an article in a magazine about La Paz and that due to the elevation, non local pilots (people who are not used to the high altitudes and thinner air) are supposed to wear their oxygen masks during that landing.

You're correct. I've flown to LPB before and a friend of mine is a 757 F/O for AA based in Miami. He says they put the oxygen masks on descent to LPB and keep them on until after take-off enroute to VVI.

For AA, the crew does not layover in LPB. They fly MIA-LPB-VVI and swap crews there.

But apparently LAB does not.

As far as people having heart attacks, I don't know, I cannot confirm. Would it surprise me? No. It is a slap in the face when that door opens. They do offer a "coca de manta" tea upon arrival, which is supposed to ease the affects of altitude sickness.

If Bolivia passes a 50% tax rate on the petro industry, I suspect the J class cabins on those LIM and MIA flights will be even more empty. The five int'l companies that operate in the energy sector in Bolivia said that passing such a high tax would certainly crush the industry there. This movement is being pushed by Evo Morales, a Bolivian chavista more or less, who wants to renationalize much of what Bolivia privatized in the early-to-mid 1990s.
 
Orion737
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Sat Apr 02, 2005 1:12 am

Its time IB went into Bolivia. If they are serious about South America, why exclude the wonderful Bolivia?
 
diezel
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Sat Apr 02, 2005 1:17 am

Departure from La Paz is breathtaking by the way. You will pass the mighty mount Illimani at very close range. Be sure to sit on the left side of the plane.

Roel.
Never be afraid of what you like. (Miles Davis)
 
nycflyer
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Sat Apr 02, 2005 1:27 am

There's a key component that many of you are missing here, and that is simply that Santa Cruz is the business capital of Bolivia. It's also a larger city in terms of population. So no surprise that it gets more, or better, service to the outside world.

Quoting Mason (Reply 3):
This is puzzled me as well. The closest major international city to La Paz is Lima, which is only served via TWO daily non-stop flights, one on LAB (727) and one on TACA (A319). Flights to other cities are sparse. I have no idea why there are only two daliy non-stop flights between LPB and LIM. I am flying there next month, and have to connect in CUZ to avoid spending 10+ hours in LIM. My first time to Bolivia, so I'm excited.

It doesn't surprise me at all that there aren't more than two flights. That's all the demand there is. When you get outside the "developed world," far fewer people fly. To show comparison, there are only two flights a day between Cairo and Amman (one each on RJ and MS), and same b/w AMM and BEY, and those three cities are among the biggest business cities in the Middle East.

That said, have a blast in Peru/Bolivia! I took a bus between CUZ and LPB back in 2001, it's long but beautiful. Those are two of my favorite cities in the world. I envy you - have fun!
 
Ratypus
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Sat Apr 02, 2005 2:22 am

I flew into LPB from sea level (not strictly recommended)....you definitely notice the altitude on first arriving: I felt really dizzy in the queue for immigration.

As for people dying - its possible, though I imagine you'd have to be pretty unfit or have a mild heart condition to trigger that sort of reaction.

The impression I got at LPB is that there simply isn't the demand to justify any more flights than go there already - the daily (at most, may even be only 3x week) flight I came in on - LAN from Arica - felt like a big event up there: there were no other aircraft movements at the time. The terminal is really small and run-down - I'm not sure how it would cope with an IB long-haul Airbus!

La Paz is a fantastic city though - I'd recommend the journey to anyone - even if you do have to change planes in LIM. And between ourselves....more flights is no bad thing, right?
 
miguel0881
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Sat Apr 02, 2005 9:37 am

Quoting Ratypus (Reply 15):
La Paz is a fantastic city though - I'd recommend the journey to anyone - even if you do have to change planes in LIM. And between ourselves....more flights is no bad thing, right?

This is very true...you can even enhance your trip if you have the time by flying to LIM...while I've flown straight from MIA to LPB, I've also traveled via LIM several times and either flown straight on to LPB on LB, or taken the scenic route by flying to Tacna (Peru), crossing to Arica and bussing to La Paz (Arica-La Paz, 8 hrs.) or visiting Nazca, Arequipa, Puno, etc. before coming into La Paz. Besides AA, many carriers fly from MIA-LIM...I've done Copa with a stopover in Panama City, and you can do Taca in SJO too. So if you like air travel and visiting new places, there are many interesting ways to get to LPB even if it isn't the world's busiest place!
 
Southamerica
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RE: Why Rare Flights To La Paz?

Sat Apr 02, 2005 1:35 pm

Quoting Miguel0881 (Reply 16):
I've done Copa with a stopover in Panama City, and you can do Taca in SJO too.

...or with Avianca via BOG too. It's in the way, short connection times, and one fair advantge over the other two airlines you mentioned: widebody aircraft on both BOG-LIM/LIM-BOG and BOG-MIA/MIA-BOG segments.

 cheerful 


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