Neo
Topic Author
Posts: 730
Joined: Sat Jan 06, 2001 8:21 am

TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Fri Apr 08, 2005 11:36 pm

According to a report in www.panrotas.com.br JJ's vice president, said that preparations are almost ready for JJ to start daily non-stop service to New York in October05.

JJ already has the aircraft, a A330 will arrive in the beginning of second semester, and government approval.

He says that the schedules should be loaded up into the system in the next 30 days and a codeshare agreement with AA is already in negotiation, to operate similarly to their one to MIA.

This is great news for JJ to inaugurate a new destination in the US. I guess, the so rumored flight GIG-MIA by JJ will have to wait...

Rgs,

Neo
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Fri Apr 08, 2005 11:44 pm

This is excellent news for the Brazil-US market, yet another flight!

TAM will provide top quality product for pax flying JFK-GRU, and most certainly will sideline RG which already flies this route daily with the B777.

This is the current overview of NYC-Brazil:

RG B777 daily JFK-GRU-GIG
AA B777 daily JFK-GRU-GIG
CO B767 daily EWR-GRU
JL B747 3 x week JFK-GRU

Great news indeed!

It also shows that JJ is getting closer to AA and, therefore, to join OW.

Rgs,
 
EddieDude
Posts: 6241
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RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sat Apr 09, 2005 12:48 am

This is very good news. I hope JJ's expansion plans continue since they are a world-class airline and they deserve to succeed.

A few weeks ago, in the wake of the termination of the JJ-AF partnership, some posts in a.net suggested that the codeshare with AA might also be terminated. The news posted by Rafa seems to indicate that this is not the case. Can anyone confirm that the JJ-AA relationship is moving forward?
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
MAH4546
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RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sat Apr 09, 2005 1:02 am

Quoting Neo (Thread starter):
This is great news for JJ to inaugurate a new destination in the US. I guess, the so rumored flight GIG-MIA by JJ will have to wait...

They have enough aircraft to operate both.
a.
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sat Apr 09, 2005 1:04 am

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 2):
Can anyone confirm that the JJ-AA relationship is moving forward?

We will have to wait for more precise information. It will depen on how the codeshare AA-JJ (for the new JJ flight GRU-JFK) will unfold. AA did not allow a codeshare for the second daily GRU-MIA JJ-operated flight. So there is some tension between both airlines.

It was indeed reported that JJ would terminate its codeshare with AA, the same way it did with AF and RG. However, there are also indications on the contrary, that JJ-AA cooperation is in fact improving. If JJ gets closer to AA you can be sure that JJ will be the next airline in OW. Although I myself would prefer to see JJ as part of Sky.

Rgs,
 
pualani
Posts: 282
Joined: Sun May 02, 2004 12:38 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sat Apr 09, 2005 5:25 am

I was in Sao Paulo GRU the other day and I saw a A330 with Etihad markings parked on the ramp. Is this a future aircraft for JJ ?



pualani
 
EddieDude
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RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sat Apr 09, 2005 10:37 am

I am sure the Brazilian a.netters will know better, but I think it might be. Actually, JJ leased some of its A332's to Etihad, so it may be one of those, rejoining the JJ fleet.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
miamix707
Posts: 3848
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RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sat Apr 09, 2005 11:41 am

Is TAM using the A330 in ETIHAD colors for its Miami flight too or is it just waiting to get rapainted back into TAM colors?
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sat Apr 09, 2005 7:01 pm

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 6):
Actually, JJ leased some of its A332's to Etihad, so it may be one of those, rejoining the JJ fleet.

You're correct. I think Etihad had about 3 ex-JJ leased A332s which are now being returned to JJ. Interesting fact about the lease is that the JJ A332s were leased to Etihad with pilots and crew included (they had to do an intensive course on Arab language, culture and customs)!

Quoting MIAMIx707 (Reply 7):
Is TAM using the A330 in ETIHAD colors for its Miami flight too or is it just waiting to get rapainted back into TAM colors?

They are waitig to get repainted into TAM colours. BTW, it would be great if TAM could change is livery....

Rgs,
 
PPVRA
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RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sun Apr 10, 2005 1:34 am

Quoting Pualani (Reply 5):
I was in Sao Paulo GRU the other day and I saw a A330 with Etihad markings parked on the ramp. Is this a future aircraft for JJ ?

I wish I could go there and see it...

Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 8):
Interesting fact about the lease is that the JJ A332s were leased to Etihad with pilots and crew included (they had to do an intensive course on Arab language, culture and customs)!

Called a "wet-lease"

Cheers,
PPVRA
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
hardiwv
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Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sun Apr 10, 2005 3:08 am

Quoting PPVRA (Reply 9):
Called a "wet-lease"

Tks for the technical word.

BTW, I think we could also expect JJ to fly to CCS by the end of the year. The flight would originate in ASU with a stop-over in GRU (ASU-GRU-CCS).

And what about the plans for the LIM-GRU flight?

Rgs,
 
glennpower
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RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sun Apr 10, 2005 2:18 pm

Excellent news,I flew MIA GRU yesterday with JJ and it was absolutely brilliant
(watch out for trip report soon with pics).
Also yesterday one of the stewards told me that the wet lease of 3 x 330-200s from JJ to Etihad was a great experience for jj staff involved,JJ and/or Etihad paid for relocation/housing etc.
Once more I can only say "TAM",you are a truly fantastic airline.
Well done.
 
AR1300
Posts: 1686
Joined: Mon Feb 07, 2005 1:22 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sun Apr 10, 2005 2:24 pm

Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 1):
JL B747 3 x week JFK-GRU

Japan Airlines flies to JFK from GRU?!!!!!What the heck?

Mike
You are now free to move about the cabin
 
PPVRA
Posts: 7878
Joined: Fri Nov 12, 2004 7:48 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sun Apr 10, 2005 2:28 pm

Quoting AR1300 (Reply 12):
Japan Airlines flies to JFK from GRU?!!!!!What the heck?

They gotta stop somewhere, no? It's a 3X weekly service and it's acutally a little shorter through JFK than LAX, by like 100nm.

Cheers,
PPVRA
"If goods do not cross borders, soldiers will" - Frederic Bastiat
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sun Apr 10, 2005 6:21 pm

Quoting AR1300 (Reply 12):
apan Airlines flies to JFK from GRU?!!!!!What the heck?

Why the surprise? Sao Paulo has the biggest Japanese population outside Japan, something about 5 million Japanese live in Sao Paulo. There is also a substantive population of Brazilian-Japanese (second and third generation) living in Japan.

VARIG flies to Japan for more than 40 years now. The complete itinerary of JAL's flight is NRT-JFK-GRU. RG flies NRT-LAX-GRU-GIG 4 x week. Many airlines operating in Brazil rely on high-yielding traffic Brazil-Japan, such as AC and LX.

Quoting Glennpower (Reply 11):
I flew MIA GRU yesterday with JJ and it was absolutely brilliant

I hope TAM keeps its international expansion.

Quoting Glennpower (Reply 11):
the wet lease of 3 x 330-200s from JJ to Etihad was a great experience for jj staff involved,JJ and/or Etihad paid for relocation/housing etc.

No wonder: they got top quality JJ crew and pilots.

Rgs,
 
EMB195ER
Posts: 253
Joined: Mon Sep 13, 2004 3:31 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sun Apr 10, 2005 9:26 pm

Hey guys!

I read in a Brazilian newspaper yeterday that in the second semester JJ will increase its flights to CDG from 10 to 14 per week, that is, two daily flights.

Hugs,

EMB195ER
 
Brasuca
Posts: 684
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 12:09 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sun Apr 10, 2005 9:35 pm

A bit off topic... But haven't JJ ever considered ordering A340s? They would be quite suitable in their CDG flights, for instance, which are underserviced. Also, they can surely fill more than 213 (A330) seats to NYC daily.

BTW, some JJ staff have complained about lots of JJ overbooked flights within Brazil, mainly BSB, where most of pax are connecting pax. They suggested TAM to order some A321 as well.  bigthumbsup 
Varig, Varig, Varig
 
hardiwv
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Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Sun Apr 10, 2005 10:29 pm

Quoting EMB195ER (Reply 15):
in the second semester JJ will increase its flights to CDG from 10 to 14 per week

This information is confirmed.

JJ will operate two daily flights GRU-CDG. The current France-Brazil bilateral is operating in its limit. Therefore, JJ will use 4 positions currently alocated to RG, which has been using them on the GIG-CDG route. RG dropped this route and the positions were then transfered to JJ.

This is the outlook for the France-Brazil market in the second semester:

CDG-GIG, daily AF B747
CDG-GRU, daily AF B777
CDG-GRU-POA, daily RG MD-11
CDg-GRU, 2 x daily, JJ A332

Total: 5 daily flights.

Rgs,

[Edited 2005-04-10 15:38:09]
 
glennpower
Posts: 92
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RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 12:36 am

So if JJ will have 2 x daily GRU-CDG, 2 x daily GRU-MIA plus 1 x daily GRU-JFK
starting October (obviously planned with the arrival of JJs 10th 332-200).
That i think will use all 10 of there 332-200s,so if in fact they are going to start a service to FRA or anywhere else for that matter,where will they get the planes for this,how quick for example does it take to buy/lease planes.

Best wishes.
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24600
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 2:28 am

Quoting Glennpower (Reply 18):
So if JJ will have 2 x daily GRU-CDG, 2 x daily GRU-MIA plus 1 x daily GRU-JFK
starting October (obviously planned with the arrival of JJs 10th 332-200).
That i think will use all 10 of there 332-200s,

Nope. Their MIA service requires only two planes, because on of the flights is a daylight, so the plane turns around, instead of sitting all day.

Also, on a side note, MIA-GRU is 13x weekly. They also fly MIA-SSA 1x a week.
a.
 
hardiwv
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RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 2:51 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 19):
Also, on a side note, MIA-GRU is 13x weekly. They also fly MIA-SSA 1x a week.

JJ flies MIA-GRU 13 x week and 1 x week (Saturdays) MIA-SSA-GRU.

Rgs,
 
JJMNGR
Posts: 924
Joined: Wed May 26, 2004 9:06 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 6:41 am

Some observations:

JJ has 04 A332 flying to Ethyhad. PT-MVA / MVB / MVD and MVE.

The one that returned now was MVB.

Yes, it is true JJ is working hard to put JFK on the air in OCT.

And CDG flights will increase from 10 to 14/week. There is also a big chance that 02 flights of these aditional frequecies go to ZRH and other 02 go to SPL...this is no so sure because crew movimentation and aircraft rotation ans to get these planes back, they have to leave GRU earlier that now....so it might not work this time but the plans are alive!
 
hardiwv
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RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 6:52 am

Quoting JJMNGR (Reply 21):
There is also a big chance that 02 flights of these aditional frequecies go to ZRH and other 02 go to SPL...t

When you write SPL you mean AMS = Schiphol Airport, Amsterdam, correct?

It would be completely G-R-E-A-T to see TAM landing in AMS...

1) AMS is Europe's 4th most important hub, after CDG, LHR and FRA;
2) AMS is the hub of JJ partner airline KLM and could provide JJ will onward connections to North Europe, Asia, the Middle Aast and Africa;
3) AMS is a major cargo airport, especially for fresh edible products and car parts, in which Brazil is a top exporter;
4) AMS is home to one of the top five major foreign investors in Brazil: The Netherlands, ensuring a dense, high-yielding business flux of pax year-around;
5) AMS is less than 2h by train to two of the World's biggest ports: Rotterdam and Antwerp, which have a number of offices of Brazilian multinational companies, and major cargo lines to Santos;
6) AMS has a substantive Brazilian community, including the fact that it houses one of Brazil's major private banks (ABN AMRO - Banco Real), and the Dutch, although small in number, are ranked number 8 as foreign tourists in Brazil;

JJ in AMS; I hope this dream could come true!

Hardi
 
Brasuca
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RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 7:07 am

Quoting JJMNGR (Reply 21):
is also a big chance that 02 flights of these aditional frequecies go to ZRH and other 02 go to SPL

Three different airlines connecting Brazil to Amsterdam? There isn't enough pax demand that justifies it, and AFAIK A330 is average regarding Cargo capacity (Correct me if I'm wrong).

Why not give a try to BRU that is not directly linked to Brazil nowadays or even LON, foreseeing a future direct non-stop flight?

 twocents 
Varig, Varig, Varig
 
hardiwv
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Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 7:26 am

Quoting Brasuca (Reply 23):
Why not give a try to BRU that is not directly linked to Brazil nowadays or even LON

AMS is Europe's 4th biggest airport and could easily handle three airlines on the route Brazil-AMS.

[not to mention that currently there are another three charter airlines connecting AMS with Northeast Brazil, with an additional 7 weekly flights. This is testimony of the amount of pax flying between AMS in Brazil].

Moreover, JJ would use AMS more as connecting hub for onwards KLM flights, the same way it uses CDG with AF.

BRU: very small airport, no worldwide connection or major cargo demand;
LON: the only airport worth landing for JJ is LHR. There are not slots available.

AMS has all the conditions to get at least two weekly JJ flights. ZRH also could support JJ flights.

Rgs,
 
Brasuca
Posts: 684
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 12:09 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 7:38 am

Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 24):
AMS is Europe's 4th biggest airport and could easily handle three airlines on the route Brazil-AMS.

I have never flown this route before, but according to reviews on loads in RG CDG-AMS leg, this is not worthy if consider pax revenue in it, only cargo.
Also, some months ago, some have said that KLM will increase flights to Brazil due to lack of AF available frequencies, although they (KL) have really good loads in this route.

Ok, a KL partnership in this route could help TAM considerably, but many of those business travellers prefer a non-stop link instead of one-stop, then connecting in Brazil. It would be too weary adding one stop to one connecting flight.

I don't really see AMS as that worthy destination for JJ if it is not non-stop.
Varig, Varig, Varig
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 7:46 am

Quoting Brasuca (Reply 25):
but according to reviews on loads in RG CDG-AMS leg, this is not worthy if consider pax revenue in it, only cargo.

This because RG has no partnership with KLM, and AMS is mainly a connecting hub. Still, the business/first seats + cargo are enough to make the small leg onward to AMS worthwhile! [some pax in AMS prefer flying with RG because KL does not offer First Class, which is something RG has. AMS also has a strong StarAlliance pax base, which ensures RG some high-yeilding traffic].

If JJ develops a more in-depth partnership with KLM, it could easily include AMS in its network.

KLM is now flying daily AMS-GRU nonstop, and loads have been reported excelent. I have inside information that about 25 pax are left (overbooking) on average every flight. Business class is FULL every single flight. Cargo is also excelent, with KL also operating B747 Cargo to CPQ/GRU.

In fact, JJ should seriously think in establishing nonstop flights GRU-AMS...but I dont think KL would see this with good eyes...it will depend on negotiations...
Once and for all, JJ has to make up its mind: OW or SkyTeam.

Rgs,
 
Brasuca
Posts: 684
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 12:09 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 7:55 am

Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 26):
some pax in AMS prefer flying with RG because KL does not offer First Class, which is something RG has

Now you beat me!  box 
KLM would outsell JJ's first class seats (only 7 each flight) to Brazil, as KL doesn't offer this service.

Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 26):
Once and for all, JJ has to make up its mind: OW or SkyTeam

How come JJ ended partnership with AF and keep theirs with KL?  Confused
Varig, Varig, Varig
 
Brasuca
Posts: 684
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 12:09 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 8:02 am

Quoting JJMNGR (Reply 21):
JJ has 04 A332 flying to Ethyhad. PT-MVA / MVB / MVD and MVE

I have found in airliners.net database that PT-MVB was flying with SAA. I never heard about this before. How come?  eek 

PT-MVB:

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Hannes Meyer
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Photo © Christian Galliker



PT-MVD and PT-MVE:

View Large View Medium
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Photo © Alexander Gill
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Simon Nicholls

Varig, Varig, Varig
 
dellatorre
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RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 8:31 am

I don't think TAM shoud consider AMS as a potential EU destination. AMS just doesn't have enough traffic that would justify this move. TAM should definately look foward to destination suchs as ZRH, FRA and FCO.

Anyways, JFK is by far the most important target for TAM right now. They have just the best product for NYC's high yielding passengers. RG, JAL and even AA don't match TAM's top quality onboard service.

BTW, does RG still have traffic rights to fly to Canada?? YYZ is in desperate need for some competition!
 
glennpower
Posts: 92
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 2:41 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 9:46 am

MAH4546,

Thanks for the correction,(not forgetting when I said 14 x services MIA to GRU
that included the weekly service with a stop in SSA).

Hardiwv,

The weekly service GRU-SSA-MIA and vice versa is on a Sunday and not a Saturday.

Cheers everyone.
 
Brasuca
Posts: 684
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 12:09 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 11:37 am

Quoting Dellatorre (Reply 29):
TAM should definately look foward to destination suchs as ZRH, FRA and FCO

None of those destinations should be considered as the most important ones.

  • ZHR: Not a good option at all! This niche market is mainly business pax in final destination GRU or EZE. They will undoubtly prefer SWISS non-stop flight over TAM (still unkown alien airline for Swiss) one-stop flight. Unless TAM uses this ZHR segment as a way of getting itself known in Switzerland;
  • FRA: TAM will make more money flying to Afghanistan than Germany (Star Alliance territory);
  • FCO: Varig and Alitalia (both code-share with each-other) discontinued flights from Rome to Brazil, concentrating in Milan (MXP). I see it as a result of a non-profitable route.

TAM top-destinations in Europe are definetly CDG, LON, BRU, MAD* and prooooobably AMS

* I'm pretty sure that, although the huge competition between Spain and Brazil (Iberia twice daily; Air Madrid; Varig + dozen of charters), TAM would quickly get spanish costumers' thumbs up and appreciation. TAM alone is way better than Iberia and Varig together. There is no more market FOR WHILE than these.

Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 26):
Once and for all, JJ has to make up its mind: OW or SkyTeam.

... AGREED!!!
All the markets to whether Europe or the US are full of codeshare agreement and TAM won't go on without closer partners.

Quoting Dellatorre (Reply 29):
BTW, does RG still have traffic rights to fly to Canada?? YYZ is in desperate need for some competition!

Don't expect that Varig would create competition to Canada. RG and AC control this route with Star Alliance monopoly.

All in all, TAM won't go any farther without joining an alliance. Competition is huge and even greater airlines need stronger partnership.
Varig, Varig, Varig
 
erikwilliam
Posts: 2122
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:30 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 8:49 pm

The minute TAM joins OW I´ll trow my Varig card and my credit card that gives Varig FF miles out the window.
Doesn´t matter how big U are, or how good your planes seats are, at the end, the average pax looks for ticket prices and if possible FF miles, wich is very reasonable, if U can get something back for your money, FF miles is a great thing.
Just a note, I was reading Isto É Dinheiro( a biz magazine), companies estimates that are 14trillion FF miles around with pax all over the world, pretty impressive ha???

Another thing, why flying from GRU to EU if competition is crazy, why not fight TP on northeast Brazil to EU, they´r all alone and making money like hell.

I think this one MAH or JJMNGR can answer, weren´t all the JFK gates taken to brazilian aircrafts???

I know that RG had 2, and was only using one, that´s why JJ got a gate??? Did RG lost it´s right for the 2nd, or JJ opend up a new gate, wich means aerican carriers will have one more gate in here also???

correct me if I´m wrong.

a nice week to us all.
Dida, Cafu, Lucio, Roque Junior, Roberto Carlo, Emerson, Ze Roberto, Ronaldinho, Kaka, Adriano, Robinho, Ronaldo
 
Brasuca
Posts: 684
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 12:09 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 9:19 pm

Quoting Erikwilliam (Reply 32):
I know that RG had 2, and was only using one, that´s why JJ got a gate??? Did RG lost it´s right for the 2nd, or JJ opend up a new gate, wich means aerican carriers will have one more gate in here also???

Brazilian's airlines have got the same number of frequencies to the US as American airlines have got to fly to Brazil. The problem is that American positions are being 100% used at the moment, while Brazilians carriers use only about half of their allowed flights to the US. There is still plenity of room for JJ and RG (why not G3?! Wink).

Can someone give some figures of this?

By the way, do JAL flights count on this bilateral?

Quoting Erikwilliam (Reply 32):
Another thing, why flying from GRU to EU if competition is crazy, why not fight TP on northeast Brazil to EU, they´r all alone and making money like hell

I believe that it would require a monstrous effort by TAM to promote their service between EU and Brazilian NE, as the traffic ranks greatly among europeans specially, also in onwards connections. Brazilians are not the target in these NE routes. Don't forget: TAM is as conservative as it goes!  Smile
Varig, Varig, Varig
 
erikwilliam
Posts: 2122
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:30 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 9:24 pm

thx

Quoting Brasuca (Reply 33):
By the way, do JAL flights count on this bilateral?

Don´t think JL counts, they´r not brazilian or american.
The route is NRT-JFK-GRU, JFK is a scale, maybe if they get some 777lr, we´ll see NRT-GRU direct.
Dida, Cafu, Lucio, Roque Junior, Roberto Carlo, Emerson, Ze Roberto, Ronaldinho, Kaka, Adriano, Robinho, Ronaldo
 
Brasuca
Posts: 684
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 12:09 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 9:44 pm

Quoting Erikwilliam (Reply 34):
maybe if they get some 777lr, we´ll see NRT-GRU direct

Opsss... B77LR could do this run, but with only about half of load and terribly weight-limited, yet with great possibilities that they'd need to refuel somewhere else frequently, as Japan often features tricky landings and take-offs, requiring even more aircraft's capability, thus not yielding enough.
Varig, Varig, Varig
 
JJMNGR
Posts: 924
Joined: Wed May 26, 2004 9:06 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 10:25 pm

Gents,

The possibility of flying to AMS is real but still a possibility and this service would not be direct. The plans are to extend the 04 aditional frequencies to CDG to some other destination(s) that might be AMS or ZRH.

LON is ahead but a little bit far away. The near intl flights forthcoming are 04 more to CDG and JFK. CCS and LIM might enter too.

Brasuca: TAM lease d 03 A332 to SA for only 02 months. After this period, both aircrafts joined the other 02 flying to Ethyhad. PT-MVB is back to cover the other 06 aircrafts checks C and after this period will not return to Ethyhad but will return on TAM´s line to cover the 04 aditional frequencies to CDG.

A brand new A332 (the 10th on the fleet) will be received next OCT and the plans to JFK becomes more real. I think that to operate JFK a domestic line with A332 should be cancelED (think REC daily).
 
erikwilliam
Posts: 2122
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 12:30 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Mon Apr 11, 2005 11:10 pm

JJMNGR: is Tam getting a new agreement on the gates or U´ll use the one that Varig doesn´t use??
If it´s a new agreement, how many slots did Tam purchased??
Dida, Cafu, Lucio, Roque Junior, Roberto Carlo, Emerson, Ze Roberto, Ronaldinho, Kaka, Adriano, Robinho, Ronaldo
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Tue Apr 12, 2005 2:34 am

Quoting JJMNGR (Reply 36):
The possibility of flying to AMS is real but still a possibility and this service would not be direct. The plans are to extend the 04 aditional frequencies to CDG to some other destination(s) that might be AMS or ZRH.

AMS is a market of great pontential, as I underlined above. It is a high-yielding market, suplemented by strong tourist demand. I would use the same words regarding ZRH.

If JJ wants to expand more in Europe it also needs to be part of an alliance.

Rgs,
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24600
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Tue Apr 12, 2005 3:42 am

Quoting Brasuca (Reply 31):
FCO: Varig and Alitalia (both code-share with each-other) discontinued flights from Rome to Brazil, concentrating in Milan (MXP). I see it as a result of a non-profitable route.

Alitalia flies FCO-GRU, non-stop.
a.
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Tue Apr 12, 2005 5:17 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 39):
alia flies FCO-GRU, non-stop

AZ flies MXP-GRU 5 x week and FCO-GRU 2 x week. RG and AZ focus on MXP exactly because FCO has lower returns than MXP. FCO is not a market for JJ. FCO is typically a low-yielding, tourist-oriented market. You cannot compare it with a market such as AMS.

Rgs,
 
Brasuca
Posts: 684
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 12:09 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Tue Apr 12, 2005 6:18 am

Hardiwv,

Thanks for clearing up things. I wasn't aware of those two weekly flights. I wonder if RG code-shares them as well. Moreover, can MXP be an alternative gateway to both French Riviera and Switzerland?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't MXP Italian financial centre too?  

[Edited 2005-04-11 23:19:14]
Varig, Varig, Varig
 
hardiwv
Posts: 4341
Joined: Sat Oct 09, 2004 11:30 pm

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Tue Apr 12, 2005 6:23 am

Quoting Brasuca (Reply 41):
I wonder if RG code-shares them as well

Yes, it does.

Quoting Brasuca (Reply 41):
Moreover, can MXP be an alternative gateway to both French Riviera and Switzerland?

MXP is a gateway for South Switzerland and Austria. I am not sure about France Riviera.

MXP is Italy's financial center, and located in one of Europe's richest regions.

Rgs,
 
Brasuca
Posts: 684
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2004 12:09 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Tue Apr 12, 2005 6:45 am

Quoting Hardiwv (Reply 42):
MXP is Italy's financial center, and located in one of Europe's richest regions.

Then maybe TAM should consider connecting ZRH to MXP in the very same flight, instead of backtracking ZRH passengers via CDG.  idea  Yet, they are probably neither in their near future's plans.
dreams..  crossfingers 
Varig, Varig, Varig
 
glennpower
Posts: 92
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 2:41 am

RE: TAM To Fly Non-stop To JFK In October

Tue Apr 12, 2005 12:09 pm

Brasuca,

I think you will find that with JJs present CEO they will be a lot more aggressive in starting new routes over the next few years,this I have heard from a fair few people,I personally hope so as I am a big JJ fan,(Much in the same way that I used to be with RG,6 to 8 times a year,flying LHR-GRU-SSA for the last 15 years),but times change and I want new aircraft,top service with a smile which JJ supply very well indeed).

Regards all.