leelaw
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Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Mon Apr 25, 2005 7:39 pm

Flight International 04/26/05:

"Carrier to boost capacity to cover expansion ahead of first 787 deliveries in 2008

Shanghai Airlines is seeking to purchase new Boeing 737s and 767-300ERs to aid its expansion ahead of delivery of its first 787s in 2008."

..."We are considering getting 737s and 767-300ERs before we take the first 787," says Shanghai Airlines chairman and chief executive Zhou Chi. "We need a few 767s," he adds, and the size of the order will depend on "whether the delivery slots match our needs."
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Mon Apr 25, 2005 7:58 pm

Considering Boeings order backlog for the B767, Shanghai could get some of them before the start of next year, if ordered shortly
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DeltaWings
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Mon Apr 25, 2005 8:04 pm

Why dont they opt for the 767-400ER? Its about as big as the 787s and 763 pilots can also fly the 764. Or is the 764 a tabu airliner?


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gigneil
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Mon Apr 25, 2005 8:10 pm

Because its an awful airplane.

N
 
Carpethead
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Mon Apr 25, 2005 8:12 pm

Perhaps Shanghai Airlines will be the final customer for the 767 too.

Boeing is sure racking up the orders. Shanghai Airlines is a Boeing only customer (mainline, they have a few CRJs) and unlike some of the other Chinese carriers that have all sorts of fleet types.
 
VivaGunners
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Mon Apr 25, 2005 8:18 pm

Yes, go for it, order some brand new 767.... I'm sure Boeing will be so glad that Shanghai could get a good price......
763 is still a good plane, you can still make money with that, also because when 787 will arrive there will be a good market for second hand 763s; I can see the plane could be very attractive for many charter carriers, expecially if it is still quite new and if they have not enough money to order 787/350....

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starrion
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Mon Apr 25, 2005 10:35 pm

If they order, Boeing would likely give them a very good price because it allows Boeing to delay the decision on the 767 line long enough for the military to decide if they want to go forward with the KC767.
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DAYflyer
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Tue May 03, 2005 2:59 am

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 3):
Because its an awful airplane

Based on what, exactly? Your expert evaluation?  irked 

Quoting VivaGunners (Reply 5):
763 is still a good plane, you can still make money with that, also because when 787 will arrive there will be a good market for second hand 763s; I can see the plane could be very attractive for many charter carriers, expecially if it is still quite new and if they have not enough money to order 787

I bet Boeing will practically give the 767 away now that there have been some cancellations.
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dutch122
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Tue May 03, 2005 3:18 am

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 3):
Because its an awful airplane


Flew it a couple of times between AMS-IAH & AMS-EWR (as also starting from tomorrow again on the AMS-EWR).
But have to say honestly that i prefer the B767-400 above the B767-300.
It flies just fine and very comfortable.

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N60659
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Tue May 03, 2005 3:21 am

Quoting Starrion (Reply 6):
If they order, Boeing would likely give them a very good price because it allows Boeing to delay the decision on the 767 line long enough for the military to decide if they want to go forward with the KC767.

You pulled the words right out of my mouth!!!  Silly
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Danny
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Tue May 03, 2005 3:22 am

So they will order new 767 for two years until 787 arrive? Tell me that there is no politics involved  Yeah sure
 
N1120A
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Tue May 03, 2005 3:32 am

Quoting DeltaWings (Reply 2):
Why dont they opt for the 767-400ER?

Not enough range.

Quoting DeltaWings (Reply 2):
Its about as big as the 787s and 763 pilots can also fly the 764.

The 788 is the same size as the 763, the 789 is the same size as the 764.

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 3):
Because its an awful airplane.

Oh come now Neil, you know better than that. For its range mission, the 764 has the best trip costs in its size class. Sure, it has 1000nm less range than its competitor and does not carry as much cargo, but it is much lighter and has lower fuel burn

Quoting Carpethead (Reply 4):
Perhaps Shanghai Airlines will be the final customer for the 767 too.

That will be the United States Air Force

Quoting Danny (Reply 10):
So they will order new 767 for two years until 787 arrive? Tell me that there is no politics involved

I don't really think there are. CAAC carriers have lots of experience flying 767s and the plane is very efficient. Add to that the used market for the aircraft and the fact that nearly 1000 planes don't just disappear over night and you get good economic reasons to order the plane. It is not like NH, JL, Kenya or Ethiopian are swapping 763ER deliveries just because they are getting 787s. 767s are available now and still offer excellent economics. Also, I doubt they are paying full price for these as Boeing has long since made a massive profit on the 767/757 program and is probably willing to sell for not much above cost simply to keep the line moving
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N60659
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Tue May 03, 2005 3:34 am

With the AI-AI spat going on, wouldn't this be a great time for Boeing to follow the same philosophy in selling to 9W and S2 in India?  angel 
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kc135topboom
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Tue May 03, 2005 3:47 am

Quoting DeltaWings (Reply 2):
Why dont they opt for the 767-400ER?



Quoting Gigneil (Reply 3):
Because its an awful airplane.

DL and CO seem to be happy with it. But what do they know?

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 7):
I bet Boeing will practically give the 767 away now that there have been some cancellations.

Boeing certinly will give them bargan basement prices.
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Tue May 03, 2005 8:48 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 11):
Quoting Carpethead (Reply 4):
Perhaps Shanghai Airlines will be the final customer for the 767 too.

That will be the United States Air Force

That may not happen. No one has guaranteed Boeing the KC-767A or the E-10A. If I were to bet on this, I'd say the KC-767 is cancelled (along with the proposed KC-330), but the E-10 is bought. The E-10A is based on the B-767-400 airframe, I believe.
 
mauriceb
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Tue May 03, 2005 9:52 pm

DL and CO seem to be happy with it. But what do they know?


think you actually mentioned a prove why it isn't a great aicraft, because only CO and DL orderd it , and since they are aiming to a mainline Boeing Fleet and because they already have 767's, its was clearly that tho's orderd it. Other airlines Didn't orderd it because they prefer the A330-300 or 777's, wich outperform the 767-400, some wich had other 767 models already:

US, AF (although they have A330-200's instead of 300's), RG (777A's), KQ, SAS, JAL, ANA, China airlines, My travel

and just some airlines wich prefered the A330-300 above 767-400ER's, without having any 767's in the fleet. Although the 767-400 came later..:

LH, NWA, Korean, CX, EK, Garuda and so it goes on
 
DeltaWings
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RE: Shanghai Plans Orders For 737s And 767s

Tue May 03, 2005 10:14 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 11):
Quoting DeltaWings (Reply 2):
Why dont they opt for the 767-400ER?

Not enough range.

OKay, but Shanghai has several 767-300s ( non ERs ) in their fleet, so range may not be that important for them. And the 767-400ER itself even has more range then the 767-300.
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