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BALandorLivery
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This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:04 am

I have seen cleaner aircraft parked up in the desert!


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What do you think?
 
MGA
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This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:07 am

Nice picture description...
Que viva el guaro, el dinero y los aviones!!!
 
dragon-wings
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This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:08 am

Looks like Air France has some competition for the title "Most dirtiest plane"   biggrin 

[Edited 2005-04-28 23:11:38]
Don't give up don't ever give up - Jim Valvano
 
jfkaua
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This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:08 am

where the hell was that flying too?!? obiously somwhere with a few factories/power plants on final
 
ACYWG
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This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:11 am

Mexico City much? Geez...that IS pretty ridiculous!
 
Cruiser
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This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:13 am

It looks just like it came from the desert!

Cruiser
Leahy on Per Seat Costs: "Have you seen the B-2 fly-by at almost US$1bn a copy? It has only 2 seats!"
 
Espion007
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This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:15 am

wow i guess iberia caught on to Air france's cleaning secret Big grin
Snakes on a Plane!
 
BOS2LAF
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This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:15 am

Man, I've seen cleaner AF planes (not even including the factory fresh ones). and when you can say that some of AF's planes are cleaner than one of yours, you know its time for a bath.
 
BNAflyer78
Posts: 256
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This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:15 am

Apparently Iberia is seriously competing with Air France!


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Long live the Widget!
 
KLMA330
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This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:16 am

Oh no, Iberia is stealing AF planes!! LOL  Wink
 
leelaw
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This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:16 am

The environmentalists gotta love it...tangible proof of water conservation. :0)
Lex Ancilla Justitiae
 
lanperu
Posts: 602
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This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:16 am

Ummm...I think as long as the inside of thier planes don't look like that then everything is ok! I mean it's not like the paint is chipping off or the metal peeling back. As long as my seat is clean and the aircraft smells good...I'm happy.
 
bongo
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RE: This Iberia A/c Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:18 am

A plane like that one looks really really unsafe...isn't it?
MDE: First airport in the Americas visited by the A380!
 
2H4
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:20 am

More shots of the filth....



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Photo © Luis Tena Orozco
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Photo © Juan Pablo Marini




 eyepopping 


2H4


Intentionally Left Blank
 
RICARIZA
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:41 am

Quoting Bongo (Reply 12):
A plane like that one looks really really unsafe...isn't it?

I was thinking the same thing..
I miss ACES, I am proud of AVIANCA & I am loyal to AMERICAN
 
LPLAspotter
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:45 am

Quoting Bongo (Reply 12):
A plane like that one looks really really unsafe...isn't it?

He's too busy making money for IB to be cleaned. I'll flyer, just give me a ticket.

LPLAspotter
Nuke the Gay Wales for Christ
 
rams777
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:47 am

Not too many differences in these two photos!!!



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Photo © Captain Akinwale Makinde


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Photo © Glenn Eldridge

 
AlitaliaMD11
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:57 am

You won't believe me when I say that I have seen more then a couple of clean Iberia aircraft.

A319s (some)
A340-300s (some)
A340-600s (almost all)
No Vueling No Party
 
Sabena332
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 6:59 am

I could never understand why people are making such a big deal about a dirty aircraft. Does dirt on the outside have any influence on the safety or the comfort?

Patrick
NZ1's mother is a disgusting crack-whore and his father is a worthless alcoholic!
 
Birdwatching
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 7:04 am

During my internship at GlobeGround Ecuador at UIO, we handled the MAD flight every afternoon. I can tell you, it came dirty every single time. And no, is wasn't always the same a/c. All of them were that way.
All the things you probably hate about travelling are warm reminders that I'm home
 
trintocan
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 7:13 am

Yes, those IB planes look very dirty. While that would hopefully have no effect on their safety the truth is that it presents a very poor image of the airline. If one for instance were to go to an agency to rent a car and visited one with clean and shiny cars, then went to another with cars covered in dirt and dust, who would you rent from? Yes, what's under the hood counts too but the first impression can be very important.

TrintoCan... I have to fly them next month...
Hop to it, fly for life!
 
Guest

RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 7:21 am

It reminds me of an old Iberia advertising slogan from the 1960's...

IBERIA...Where only the plane gets more attention than you!
 
gkirk
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 7:33 am

It tends to be A340s that are dirty a/c. Is it because of their crappy climb performance that they pick up more dirt from the ground?  Silly
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
bohica
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 7:43 am

Dirty airplanes not only presents a negative image of an airline, but it costs an airline money. Dirt causes drag on the plane as well as adding weight to the plane. This results in increased fuel burn.
 
AirNZ
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 7:43 am

Such a total nonsensical, and trivial, thread!!
Honestly, do some of you have nothing to do but gripe or find fault with the most trivial things?
We are supposed to be aviation enthusiasts here.......yet some have the stupidy to question if dirty paintwork on an aircraft makes it unsafe????????
Oh please! get real......or better still, grow up!
Flown:F27/TU134/Viscount/Trident/BAC111/727/737/747/757/767/777/300/310/320/321/330/340/DC9/DC10/Dash8/Shorts330/BAe146
 
TACAA320
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 7:50 am

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 18):
Does dirt on the outside have any influence on the safety or the comfort?

I will never go to a restaurant that obviously looks dirty from outside. Do you? Some things "enter" throught the eyes.
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
Xkorpyoh
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 7:50 am

I have seen those IB 340 a couple of times in SCL and they do look like that.
 
senorcarnival
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 7:58 am

Quoting TACAA320 (Reply 25):
I will never go to a restaurant that obviously looks dirty from outside. Do you? Some things "enter" throught the eyes.

What if someone told you, "Taca, this little restaurant is awesome, it's dirty outside, but the food is delicious!" Would you go then? Now, let's put it into this scenario, say someone said, "Taca, [insert airline that you feel has great service] this airline is awesome, their planes are filthy, but their service is great!" Would you not fly that airline solely based on the fact they don't clean their planes too often?
Sure, it may add weight and cause additional burning of fuel, but wouldn't the price of washing them offset those costs? I have no idea how much it costs to wash an Airbus 340, but I can only imagine it takes a lot of water and time.
Oh no, she's getting impatient! Take a stab at it!
 
wingman
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 8:03 am

It certainly doesn't do much for an airline's image or perception of quality. I guess some on this thread would rent a car covered in bird crap and think nothing of it. Think about it, if you board a plane with an atrocious exterior appearance it must lead some people to think where else maitenance costs are being cut.
 
IBERIA747
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 8:04 am

Having flown on them 10 times in the last 2 years, I can tell you they are completely different on the inside. Even have pics...
¡¡VIVA ESPAÑA!!
 
Sabena332
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 8:04 am

Quoting TACAA320 (Reply 25):
I will never go to a restaurant that obviously looks dirty from outside. Do you?

Yes, because the cook is not the cleaner of the facade!

As I already wrote, a dirty aircraft is not unsafe and the dirt outside the aircraft is absulutely irrelevant regarding the onboard service which is after the safety the most important thing for me as a passenger.

Quoting AirNZ (Reply 24):
We are supposed to be aviation enthusiasts here.......yet some have the stupidy to question if dirty paintwork on an aircraft makes it unsafe????????
Oh please! get real......or better still, grow up!

I agree 100%!

Patrick
NZ1's mother is a disgusting crack-whore and his father is a worthless alcoholic!
 
SWISSER
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 8:18 am

Consider this,

long range planes fly almost 20 hours a day,
they "work" almost 2.5 times more than some of us do (normal jobs off course!not aviation related jobs  Wink)

And when you see a healthy dirty aircraft (horizontal dirt stripes on the fuselage etc.)like this IB aircraft you can see it is a true workhorse!

I love such dirt on aircraft!To me this is the sign that this plane is used and fly's a lot,and a plane on the ground gets older faster!So I feel safe on them too!
What time is top of descent?
 
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BALandorLivery
Topic Author
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 8:26 am

Quoting SWISSER (Reply 32):
And when you see a healthy dirty aircraft (horizontal dirt stripes on the fuselage etc.)like this IB aircraft you can see it is a true workhorse!

Nobody is suggesting that dirty aircraft are unsafe!

But if all the other airlines (apart from air france) can keep their aircraft clean, why can't Iberia?

It just presents a bad image. When passengers sit in a departure lounge and see an a dirty aeroplane, they may get a bad impression of the company.
 
Xkorpyoh
Posts: 727
Joined: Fri Oct 29, 2004 12:55 am

RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 8:28 am

would they benefit from a shiny bare silver look like AA or keep cleaning the white?
 
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SQ773
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 8:30 am

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 18):
I could never understand why people are making such a big deal about a dirty aircraft. Does dirt on the outside have any influence on the safety or the comfort?

Patrick

Not at all, Sabena332, but you know that THIS would be unthinkable on a LH or LX airplane.

Just search for any photo and show it, if you can...

Although a private carrier, IB still is a little bit of an "embassador" of Spain wherever one of those big planes go, so no comments...
 
TACAA320
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 8:40 am

Quoting Senorcarnival (Reply 28):
What if someone told you, "Taca, this little restaurant is awesome, it's dirty outside, but the food is delicious!" Would you go then?

Only if I trust that someone.

Quoting Senorcarnival (Reply 28):
"Taca, [insert airline that you feel has great service] this airline is awesome, their planes are filthy, but their service is great!"

IB service is great... Uhmmmmmmmmmmmmm

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 31):
Yes, because the cook is not the cleaner of the facade!

Of course. But I still prefer a clean one. In and out.
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
Jamie757
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 8:46 am

I must admit, flying on a plane that's as filthy as that wouldn't exactly fill me with confidence (I'm sure many would disagree with me), but the impression that I get from seeing that is a bad one. If they can't even be arsed to clean it, then what else can't they be arsed to do?!

Of course, it's probably a different story on the inside, which is what matters to the paying passenger..... I think I'll leave it there!

Rgds
"I feel like a turkey who's just caught Bernard Matthews grinning at him!"
 
OH-LGA
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 8:50 am

Yes, dirty aircraft certainly do not in any way usually reflect the airworthiness of an aircraft.

But, nonetheless, popular opinion among the general public follow exactly the lines posted by other users. A dirty airplane = unreliable in most people's minds. It may not be true, but it's their thoughts.

Kai
Head in the clouds... yet feet planted firmly on the ground.
 
Sabena332
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 8:55 am

Quoting SQ773 (Reply 35):
Not at all, Sabena332, but you know that THIS would be unthinkable on a LH or LX airplane.

LH don't need dirty planes to be a disgrace, they are anyway.

Patrick
NZ1's mother is a disgusting crack-whore and his father is a worthless alcoholic!
 
2H4
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 10:24 am

It all comes down to pride and professionalism. Funny how some people here think it's stupid to be concerned about the outward appearance of an aircraft. I wonder how they would feel if their pilots showed up unshaven, unshowered, and wearing filthy, stained clothes?

Oh, wait....it doesn't affect the safety, so it must not matter...  Yeah sure







Quoting AirNZ (Reply 24):
Honestly, do some of you have nothing to do but gripe or find fault with the most trivial things?

....Like griping about and finding fault with what other people are griping about?  wink 



2H4


Intentionally Left Blank
 
GQfluffy
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 11:17 am

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 40):
I wonder how they would feel if their pilots showed up unshaven, unshowered, and wearing filthy, stained clothes?

Not to knock my own airline...but I see this more often then not when the flight crew only has 8 hrs of turnaround from the previous flight the night before. Sometimes it's pretty sad...

fluffy
This isn't where I parked my car...
 
PapaNovember
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 11:26 am

Quoting SWISSER (Reply 32):
And when you see a healthy dirty aircraft (horizontal dirt stripes on the fuselage etc.)like this IB aircraft you can see it is a true workhorse!

Those "dirt stripes" are vertical, not horizontal. That plane has been sitting somewhere it rains a lot and has very polluted air - like Mexico City.

If you review the photo's of that specific plane, it's Zebra stripes started showing up in September of last year!
 
nikrc
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Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 9:45 am

RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 11:28 am

This is how clean an airliner should be:


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Photo © Michael W. Rosa



Of course an planes worthiness is not limited if it's dirty (You should see my 1978 Cessna 152 I train in, boy I wish I could just repaint it with spray cans from wal mart, but she still flies beautifully) But in the end when you see an airliner like ibera's a340, you automatically think, better not book with that airline...


-Nik
 
SLC1
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 11:38 am

Quoting Senorcarnival (Reply 28):
What if someone told you, "Taca, this little restaurant is awesome, it's dirty outside, but the food is delicious!" Would you go then?

This is probably the case with Iberia. Image doesn't necessarily reflect truth in safety, one does not cause the other, but image can be a good indicator nonetheless. But taking the image for nothing more than face value, a person would never know what the maintenance quality was on the a/c except by what he can see. If the airline can't keep their planes clean (especially to such a horrible extent), why should someone assume they can keep them safe? There's a difference between a few scuffs and that. Honestly, for an airline like Iberia, there's simply no excuse for something like that unless it flew through a tornado. AF & DL need to learn this concept as well.
We're gonna do what we like to call a "jetBlue how do you do", which is slang for dumping a bunch of fuel in the ocean
 
TACAA320
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 12:00 pm

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 31):
a dirty aircraft is not unsafe and the dirt outside the aircraft is absulutely irrelevant regarding the onboard service which is after the safety the most important thing for me as a passenger.

Where did I said so?

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 40):
Funny how some people here think it's stupid to be concerned about the outward appearance of an aircraft.

Is not funny nor stupid. It's logic that people like to see clean aircrafts. As we do with our own cars and houses.

Quoting 2H4 (Reply 40):
it doesn't affect the safety, so it must not matter

We all know that. The original thread didn't mention anything about safety.
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
Aircellist
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Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 8:43 am

RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 12:25 pm

Well, SSSOOOOOO easy to bash AF and every other airline whose color is predominantly white.

The fact is: the air is dirty! Has no one ever noticed that a car needs cleaning after a rain, more often than before?

On a side note, we are actually breathing that same dirty crap as well.

...so, in order to have those magnificent machines a little bit cleaner, maybe we could start thinking about reducing pollution? Just for our eye's pleasure, of course...
"When I find out I was wrong, I change my mind. What do you do?" -attributed to John Maynard Keynes
 
Bridogger6
Posts: 664
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2005 11:21 am

RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 12:33 pm

Quoting Aircellist (Reply 46):
Well, SSSOOOOOO easy to bash AF and every other airline whose color is predominantly white.

I can see where you'd think that.. but you don't see anyone bashing continental, or HP, or any other white colored airline of which there are MANY... do you?
 
Aircellist
Posts: 1242
Joined: Fri Oct 08, 2004 8:43 am

RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 12:58 pm

Well, Bridogger, you are right...

This one only has the airbridge marks around the forward door:

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Photo © Nathan Zalcman



This one only has a little spot under the horizontal tailplane:

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Photo © Paul Leach



So, I must have been wrong, I admit... AF and IB's planes are a disgrace to the aviation community.

Then, either:
-HP, CO's planes are indeed washed more often, or
-the photographers have a bias, and will not take pictures of dirty HP, CO planes, or
-in the case of HP, their planes could be going to less polluted cities (smaller planes flying between smaller towns, as opposed to the big urban basins to which long-haulers fly), or
-AF does voluntarily make its planes dirty, for an unknown reason.

[Edited 2005-04-29 06:04:45]
"When I find out I was wrong, I change my mind. What do you do?" -attributed to John Maynard Keynes
 
Aircellist
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 1:06 pm

oooops, I missed this one...

A few months ago, someone bashed AF for having dirty flaps, from a picture taken from a landing in Beijing.. Was it this picture?


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Photo © Andrew Morrell

"When I find out I was wrong, I change my mind. What do you do?" -attributed to John Maynard Keynes
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: This Iberia Aircraft Is A Disgrace!

Fri Apr 29, 2005 1:23 pm

Quoting OH-LGA (Reply 38):
Yes, dirty aircraft certainly do not in any way usually reflect the airworthiness of an aircraft.

Exactly.But the Flying public dont realise that.
I guess Regular cleaning is a necessity.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)