matt
Posts: 677
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 1:36 am

AC Jazz CRJ-705

Sun May 08, 2005 2:02 am

I just saw an Air Canada Jazz CRJ-705 land in YQM (Moncton, NB). Does anyone know when they entered service? Or the routes they are deployed on. This must be one of the first ones in the fleet.
Next flights: YQM-YYZ-YOW v.v. / YQM-CUN v.v. / YQM-YUL-YWG v.v. / YSJ-YYZ-SEA-SFO / SFO-YYZ-YOW-YQM / YQM-YYZ-MUC-TXL /
 
ACYWG
Posts: 259
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2005 7:20 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Sun May 08, 2005 4:28 am

They're not actually supposed to start service until sometime in June. Perhaps its a delivery flight to AC and they're gonna spend the next month on test flights? Who knows.
 
matt
Posts: 677
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 1:36 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Sun May 08, 2005 5:15 am

Actually, I just checked the press release on AC Jazz's site (www.flyjazz.com) and it says that the CRJ-705 would be put into service in May. I also saw on another website that C-GJAZ and C-FBJZ, both CRJ-705s, were slated for delivery in May 2005. So I take it that they've been delivered and are being used on select flights. Basically, I've answered my initial question!  Wink Any more information, however, would be appreciated.
Next flights: YQM-YYZ-YOW v.v. / YQM-CUN v.v. / YQM-YUL-YWG v.v. / YSJ-YYZ-SEA-SFO / SFO-YYZ-YOW-YQM / YQM-YYZ-MUC-TXL /
 
Allee
Posts: 499
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 1999 5:47 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Sun May 08, 2005 5:21 am

From yyznews:

Jazz Air are expecting to take delivery of the first two CRJ-705s in late May and initial plans (subject to change) are to utilize them from Calgary to Vancouver and Calgary to Houston routes.
 
FriendlySkies
Posts: 3540
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RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Sun May 08, 2005 5:48 am

Any pics? The CRJ-705 is the same size as the CRJ-900, isn't it?
 
RedDragon
Posts: 1096
Joined: Sat Jul 03, 2004 2:24 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Sun May 08, 2005 5:59 am

It is indeed - it's effectively just a CRJ900 with a lower-density (ie. two-class) layout.

Rich
 
radialman
Posts: 32
Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2001 3:39 pm

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Sun May 08, 2005 8:01 am

The winglets are also a little different.They are more spreadout,adding another 5.8 ft to the wing spam and also swept back a bit more.The cabin will have around 34 in seat pitch.Its a whole new adventure for Jazz.
 
PDPsol
Posts: 1109
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RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Sun May 08, 2005 8:04 am

Why is AC introducing new CRJ200's into its MAINLINE fleet [along with the new E175s and E190s]? I know AC's existing CRJs are being transferred to Jazz, but AC has [apparently] ordered 50 new CRJ200's for its mainline fleet.
 
ac7e7
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Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2004 7:27 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Sun May 08, 2005 8:33 am

Quoting Pdpsol (Reply 7):
but AC has [apparently] ordered 50 new CRJ200's for its mainline fleet.

AC did not order 50 more CRJ-200s. All mainline CRJ-100s are being transfered to Jazz. Jazz has ordered CRJ-200s on its own. Jazz is expecting 15 CRJ-705s and I believe 15 more CRJ-200s.

AC is receiving the Embraers.
 
AC787
Posts: 330
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RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Sun May 08, 2005 3:17 pm

All of these new CRJ-705's will have PTV's right?
 
radialman
Posts: 32
Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2001 3:39 pm

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Sun May 08, 2005 7:44 pm

not right away.They will get PTV`s at a later stage.
 
CRJ900
Posts: 1937
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RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Sun May 08, 2005 9:45 pm

Does the CRJ705 have full hot galleys as well so they can offer full meals and drinks services or will in-flight service be pretzels only?
Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
 
chrisa330
Posts: 545
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 1999 10:24 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 2:25 am

For those who care, AC now has the CRJ705 on its fleet page, including a seat map. EMB175 is also posted

http://www.aircanada.com/en/about/fleet/crj705.html

http://www.aircanada.com/en/about/fleet/embraer-175.html
 
CRJ900
Posts: 1937
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RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 3:08 am

ChrisA330: thanx for the tip - had to have a browse.

And I wonder: BBD list the CRJ705 as having a range of 3,700 kms but AC list the range as 2,400 kms - why???

Also, the CRJ705 only have 2 overwing exits according to the seatmap (instead of 4). At how many pax/seat numbers must they install the other 2?

The CRJ705 and EMB175 are virtually identical in seat # and range - how can that be economical, sans the CF34-8C/8E engines?
Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
 
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yyz717
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RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 3:31 am

I still cannot get over the operational lunacy of an airline ordering both 75-seat CRJ-705's for its commuter wing and 73-seat ERJ-175's for the mainline. It's operationally inefficient. No financials will ever justify this nonsense.
I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
PDPsol
Posts: 1109
Joined: Fri Feb 20, 2004 5:09 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 3:33 am

Quoting AC7E7 (Reply 8):
All mainline CRJ-100s are being transfered to Jazz. Jazz has ordered CRJ-200s on its own. Jazz is expecting 15 CRJ-705s and I believe 15 more CRJ-200s.

While the new AC Jazz CRJ200s only number 15, is AC's plan to eventually replace all its CRJ100s [including all the transferred AC examples] with newly-ordered CRJ200s??

So, AC Jazz will eventually [I suppose] fly an all CRJ fleet once [or if] the DHC-8-100 and DHC-8-300 examples are phased out? Of course, the five B1900Ds may continue their "puddle-jumper" status!
 
CO737800
Posts: 514
Joined: Tue Dec 30, 2003 6:53 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 3:42 am

I hope that before they put the PTV's on the CRJ 700 they put them on the A320 and A319s
 
AirWillie6475
Posts: 2372
Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2005 1:45 pm

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 3:43 am

Finally some other company is flying the crj900.
 
ac7e7
Posts: 655
Joined: Mon Oct 25, 2004 7:27 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 7:11 am

Quoting Yyz717 (Reply 14):
I still cannot get over the operational lunacy of an airline ordering both 75-seat CRJ-705's for its commuter wing and 73-seat ERJ-175's for the mainline. It's operationally inefficient. No financials will ever justify this nonsense.

Jazz is a separate company from Air Canada. The CRJs are cheaper to fly than the Embraer 175s. Jazz will be able to utilize these jets on the smaller routes while AC will have the the 175s for flights like YUL-LGA. They will offer more comfortable seating. AC already ordered the 190 and they felt they needed a 75 seater in their mainline that would offer big-jet comfort for the passenger while offering the airline great fuel efficiency as well as commonality with its 190s.

Quoting Pdpsol (Reply 15):
While the new AC Jazz CRJ200s only number 15, is AC's plan to eventually replace all its CRJ100s [including all the transferred AC examples] with newly-ordered CRJ200s??

AC is nor replacing its -100s with -200s. They are simply transfering their CRJs (which happen to be 100 series) to Jazz (who happen to have the -200 series). AC will operate the new Embraer 175/190s while Jazz will operate the 100/200 and 705s.

A number of Dash-9s will be retired, but not the entire fleet. There have been rumours that Jazz was looking into the new Q-Series Dash-8s, but I think they were only rumours.

Quoting CRJ900 (Reply 11):
not right away.They will get PTV`s at a later stage.

I thought they were coming with them already installed?
 
EnviroTO
Posts: 723
Joined: Sat Aug 07, 2004 12:11 pm

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 7:47 am

Quoting AC7E7 (Reply 18):
I thought they were coming with them already installed?

That's what I thought too and it makes sense to do it before they enter service rather than messing around with all the seats later. Have they dilly-dallied too long making a decision on the IFE vendor?
 
CXYYZ
Posts: 177
Joined: Sun Mar 20, 2005 4:36 pm

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 8:01 am

Quoting Pdpsol (Reply 15):
once [or if] the DHC-8-100 and DHC-8-300 examples are phased out?

As long as AC Jazz wish to continue operating from YTZ, they'll keep the turboprops around as jets are not permitted at Toronto City Centre airport.

Quoting Yyz717 (Reply 14):
still cannot get over the operational lunacy of an airline ordering both 75-seat CRJ-705's for its commuter wing and 73-seat ERJ-175's for the mainline

I believe one of the explanations for the order split at the time it was announced was delivery slots. AC wanted a relatively large number of RJs and neither Bombardier nor Embraer were able to deliver the entire order within the timeline set by AC.
 
chrisa330
Posts: 545
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 1999 10:24 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 9:02 am

Quoting EnviroTO (Reply 19):
That's what I thought too and it makes sense to do it before they enter service rather than messing around with all the seats later. Have they dilly-dallied too long making a decision on the IFE vendor?

The only IFE system currently certified in Canada is Westjet's ExpressVu Live TV. As a result anything AC chooses has to be certified by Transport Canada. Considering there's quite few aircraft types to be certified on, this is not a small task.
 
fallingeese
Posts: 2031
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2001 2:33 pm

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 9:36 am

Does anybody know where the CRJ-700 is at now, and where it's journey will be taking it in the next few days?
Mark McWhirter...Contrails Photography
 
Mark_D.
Posts: 1360
Joined: Wed Aug 01, 2001 9:55 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 10:33 am

Yyz717--I still cannot get over the operational lunacy of an airline ordering both 75-seat CRJ-705's for its commuter wing and 73-seat ERJ-175's for the mainline. It's operationally inefficient. No financials will ever justify this nonsense.

What might you intend to do about it, then?  Smile


It is kinda quirky to be sure but then I guess they just had too much domestic political pressure to go All-Embraer.
 
chrisa330
Posts: 545
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 1999 10:24 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 10:38 am

AC adjusted their original BBD order downwards by 15 airframes. My guess is that AC got a steal of a deal with the EMB175s to be the launch customer, and in doing so they also fulfilled their obligations with ACPA. Of course who really knows, that's just my thought.
 
spyderz
Posts: 624
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2001 8:06 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 10:49 am

The sole reason Bombardier and Embraer both received orders is due to labour issues. By having two seperate fleets, both companies can operate a seperate aircraft type. Air Canada would have had a labour relations nightmare if they just ordered CRJ's or EMB's.
 
sebring
Posts: 1320
Joined: Sat Jul 24, 2004 12:08 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 11:37 am

Quoting Yyz717 (Reply 14):
I still cannot get over the operational lunacy of an airline ordering both 75-seat CRJ-705's for its commuter wing and 73-seat ERJ-175's for the mainline. It's operationally inefficient. No financials will ever justify this nonsense.


The 705 has a great deal of commonality with the CRJ-200, and it has more range than the 175. For the kind of flying the CRJ-705 is projected to do, like Toronto-Saskatoon or Calgary-Houston, the 175 would be insufficient and the E190 too large. The 705 is being used for quasi-mainline trunk routes while the 175 is being used as a hub-supplementer, taking over off-peak flights on routes like YUL-ORD and YUL-LGA and freeing up Airbuses for more remunerative missions. Each of these three planes - the CRJ-705, EMB-175 and EMB-190 - has an optimized mission. The E190 is a 93-seater with near-transcon range. It has more seating capacity than either the CR7 or E175. It would be too big for some of the routes on which AC plans to fly a CR7, which is only practical for longer flights by virtue of taking a CR900 frame and giving it only 75 seats.

The E175 is a short-to-medium haul aircraft, with great cabin attributes that mimic the interior of the A319 for spaciousness, but not the range to do routes like YYZ-YQR with a full payload. If the E175 had gone to Jazz instead of the CR7, AC would have had to put an E190 (or leave the A319) on a route like YYC-IAH: both are too big for that route. Finally, the E175, E190 and CR7 all use deratives of the GE-34 engine family. The E175 and CR7 use GE34 derivatives that are virtually identical except - if I recall correctly - except for the operation of the thrust reversers, because one type is rear mounted and the other wing-mounted. The E175 would not be suitable for Jazz unless Embraer chose to bring out a longer range version which, to date, it has not. The CR7 is suitable for the long, thin-density city pairs envisioned. The Embraers have no commonality with the CRJ-200s, so if AC had ordered the EMB-175 for Jazz, there would be less commonality within Jazz than with an all CRJ fleet.

The only way to have done better from the standpoint of commonality would have been for AC to buy only Bombardier, no Embraer, for both Jazz and mainline, but then instead of the passenger friendly E190, you would have had the 86-95 seat niche handled by CR9s with 90 passengers and smaller seat pitch, not nearly as customer friendly as the E190s with 33 inch pitch. And since AC is ordering so many Embraers overall, there are great economies of scale.

I submit that it is better economics to match the plane to the mission, and give customers their preferred aircraft where feasible than it is to assign planes that are too large or too small for that mission. The added commonality virtues you talk of - especially considering you have virtual 100% engine commonality based on the GE-34 - pale against the economics of putting too large or too small a plane on a route.
 
CRJ900
Posts: 1937
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:48 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 5:22 pm

I just noticed on the CRJ705 info page at AC: the picture is of a CRJ701 - a standard -700 and there are 66 seats in economy instead of 65.

Shouldn't there be a "real" -705 available with paint by now - they are supposed to be delivered this month?

And will AC block the 66th Y seat on every flight so that the max number of pax never exceeds 75? Is the 66th seat a dedicated crew rest seat?
Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
 
miami1
Posts: 652
Joined: Wed Feb 28, 2001 10:31 pm

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Mon May 09, 2005 8:49 pm

I assumed that perhaps seat 12B would not exist due to the offsest in the aisle between J and Y. Sometimes airlines do this so as to limited the amount of space between J and Y but keep up with regulatory requirements.

Spirit Airlines on the M80 is one example. QF on some 146s is another. Also the European airlines with convertible seating (6 to 5 seats abreast) where the first row of Y is always 5 across also.

Is the 75 seat limit a scope limit imposed by unions? In that case the 'spare seat' thing makes sense.
 
Arrow
Posts: 2325
Joined: Wed Jun 19, 2002 7:44 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Tue May 10, 2005 12:02 am

Anyone have any efficiency numbers comparing the CRJ705 with the E175? And if the 705 has a 34 inch seat pitch, is the Embraer that much more comfortable?
Never let the facts get in the way of a good story.
 
HiFi
Posts: 189
Joined: Fri Apr 29, 2005 5:36 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Tue May 10, 2005 12:26 am

Quoting Arrow (Reply 29):
Anyone have any efficiency numbers comparing the CRJ705 with the E175? And if the 705 has a 34 inch seat pitch, is the Embraer that much more comfortable?

Get inside a E175 if you can... I'm 2m tall and I can walk the aisle without having to put my chin against my chest. seats are wider, aisle is wider. Head clearance when you're seating on a window seat is a lot better. And windows are larger. I have no problems with the CRJ 700, but the E175 is just more spacious. Believe me...  Wink
no commercial potential
 
Samurai 777
Posts: 2000
Joined: Thu Jan 27, 2000 2:56 pm

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Fri May 13, 2005 2:13 am

This is it - the 1st pic of a CRJ-705 in AC Jazz colors! Big grin


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Eric Fortin - AirImages

 
fallingeese
Posts: 2031
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2001 2:33 pm

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Fri May 13, 2005 3:13 am

Does anybody know the schedule, and day the plane will be put on it's first routes.
Mark McWhirter...Contrails Photography
 
chrisa330
Posts: 545
Joined: Mon Oct 18, 1999 10:24 am

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Fri May 13, 2005 3:22 am

The main routes that it'll be put on are the Texas routes:

YYC-IAH June 1 replacing A319
YYZ-IAH July 1 replacing CRJ200
YYZ-DFW August 1 replacing CRJ200

You'll see it on other shorthauls too...YYZ-LGA, EWR etc.
 
fallingeese
Posts: 2031
Joined: Sat Apr 28, 2001 2:33 pm

RE: AC Jazz CRJ-705

Fri May 13, 2005 5:55 am

So where is it going to be for the next 3 weeks if it starts service on June 1st?
Mark McWhirter...Contrails Photography

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