squirrel83
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BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 10:54 am

Does anyone know what routes will be added in the US?

He told reporters the airline had identified 14 other potential long-haul destinations including Hong Kong; Johannesburg and Cape Town in South Africa; Narita in Japan; and destinations in the United States.

Bishop told reporters the airline was in talks with aircraft manufacturers including Boeing and Airbus on possible fleet expansion. The airline has options to add to its existing fleet of three Airbus A330 aircraft.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/story/0,3604,1482894,00.html
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behramjee
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 11:12 am

New slots at NRT are virtually impossible to obtain so it'll be interesting to see how that fizzles out.

Yes HKG-JNB-CPT are all viable options but in order to compete effectively with BA-VS-CX-SAA respectively on these routes, BMI has to fly minimum daily frequencies especially to HKG and JNB.

BMI should also look at cities where there is lots of demand but doesnt see any BA/VS service from LHR i.e LAHORE, Pakistan. PIA flies 4 weekly B 747s (3 B 743s and 1 B74M) LHE-LHR-LHE nonstop and has year round 85% load factors on these flights even in J class. And this figure doesnt include the 1000s too that fly EK/GF/QR/KU via Arabia to LHR. With BMIs extensive EU-UK and trans-atlantic network via UAL codeshare from LHR, a 4 weekly A 332 LHR-LHE-LHR flight would do very well guaranteed.

Does anyone believe that BMI would do well with 4-5 weekly A 332 flights to TEHRAN, IRAN nonstop from LHR. The reason why I say THR is because IR flies ageing B 747s with an average inflight product in all classes on this route and the Iranian community in Iran and UK have been asking for a long time for a reputable-good quality airline flying THR-LHR-THR nonstop.

BMI should too look at daily flights to BKK from LHR as its a big Star alliance hub and it can coordinate/interline with TG (both STAR carriers) on this route thus forming an effective competitor to BA and QF on this sector. There is year round high demand for both leisure and business between LHR and BKK whereby justiying additional capacity in the form of daily A 332 service especially since VS hasnt as yet ventured into Thailand as yet.
 
gkirk
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 4:25 pm

They should forget about LHR and concentrate on expanding from MAN. Otherwise they are in danger of becoming another London Airways...errr BA.
 Wink
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
cornish
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 4:55 pm

Quoting Squirrel83 (Thread starter):
He told reporters the airline had identified 14 other potential long-haul destinations including Hong Kong; Johannesburg and Cape Town in South Africa; Narita in Japan; and destinations in the United States.



Quoting Behramjee (Reply 1):
New slots at NRT are virtually impossible to obtain so it'll be interesting to see how that fizzles out.

Yep - can't see the Japanese giving BD NRT slots ahead of other carriers, especially when there are already four carriers serving the direct UK-NRT market.

South Africa - I suspect it'll be a code share on SAA if they don't already. South African bilaterals are very restrictive to protect SAA. I can't see them allowing another UK carrier to compete on the market.

USA - well if they are going out of LHR they'll have to wait for a renegotiation of Bermuda 2 first. If it's out of MAN, why are they downgrading service to IAD already if they plan to expand. Not a good way to impress MAN customers.

HKG - again three carriers on the direct route - can't see it happening somehow.

Absolutely nothing concrete mentioned whatsoever - I think it's purely a "we are serious about long-haul out of LHR" speech on the eve of the launch of new service to India." I hope they make a success of long haul out of LHR, as their product is very good, but they will always end up getting the crumbs rahter than the prime traffic rights that would go to BA and VS ahead of them.
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
JGPH1A
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 5:01 pm

Quoting Cornish (Reply 3):
South Africa - I suspect it'll be a code share on SAA if they don't already.

They actually do already.

** AMADEUS - TN ** JNB JOHANNESBURG.ZA 01JUN05 08JUN05
1SA:BD2505 D LHR 1 JNB A 1930 0730+1 0 07MAY05 31AUG05 744 11:00
2SA:BD2507 D LHR 1 JNB A 2130 0930+1 0 30APR05 12JUN05 744 11:00

This is good news, except for one thing. They are trying it on at LHR. If they would launch these routes from MAN instead, I think they would have a chance. The competition at LHR is too fierce for BD to stand snowball's chance. Incumbent carriers on these routes (many of them Star Alliance partners) will kill them.
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cornish
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 5:18 pm

Quoting Gkirk (Reply 2):
They should forget about LHR and concentrate on expanding from MAN. Otherwise they are in danger of becoming another London Airways...errr BA.



Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 4):
They are trying it on at LHR. If they would launch these routes from MAN instead,

Agreed - but I suspect their approach will be to try and fly passengers from MAN down to LHR to connect for long haul. Not realsing that this gives them no differentiation over BA, and if that's the case, they're going to lose out big time.

But as I said above - identifiying routes and actually getting the rights/decent number of flights for them is another matter. India is marvellous in theory - they got the rights, but only for a few flights, and then suddenly the market is getting filled with capacity because everyone else got new flights too....
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
squirrel83
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 6:19 pm

Quoting Gkirk (Reply 2):
ecoming another London Airways...errr BA.

LOL. . . Ohhh come on - - - BA cant be that bad . . .
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cornish
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 6:20 pm

Quoting Squirrel83 (Reply 6):
Quoting Gkirk (Reply 2):
ecoming another London Airways...errr BA.

LOL. . . Ohhh come on - - - BA cant be that bad . . .

Not for those of us in the Southeast of England  Silly
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
jakob77
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 6:23 pm

Quoting Cornish (Reply 3):
HKG - again three carriers on the direct route - can't see it happening somehow.

Actually, there're 4 carriers now on HKG - LHR.
BA, CX, QF, and VS.
 
gkirk
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 6:26 pm

Quoting Squirrel83 (Reply 6):
LOL. . . Ohhh come on - - - BA cant be that bad . . .

The only BA routes at MAN,NCL,GLA,EDI and ABZ are to LHR and LGW.
MAN has loads of CitiExpress routes including to JFK but they aint proper BA. NCL has no CitiExpress at all anymore, just the LHR and LGW flights. GLA has some CitiExpress flights as does EDI but these are domestic only (with CDG from EDI also I believe) and ABZ has LHR and LGW and very little BACX flights. BHX see's no mainline BA service, neither does LBA, CWL or MME. BRS is a CX base with 5 or 6 ERJ145s.

It really is that bad. Fortunatly LCCs have now entered these markets, so many people can now fly direct to the European continent without having to go through LHR or LGW  Smile
And with CO and EK expanding in the regions, no longer do people have to go through LGW and LHR for long haul flights  Smile
It's BA's loss I suppose though  Wink
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whitehatter
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 6:34 pm

Quoting Cornish (Reply 3):

USA - well if they are going out of LHR they'll have to wait for a renegotiation of Bermuda 2 first. If it's out of MAN, why are they downgrading service to IAD already if they plan to expand. Not a good way to impress MAN customers.

Not downgraded as such, they took an ACMI lease on an aircraft until new capacity comes online of their own. There is a lot of crap talked about BD's MAN-IAD route and how the 757 will cost them huge numbers of passengers. The truth is that BD sell it as a MAN departure to a Washington gateway and the average business traveller is not as shallow as a sixteen year old who wants two hundred channel IFE and a wide cabin which looks pretty. The business traveller just wants to get there and Icelandair's aircraft are clean and comfortable.

The whisper is that BD are looking at MAN-LAX due to a certain American Airline dragging its feet over a long-rumoured service. LAS could also be a candidate for increased service.

My 'spies' within BD tell me that they are looking seriously at a 787 purchase due to that aircraft potentially being a better fit with certain routes. The A330 aircraft would then be freed up for expansion into India which is looking extremely promising.
Lead me not into temptation, I can find my own way there...
 
7LBAC111
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 6:40 pm

Quoting Cornish (Reply 3):
Absolutely nothing concrete mentioned whatsoever - I think it's purely a "we are serious about long-haul out of LHR" speech on the eve of the launch of new service to India

I agree - it's a very speculative, presumptious and arguably ambitious press release to try and make the 'less informed' think of BMI as a serious carrier with focus and a clear business plan. However the vast majority of us on here realise they are a lame duck.

Quoting Cornish (Reply 7):
Quoting Squirrel83 (Reply 6):
Quoting Gkirk (Reply 2):
ecoming another London Airways...errr BA.

LOL. . . Ohhh come on - - - BA cant be that bad . . .

Not for those of us in the Southeast of England

No - if you live within reasonable distance of LHR, BMI are a great ull service carrier - for now (see http://www.airliners.net/discussions...general_aviation/read.main/2105820 )

But BMI have shown total disregard for its Premium passengers at MAN by using this ridiculous FI 757 to satisfy the needs of it's London passengers at the detriment of it's established and loyal MAN passenger base. Hence, GKirks London Airways' comment being reasonably accurate!

7LBAC111
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HT
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 6:43 pm

Quoting WhiteHatter (Reply 10):
ACMI lease on an aircraft until new capacity comes online of their own. There is a lot of crap talked about BD's MAN-IAD route and how the 757 will cost them huge numbers of passengers. The truth is that BD sell it as a MAN departure to a Washington gateway and the average business traveller is not as shallow as a sixteen year old who wants two hundred channel IFE and a wide cabin which looks pretty. The business traveller just wants to get there [..]

I second that opinion.
BTW is there any chance that MAN-IAD will be operated by an Icelandair B752 equipped with winglets?
Carpe diem ! Life is too short to waste your time ! Keep in mind, that today is the first day of the rest of your life !
 
cornish
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 6:50 pm

Quoting HT (Reply 12):
BTW is there any chance that MAN-IAD will be operated by an Icelandair B752 equipped with winglets?

I think there was another thread that said the FI aircraft is already at MAN painted in hybrid colurs - no mention of winglets.

Quoting WhiteHatter (Reply 10):
Not downgraded as such, they took an ACMI lease on an aircraft until new capacity comes online of their own. There is a lot of crap talked about BD's MAN-IAD route and how the 757 will cost them huge numbers of passengers. The truth is that BD sell it as a MAN departure to a Washington gateway and the average business traveller is not as shallow as a sixteen year old who wants two hundred channel IFE and a wide cabin which looks pretty. The business traveller just wants to get there and Icelandair's aircraft are clean and comfortable.

Well I agree with your point about general business traveller needs - my issue is that moving to a smaller aircraft during the summer season suggests that loads weren't that strong (somebody confirm this). If they were then will there be a problem of not enough capacity to meet demand? Also BD had their premium economy cabin on the A330. Surely this was a popular option with some cost concious business travellers - I assume this option has now gone on the FI 757. Does this mean they'd travel in an economy seat instead now?

That sort of thing would matter to the business traveller IMO.
Just when I thought I could see light at the end of the tunnel, it was some B*****d with a torch bringing me more work
 
LO231
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 7:03 pm

Quoting JGPH1A (Reply 4):
This is good news, except for one thing. They are trying it on at LHR. If they would launch these routes from MAN instead, I think they would have a chance. The competition at LHR is too fierce for BD to stand snowball's chance. Incumbent carriers on these routes (many of them Star Alliance partners) will kill them.

But then they should think of expanding shorthaul operations from MAN as now they don't have a lot of capacity, for example to the continent, to feed their longhaul flights. Not only UK citizens use UK as a transfer point, you know....

Regards,
LO231
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Gman94
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 7:24 pm

Everyone knocks BA and calls them London Airways but there must be a reason why they only operate one longhaul service outside of London, could it actually have something to with the fact that can't make any money out of these services and I wonder why BMI are busting a gut to try and get more longhaul services out of LHR nothing to with trying to make more money then it can out of MAN is it. Or should these private companies operate services just for the sake of providing a service and forget about actually trying to make money for their shareholders.
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Orion737
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 7:45 pm

I remember when I used to fly to Milan and Geneva from MAN and it was mainline on a Bac1-11 and then the 732 now they are BA Citiexpress and ERJ145s which are full months in advance. I can never get a seat on BA Citiexpress from MAN-Europe thay are always full, thats what you get replacing a 120 seat aircraft with a 49 seat one!!
 
7LBAC111
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 8:02 pm

Quoting Orion737 (Reply 16):
I remember when I used to fly to Milan and Geneva from MAN and it was mainline on a Bac1-11 and then the 732 now they are BA Citiexpress and ERJ145s which are full months in advance. I can never get a seat on BA Citiexpress from MAN-Europe thay are always full, thats what you get replacing a 120 seat aircraft with a 49 seat one!!

And what has this got to do with BMI's longhaul strategy from LHR?  confused 
Debate is what you put on de hook when you want to catch de fish.
 
Speedbird2155
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 8:07 pm

Quoting 7LBAC111 (Reply 17):
And what has this got to do with BMI's longhaul strategy from LHR?

Absolutely nothing, some people just like to have every opportunity to knock BA for not having more service from MAN and this discussion is adequate cause it involves MAN, even though it is in relation to BD.
 
Orion737
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 8:12 pm

I like BA, I prefer to fly them just cant help getting angry everytime I try to book a flight from MAN and they are full up months in advance because they insist on replacing 732s with 49 seaters!
 
northwest 777
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 8:29 pm

If there is some modifying of that damn Bermuda II I'd love to see BD fly here in to SEA. British make an absolute KILLING on this flight now that United no longer serves the route. Dailly 744 serivce, constantly full and if like in years past, we'll probably see a an 3x weekly serive with a 777 or even 763ER like has been done before. I think it be a great place for BD to get into.
 
Flighttime
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Fri May 13, 2005 10:29 pm

Quoting Orion737 (Reply 19):
I like BA, I prefer to fly them just cant help getting angry everytime I try to book a flight from MAN and they are full up months in advance because they insist on replacing 732s with 49 seaters!

Which perhaps helps BA to keep prices high, thus turning a profit?
 
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Crosswind
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 12:19 am

Quoting Orion737 (Reply 16):
I remember when I used to fly to Milan and Geneva from MAN and it was mainline on a Bac1-11 and then the 732 now they are BA Citiexpress and ERJ145s which are full months in advance. I can never get a seat on BA Citiexpress from MAN-Europe thay are always full, thats what you get replacing a 120 seat aircraft with a 49 seat one!!

The BAC1-11s seated 99 and the B737-200s seated a maximum of 106 with all rows in 6 abreast configuration, on typical European routes there tended to be 4-5 rows of Club which puts capacity at 101. The B737-500 which is the last type BAR based at Manchester seated a maximum of 110, go average capacity would have been around 105.

The Geneva route was formerly served daily by 732/735 with around 105 seats available, ever since it was transferred to a BA CitiExpress they have opffered a twice daily ERJ-145 with a daily capacity of 98 seats. A net reduction of 7 seats per day.

On the Milan route BAR used to fly twice daily 732/735 aircraft, and for a few years this was supplemented by an evening ERJ-145. Since BA CitiExpress took over a twice daily 110-seat BAE RJ100 has been maintained, plus Alitalia now offer twice daily A319/MD-80 flights on the route.

On both the routes you mention capacity has been virtually unchanged by the transition from BAR to BACX...

Regards
CROSSWIND
 
col
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 12:33 am

Seems that foreign carriers are better at exploiting MAN than UK based. So maybe EK, SQ, QR should show BMI/BA how it is done?

The 757 on IAD is stupid, don't care if you are a business person, or someone going to Disney. An Icelandic 757 is not a BMI 332. I have stopped using it, next two trips to MAN are with US.
 
BA380
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 12:35 am

could bmi operate MAN - Jo'Burg or Cape Town?
cabin crew: doors to automatic and cross-check...
 
JGPH1A
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 12:45 am

Quoting BA380 (Reply 24):
could bmi operate MAN - Jo'Burg or Cape Town?

Depends on the SA-UK bilateral, but in theory why not ? SA used to operate to MAN via ORY in the late 80's (IIRC), but it wasn't for very long. Flights to SA are in huge demand right now, load factors are very high (partly a deliberate management of demand vs supply), but what's to prevent a successful daily operation, especially if it offers an SA codeshare (normal for Star partners). Excellent possibilities for customers in the NW who have to transfer in FRA, AMS, PAR or (horrors) LHR (actually the transfer in LHR is relatively painless as its a T1-T1 in all cases, but its a fair old schlep from the BA/BD dom gates (in the air conditioning duct) out to the end of the big pier for the SA flights, or worse, the Europier where the BA flights leave from).
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BA380
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 12:53 am

that sounds like a good option for them then...
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Gofly
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 1:45 am

Quoting WhiteHatter (Reply 10):
My 'spies' within BD tell me that they are looking seriously at a 787 purchase due to that aircraft potentially being a better fit with certain routes. The A330 aircraft would then be freed up for expansion into India which is looking extremely promising.

I thought that since they have spent so long making their fleet all Airbus, this would be the last road they would want to go down.

If the 787 does fit for their routes, will this offset other costs?
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travelin man
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 3:07 am

I would think that given its Star Alliance affiliation, its target long-haul routes for the US would be to LAX and/or SFO. Given there are now 9x daily LAX-LHR (3x BA, 2x AA, 2x VS, and 2x UA), BMI might be fairly strong on an LAX-MAN daily.
 
Eirules
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 3:15 am

I heard that BD have applied for a number of the governement backed irish provincial routes. Most notably they have applied for Kerry - DUB which has also been applied for by FR!!
The way you cut your meat reflects the way you live....
 
soups
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 3:17 am

BD should launch service to Accra, Lagos, Freetown, Kano. good money there
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cloud4000
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 3:20 am

Before BMI expands it needs to get a hold of more aircraft? I know they'll order more aircraft, but will they lease for the short-term? And are there any spare A330s to be found, or, for that matter, A340s?
Boston, USA
 
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uka330
Crew
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 6:26 am

BMI will soon be taking delivery of their 4th A330. This one is from Emirates, reg A6-EAS, and will become G-WWBC. Could we possibly see an A350 order from BMI soon?
 
B742
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 6:29 am

Would there be enough demand for a new MAN-BKK-MAN route in codeshare with TG?

I would also like to see LHR-HKG and LHR-CPT

Rob!
 
7LBAC111
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 6:32 am

Quoting Gofly (Reply 27):
I thought that since they have spent so long making their fleet all Airbus, this would be the last road they would want to go down.

You'd think!! But alas, not BMI. YOu see they still think it viable to operate the F100, the ERJ, and, lo and behold - the ATR42.

That, I believe was strategy number 7 on BestWesterns list some months back!

BMI
Bring
More
Ideas.

7LBAC111
Debate is what you put on de hook when you want to catch de fish.
 
David_itl
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 7:14 am

Quoting B742 (Reply 33):
Would there be enough demand for a new MAN-BKK-MAN route in codeshare with TG?

In the Manchester Evening News's list of 8 routes* MAN is attempting to attract, the paper claims that MAN is stating that 100,000 pax travel to BKK ex-MAN on other carriers.

* just the usual suspects that have been doing the round for the past 20 years, even allowing for some of them having been started and withdrawn in that period.

David
 
behramjee
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 7:50 am

Quoting Uka330 (Reply 32):
BMI will soon be taking delivery of their 4th A330. This one is from Emirates, reg A6-EAS, and will become G-WWBC. Could we possibly see an A350 order from BMI soon?

A week ago, I read on A.Net over here that EK were crying about having lack of aircraft to fuel expansion hence the start delay of GVA flights and now I read that EK is leasing out an A 332 to BMI??? What is going on here?

If those MAN-BKK-MAN pax numbers are supposed to be believed then yes a 4-5 weekly nonstop BMI A 332 MAN-BKK-MAN in codeshare with TG would do just fine as then from BKK, BMIs pax can go on to other SE Asian destinations on TG due to their Star Alliance partnership.
 
dutchjet
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 8:19 am

Concerning BMI's 4th A332 - wasnt a fourth aircraft built as part of the original BMI order for the type, but BMI did not take delivery and the aircraft went directly to EK? Is that the aircraft that is now coming back to BMI? Was that BMI A332 sold to or leased by EK?

In any case, I have long believed that BMI made a major mistake by not developing Manchester into some type of hub operation - offering long haul services supported by connections to key European cities as well as other UK regional airports - something that could give LHR some competition. STAR partners (and part owners) LH and SAS could have added services to support a Manchester hub operation.

BMI was so focused at launching flights out of LHR to the US (which they could not do due to the failure to renegotiate Bermuda 2) that they really had no cohesive strategy as far as utilizing the A332s - so the half-hearted effort at Manchester began simply flying out of MAN to UA's hubs - BMI basically relied on UA's network to fill the flights up out of MAN.

It really is time for BMI to come up with a better strategy - they should make a full committment to Manchester as a long haul base OR go back to LHR and see what non-US routes can be money makers. But why compete with BA and VS at London when Manchester is ready for route development?
 
JOYA380B747
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 3:22 pm

BMI has 4x weekly flights to BOM from this Saturday(14th). Is there any hope of BMI adding a DEL MAA or BLR 3x weekly to make it daily to India. I love the BMI scheme on those 330's.


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ba757
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 9:20 pm

MAN-EWR or MAN-JFK? Would this not be possible?

I know it would be hard for BD to take on BA & CO on these routes, but I am pretty sure it would be successful. I refuse to fly BA MAN-JFK, just to avoid the 767, and whats more it can be hard to get a decent fare on that flight.

I have never flown CO MAN-EWR and i assume the service is pretty good.

I honestly don't see why BD couldn't fill and A330 on either of these routes.

Adam
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 9:44 pm

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 1):
a reputable-good quality airline flying THR-LHR-THR nonstop.

I guess British Airways (via BMed) doesn't qualify as a reputable-good quality airline?  scratchchin 

Quoting Behramjee (Reply 1):
Does anyone believe that BMI would do well with 4-5 weekly A 332 flights to TEHRAN, IRAN nonstop from LHR. The reason why I say THR is because IR flies ageing B 747s with an average inflight product in all classes on this route and the Iranian community in Iran and UK

I realize Iranair's 747SPs are old, but they are in excellent working order and serve the route well. Still, there is a sizeable Iranian population in London and a quick and dirty average (figuring for IR's SPs and BA's A32S) of 300 seats per day for both O&D and connectors leaves room for BMI, especially if they connect it to UA's LAX-LHR flight

Quoting WhiteHatter (Reply 10):
The whisper is that BD are looking at MAN-LAX due to a certain American Airline dragging its feet over a long-rumoured service.

Would make sense. Would then also make sense to open MAN-THR

Quoting Northwest 777 (Reply 20):
If there is some modifying of that damn Bermuda II I'd love to see BD fly here in to SEA.

Don't see a reason they can't fly to SEA. Would just have to go from MAN or LGW

Quoting Travelin man (Reply 28):
Given there are now 9x daily LAX-LHR (3x BA, 2x AA, 2x VS, and 2x UA),

When did UA add the second flight. I just booked tickets to London and only the one flight was flying.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
georgiabill
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sat May 14, 2005 10:04 pm

Perhaps BMI should consider Man-Bos, Man-SFO,Man-LAX and MAN-MIA. Why should they compete with BA,AA,UA or VS out of LHR when MAN could be developed as a international base.
 
dutchjet
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sun May 15, 2005 2:01 am

Why doesn't BMI fly the above-mentioned routes, such as MAN to SEA, LAX, SFO, MIA or BOS, its because BMI wants to operate longhaul services out of HEATHROW, not Manchester.

BMI purchased the A330-200s with one thing in mind, routes from Heathrow to the US (New York, Chicago, Los Angeles and Miami are the cities that I think BMI had targeted back then). BMI was counting on Bermuda 2 being renegotiated or done away with altogether - it never happened and therefore BMI was precluded from opening the new US routes out of LHR. With no real "Plan B" for the big and expensive new aircraft, BMI went to Manchester and opened the MAN-IAD/MAN-ORD routes....there was no real support or feed for the flights out of Manchester (BMI operates a large UK and European network out of LHR) but the IAD and ORD were chose to tie into UA's hubs at those cities (BMI and UA are both STAR alliance partners). Two A332s were needed for the two new routes but four A332s were ordered at the time....one was leased to SAS for a while (its back now) and other went to EK (I think BMI has another A332 on the way). BMI went on to open some additonal longhaul routes out of MAN (such as LAS, the Caribbean) but never really made a full commitment to that city.

Now, several years later, there has still been no progress on Bermuda 2, and BMI still cannot fly out of Heathrow to the US....thus, BMI is looking elsewhere and is launching longhaul routes out of Heathrow to India and the Gulf (lets see if that is a success).....so, BMI will fly the leased 752 on the MAN-IAD route (I hope it works, I have no problem with the 752 accross the Atlantic and the 757 is probably the right sized aircraft for this route but not during the peak summer season, yet another story) but it will offer a different level of service than BMI's rather good A330 long haul product. BMI's A330s are needed in London - so its back to the same story, BMI is not committed to Manchester.
 
gkirk
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sun May 15, 2005 3:23 am

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 42):
BMI's A330s are needed in London - so its back to the same story, BMI is not committed to Manchester.

E.G BMI may as well be called London Airways
When you hear the noise of the Tartan Army Boys, we'll be coming down the road!
 
behramjee
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sun May 15, 2005 3:59 am

BMIs A 330-200s will make a lot of money flying nonstop from LHR to Lahore 4-5 times a week. The connections that it can conveniently offer from LHR to other UK-EU cities plus trans-atlantic on AC-UAL will make them a lot of money on the LHR-LHE-LHR route which is one of PIAs most profitable routes flown 4 times a week nonstop using B 743s and B 747-200M.
 
B742
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sun May 15, 2005 4:03 am

I thought Bmi were getting a/some A340-300's?

Rob!
 
David_itl
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sun May 15, 2005 6:12 am

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 42):
With no real "Plan B" for the big and expensive new aircraft, BMI went to Manchester and opened the MAN-IAD/MAN-ORD routes....there was no real support or feed for the flights out of Manchester (BMI operates a large UK and European network out of LHR) but the IAD and ORD were chose to tie into UA's hubs at those cities (BMI and UA are both STAR alliance partners).

Not quite true - they had 3 plans, all based on their initial routes operating to the States:
(a) LHR only
(b) dual LHR/MAN launch
(c) MAN launch only

As they have limited presence at MAN, it was an obvious choice to see if they could operate out of LHR but given the reticence of the negotiators on Bermuda II to achieve anything worthwhile, it had to be plan (c). They have stated that they envisage a maximum of 8 long-haul routes out of MAN, but that was approxiamately 15 strategies ago. In fact, I'm a bit peeved about the India routes started ex-LHR as all the media reporting about future long-haul a years or so ago had Sir Michael Bishop hoping for good news on MAN-India (and MAN-JNB) by the end of last year.
 
behramjee
Posts: 4344
Joined: Sat Aug 02, 2003 4:56 am

RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Sun May 15, 2005 11:28 am

Quoting B742 (Reply 45):
I thought Bmi were getting a/some A340-300's?

That was just a rumor ppl started on this website last year when BMI was dead serious on wanting to start LHR-South Africa nonstop flights and many users predicted the A 343 being inducted in the fleet to fly this route. But it had no face value what so ever and remained just a rumor which obviously hasnt materialized at the end of the day!!!
 
jaysit
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Mon May 16, 2005 6:37 am

How is the Bombay service doing?

What do advance bookings look like, especially since BMI has no brand recognition in India?
Atheism is Myth Understood.
 
BestWestern
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RE: BMI To Add More Longhaul Routes & Fleet Upgrade

Mon May 16, 2005 5:17 pm

Its amazing how spin on a press release gets 50 responses on Airliners.net

BMI isnt getting a 4th A330
BMI isnt getting the 787
BMI isnt expanding at MAN
BMI is shrinking at Heathrow.

BMI - the airline with 7 logos.
You are 100 times more likely to catch a cold on a flight than an average person!