TACAA320
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FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 9:39 am

'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
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alberchico
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 9:45 am

He will probaly get his license revoked. Serves him right. Flying is a serious business that does not tolerate ANY mistakes. He just screwed it up for the rest of us. Now the TFR zone in Washington might get bigger.
short summary of every jewish holiday: they tried to kill us ,we won , lets eat !
 
norcal
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 9:50 am

Good the guy is an idiot. How many thousands of dollars did it cost the government to send F-16s up and evacutate numerous government buildings?
 
TACAA320
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 9:53 am

Quoting NorCal (Reply 2):
Good the guy is an idiot.

No doubts about it. The damage was done.
'Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind'. Albert Einstein
 
APFPilot1985
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 9:54 am

I agree that he should lose his license, after all the work and lobbying that the AOPA has done to get the TFR's reduced and Washington National open to GA traffic, now because of this idiot its like taking two steps back.
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senorcarnival
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 9:54 am

Quoting NorCal (Reply 2):
How many thousands of dollars did it cost the government to send F-16s up and evacutate numerous government buildings?

A couple of thousand bucks is chump change in terms of running a country.
The real question is, why did this idiot not have the insight to plan his flight around the TFR knowing he was going through the area?
Oh no, she's getting impatient! Take a stab at it!
 
Gilligan
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 9:59 am

I just have to wonder what their faces looked like when two F-16's blew past on afterburner! lol I saw the video of the one in handcuffs by the side of the runway. I kept waiting to see them stand him up and see a dark splotch on the front of his pants! lol You just have to think that at least the student would have said something like "Gosh that looks just like the Washington monument, what is that thing?"

I would think that the government will charge at least a portion of the bill involved in alerting everyone and scrambling those jets. I am also sadly sure that some lawyer will file a civil lawsuit on someone's part claiming some sort of personal injury due to their negligence. They may not go to jail but I doubt they will ever be rich men either.
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777STL
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 10:38 am

I want to be sympathetic to this guy but I'm finding it hard. The biggest TFR in the US and he goes crashing right through it on a site seeing tour over DC. Even if he wasn't reading his sectionals he should have known to be vigilent, this isn't the first time this has happened and gotten national press coverage.
PHX based
 
AsstChiefMark
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 10:56 am

Why would he NOT be surprised when a Blackhawk helicopter appeared as he sat there gawking at the White House, Washington Monument, Capitol, Jefferson Memorial, and Lincoln Memorial. Where has this guy been for the past four years? Under a rock?

What bothers me is the way he froze up. He's the instructor, for God's sake! So much for being able to handle an emergency.

He deserves whatever he gets. He endangered the life of his student and people on ground (A Sparrow missle would have caused a lot of debris). I hope they bill him for the expenses for his ignorant sight-seeing tour.

I wonder what will happen to the Cessna. The US Fish & Wildlife Service could surely use it. Maybe the flying club will sue him if they don't get it back.

Mark
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usair330
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 11:32 am

Instead of spending millions of dollars on GTA Missles maybe the goverment should invest in a warning device for GA aircraft to let them know when they are 10 or 20 NM from restricted airspace.
 
AsstChiefMark
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 11:34 am

Quoting USAir330 (Reply 9):
maybe the goverment should invest in a warning device for GA aircraft to let them know when they are 10 or 20 NM from restricted airspace

They have.


http://www.faa.gov/news/news_home/visual_warning/
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Gilligan
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 11:36 am

Quoting USAir330 (Reply 9):
Instead of spending millions of dollars on GTA Missles maybe the goverment should invest in a warning device for GA aircraft to let them know when they are 10 or 20 NM from restricted airspace.


I saw a report on CBS the other night that this is close to being a done deal. They have several laser sights around DC that are directional in their operation. If a plane flies too close to the airspace they will be lit up. The lasers are not the kind that can hurt your eyes but can be seen from up to 30 miles away depending on visibility. They flash two greens and a red and alert you that you are getting too close for comfort.
Warm winds blowing, heating blue skies, and a road that goes forever, I'm going to Texas!
 
Indy
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airsp

Sun May 15, 2005 11:39 am

How do you think the student felt? Thinking "omg this idiot is going to get us shot down". That makes me wonder if the student was just along for the ride or if he was in the left seat. If he was in control of the plane I would expect him to share some responsibility especially with 30 hours in. Don't you start flying solo after 20 hours?
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
DC10GUY
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 11:44 am

I wonder why they didn't use that new laser warning system that was rolled out a couple weeks ago ???
Next time try the old "dirty Sanchez" She'll love it !!!
 
AsstChiefMark
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 11:48 am

Quoting DC10GUY (Reply 13):
I wonder why they didn't use that new laser warning system that was rolled out a couple weeks ago ???

If the dumb f*ck didn't know he was over the middle of Washington, DC and didn't know it was restricted airspace and didn't know what a pair of F-16's firing flares and dipping their wings meant, how would he know what the green and red lights are for?

Mark
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Indy
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 11:49 am

They are SOOOOOO lucky they didn't get shot down.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
Brido
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 12:18 pm

From what I hear, the instructor was a blockhead who totally messed everything up! Frozen solid, unable to conduct himself properly. Not to mention that he was the one who got them in that situation in the first place! Not AT ALL on the ball...

Meanwhile, the student took control of the situation. Communicated with the intercepting armed forces, and plotted/executed the landing.

If all this is true, the instructor has no business flying any kind of airplane, anywhere! I say FIND HIS NAME AND PRINT IT! This dude is an idiot...

Now don't get me started on how our government officials kept the President so "out-of-the-loop" on this emergency. George and company are idiots. This whole thing was a fiasco that should chill every American to the bone!
 
L-188
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 12:22 pm

Terriffice another person is going to lose their livelyhood due to the fact the goverment is full of very paranoid idiots.

This guy was about as much of a threat to the capitol as Bill Clinton's pennicillin passer was.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
Brido
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 12:40 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 17):
Terriffice another person is going to lose their livelyhood due to the fact the goverment is full of very paranoid idiots.

This guy was about as much of a threat to the capitol as Bill Clinton's pennicillin passer was.

Who is Terriffice?

NOW we know that these people were not a threat. While is was happening we did not know that.

What would you have had happen? The fact of the matter is this: ***There is to be no flying of any kind over the capitol, the White House, or other sensitive areas!***

Multiple NOTAMS, bulletins, and other information have been posted in the past 3+ years with regard to this information! Nobody should be flying in the direction of, or the vicinity of, the White House, for goodness sake! It is not too hard to figure out, yet this "instructor" (quote-unquote) seems to be really out of the LOOP!

He should be working in an office someplace, not flying around Washington DC! Much less "instructing" student pilots.
 
Indy
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 12:50 pm

I can in a few minutes sum up my personal flight experience and even I know to avoid that place. Maybe this comes from living on the space coast in Florida and flying with my stepdad and knowing about restricted air spaces. But dang. He is a professional. No excuse.
Indy = Indianapolis and not Independence Air
 
atmx2000
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 1:12 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 17):
Terriffice another person is going to lose their livelyhood due to the fact the goverment is full of very paranoid idiots.

This guy was about as much of a threat to the capitol as Bill Clinton's pennicillin passer was

It's you who is the idiot. I think we should ground this 69 year old flight instructor if he can't keep control of his faculties while piloting a plane and respond to clear warnings from the intercepting aircraft.

The fact that this particular person turned out not to be a threat is irrelevent. The simple fact of the matter is that it would be rather easy for someone to simply fly a plane into a government building in the DC area without a large enough no-fly zone that allows the authorities to have sufficient reaction time to intercept the aircraft. Hell, someone already did it to the White House in the 1994 with a GA aircraft. If that guy had explosives in the aircraft, he could have done serious damage.
ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
 
AsstChiefMark
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 1:22 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 17):
This guy was about as much of a threat to the capitol as Bill Clinton's pennicillin passer was.

As previously mentioned, who would have thought a rubber dingy would be a threat to the USS Cole?

Here's one of many reasons why a Cessna 152 IS a threat:

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=37013
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redflyer
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 1:51 pm

Quoting APFPilot1985 (Reply 4):
I agree that he should lose his license, after all the work and lobbying that the AOPA has done to get the TFR's reduced and Washington National open to GA traffic, now because of this idiot its like taking two steps back.



It's truly amazing how DUMB some pilots are. And make no mistake: this guy was a total moron.

Quoting AsstChiefMark (Reply 14):
If the dumb f*ck didn't know he was over the middle of Washington, DC and didn't know it was restricted airspace and didn't know what a pair of F-16's firing flares and dipping their wings meant, how would he know what the green and red lights are for?

Very true. This individual has no business being a PIC. And regardless of what the reasons were for him getting lost, the moron was flying VFR over one of the most recognizable pieces of terrain in the world. The fact of the matter is, if anyone is flying within 100 nautical miles of DCA then they should be extra vigilent and observant.
My other home is a Piper Cherokee 180C
 
L-188
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 2:05 pm

The simple fact of the matter is that it would be rather easy for someone to simply fly a plane into a government building in the DC area without a large enough no-fly zone that allows the authorities to have sufficient reaction time to intercept the aircraft

And exactly how large should that be?

Do you really think that it would be impossible to get something faster in there before the flyboys could react.

This guy is a victim of the US of A Federal Goverment, one of the most corrupt and unfair goverments on the face of this earth. He is being used as an example. I love how all of you are calling for this poor mans head, yet he has had no trial.

The people here who claim the FAA's response is the right one are some very sick individuals.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
jacobin777
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airsp

Sun May 15, 2005 2:32 pm

Quoting AsstChiefMark (Reply 21):

As previously mentioned, who would have thought a rubber dingy would be a threat to the USS Cole?

Here's one of many reasons why a Cessna 152 IS a threat:

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/ar...37013

egad..you actually read that website rubbish propaganda?  sarcastic  I wouldn't be surprised if you think Ann Coulter is a goddess (and everything on Fox news is "Fair and Balanced"-but I do like Jeraldo Rivera..he's one of the only people at Fox News who is "Fair and Balanced")...........the only person on that website who has a brain is Pat Buchanan (he has enough balls to criticise this Bush Govt.)...too bad that pie didn't hit A.C. in the face..now THAT would have been funny  rotfl 
"Up the Irons!"
 
57AZ
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 4:02 pm

How the times have changed. Back about fifteen years ago, we were departing DCA in our private plane on an IFR flightplan and busted the prohibited airspace over the city. After realizing what had happened, my parents (the pilots) dreaded what might come out of that. However, nothing happened at all-no call from the FAA or federal law enforcement. In hindsight, the reason we busted the airspace was that we turned to the heading assigned us by Departure on northbound departure. Since they never said anything to us, we naturally avoided asking questions. However, I suspect that the controlled involved got a stern talking to at the least. Our flightpath put us directly overhead the Capitol and the White House. Now GA can't fly into DCA-for good reason too.
"When a man runs on railroads over half of his lifetime he is fit for nothing else-and at times he don't know that."
 
UA772IAD
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 4:09 pm

Good. That personally made my afternoon hell, since half of Downtown Washington was evacuated. That's just common sense, you don't have to know much about aviation, or Washington to know that, it's been like that since the beginning of aviation.
 
jahckass
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 4:52 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 23):
The people here who claim the FAA's response is the right one are some very sick individuals.

I feel the FAA's response is right, and i feel fine, thanks for the concern!
 
Stealthz
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 4:53 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 23):
This guy is a victim of the US of A Federal Goverment

NOT!!..The guy is a victim of his own stupidity, there are many places better than this to argue the validity or politics of the no fly zones in the USA but it is not like they are a new thing. He was PIC and "instructor" not responding to communications, freezing up when intercepted.. he has NO place flying an aeroplane, even less teaching others!!

Chris
If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!
 
atmx2000
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 4:57 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 23):
The people here who claim the FAA's response is the right one are some very sick individuals.

Frankly, I don't think a 69 year old should be a flight instructor. No telling when he is going to have a heart attack or a stroke, leaving some poor clueless student in the air.
ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
 
atmx2000
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Sun May 15, 2005 5:20 pm

Quoting L-188 (Reply 23):
And exactly how large should that be?

Do you really think that it would be impossible to get something faster in there before the flyboys could react.

The time needed to deal with an encroachment by a nonresponsive aircraft is a function of the time to travel the distance to potential targets from the edge of the restricted air space minus the time to get aircraft to intercept the encroaching aircraft and minus the expected time to get cooperation from the nonresponsive aircraft, assuming that it isn't hostile. This guy froze up and was nonresponsive for an extended period of time after aircraft intercepted him. If the restricted airspace was smaller, the plane would have gotten a lot closer to Mall area and would have potentially forced a shoot down decision.

Quoting L-188 (Reply 23):
I love how all of you are calling for this poor mans head, yet he has had no trial.

We're not calling for his head. We're just calling for his pilot's license to be revoked, and certainly for him to be prohibited from being a flight instructor.
ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
 
VEEREF
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 12:01 am

This probably one of the most acute examples of loss of situational awareness
I have seen in my 16 years of flying.
Not to hijack this thread but sadly these are the kind of guys that will be applying for jobs flying 777's and A3xx's when pilot's salaries are finally cut down to nothing and all the good one's have gone to other careers!
Airplanes are cool. Aviation sucks.
 
fspilot747
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 12:10 am

eh. the CFI was 69, i dont think he's lookin for an airline job, i dont feel so bad for him anymore.
 
Olympus69
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 12:37 am

Did I miss something? Where did it say that Shaeffer is an Instructor? The only facts I have read state that the two guys were on their way to an Air Show, and that the passenger happened to be a student pilot. I have seen no mention of the flight being an 'instructional' one.
If Shaeffer is not an instructor I would find his actions slightly more believable.
 
pilotpip
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 12:57 am

I flew to the DC area last year. Things may have changed now, but at the time you had to be in contact with Potomac approach when you were in the DC ADIZ, basically like flight following. All it took was a 15 minute phone call with a friendly briefer at Leesburg Flight Service to find out the NOTAMS affecting the area at the time and get specific procedures for flying within the ADIZ. The local guys in STL didn't know exactly, but my certificate relied on me finding out, less I end up like this guy.

This guy didn't do that. He didn't keep situational awareness, and he didn't bother to call Potomac for some flight following. They don't want to have somebody bust airspace either and had he asked them to "keep an eye on him and steer him clear of restricted areas" they would have. Because of this guy's inability to take a few minutes and figure out what needed to be done he has done a disservice to all of us who fly civil aircraft in the US.

L-188, this guy broke the rules. You break the rules, you should be punished. If he can't control an aircraft to the standards set by the FAA, including having situational awareness, he shouldn't be flying.
DMI
 
CORULEZ05
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 1:05 am

Everyone makes mistakes and this pilot is being a victim of an over-reacting government. Isn't it sad that we feel SOOOOO UNSAFE that in the even of an aircraft going of course it freaks everyone out????? Next thing we know all airplane traffic, including commercial is banned from the DC area...this is ridiculous.
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KaiGywer
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 1:27 am

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airways6max
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 1:41 am

He should have his license revoked. From all the accounts and his failure to take basic precautions before taking off, he has no business flying an aircraft. I think that the military should adopt a policy of giving unidentified aircraft, or aircraft that stray into no-fly zones one warning and one warning only. If the aircraft fails to comply, then it should be shot down. I'm sorry, but I would much rather hear the news that a plane was accidentally shot down than to wake up to another 9/11.
 
VEEREF
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 1:57 am

Quoting CORULEZ05 (Reply 35):
Everyone makes mistakes and this pilot is being a victim of an over-reacting government. Isn't it sad that we feel SOOOOO UNSAFE that in the even of an aircraft going of course it freaks everyone out????? Next thing we know all airplane traffic, including commercial is banned from the DC area...this is ridiculous.

Even prior to 9/11 an airspace transgretion of this nature was subject to certificate action.
It's not so much because of a terrorist threat but in general when situational awareness is lost by one aircraft it then becomes a potential hazard to all other aircraft operating in the vicinity. In all fairness, perhaps a 709 ride in place of an outright revocation would be in order. Then if the 709 is unsatisfactory a revocation would be the next step.

[Edited 2005-05-15 19:01:47]
Airplanes are cool. Aviation sucks.
 
VS74741R
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 2:30 am

Just out of curiosity, how the hell does a F16 fly slow enough to stay with a Cessna 150.
Obviously a Virgin Atlantic fan!!!
 
redflyer
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 2:44 am

Quoting VS74741R (Reply 39):
Just out of curiosity, how the hell does a F16 fly slow enough to stay with a Cessna 150.

It doesn't. It flies past at very slow speed (for the F16), which is still about 60 kts. faster than the Cessna.
My other home is a Piper Cherokee 180C
 
Douglas7Seas
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 2:54 am

Some senior citizen screws up in his little Cessna 150.... No one hurt, no damage done. Let's move beyond it. Or, apply a little proportionality...

Dubby goes into Iraq to save us all from WMD. Oops, no WMD. Uh, got 1500 + Americans killed in the process. Now, we don't see pics of him handcuffed, or his "license" taken away....

Proportionality comrades!!!
Be different; Be nice.
 
777STL
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 2:59 am

Quoting L-188 (Reply 23):
The people here who claim the FAA's response is the right one are some very sick individuals.

Yanking someone's ticket is a pretty routine occurance, definitely not unheard of and really not that big of a deal. It's not like the FAA gave this guy a death sentence, sheesh...

If the guy wasn't smart enough to avoid the TFR he should get his ticket yanked. The very fact that he froze up leads me to believe he should never be PIC of an airplane again.

Quoting L-188 (Reply 23):
This guy is a victim of the US of A Federal Goverment, one of the most corrupt and unfair goverments on the face of this earth

If you hate the government so much, why do you even live here? Lemme guess, you live in a small one room cabin in Montana and in your free time you send off mail bombs? I dun't know, if you hate it so much then move, I hear Canada is nice.
PHX based
 
bravogolf
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 3:15 am

This is interesting that now national attention is being given to a long time problem, namely some pilots should never have been licensed. Ask any controller about how many times his airspace has been busted by someone flying along fat dumb and happy. Almost never is something done by the FAA. Time to do something other than to tag them violator on the scope and "call the tower when you land".
 
We're Nuts
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 3:53 am

Actually he lives in Alaska (Ruby Ridge North?)

Hi L-188! No, I'm not back, I just pop in from time to time and share my thoughts. Don't worry!  Smile

I don't usually agree with L-188 - come to think of it, I never have - but this time I'll get his back. A C-150 is not a threat in any way. Let's analyze:

Its Vne is 141 kts. If you've ever flown one, you know that's just about impossible to reach; you'd have to be in a dive with the engine at full throttle, and even then the forces at work on the wings and tail would be almost too great to overcome. Therefore if one wants some degree of accuracy in their suicidal rage, a shallow dive would be much more likely, producing a speed closer to 120 kts. That's about the maximum a car could do. Well you can imagine hitting a building at 120 kts in your car, but the comparison would be flawed. The front of the car would have much more surface area spread over a finer edge, and a heavier, larger engine block behind it, to smash through previously solid objects. In a C150, the cowl would prevent too deep a penetration because of its small size, blunt edge, and the lack of weight to back it up. Additionally, if the building could not simple shrug off the attack (and the White House definitely could), the wings would stop the former aircraft from doing any more damage to the interior.

Now consider the nuclear option. Here I'm going to be making a few logical guesses and I apologize for that beforehand.

The gross weight of the C150 is 1600 lbs, the empty weight 1111 lbs, leaving us with 489 lbs useful. Take away 170 lbs for the average pilot and 120 lbs for fuel (20 gal*6 lbs/gal) and we have 199 lbs left for everything else. Here is where the guessing comes in, so bear with me. Critical mass decreases as density increases in nuclear weapons, but since terrorists aren't likely going to be able to properly enrich their material, we're looking at a pretty crude weapon. Furthermore I doubt they would have the expertise or equipment to build the spherical style (Fat Man) weapon, so we could expect the gun-and-barrel type (Little Boy.) Add in the explosive charge and the shielding, that bomb would weigh a whole lot more than 199 lbs. I'd go so far as to say it would be impossible for the C150 to carry nuclear weapons. And if that doesn't convince you, think about the C150's cockpit: I have a hard time getting inside, so how on earth would they get a nuclear bomb strapped in the seat?

But what if they just want to throw some radioactive junk around? That avoids the weight penalty of a full-fledged bomb and creates a bit more death than just an impact, right? Well, no, not when you think about it. First of all the C150's cockpit is designed to keep thing IN, not throw them OUT (though there were many times I wished Cessna had included that as an option,) so very little of the payload will actually leave the airplane in the small crash we discussed earlier. If this were to happen, the radioactivity wouldn't be enough to kill anyone who didn't run up and eat the glowing rocks. But maybe a little is more than enough, right? Wrong. As before, terrorists just aren't going to stumble upon highly enriched Pu or U lying in the street. Plus, if the radioactive material is strong enough to kill in small quantities, the pilot would succumb long before he got near the Capitol.

Though I am no longer a pilot, I still visit my old airport and occasionally mooch flights out of my friends. I never feel anything but secure and safe in the C150. It's just too pathetic to be a real weapon.
Dear moderators: No.
 
slider
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 3:59 am

Quoting StealthZ (Reply 28):
he has NO place flying an aeroplane, even less teaching others!!

Amen.

Quoting Atmx2000 (Reply 29):
Frankly, I don't think a 69 year old should be a flight instructor. No telling when he is going to have a heart attack or a stroke, leaving some poor clueless student in the air.

This is a statement of ignorance. Now this guy may be a total moron with bad judgement (and I think we can all agree on this fact), but he's got his medical and is scrutinized a hell of a lot more than the other "elderly" people on the road driving a car.

You should worry more about the little old lady driving the Buick than this guy medically speaking. I suppose you support the FAA age 60 rule too?
 
aa777jr
Posts: 2269
Joined: Tue Feb 17, 2004 12:03 pm

RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 4:04 am

Anyone smart enough to know how to operate a plane should be smart enough to know to stay out of RESTRICTED airspace. I have no sympathies for the pilot, only the people that ran out of the Capitol Building fearing the worst I'm sure.

Regards.
A liberal is a man who is right most of the time, but he's right too soon.
 
PlanesNTrains
Posts: 5347
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RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 4:32 am

Quoting Jacobin777 (Reply 24):
egad..you actually read that website rubbish propaganda? I wouldn't be surprised if you think Ann Coulter is a goddess (and everything on Fox news is "Fair and Balanced"-but I do like Jeraldo Rivera..he's one of the only people at Fox News who is "Fair and Balanced")...........the only person on that website who has a brain is Pat Buchanan (he has enough balls to criticise this Bush Govt.)...too bad that pie didn't hit A.C. in the face..now THAT would have been funny

Oh for the love of God...oops, sorry, not supposed to say "that" any more. Anyhow, I'm sure once Hilary is president her first act will be to rescind any no fly zone around the Capitol. After all, it's stupid, right?

Well, "Fair and balanced" is for each person to decide. I'm sure you'd prefer if we had only one source of info - you. Sorry, but I can make up my own mind, and I'm sure most people can as well. Fox may not be right all the time in what it presents, but at least we have choices. Is that a problem for you?

Quoting Brido (Reply 18):
What would you have had happen? The fact of the matter is this: ***There is to be no flying of any kind over the capitol, the White House, or other sensitive areas!***

So simple, but yet so hard for some to understand.

Quoting StealthZ (Reply 28):
NOT!!..The guy is a victim of his own stupidity, there are many places better than this to argue the validity or politics of the no fly zones in the USA but it is not like they are a new thing. He

Amen. Oops, there I go again.

Quoting Pilotpip (Reply 34):
L-188, this guy broke the rules. You break the rules, you should be punished. If he can't control an aircraft to the standards set by the FAA, including having situational awareness, he shouldn't be flying.

Again, that's just too simple to understand  Smile.

Quoting CORULEZ05 (Reply 35):
Everyone makes mistakes and this pilot is being a victim of an over-reacting government.

Yawn.

Quoting Douglas7Seas (Reply 41):
Dubby goes into Iraq to save us all from WMD. Oops, no WMD. Uh, got 1500 + Americans killed in the process. Now, we don't see pics of him handcuffed, or his "license" taken away....

I'm sorry, I'm trying to follow. These guys fly into restricted airspace over the Capitol, are unresponsive to warnings, and ... ya, I'm not following.

-Dave
-Dave
 
Douglas7Seas
Posts: 119
Joined: Mon May 10, 2004 5:00 pm

RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 6:47 am

Quoting TACAA320 (Thread starter):
Quoting Douglas7Seas (Reply 41):
Dubby goes into Iraq to save us all from WMD. Oops, no WMD. Uh, got 1500 + Americans killed in the process. Now, we don't see pics of him handcuffed, or his "license" taken away....

I'm sorry, I'm trying to follow. These guys fly into restricted airspace over the Capitol, are unresponsive to warnings, and ... ya, I'm not following.

Heyy Dave,

Sorry ya find this thread so tedious. Let me lead you through my thought, step, by tiny step. The old, guy, the one flyin' the little puddle jumper, he made a little mistake, ya know, a boo boo. No one got hurt so let's just leave him alone. Ok so far?

Dubbya, made a big ole mistake. He read the "intelligence" briefings wrong. Or he didn't read them at all. Or, he just made up his own intelligence. Fact is Dubbya's mistake costs billions, and got lots of people killed.

Point is Dave, that if "we" are gonna handcuff and sanction Grampa Moses for a mistake that cost relatively little money-wise, and nothing in the way of lives, then surely a proportionate sanction is needed for as gross an error as Dubbya's war in Iraq.
Be different; Be nice.
 
kbfispotter
Posts: 658
Joined: Sat May 14, 2005 5:56 pm

RE: FAA To Punish Pilot Who Violated Capital Airspace

Mon May 16, 2005 6:53 am

What about the Student? Will any legal action be taken against him? I know for a fact that when I am on training flights, I have the right to devert the plane if something goes wrong. The student should have done that... He should have known that they were encroaching a no-fly zone.

Also, what about that new visual warning syatem that NORAD installed around the capital? I have read lots about it, and even watched the demonstration video on AOPA. Did it work? If so, why did the pilots not see it?
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