Beaucaire
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Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 2:55 am

Following an article by Reuters, the Syrian minister of Transport,Makram Obeid, has confirmed talks with Airbus regarding an order for seven aircraft.
No details were given ,but the fleet of Syrianair is relatively old and in need of modernisation.
Due to a ban on the export of hightech equipment to Syria,chances for Boeing to sell aircaraft to Damascus are close to zero...
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MEA-707
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 2:58 am

I bet on 3 A-330s to replace the 2 747SPs and expand a bit, and 6 A-319/320s to replace the remaining 727s and the one/two Tupolevs which are still in service.
nobody has ever died from hard work, but why take the risk?
 
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yyz717
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 4:15 am

Quoting MEA-707 (Reply 1):
I bet on 3 A-330s to replace the 2 747SPs and expand a bit, and 6 A-319/320s

Good guess. I was thinking 2 RR 332's and 5 320's.
I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
FCKC
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 4:19 am

Why not A330-300s , as capacity is closer to this of the 747SP which are full on flights to India.
 
KL808
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 4:33 am

Great news indeed.

Do you think there would be a chance for 2 A350's?

But I guess the A330-300 would be more suitable than th A330-200.

Quoting FCKC (Reply 3):
Why not A330-300s , as capacity is closer to this of the 747SP which are full on flights to India.

totally agree.

Drew
AMS-LAX-MNL
 
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yyz717
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 4:55 am

Quoting FCKC (Reply 3):
Why not A330-300s , as capacity is closer to this of the 747SP which are full on flights to India.

Why is there such demand to India? Indians transiting to Europe thru Damascus?
I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
ahlfors
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 4:58 am

Quoting Yyz717 (Reply 5):
Why is there such demand to India? Indians transiting to Europe thru Damascus?

Well, considering the BOM flights stop in AUH and the DEL flights in SHJ, I would say guest workers going to the UAE.
 
Beaucaire
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 5:01 am

Damascus airport is not really known as a transit -paradise...
Syrian airport authorities would have to change a lot to attract more connecting traffic via Syria - although syrians are a very hospital people ( within their country I speak ...) and have a great lot of attractions to show in Syria.
Visa-requirements and complicated administrative hurdles would have to be demolished before you can sell Syria as transit country.
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yyz717
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 5:07 am

Thanks Ahlfors. Make sense.

Perhaps the 333 would be a better than the 332.
I dumped at the gybe mark in strong winds when I looked up at a Porter Q400 on finals. Can't stop spotting.
 
FCKC
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 5:41 am

Yyz717

The demand to India via Damascus is strong , simply as the fares on the Syrianair flights are the cheapest on the market.
 
c680
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 5:52 am

Quoting Beaucaire (Thread starter):
Due to a ban on the export of hightech equipment to Syria,chances for Boeing to sell aircaraft to Damascus are close to zero...

I though quite a bit of the avionics in one of those Airbus lines was made in USA. How does the high tech ban work in that case? Is it OK because Honeywell (or whoever it is - If I'm even correct) first sold it to Airbus, and then they are re-exporting it to Syria?

Inquiring minds want to know.
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Beaucaire
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 5:56 am

Well there are european manufacturers of avionics perfectly capable to supply gear to make an Airbus fly.....
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OHLHD
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 6:55 am

God, its time to get on the 747SP before its gone!!!!!!!
 
airevents
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 7:30 am

Well, wait until next year for that !!!
www.airevents.com
 
FlySSC
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 8:12 am

Quoting KL808 (Reply 4):
Do you think there would be a chance for 2 A350's?

No. The A350, if ever it is launched, won't be available before 2010. Syrianair needs to renew its fleet sooner.
 
AF022
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 9:40 pm

Quoting Beaucaire (Thread starter):
Following an article by Reuters

can you source the link?
 
Beaucaire
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 10:00 pm

sorry it's in french :

http://www.reuters.fr/locales/c_news...ws&localeKey=fr_FR&storyID=8546203

in a different article Makram Obeid announces the cosntruction of two new airports in Syria..
http://www.lasyrie.fr/Economie/Actualites/Article4_Aeroports.htm

[Edited 2005-05-20 15:03:19]
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Tommy Mogren
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 10:08 pm

Quoting C680 (Reply 10):
I though quite a bit of the avionics in one of those Airbus lines was made in USA. How does the high tech ban work in that case?

The embargo works like that when it comes to Iran.
Affecting Iran Air, who now can't buy newer Boeing or Airbus aircraft.

What/Where is the difference ??


Tommy Mogren
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Beaucaire
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 10:16 pm

Quoting Tommy Mogren (Reply 17):
The embargo works like that when it comes to Iran.
Affecting Iran Air, who now can't buy newer Boeing or Airbus aircraft.

What/Where is the difference ??

Just to put things into perspective - a company like Thales is main supplier for Airbus on flight-electronics.
http://www.thalesgroup.com/ga/business_zone/aerospace/avionics.htm

If some Airbus -models contain a large amount of US made gear, that gear can be replaced by european made gear !
For market accessibility it is advisable to incoroprate US made added value in any Airbus-plane sold to the USA or elswhere.
But Airbus can basically build a fully european aircraft without helping hands from US hightech companies.
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Tommy Mogren
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 10:28 pm

Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 18):
But Airbus can basically build a fully european aircraft without helping hands from US hightech companies

If what you write is true, then Iran Air would be able to buy new Airbus aircraft.

They can't, due to the US embargo.

And if Airbus could make an European version, like you say, then why wouldn't they ?

They want to, but are not allowed...

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Beaucaire
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 10:40 pm

In my opinion ther are several degrees of embargo and Iran probabely like Cuba and North Corea are at the very top of the restrictive scale.
Syria is on an embargo list of the US dept. of Trade and Commerce but I doubt that they fall into the same cat as Iran.
Regarding a fully european version of Airbus - it is technically feasable but would most likely imply additional work ,research and budgets to replace the existing combination of avioncs,electronics and hydraulics with a europeanized ,sanitized version.
Would not make sense for a small number of aircraft but be worthwile for a larger order.
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Tommy Mogren
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 10:48 pm

Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 20):
In my opinion ther are several degrees of embargo

That could be the case...However with all the talks at the moment, I fail to see how Syria isn't at the top of that list too...

But then again, that list is constantly changed to fit the US needs....
So there's probably a reason for it...


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ushermittwoch
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 10:58 pm

Quoting Airevents (Reply 13):
Well, wait until next year for that !!!

This time around I'll have the money!
 Smile
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Tommy Mogren
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 11:07 pm

Quoting OHLHD (Reply 12):
God, its time to get on the 747SP before its gone!!!!!!!

Yeah, if you're looking at the Syrianair 747SP's
here they are:

YK-AHA c/n: 21174
YK-AHB c/n: 21175


Tommy Mogren
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Beaucaire
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 11:08 pm

Quoting Tommy Mogren (Reply 21):
But then again, that list is constantly changed to fit the US needs....

How much do we really know about the "Bad Guys " in Syria ?
I have been there quite a few times and always had a warm welcome...
My understanding is that you should not talk to lebanese about syrians but from there putting them at the same level as the North Coreans seems a little far fetched...
And implying ,like Condaleeza does, that Damascus is behind terror attacks in Iran is one of these allegations nobody can proof....
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Tommy Mogren
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 11:22 pm

Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 24):
How much do we really know about the "Bad Guys " in Syria ?

It's not a matter of what we think about them.
It's all about what the US gvmt thinks....

After Iraq, I wondered who'd be next in the world....

Quoting Beaucaire (Thread starter):
confirmed talks with Airbus regarding an order for seven aircraft.



Quoting Beaucaire (Reply 20):
not make sense for a small number of aircraft but be worthwile for a larger order.

If 7 aircraft is considered enough to make a European version Airbus for Syria, then there's a potentially bigger order coming from Iran.
If that was the only problem....

So there's more to it than that....obviously.


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na
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 11:26 pm

Syrianair´s SPs are 29 years old by now, an impressive age for an airliner still in its original hands. They´ll past 30 when replaced. Well done. Anyone who knows about their flight hours record? Even if they have been used moderately, they can´t be far away from 100.000 hrs, the typical age of a 747 Classic for final retirement.

Btw, why do you expect A330-200/300s, and not A340-300s to replace them?
 
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Fri May 20, 2005 11:31 pm

Quoting MEA-707 (Reply 1):
I bet on 3 A-330s to replace the 2 747SPs and expand a bit, and 6 A-319/320s to replace the remaining 727s and the one/two Tupolevs which are still in service.

Er, wouldn't that be 9 aircraft...?
 
OHLHD
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Sat May 21, 2005 12:15 am

Thanks Tommy.

Does anybody know for how long they will remain the fleet?
 
HEGAN
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Sat May 21, 2005 12:22 am

The article says (if my French doesn't lie me) the order will be composed by 7 aircrafts: 4 middle-sized and 3 for high capacity.

So it could be 4 A320 and 3 A332/3.

It also says the actual fleet is composed by 14 aircraft, 6 of them A300 (ordered in 1999). With this new order Syrian will have a very young fleet, even if it's not very big.

Agur,
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FlySSC
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Sat May 21, 2005 1:09 am

It also says the actual fleet is composed by 14 aircraf, 6 of them A300 (ordered in 1999). With this new order, Syrian will have a very young fleet, even if it's not very big

Maybe in their dreams... beacause in the fact, Syrian Air doesn't operate any A300. They never operated any A300 or A310.

Syrian operates today officialy a fleet of 6 A320 and 2 B747SP.
The Tu-154 have been retired from service and are stored at DAM.
But the 5 B727 are still used occasionnaly to provide additional flights.
 
chazzerguy
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RE: Syrianair To Order Seven Planes From Airbus

Sat May 21, 2005 2:13 am

Quoting NA (Reply 26):
Anyone who knows about their flight hours record?

Not current as of today, but the two Syrain SPs had the following cycles/hours as of 2003:

YK-AHA: 18485/43742
YK-AHB: 18876/44563

That's really not bad given their age... Figure roughly 1650 hours/year or so. Most of the SAA 747SP had hours in the 70-80 thousand range in 2003.

So, assuming usage has remained more or less constant, the Syrian SPs might only have around 50000 hours on them.