SWALoveField
Topic Author
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Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 10:16 am

The North Dallas Chamber of Commerce is recommending that the Wright Amendment be repealed as reported by the NBC affiliate in Dallas.

http://www.nbc5i.com/news/4509640/detail.html

The chamber says that the Wright amendment is hurting business in Dallas.

Support is growing. www.setlovefree.com

Robb
Dallas, TX

"You can't spell win without WN!"
 
SPREE34
Posts: 1561
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 10:37 am

That's the first objective group to make any sense of that mess down there.
Screw AAL, screw the port authority, do what serves the area as a whole.

DFW didn't make that region what it is.( it does have it's part in the mix) That region made DFW what it is. Let AAL and DFW compete with the market place, and the pie will get bigger for eveyone.
I don't understand everything I don't know about this.
 
JonnyGT
Posts: 228
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 10:39 am

Excellent news. I'm a Texas liberal (we're rare outside of Austin) but I wholly support the repeal of the Wright Amendment. My girlfriend and I wanted to fly to Manchester, NH in August but since we can't out of DFW for cheap (it's 460 bucks on AA), we are flying out of Austin for 280 on WN.

Plus, I live just 2 miles from Love Field and it would be MUCH more convenient to fly out of Love. WN should really put their corporate back into this. Threaten to seriously move their HQ out of the D/FW area unless Wright is repealed.


PS, that "report" that DFW commissioned is a SHAM. It's 10 power point slides, with no actual research or hard facts to back up it's dubious claims. Ask DFW to show you the report. They will send you a 24k PowerPoint file. That's it.

[Edited 2005-05-21 03:42:19]
 
PapaNovember
Posts: 461
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 10:53 am

If they do repeal the Wright Amendment, is Southwest anticipating picking up these extra 120 flights allowed, or will they cancel "one-stop" flights in favor of non-stops?

What happens to traffic levels in El Paso, Alberquerque, New Orleans, etc. if competing airlines move in to the additional flight slots and WN changes their flight plans to non-stop flights?


Phil...
 
OPNLguy
Posts: 11191
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 10:56 am

As you might expect, Baghdad Bob and the other minions at DFW came out with a news release on keepdfwstrong.com in which they pooped all over the North Dallas Chamber of Commerce's recommendation to dump the Wright Amendment.

One particularly great quote (from Jeff Fegan) was:

"We know people are beginning to understand that is not about low fares, but about a single airline trying to dictate
public policy and keep new airline competition out of
North Texas."

1. It -is- about fares, as in lowering them, but *they don't want to talk about that* at all. The study that DFW released last week doen't mention fares at all, yet it's -supposed- to be an economic impact study?

2. What they should do is to ask all the Metroplex travelers (who are stuck with the higher priced fares from DFW) who -they- think is truly the "single airline trying to dictate public policy and keep new [low fare] airline competition out of North Texas." I'd bet that their aircraft would be polished aluminum, and not Desert Tan/Canyon Blue.

[Edited 2005-05-21 03:57:23]

[Edited 2005-05-21 03:58:33]
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
jr
Posts: 1043
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 1:15 am

RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 2:37 pm

Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 4):
We know people are beginning to understand that is not about low fares, but about a single airline trying to dictate
public policy and keep new airline competition out of
North Texas."

Is it just me, or do some of these guys at DFW just wanna make you puke? Do they really believe people are that ignorant or do they need more classes in business and economics? There are going to be some real wise fools out there when Wright becomes a write-off.
I've flown on 9V-SPK.
 
padcrasher
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 2:51 pm

There are valid aruguments for the DFW position.

1) If WN is is being so generous in wanting to bring low fares to more people (out of the goodness of their own hearts of course) they can surely do it out of DFW.
2) DFW is more able to handle larger volumes of traffic.
3) Unlike LUV, a build up in DFW creates more incentive for International service.
3) If LUV is opened up. AA should be granted an equal opportunity and this would just add to the congestion.

This is about WN wanting to capitalize on it's monopoly at LUV. They are more than capable of flying into DFW...The low fare argument is bullshit, Texas style.
 
FlyingTexan
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 2:54 pm

Quoting Jr (Reply 5):
Wright becomes a write-off.

 checkeredflag 

Slam dunk right there! Excellent cliché, Jr.

OPNL, superb points as always.

A good ten years ago when I started flying Southwest habitually, I asked a SWA Captain when Wright will be repealed.

His reply, a sarcastic “Yea Right.”
"Wouldn't your boss like to fly home nonstop at 4:30 on a Friday afternoon?" -Airline Exec to Congressional Staffer
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 3:06 pm

Quoting Padcrasher (Reply 6):
1) If WN is is being so generous in wanting to bring low fares to more people (out of the goodness of their own hearts of course) they can surely do it out of DFW.

Which would force them to split opperations, or completly abandon DAL all together. You can't seriously expect them to do either, can you? I thought our capitalist system meant freedom of enterprise?

To turn the question back on you: why should the W.A. be there in the first place? Other major cities have secondary airports SFO/OAK, ORD/MDW, MIA/FLL, JFK/LGA.... why should WN be forced to abandon their proven business model for the absurdity of a law tacked onto a bill that Congress had virtually no choice but to pass?

Quoting Padcrasher (Reply 6):
3) If LUV is opened up. AA should be granted an equal opportunity and this would just add to the congestion.

DFW is a congested airport.

DAL is not. Traffic in 2004 and 2003 has been down and WN has been cutting flights on the inter-Texas routes.

Quoting Padcrasher (Reply 6):
This is about WN wanting to capitalize on it's monopoly at LUV

WN opperates from 14 of the 32 gates at DAL, 43% of available space. WN is also capped to control no more than 62.5% of all DAL gates.

DFW has no such cap, and AA controls more that of 75% of gates.

Who has the monopoly again? Why in WN's right mind would they abandon DAL to enter DFW??

Quoting Padcrasher (Reply 6):
They are more than capable of flying into DFW...

Of course, by their own admission. But here's the beauty of the capitalist system: they don't have to. WN has an inextricable right to do business wherever, whenever, and however they see fit... so long as it does not exploit or harm the innocent. To DFW/AA's chargin, that might mean a little bit more competition, but it's time for the metroplex to step out of the closet, and embrace DAL as a legitimate airport.

Quoting Padcrasher (Reply 6):
The low fare argument is bullshit, Texas style.

The "bullshit" is the arbitrary Wright Ammendment tacked to critical legislation for Congressmen Wright's own political capital... but being the DFW pawn that you are, I guess you skipped right over that part...
 
padcrasher
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 3:21 pm

DFW is not a congested airport it has plenty of space. It could handle what WN has in LUV x 4 easy. And it is not delay prone.

If WN doesn't want to split operations they can come over to an airport and go head to head with other carriers. ""This ensures low fares"" - not WN's mythical good will towards men.

This is about WN wanting to get a competitive advantage over other carriers by providing a more convent departure point rather than going head to head.

Your figures about AA are misleading. AA has put in jetbriges that double the amount of their gate space. They have 1 1/2 terminals now and will have a little less than half the Intl terminal. E is yours for the taking

Please some of us are not that naive. They were fine with Wright when they were small and it gave them protection, now that they are large the want to enshrine their monopoly.
 
padcrasher
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 3:36 pm

Now this is strange. You said DFW was prone to delays but on this report.

http://airconsumer.ost.dot.gov/reports/2005/0505atcr.pdf

Table 7. DFW is withing 1% of Luv's arrival percentage and is better than LUV in departure percentage. This after Southwest cut flights as you said.

And WN wants to add over a hundred flights?

What kind of BS is Ron Ricks trying to pull?
 
OPNLguy
Posts: 11191
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 4:18 pm

>>>Padcrasher Reply #6
>>>This is about SA)">WN wanting to capitalize on it's monopoly at LUV.

>>>Padcrasher Reply #9
>>>now that they are large the want to enshrine their monopoly.

I see that you seem to be fixated on Southwest's monopoly at Love, currently 97% of the departures. Alright, let's run some common sense numbers...

The only reason that Southwest has that 97% after all this time is that nobody (other than CoEx, who has the other 3%) is dumb enough to come into Love and have to put up with the WA/SA restrictions. DFW/AA and other pro-Wright folks like to parrot that 97% figure around every chance they get, but doing so is disingenuous.

Why? That 97% is a PRE-repeal number, not a "forever" POST-repeal number as folks like to infer. Once the WA/SA are history, sure, Southwest will add some flights to connect the dots to existing cities. Other airlines will have other flights of their own, and Southwest's relative share of the total flights at Love will decline from 97% to something less. I don't have the exact number, but in the study that DFW released last week, they projected that Southwest would have 201 of 362 Love departures, and if my math is correct, that's 55%, and nowhere near the 97% it is now.

So, why do folks like to keep throwing the 97% number out? Two reasons. First, it makes Southwest look bad, like greedy folks who want it all, i.e. "monopoly bad = Southwest bad. The other reason is that the 97% figure makes AA's 75%-80% at DFW look less objectionable in comparison. Of course, if that 55% ends up being the case, AA's 75%-80% would look worse, again...

Southwest doesn't want 97% of the post-repeal traffic--it just wants to run its business as it (and not AA, and not DFW, or anyone else) sees fit, for the benefit of its employees, shareholders, and customers. In our capitalist society, I don't think that's asking too much.

[Edited 2005-05-21 09:20:25]
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
OPNLguy
Posts: 11191
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 1999 11:29 am

RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 4:33 pm

>>>1) If SA)">WN is is being so generous in wanting to bring low fares to more people (out of the goodness of their own hearts of course) they can surely do it out of DFW.

There's no denying that Southwest is a business, but certainly history, and the appearance of the "Southwest Effect" on fares demonstrates that Southwest can concurrently have low fares and be profitable. Why ahould they be precluded from doing so at their home base?


>>>2) DFW is more able to handle larger volumes of traffic.

But even with American's de-peaking, there's still alot of traffic, still traffic "spikes" throught the day, and airborne holding occurs. Southwest prefers, where this doesn't occur, amongst other reasons.


>>>3) Unlike LUV, a build up in DFW creates more incentive for International service.

A complete non-issue. Southwest doesn't interline (ATA code share aside). Besides, with Wright/Shelby gone and resultant competition lowering fares, the folks who need to connect to ionternational flights will be able to do so on DFW airlines, and make DFW-DFW connections versus DAL-DFW connections.


>>>3) If LUV is opened up. SA)">AA should be granted an equal opportunity and this would just add to the congestion.

When Wright/Shelby are repealed, American and other airlines will get access to Love, and this has never been an issue. Sure, Love would be more congested than it is now, but it'd still be better than being #33 in line for takeoff behind 32 silver jets at DFW.

How come you had two number 3s?

[Edited 2005-05-21 09:36:20]
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
SPREE34
Posts: 1561
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2004 6:09 am

RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 5:02 pm

Pad,
Last time I connected at DFW, our taxi time alone was long enough for Southwest to turn an airplane twice. If you aren't running a hub operation, DFW offers nothing. Compared to other passenger terminals I'm in fairly often, I found DFW to be untidy and lacking in amenities. And what's with these electric carts rushing about and acting as though we passengers were walking in "their" street. These were not for handicapped people, they were carrying AAL employees and perfectly fit looking people.

No thanks. Don't care to fly through there.
I don't understand everything I don't know about this.
 
satx
Posts: 2771
Joined: Mon Apr 11, 2005 7:26 am

RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 5:05 pm

Quoting Jr (Reply 5):
Do they really believe people are that ignorant

It's known as the 'Carl Rove Method'. You attack reality, logic, and fundamental reasoning instead of just attacking your opponent on the facts alone. Then you let the media present both sides as if they are both valid and thus continually confuse the average citizenry until you're left with a mix of bloodthirsty brainwashed activists and complacent apathetic couch potatoes.

Quoting Padcrasher (Reply 9):
DFW is not a congested airport it has plenty of space.

Congested or not, I have many not-so-fond memories of taxiing for 15, 20, or even 25 minutes to and from the runway. Maybe that's light-speed to you, but it's not much fun to me.

Quoting Padcrasher (Reply 9):
And it is not delay prone.

In wintertime my local news shows DFW with all sorts of delays. I have no idea if DAL is also delayed at those times because my news doesn't list DAL separately.

Quoting Padcrasher (Reply 9):
This is about WN wanting to get a competitive advantage over other carriers by providing a more convent departure point rather than going head to head.

What the heck does a convent have to do with air travel?  Big grin

1. WN providing a more convenient & efficient departure point sounds like a reasonable business motive to me.
2. 'Going head to head' is accomplished by repealing the Wright amendment. What would stop AA from using DAL?

Maybe you should let go of the Wright Amendment and start pushing for a new DAL master plan that allows for massive expansion so AA can move their whole operation in, if they so chose. Would that satisfy you?

Quoting Padcrasher (Reply 9):
Please some of us are not that naive. They were fine with Wright when they were small and it gave them protection, now that they are large the want to enshrine their monopoly.

Maybe you just think the rest of us are naive. I don't think anyone is so blind as to assume that WN is doing this purely for the good of the public. Obviously WN expects to get some substantial financial and operational benefits out of this change, presumably much more so now than before they were so large. However, they have not gone out of their way to hide this obvious fact and I don't see how it would have any bearing on the legalities of the WA anyway. WN is merely trying to sell the public and the politicians on the idea that helping WN will also be helping them. What, in-and-of itself, is so unfair about that?

Look, there may be many valid reasons for keeping the Wright Amendment in place, but so far it doesn't look as though you or anyone else has managed to find any. I figure that if the WA supporters can't find any good reasons themselves to keep it in place, then what are the chances that any such reasons even exist to begin with? So, ironically, you've actually helped solidify my view that the Wright Amendment is wrong simply because all your efforts to prove otherwise seem to be grasping at straws.
Open Season on Consumer Protections is Just Around the Corner...
 
dacman
Posts: 380
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 10:26 pm

Padcrasher,

Just curious, why so much negativity toward WN?

Mike
lgbguy
"Airliner Photography is not a crime"
 
commavia
Posts: 9744
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 10:42 pm

I have the utmost respect for Southwest Airlines and Herb Kelleher in particular and I think Southwest is one of the greatest success stories of American capitalism and freedom. I admire the company and its people tremendously. That being said, I disagree with the North Dallas Chamber and oppose the Wright Amendment's repeal for several reasons:

1) It's not fair -- Every other airline for thirty years has been stuck at DFW without the choice of operating out Love, which has given Southwest a virtual monopoly at Love and provided a chance for them to survive. I fully believe that Southwest would not exist today if other airlines were allowed to fly to Love Field for the last thirty years. Back in the late 1960s, every U.S. airline (American, Delta, Braniff, Texas International, etc.) was forced to sign bond agreements and move their Dallas operations over to DFW (yes, they had no choice in the matter). WN, which came along after, took advantage of the fact that they had never signed a bond agreement and decided to fly out of DAL despite the City of Dallas' promise that DAL would be closed to commercial traffic. WN was allowed to grow and expand at DAL unfettered because they were guaranteed not competition. WN owes its existence today to the fact that they faced no competition at the beginning.

2) It will wreck DFW -- After billions in spending on new capital improvements, better customer service and more technology at DFW, opening up Love would make all of that virtually worthless. DFW, AA, DL and every other airline would never have signed on to spend billions on constructing the new Terminal D or the SkyLink train if they thought for one second that the Wright Amendment was in doubt. It would never have happened.

3) Southwest is preserving its monopoly -- Even though Southwest is generally regarded as the savior of all saviors in America, it is a company like any other and as such is trying, extremely unfairly and disingenuously, to preserve its near-total (I believe around 98%) monopoly at Love Field by refusing to even discuss a redrawing of the airport's Master Plan. This plan artificially caps the number of gates and flights the airport can handle -- based on the Wright Amendment being in place -- and essentially guarantees that no airline could ever truly give Southwest a run for their money with equal frequency, capacity or facilities.

4) Southwest can use DFW -- If Southwest really wants to offer longhaul flying from the Dallas area, they can use DFW easily. The entire argument about offering connections over DAL is pretty much moot in my view because there is not a single city in the Southwest system that can't currently connect over a different point (probably AUS or HOU) instead of DAL. Southwest's real motivation for opening up DAL is to capture Dallas-originating O&D traffic, not offer new connections, and if they wan't to do that they can do it just fine from DFW. Customers don't have to connect from RDU to SAN over DAL, they can already do it over BNA, for example. So, splitting the two Dallas area operations is not really cutting down on too many connections as customers can already connect over many other midcontinent points like MDW, BNA, STL, HOU, ASU, LAS, PHX, etc.

5) It would hurt the Metroplex -- Just look at the closest metropolitan area in size and scope to DFW that has two airports, the Houston area. Houston has Hobby, where Southwest dominates, and Bush, where CO dominates. As a result of this split operation, IAH is a fraction of a hub compared to DFW with fewer flights with smaller planes. DFW is the world's sixth largest airport for a reason. Because of the limited growth at DAL, DFW has been able to consolidate virtually all of the flying in one of the nation's largest and fastest growth metropolitan areas and offer passengers and prospective corporations millions of seats to hundreds of cities. That would no doubt be greatly diminished if DFW was forced to compete against an airport that should have been shut down thirty years ago.

Well, I know that many of you now think I'm crazy, but just my opinion!
 
aa777flyer
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 11:00 pm

Commavia- Could not agree more.

The Wright Ammendment needs to stay in place. WN has an open invetation to move to DFW, if they want long haul out of North Texas. WN has a strong hold on the majority of the gates at DAL, so if the Wright is repealed they will still have a virtual monopoly at the airport.

If the Wright is repealed it will cost thousands of jobs in the DFW area as AA would be forced to cut over 200 flights a day at DFW.

WN is not the sweet little low fare airline that every one makes them out to be. They are a self centered arrogant bunch of snobs.

Too bad they did not have an airplane fly into the side of a building on 9/11.
The TSA was created to make the post office look efficient!
 
commavia
Posts: 9744
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2005 2:30 am

RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 11:08 pm

Quoting Aa777flyer (Reply 17):
WN is not the sweet little low fare airline that every one makes them out to be. They are a self centered arrogant bunch of snobs.

I wouldn't call them "snobs" but I definitely think it's unfair that everyone automatically assumes they have the moral high ground on this issue. They are a company just like all other companies, defending their interests above all others. That's their job, and I don't blame them for it one bit.

Quoting Aa777flyer (Reply 17):
Too bad they did not have an airplane fly into the side of a building on 9/11.

Now, that is going way too far. I may not like WN's position on Love Field, but there is no justification for wishing the atrocities of September 11 on anyone or any airline.

[Edited 2005-05-21 16:24:43]
 
OPNLguy
Posts: 11191
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 1999 11:29 am

RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 11:22 pm

>>>Too bad they did not have an airplane fly into the side of a building on 9/11.

You know, I can halfway understand your ire towards Southwest since your profile indicates you were "LAAID Off" and you perhaps somehow blame Southwest for that. That said, as an ex-employee of AA (who lost two flights on 9/11), for you to wish that Southwest had one of their flights flown into a building on 9/11, well, that just demonstrates that you have some serious issues that you need to deal with.

And to think, you called Southwest folks (all 30,000+ of us?) "a self centered arrogant bunch of snobs." What do you call -your- attitude?

This thread is about The North Dallas Chamber of Commerce's support for Wright/Shelby Amendment repeal, and comments pertaining thereto. If you want to spew, I respectfully suggest that you find someplace else to do so.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
OPNLguy
Posts: 11191
Joined: Tue Jun 15, 1999 11:29 am

RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 11:27 pm

>>>If the Wright is repealed it will cost thousands of jobs in the DFW area as AA would be forced to cut over 200 flights a day at DFW.

Thousands?

If AA cuts some flights at DFW and moves them to Love, wouldn't some of those "thousands" just be transfering locations?
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
slider
Posts: 6806
Joined: Wed Feb 25, 2004 11:42 pm

RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 11:31 pm

Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 4):
"We know people are beginning to understand that is not about low fares, but about a single airline trying to dictate
public policy and keep new airline competition out of
North Texas."

Read as:

"We AAre opposed to AAny AAction that will mean increAAsed competition for AA."

 Smile

Clearly, the Wright Amendment absolutely has to go. However, I would also say that in the interest of fairness and leveling the playing field, that WN should divest several gates at Love in conjunction with the elimination of Wright.
 
swacle
Posts: 362
Joined: Wed Oct 15, 2003 1:41 pm

RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 11:35 pm

Quoting Commavia (Reply 16):
3) Southwest is preserving its monopoly -- Even though Southwest is generally regarded as the savior of all saviors in America, it is a company like any other and as such is trying, extremely unfairly and disingenuously, to preserve its near-total (I believe around 98%) monopoly at Love Field by refusing to even discuss a redrawing of the airport's Master Plan. This plan artificially caps the number of gates and flights the airport can handle -- based on the Wright Amendment being in place -- and essentially guarantees that no airline could ever truly give Southwest a run for their money with equal frequency, capacity or facilities.

Have you paid attention to nothing in this thread? WN is legally limited to 62.5% of the available gates at DAL...again, AA controls about 75% at DFW. Estimates guess that WN would operate about 201 of the limit of 362 flights out of DAL, or about 55%.....Hardly a monopoly when compared with AA at DFW...that 97% BS is pre-wright-repeal...after, all WILL have a fair chance to compete.

BTW--would WN really have a FAIR chance to compete with AA at DFW, with 75-80% of the gates controled by AA? Seems to me that the competition would be much more equal at DAL...

DC
Aircraft Flown: SF3 DH8 DH4 328 ERJ CRJ CR7 CR9 E70 E75 D9S M80 712 72S 732 733 734 735 73G 738 739 739ER 752 318 319 32
 
texan
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 11:37 pm

AA777flyer, that is an extremely immature and completely horrible response. You don't like WN, obviously, and as your name indicates you will agree with AA's position. Yes, WN is waging a propaganda war right now, but they tend to use cold hard facts. AA tends to shoot themselves in the foot with some of their arguments, but not even they would stoop to the level of saying something like

Quoting Aa777flyer (Reply 17):
They are a self centered arrogant bunch of snobs.

Too bad they did not have an airplane fly into the side of a building on 9/11.

AA has stated that the majority of the Metroplex lives closer to DFW, who would presumably still be using DFW. Why, then, would they be so concerned with having DAL open up? AA has reduced fares in a couple markets: DFW-BNA specifically. But only after the Tennessee delegation stated that they would support a repeal of the Wright Amendment in order to have lower fares between Nashville and Dallas. DAL is extraordinarily convenient for me and many others in the Metroplex. Many of us are tired of not being able to travel because we can't afford the high fAAres out of DFW. AA will have their opportunity to move flights into DAL if they so desire: maybe to ORD, LGA, DEN, DCA, etc. But if it didn't make money the first time when the only competition they had was a weak Legend Airlines...

AA has a good thing going at DFW. They control the market out of the Metroplex and gauge us consumers like no other. Maybe if AA had made flying affordable for the majority of us we wouldn't even be having this discussion. The Wright Amendment will be repealed, likely in a similar way to what the North Dallas Chamber outlined. Perhaps it is time for AA to start devoting more money to figuring out what they want to do when Wright is repealed than spending money on a losing propaganda battle.

And if you are looking for a bunch of "self centered arrogant snobs," look at who is trying to keep their monopoly in place instead of the airline that is looking to allow more competition  Smile

Texan
"I have always imagined that Paradise will be a kind of library."
 
SPREE34
Posts: 1561
Joined: Tue Jun 29, 2004 6:09 am

RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sat May 21, 2005 11:39 pm

Aa777flyer said......"Too bad they did not have an airplane fly into the side of a building on 9/11."

With that remark, you basically shot any credibility anything you have said, or will now say, could ever have. Wishing death upon others? You have some desperation issues that Mental Health professionals can help you with. You must seek them out for treatment, as they will not seek you out. Pick up the phone book, go to the yellow pages, and pick one close by. It's that simple.

This is not a "slam" or "flame job" on you. I'm serious. You need to take a look at where you are right now, and how you got yourself there.
I don't understand everything I don't know about this.
 
commavia
Posts: 9744
Joined: Mon Apr 25, 2005 2:30 am

RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 12:25 am

Quoting SWACLE (Reply 22):
WN is legally limited to 62.5% of the available gates at DAL...again, AA controls about 75% at DFW.

Where, exactly, are all of these extra Love Field gates that AA or any other airline could presumably use? From the Love Field Master Plan:

"Prior to the opening of DFW Airport, the main terminal building at Love Field contained 55 working gates. Today, as a result of new development and various lease restrictions in place, there are far fewer gates possible."

Love Field Terminal Gates Available For Use

West Concourse (WCC) – There are no additional gates available for use on the West Concourse. A previous 15th gate has been replaced by public necessity and convenience spaces.

North Concourse (NCC) –There are seven gates possible on the North Concourse. Other NCC gates have been replaced by vital SWA ramp/cabin services facilities which have been developed since 1974. SWA leases NCC with first-right-of-refusal to operate gates in scheduled service. Lease expires 12/16/06.

East Concourse (ECC ) - Of the 15 available gates, 4 are at a ground level loading satellite building connected to the ECC. In addition to the 15 available gates, 4 gates originally operated on the interior ECC cul de sac are obstructed by Gulfstream Aviation facilities. The AMR lease of the ECC for office space expires 9/30/23. AA has requested permission to activate 3 gates for scheduled airline service.


In other words, WN essentially controls all 14 gates on the West Concourse and has first right of refusal to all seven on the North Concourse. That basically leaves 11 gates on the East Concourse, of which four are basically ground-level boarding doors and thus are horribly inadequate for competition, and six gates at the former Legend terminal So, in essence, we are talking about all other airlines that want to compete with WN at Love Field fighting over 17 gates seperated by a runway, when WN alone will have control over at least 21. This is not even taking into account the fact that the East Concourse gates (and probably the Legend terminal as well) would probably need millions in renovations and reactivation costs just to be brought back up to safe, operating standard. This isn't WN preserving a monopoly?

Quoting SWACLE (Reply 22):
BTW--would WN really have a FAIR chance to compete with AA at DFW, with 75-80% of the gates controled by AA?

Absolutely. There are about 15 gates in Terminal E sitting completely empty as we post. Using a standard and fair assumption of 10 WN departures per gate per day, that is 150 flights, more than enough room for WN's ambitions.

[Edited 2005-05-21 17:26:58]
 
jm017
Posts: 780
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 12:32 am

Maybe someone can answer me this question: what percentage of DFW traffic is O&D?
"It's okay to cheat, if you just really don't like to lose."
 
jm017
Posts: 780
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 12:40 am

Quoting Jm017 (Reply 26):
Maybe someone can answer me this question: what percentage of DFW traffic is O&D?

Let me rephrase: what percentage of AA's traffic at DFW is O&D?
"It's okay to cheat, if you just really don't like to lose."
 
padcrasher
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 12:56 am

I have no problem with WN. They are just trying to grow the business as they should. But opening LUV is not all about what's good for WN, or what's good for Love field customers. People living around the airport should have an input, The cities of Dallas and Ft Worth have made investments in DFW, they want robust competition.

So when you start blowing smoke about low fares (like North Texas would not benefit from WN/AA going head to head in DFW), and congestion at DFW , how unfair Wright is (Southwest has had no problem with Wright for 25 years), And lastly, threatening the city of Dallas about pulling certain operations. That's when I have a problem.
 
SWALoveField
Topic Author
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 12:56 am

Quoting Commavia (Reply 16):
Well, I know that many of you now think I'm crazy, but just my opinion!

While we have different views on Wright/Shelby, I think your thoughts are logical and well-supported. I just happen to respectfully disagree with them.

Quoting Aa777flyer (Reply 17):
WN is not the sweet little low fare airline that every one makes them out to be. They are a self centered arrogant bunch of snobs.

Unlike this "argument" which doesn't make any sense. Snobs? How is this an argument against Wright/Shelby?

Quoting Aa777flyer (Reply 17):
Too bad they did not have an airplane fly into the side of a building on 9/11.

Anyone wishing for this needs to seriously think about what they are saying before they say it. Make an argument supporting Wright/Shelby and please don't wish for catastrophes to make yourself feel better.

Robb
Dallas, TX

"You can't spell win without WN!"
 
commavia
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 1:00 am

Quoting Padcrasher (Reply 28):
I have no problem with WN. They are just trying to grow the business as they should. But opening LUV is not all about what's good for WN, or what's good for Love field customers. People living around the airport should have an input, The cities of Dallas and Ft Worth have made investments in DFW, they want robust competition.

So when you start blowing smoke about low fares (like North Texas would not benefit from WN/AA going head to head in DFW), and congestion at DFW , how unfair Wright is (Southwest has had no problem with Wright for 25 years), And lastly, threatening the city of Dallas about pulling certain operations. That's when I have a problem.

If I am understanding your point correctly, than I totally agree. I think the first step in this public policy debate is for everyone to calm down a bit. AA and WN are rightly passionate and fired up, as both stand to face enormous operational and competitive changes depending on what happens here, but all of the spectators are the sidelines should quiet down just a little!

Quoting SWALoveField (Reply 29):
While we have different views on Wright/Shelby, I think your thoughts are logical and well-supported. I just happen to respectfully disagree with them.

Thank you. I was only trying to be logical and well-supported, and I appreciate that we can respectfully disagree.
 
OPNLguy
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 1:02 am

>>>when WN alone will have control over at least 21

Someone previously said that Southwest was restricted to 62.5% of the airport's 32 gates (under the Master Plan in place), and that 62.5% of 32 comes out to be 20, not 21.

>>>This is not even taking into account the fact that the East Concourse gates (and probably the Legend terminal as well) would probably need millions in renovations and reactivation costs just to be brought back up to safe, operating standard. This isn't WN preserving a monopoly?

What the other gates will cost to get ready doesn't have anything to do with monopolies, and the costs are not Southwest's concern--it's that of the City and the other airlines and is "the cost of doing business". Southwest will have its own costs getting the North Concourse ready.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
commavia
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 1:08 am

Quoting Commavia (Reply 30):
Someone previously said that Southwest was restricted to 62.5% of the airport's 32 gates (under the Master Plan in place), and that 62.5% of 32 comes out to be 20, not 21.

According to the Master Plan text I quoted, which is available here (page 4-5), Southwest is right now operating 14 gates on the West Concourse and has first right of refusal (i.e., de facto control) over seven more on the North Concourse.

Quoting OPNLguy (Reply 31):
What the other gates will cost to get ready doesn't have anything to do with monopolies, and the costs are not Southwest's concern

I respectfully disagree. WN has already had advantage afte advantage by having a monopoly at DAL for thirty years, and I think it is even more unfair if they are going to be aloud to use the existing facilities and resources they have in place at DAL to operate new longhaul service while other carriers (and/or the City of Dallas) will be forced to spend millions just to approach leveling the playing field.
 
OPNLguy
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 1:22 am

>>>I think it is even more unfair if they are going to be aloud [allowed?] to use the existing facilities and resources they have in place at DAL to operate new longhaul service while other carriers (and/or the City of Dallas) will be forced to spend millions just to approach leveling the playing field.

Gee, didn't Southwest have to spend some bucks in the past to get things up to snuff? I think they've "paid their dues" already, and if anyone else wants in, they'll have to pay for their own improvements as well. I say again, it's the cost of doing business.

As far as some of the other points mentioned go, someone just sent me this excerpt from the WSJ on 5/19, and I think they cover them pretty well...

REVIEW & OUTLOOK
Free Love
May 19, 2005

Given how often Congress has tried to bail out failing airlines, it'd be nice if it felt as strongly about giving healthy carriers access to a freer market. It could start by repealing an arcane law that serves no purpose other than to restrict low-cost Southwest Airlines from competing against its more traditional rivals.

The law in question limits Southwest to running flights to and from its headquarters in Love Field, in Dallas, to seven states. This anticompetitive statute was jammed into legislation back in 1979 by then-Democratic House Speaker (and Fort Worth Congressman) Jim Wright. Contrary to some claims, the law was not intended to "help" Southwest by graciously allowing it a few destinations outside Texas, but was a naked attempt to protect nearby Dallas-Forth Worth airport from competition after numerous lawsuits to shut down Southwest and rival Love Field had failed.

And it's worked like a charm. American Airlines, based out of DFW, has become an uncontested giant in the market. It flies some 850 departures a day from DFW. (Southwest, in comparison, flies closer to 115 out of Love). American is so dominant that other airlines have scaled back Dallas operations; Delta quit using DFW as a hub in January, canceling more than 225 daily flights.

Airline passengers suffer from this holding pattern, with higher fares and fewer choices. The Wright Amendment means Southwest is currently able to carry passengers from Love to only 14 cities and cannot route flights from its 45 other cities, such as Pittsburgh or Seattle, into Dallas. Other commercial carriers at Love are held to the same seven-state restrictions. On flights in which Southwest competes with DFW carriers out of the Dallas area, Love Field fares are an average of 15% cheaper.

Difficult as it is to argue against market fairness, American (which lost $761 million last year) and its proxies are giving it a stellar try. A favorite warning is that allowing more competition in the already fragile airline industry would do irreparable "damage" to DFW airport, American, and the local economy. But it is not Congress's job to support one airline over another. If DFW (currently one of the five busiest airports in the world) and American offer travelers what they need, they'll both succeed. If they can't, then jobs and business will migrate to more efficient competitors. Many large cities sport more than one large airport, and the competition has only benefited local economies and consumers.

An even stranger argument is that if Southwest wants to expand, it should have to do so at DFW -- which has excess capacity. But that would force Southwest to invest in a separate costly operation across town, rather than expand from its headquarters of 34 years. As for the contention that Southwest's expansion would "strain" Love Field, the city of Dallas years ago decided to cap the number of gates at Love to the 32 that already exist.

Everyone laments the dismal state of the airline industry, but the reality is that the government has contributed as much as anyone to its problems. Antitrust limits on mergers, obstacles to foreign investment, high taxes, labor rules and other policies have prevented the kind of competition that would produce a healthier industry. The Love field limits illustrate once again that when government attempts to protect one competitor at the expense of another, it ends up hurting everyone. We'd have thought Congress would be relieved to see an airline asking not for a loan guarantee or a pension giveaway, but simply the right to roll up its sleeves and compete.
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
ramerinianair
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 1:55 am

You can't spell Wright Amendment without WN either.
Almost all the other airlines have paid higher fees and developed their operations in a more expensive DFW environment. LUV is much cheaper and local for Dallas but is limited in it's service. Is it fair for WN to pay less to develope a hub in LUV and then just petition the Shelby and Wright Amendments? NO!
SR
W N = my Worst Nightmare!!!!!
 
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casinterest
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 2:01 am

I think the chamber has it right, Allow a phase in over 2 to 5 years. Maybe allow 1 more state a month to connect through DAL for awhile. The state would be set up by the airport commission. Maybe after 2 months they couls have florida and california.

I think the garbage about who should operate at which airport is bunk. Regardless of which side you agree with here. The wright amendment will have to be repealed eventually. Especially since the Dallas Metroplex continues to grow. Eventually the 2nd airpoort will be a necessity. And I think that day is no farther than 20 years from now.

Repealing the wright amendement now will lower landinging costs in DFW, help the consumers travel more. Increase O&D. Give airlines an incentive to hub there(B6 or FL) and make the whole area healthier. Keeping the Wright in place only harms DFW and the Dallas Economy. I find it hard to believe that the Guys running DFW are so staunchly against this. They have to be retarded. They should be pushing lobbyists into congress to repeal this. When Wright gets repealed, go back and ask those DFW officials 5 years later how they feel. I guarantee that their tune will have changed.
Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
 
KarlB737
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 2:03 am

Commavia,

Has Southwest's operations at MDW wrecked ORD?

Last I heard ORD was going to be expanded.
 
commavia
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 2:05 am

Quoting CasInterest (Reply 35):
Eventually the 2nd airpoort will be a necessity.

I completely disagree. In fact, in the entire U.S., Dallas and Denver are among the only two cities where a second airport will probably not be necessary for decades, or maybe ever. DFW has so much room to grow -- space for probably 3-4 more runways and 3-4 more terminals, that the Metroplex won't need a second airport for a very, very long time.

Quoting CasInterest (Reply 35):
I find it hard to believe that the Guys running DFW are so staunchly against this.

Believe it. Opening up DAL to longhaul traffic which the City of Dallas agreed not to do thirty years ago would be an unmitigated disaster for DFW.
 
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casinterest
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 2:09 am

Dallas and Denver?

Dallas is 3 times the MSA of Denver.

Dallas will need it long before Denver will. Also Dallas is a much more attractive Hub location.
Older than I just was ,and younger than I will soo be.
 
BHMNONREV
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 2:25 am

I have tried to keep myself away from these WA arguments, but I figure I will throw my .02 in anyway...

IMHO, I think there should be a semi-repeal of WA, in other words lift the ban on thru ticketing for two years and see what happens as a result. At the end of the two year period, if the results are favorable, lift the flying ban and open up Love to all who want to fly there, and somehow sh*tcan the Love master plan. If an airline wants to fly at Love, fine, let them build their own facilities and run as many flights as they want. The two airport operation does not seem to be doing too badly in Houston.

I really don't undertand what the big deal is about Love. It's a crappy facility in a crappy part of town and what is the big competitive advantage that Southwest will manage to gain if the WA is repealed. How much farther is DFW to downtown Dallas than Love anyway? And besides, DFW is catering to the entire Metroplex, while DAL's main focus seems to be Dallas and the surrounding suburbs.

I have said repeatedly that AA should let this go by quietly, and keep their DFW monopoly all to themselves...
 
txagkuwait
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 2:26 am

If any of you patronized Holly Hegeman's Planebusiness board back in the late 90s and in to the year 2000 you;d remember that I am (among other things) a failry frearless prognosticator and have no problem predicting what is going to happen.

You might also remember that a lot of what I predeict comes to pass. It's true that even a blind squirrel finds an acorn now and then...and if you make enough wild, outlandish predictions eventually one of them will come to pass. But I think I have a pretty decent track record.

So here's my vision of what is going to happen:

One state, Tennessee, will be added to the Wright Amendment radius. It's possible that it could be two...Tennessee and either Arizona or Missouri.....but I would rate the chances of seeing more than one state added as less then 50%.

The restrictions against thru ticketing and one stops/connections will be abandoned.

Southwest will thank the legislators from Tennessee who pushed this legislation thru by inaugurating service to Memphis.

Southwest will connect a lot of dots via one stops.

Expect the following routings:

DAL-ELP-PHX
DAL-ELP-LAX
DAL-ABQ-LAX
DAL-ABQ-OAK
DAL-MAF-LAS
DAL-AMA-LAS
DAL-LBB-LAS
DAL-OKC-MCI
DAL-OKC-MDW
DAL-TUL-STL
DAL-TUL-MDW
DAL-LIT-STL
DAL-LIT-BWI
DAL-MEM-BWI
DAL-BNA-ORF
DAL-BNA-RDU
DAL-BNA-PHL
DAL-BNA-BWI
DAL-MSY-MCO
DAL-MSY-TPA
DAL-JAN-MCO
DAL-JAN-TPA
DAL-HOU-MCO
DAL-HOU-TPA

I take exception with the folks who scream that Southwest has "enjoyed" a monopoly at Love Field and now they want to change the rules. Southwest has put up with the restrictions that kept them a virtual monopoly at Love Field...but they scarcely enjoyed them. Southwest was a monopoly at Love Field, not because other airlines couldn't go there.....they were a monopoly at Love Field because other carriers WOULDN'T go there.

From time to time, Braniff, TI, and American all came over to do battle with Southwest at Love Field. Invariably they got their butts handed to them. I don't recall DFW or the cities ever raising too much objection to any of those carriers leaving DFW to do battle with Southwest.

If you have seen this mess unfold as long as I have, it's all about trying to impose regulatory burdens on Southwest that will hurt Southwest. It was that way when they tried to evict Southwest in the 70s and it is that way now.

The entity between the proverbial rock and hard place in this situation is the city of Dallas.

If Love Field grows, Dallas gets the revenue.

If fares come down, more conventions come to town, and Dallas will get a good chunk of that revenue.

If Dallas residents enjoy lower fares, that gives them more discretionary income with which to make purchases at stores in Dallas, and that additional tax revenue flows to the city of Dallas.

If I were Dallas....I'd make the city of Fort Worth an offer. Okay...we'll close Love Field as an airport, bulldoze the runways, and Southwest will then have to move to DFW. (Or Addison). That's our contribution. You close Alliance and make all of those cargo firms move to DFW. And oh by the way.......you will allow the city of Dallas to annex the airport all the way to the middle of that road that runs N/S through the airport grounds.

[Edited 2005-05-21 19:30:14]
 
stirling
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 2:26 am

Quoting SWALoveField (Thread starter):
The North Dallas Chamber of Commerce is recommending that the Wright Amendment be repealed as reported by the NBC affiliate in Dallas

Robb Buddy, I am gonna tell you something that is gonna break your heart.....that NBC affliate of which you speak, KXAS, (once known as WBAP-TV) the station that Harold Taft built (BTW-the world's greatest TV weather-man...God rest his jolly soul...) is located in the the treasonous county of TARRANT! at 3900 Barnett!.....not in DALLAS, but FT WORTH! %}&?/:@#$*
Their Phone number starts with the dreaded 817.....

But back to the topic!

Glad to see the boys at KXAS are fair in their reporting, since the Wright Amendment is an antideluvian piece of protectionist legislation whose time has come....Let it go, it's over!
The people have spoken. Open up Love Field, and let the MARKET decide. It's only fair.
It's funny, the monopoly argument batted about by the AA camp...are we really expected to believe their rhetoric..?
Well if there is such thing as a Southwest Monopoly, it's a monopoly of the public's trust and respect...something which they've earned.

For all those who say WN is free to move to DFW....In what country would that be considered a fair business practice? AA is free to move to DAL.
Oh wait.
They tried that.
Failed. Something about a predatory attack on a smaller competitor. When they ran the little guy out of town, so were they. One thing about Southwest you'll never be able to say about American, at least when they committ to something, they stick to it....(the few exceptions duly noted), unlike AA who is here today, gone tomorrow.
What is AA so afraid of?

Suck it up.

All this talk of DFW failing all of a sudden is comical! Doesn't say much for AA's confidence, placing the success/failure of a major world airport on the activities of one airline wanting only to spread a little "LUV".....
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apodino
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 3:18 am

One thing that hasn't been mentioned. Under the wright amendment, aren't other airlines free to run 50 Seat RJ's into DAL? I would love to see UA run some RJ's from ORD and DEN, maybe Independence Air from IAD, NW from MEM, US from CLT. Can you imagine what AA would do if these airlines did that?

And one thing for you AA lovers on here. If you are opposed to the wright amendment, by continuing to fly AA you are giving money to support the current rules. If you don't want to do this, boycott AA and fly someone else. Send them a message.
 
jm017
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 3:20 am

From what I have read here, DAL is limited to 32 gates. So opening up this airport to traffic all over the country (repealing the Wright Amendment) will jeopardize DFW? My take on it is that it puts Dallas-Ft Worth on par with New York , Chicago, Miami-Ft lauderdale and LA as cities where passenger have multiple choices with respect to airports. WHAT IS THE BIG DEAL? DFW will not fail because of the presence of a 32-gate capped airport.

And I am sure AA fans won't like this comment, but AA has a history of stifling competition by shady means . So i am more inclined to question their motivation that I am WN. Don't get me wrong, I think they are all in it for personal gain, I just think a stronger argument can be made for opening up Love Field. You could even level theplaying field there more by capping WN's gates there to, let's say 50%.
"It's okay to cheat, if you just really don't like to lose."
 
william
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 3:46 am

TxAg,I remember you from Plane business. I will also state that nothing will change,except possible what TXAG has stated. SWA has another problem. If traffic is so stellar on present routes,they can drop them,so there is only so many extra flights they could add anyway with the number gates added.
 
PassBureauMgr
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 3:54 am

AA needs to get off it. AT DFW, they have less competing flights than they have ever had since they moved there. BN is gone, DL is all but gone, The originial Frontier is gone, People Express is Gone, TWA is gone, Texas International is gone (but CO has a few flights out of DFW) Midway is gone,
Ozark is gone. If WN has flights beyond the Wright Amendment, whats AA's problem. Let them go to Love & try & compete. They will fail miserably.
 
stirling
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 4:05 am

Quoting TxAgKuwait (Reply 40):
It's true that even a blind squirrel finds an acorn now and then

Hey TX, Down on the farm in Hopkins County (Sulphur Springs!) We have a similar sayin, "Even A Blind Dog Finds A Bone Once In Awhile".  Wink

Quoting Apodino (Reply 42):
One thing that hasn't been mentioned. Under the wright amendment, aren't other airlines free to run 50 Seat RJ's into DAL? I would love to see UA run some RJ's from ORD and DEN, maybe Independence Air from IAD, NW from MEM, US from CLT.

That is correct. Good point, thanks for bringing it up.
All the airlines you mention, that currently zing their RJs all over the country, are free to zing the same into Love Field...but...oh, that's right, on the Deed to Love Field it says "Southwest" as the owner! (Not!)
The monopoly argument is thin. Any airline under the moon is free to fly into Love anytime they want. Bring it on!
But, because of prohibitive restrictions, choose not to do so.

Close DAL, Close that thing in Fort Worth too! What's good for the goose, is good for the gander! (And what the hell does that mean exactly????)
Delete this User
 
PassBureauMgr
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 4:07 am

If I'm not mistaken, didn't AA fly some F100's a few years back and attempt to enter the Love Market, to IAH, SAT & TUL but failed miserably?
 
commavia
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 4:14 am

Quoting PassBureauMgr (Reply 47):
If I'm not mistaken, didn't AA fly some F100's a few years back and attempt to enter the Love Market, to IAH, SAT & TUL but failed miserably?

It was only to AUS, and yes, it failed miserably as they could never compete with WN on costs. Then, when Legend started up in 1999, they competed with all-First Class F100s on routes to ORD, LAX and LGA, which were also a financial disaster but served the purpose of competing against Legend, which folded soon after because of a horrible business plan and the heightened competition.

[Edited 2005-05-21 21:17:49]
 
OPNLguy
Posts: 11191
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RE: Dallas Chamber "Repeal Wright Amendment"

Sun May 22, 2005 4:25 am

>>>Then, when Legend started up in 1999, they competed with all-First Class F100s on routes to ORD, LAX and LGA, which were also a financial disaster but served the purpose of competing against Legend, which folded soon after because of a horrible business plan and the heightened competition.

...not to mention AA keeping Legend tied up in court every chance they could which helped them eat up their start-up money.  Yeah sure
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.