727EMflyer
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Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 1:53 am

In today's Honolulu Star Bulletin:

http://starbulletin.com/2005/06/03/news/index4.html

An elderly passenger thought he was opening the restroom door! First class cabin was evacuated for about an hour, but no harm done.
 
N766UA
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 1:57 am

Since when did restroom doors have windows with clouds going by outside?  silly  Poor guy, probably darn near had a heart attack.
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Glareskin
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 1:58 am

You will have to admit: the big handles look inviting...  bomb 
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FlyingTexan
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:00 am

A fellow passenger described him as an elderly Caucasian man, in his 80s or 90s, traveling with an elderly woman.

A Hawaiian Airlines pilot said it would be impossible to open the door of a pressurized cabin in flight.


Passeger: "Who knows what could have been sucked out of there? ... Who knows if those seat belts would have held us?"

Gotta love the media...
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HAWK21M
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:01 am

In Flight a Strong man would not be able to open the door leave alone a 90 yr old Senior.  Smile
What was the Aircraft in question.
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MEL
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Superfly
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:02 am

If the door opened in flight, he would have got the 'flush' of a lifetime.  Smile
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Superfly
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:03 am

HAWK21M:
Boeing 767
Bring back the Concorde
 
ikramerica
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:07 am

old people are scary once dementia kicks in.

one guy killed and maimed 10s of people here in santa monica, ca because he drove through the farmers market. he made a wrong turn, and then hit the gas instead of the brake, and claimed it was a mistake, but people who were watching him said he looked calm, not confused or panicked. and he plowed through lots of people while accelerating.

a few weeks earlier he had turned directly into the front of a bank building. yet they still let him drive...
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
TIMC
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:09 am

Quoting Glareskin (Reply 2):

Its called an affordance:

- Buttons afford pressing
- sliders afford sliding

Human nature just makes people want to do whatever it is the thing is made for. Obviously, the majority of passengers know what the door is, and know not to pull its lever.

However, when confused, if you think something is whatever it is you're looking for, you would use the handle. This is why they work so well in emergencies, they are easy to open, and people know how to do it. No point having an emergency door if no-one can operate it!

The flipside is when people get confused and try and do it mistakenly!!
 
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litz
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:36 am

I've always wondered, though ... that big, huge red lever on a CRJ's door ...

and the accompanying sticker on the stair ...

"DO NOT OPEN DURING FLIGHT"

...

Is it there because someone was actually stupid enough once to DO that?

- litz
 
MaverickM11
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:40 am

" yet they still let him drive..."

I lived in South Florida for 7 years....'nuff said.
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cedarjet
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:43 am

Hawaiian Airlines spokesman Keoni Wagner said..."There was no consequence -- the door did not open, there was no loss of cabin pressure or any of that stuff." Where the hell do Hawaiian Airlines find their so-called spokesmen?! Kindergarten in the San Fernando Valley?! "...Or any of that stuff"?! The mind boggles.
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September11
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:44 am

767 has how many lavatories!?
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rduramper
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:45 am

I know that during provisioning training we were told if you look thru the window and the red flag is down, try to look through to the other side to see who is standing there before you start knocking on the door. You just never know when there will be an elderly person trying to help out the nice young man out there...
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travatl
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:46 am

I'm still amazed at how many people with apparent full mental capacities, attempt to open the cockpit door or better yet, that tiny closet door, thinking it's the lavatory. Unfamiliar environements make people do strange things.

Travis
 
L-188
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:57 am

Quoting Cedarjet (Reply 11):
Hawaiian Airlines spokesman Keoni Wagner said..."There was no consequence -- the door did not open, there was no loss of cabin pressure or any of that stuff." Where the hell do Hawaiian Airlines find their so-called spokesmen?! Kindergarten in the San Fernando Valley?! "...Or any of that stuff"?! The mind boggles.

I think he was speaking to that portion of the public, who's only knowledge of airplanes comes from watching the Airport movies, when they first came out. Stupid as it sounds there are people who wonder that.

Quoting Litz (Reply 9):
I've always wondered, though ... that big, huge red lever on a CRJ's door ...

and the accompanying sticker on the stair ...

"DO NOT OPEN DURING FLIGHT"

I think it has something to do with Canadian Airplanes.

I remember that DHC had to put out a SB to relable the lav door and the aft gally door on the Dash-8-300 because people where getting the two confused.
OBAMA-WORST PRESIDENT EVER....Even SKOORB would be better.
 
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PA110
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 3:00 am

I still marvel at the number of people who can't figure out how to open the folding style lavatory doors. Why on earth manufactures still have ashtrays on the front of these doors I'll never understand. One one flight, I watched over 2 dozen passengers pull the astray out of the door instead of pushing where the door handle says "PUSH". So, I don't blame the old fart for seeing an actual door handle and giving it a tug.
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September11
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 3:10 am

Hawaiian 767 jet
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Photo © Aaron Mandolesi



photos of Hawaiian 767 F class


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Photo © Erik Nugal
View Large View Medium
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Photo © Erik Nugal



Just trying to get the picture ... of the incident.
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bwaflyer
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 3:11 am

And the number of passengers who tug on the flight deck door handle instead of the foward toilet on a 737/757, even though the flight deck door has a big sign saying "CREW ONLY" and the toilet door has a big sign saying "TOILET".

We say to the passengers who try that, Don't go through there and do what you were going to do, it doesn't make the Captain a happy chappy".

And the people who tug the ashtray - Turn the handle - it works just like the door on your trailer!

Did you know that's it's a no go item if an ashtray is missing on a door?! Even though smoking's not allowed, you still need somewhere safe to put a ciggy out if some idiot tries to light up. After all, you don't want it going in the toilet bin - full of paper towels.

Bless
 
Boeing Nut
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 3:42 am

Quoting FlyingTexan (Reply 3):
A Hawaiian Airlines pilot said it would be impossible to open the door of a pressurized cabin in flight.

For a plug type door, I understand this to be a correct statement.
I'm not a real aeronautical engineer, I just play one on Airliners.net.
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 3:43 am

I really doubt that this man was able to operate the door handle. The door gets pressed firmly into it´s seat by cabin pressure and even the Governator wouldn´t be able to open it or force the handle.
It is a PLUG TYPE DOOR, g*ddamnit!

Sorry, ANCFlyer, but I have to borrow your Bullshit flag!
 redflag 

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
Superfly
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 3:53 am

Enough of the technical jabber, was the old man able to get to the toilet?
Bring back the Concorde
 
jetBlue
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 4:08 am

Quoting Glareskin (Reply 2):
You will have to admit: the big handles look inviting...

Ever notice the HUGE handles on the 777 doors? Now those look inviting. They just appear so easy to operate.

Quoting MD11Engineer (Reply 20):
It is a PLUG TYPE DOOR

Don't the open upward and into the ceiling by motor? Aren't the mechanicals a bit different from the plug type?

jetBlue
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Tod
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 4:24 am

Quoting PA110 (Reply 16):
still have ashtrays on the front of these doors

Because if the manufacturer built the lav without it, the lav would be a new design and have to be recertified. Not usually that expensive of a deal, but for some operators, every penny counts.

Quoting JetBlue (Reply 22):
upward and into the ceiling by motor? Aren't the mechanicals a bit different from the plug type?

IIRC - the door does not have a motor, but does have a spring counterweight to assist raising it. Nonetheless, the pressure differential would preclude it going anywhere.
 
aa757first
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 4:34 am

Quoting Litz (Reply 9):
I've always wondered, though ... that big, huge red lever on a CRJ's door ...

and the accompanying sticker on the stair ...

"DO NOT OPEN DURING FLIGHT"

CRJ doors can be opened during flight, IIRC.

Quoting Tod (Reply 23):
IIRC - the door does not have a motor, but does have a spring counterweight to assist raising it. Nonetheless, the pressure differential would preclude it going anywhere.

Door 1L of the 762 (I think all L doors on the 763) do have electric motors.

AAndrew
 
kaneporta1
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 7:07 am

When a man's gotta go, a man has got to go...It was probably number 2, that's why he just jumped up and headed to the first door he could see...
I'd rather die peacefully in my sleep, like my grandfather, not terrified and screaming, like his passengers
 
NYCA330
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 7:28 am

Quoting FlyingTexan (Reply 3):
A fellow passenger described him as an elderly Caucasian man, in his 80s or 90s, traveling with an elderly woman.

A Hawaiian Airlines pilot said it would be impossible to open the door of a pressurized cabin in flight.

Passeger: "Who knows what could have been sucked out of there? ... Who knows if those seat belts would have held us?"

Gotta love the media...

it seems the media usually like to interview the dumbest passenger possible when this kind of event happens. I mean, the captain made an announcement saying there was no danger of the door opening during flight!!! good god.
 
airlinelover
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 7:29 am

That would be a hell of a way to evacuate your bowels..  Wink

Chris
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Gary2880
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 7:32 am

i hope they let him go to the toilet before they explained to him what he was trying to do
Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel :- Samuel Johnson
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 7:37 am

The door is smaller than the opening. It sits on doorstops attached to the door frame and is pressed into it´s seat by the cabin pressure, with a rubber seal around it. On opening, the lever unlocks it and pulls it in, so that the spring balance mechanism can pull it up. There is NO way you can force a 767 door open against the cabin pressure.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
jafa39
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 9:09 am

They should have a sign saying;

"Poo"

on the toilet door and one saying:

"In the Poo"

On the outside door.
We, the undersigned, do hereby consent.....
 
YZFOO7F
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 9:41 am

I still marvel at the number of people who can't figure out how to open the folding style lavatory doors. Its incredible. I almost spend more time watching people try to open the lav door than I do watching the movie!
Promise me you'll always leave the ground
 
baw716
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 10:02 am

It is my understanding that cabin doors cannot be opened in flight due to the difference in cabin pressure and the way the door is designed, smaller on the outside, larger on the inside, the door has to open in to open and with the inside cabin pressure pushing outward, it is a physical impossibility to open the door. If someone was intent on breaching the door, they would have to break the window

Any aircraft mechanics or engineers out there that can confirm my thinking?
Thanks
baw716
David L. Lamb, fmr Area Mgr Alitalia SFO 1998-2002, fmr Regional Analyst SFO-UAL 1992-1998
 
aa757first
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 10:21 am

BAW716,

You are correct. The only exception is the CRJ, which does not have a plug type door. They, theoretically, can be opened inflight. The 747 has a smoke clearing procedure in which the flight attendants open all of the doors in air, after, of course, the cabin is depressurized.

AAndrew
 
ComeAndGo
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 12:43 pm

Quoting TIMC (Reply 8):
Its called an affordance:

- Buttons afford pressing
- sliders afford sliding

It's called button-pusher-syndrome

They press or pull anything they get their hands on.
 
AvionicMech
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 1:01 pm

The 737 overwing exits are not plug type but they have flight locks on them to stop people opening them in the air.
 
ComeAndGo
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 1:07 pm

The fact that people mistake the lavatory door with the cockpit door or aircraft exit speaks for bad design on part of the aircraft manufacturers and airlines. Public places such a telephone booths or public transportation such city bus or taxi have clear sign to differentiate from the background. The same old people that pull on the wrong door on airplane also use taxi and phone booths without a problem. Telephone booths either have clear markings identifying as a phone booth such as a big sign or a clear color such as the red phone booth in the UK or the piss yellow ones in Germany. That way the poor old man doesn't confuse the phone booth with a public restroom or a bus stop. The same goes for the city bus. You have clear colors such as orange, green, yellow, red etc. The same goes for taxis. It's time the airlines clearly mark the lavatory so every idiot out there gets it right. Especially with the heightened terrorist alert these days. Could you imagine the poor old man opening the cockpit door and in reaction be clubbed to death by panicked passengers.
 
S12PPL
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 1:09 pm

Quoting N766UA (Reply 1):
Since when did restroom doors have windows with clouds going by outside?

Since Airbus started putting windows in the A346? Smile

Seriously though...Wow. Even knowing a door could not open at that altitude in a pressurized plane...I woulda probably pissed my pants at the sheer shock of seeing that....
Next Flights: 12/31 AS804 PDX-MCO 2/3 AS19 MCO-SEA QX2545 SEA-PDX
 
fbgdavidson
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:12 pm

Quoting September11 (Reply 17):
photos of Hawaiian 767 F class

Well if that is what F is like then no wonder he wanted to get out fast  Wink...did the designer have a fetish for Cadbury's chocolate?
"My first job was selling doors, door to door, that's a tough job innit" - Bill Bailey
 
chris777
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 2:58 pm

Does anyone know what is the situation with the old TU-134`s door .Because it is opening to the outside.
 
chris777
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 3:09 pm

ooops my bad it was long time ago when i flew on one.It is opening inside.Sorry....never mind  Embarrassment,  Silly
 
KDTWflyer
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 3:10 pm

Quoting Aa757first (Reply 33):
The 747 has a smoke clearing procedure in which the flight attendants open all of the doors in air, after, of course, the cabin is depressurized.

Now that wouldn't be loud at all would it?
NW B744 B742 B753 B752 A333 A332 A320 A319 DC10 DC9 ARJ CRJ S340
 
baw716
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 3:14 pm

AAndrew,
Thanks! Another question...why would the CRJ be built with a cabin door that could be opened in flight? To me that would be a huge safety deficiency. Is there something I am missing?

thanks
baw716
David L. Lamb, fmr Area Mgr Alitalia SFO 1998-2002, fmr Regional Analyst SFO-UAL 1992-1998
 
milesrich
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 4:24 pm

The solution, a New cabin announcement.
"Persons under 15 and over 70 may not sit in an exit row."
 
Silver1SWA
Crew
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 5:16 pm

Quoting RDURAMPER (Reply 13):
I know that during provisioning training we were told if you look thru the window and the red flag is down, try to look through to the other side to see who is standing there before you start knocking on the door. You just never know when there will be an elderly person trying to help out the nice young man out there...

I recall hearing the same thing when I was training in Dallas. This refers to the automatic slide deployment. It can knock you right off the truck. Never had to worry about it til I got to SAN and started doing provo. It really is scary. Even if I have to open the door my self I still want to brace for the worst.

Anyone else feel like they are being put on the spot when trying to operate certain things in public? It makes some of the easiest no brainers of this world a little more difficult to handle.  Wink
ALL views, opinions expressed are mine ONLY and are NOT representative of those shared by Southwest Airlines Co.
 
ComeAndGo
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 5:27 pm

Quoting Milesrich (Reply 43):
The solution, a New cabin announcement.
"Persons under 15 and over 70 may not sit in an exit row."

If you suffer from delusion that doesn't help. Some people get panic attacks in their mid 30's and 40's. They can do anything in a plane, like suddenly get up and wanting to get out of the plane in mid-flight. It's some psychological problem that is very common. There's lots of people in the US who get panic attacks when they drive on a freeway. You drive and suddenly you get head-rushes… holy sh.. what the hell is going on. And this comes on without any warning and all because when you were a kid something happened to you and you never dealt with that problem. So age per se is no indicator. An 80 year old man might be a better seat companion than a middle aged freaked out nut.
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 7:31 pm

Quoting AvionicMech (Reply 35):
The 737 overwing exits are not plug type but they have flight locks on them to stop people opening them in the air.

You are refering to the new emergency exit doors intalled on the B737NG, which swing out and upwards. The old emergency exit doors are classical plug type doors, which fit from the inside.

Quoting ComeAndGo (Reply 36):
Telephone booths either have clear markings identifying as a phone booth such as a big sign or a clear color such as the red phone booth in the UK or the piss yellow ones in Germany.

This was long ago. Since the German Telekom was privatised more than ten years ago, they changed to colour of the telephone boxes to silver/pink (Yellow stayed with the Deutsche Post, of which the Telekom was split off). In Britain too, they got rid of the red telephone boxes since a few years.


Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi
 
Blackbird1331
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 7:44 pm

At that age, having to get to the toilet is an emergency.
Cameras shoot pictures. Guns shoot people. They have the guns.
 
ACdreamliner
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 10:02 pm

i always thought that the emergancy exit row was onl to be given to young ale bodied folk. Let me say here and no I have nothing against the eldery or disabled people, but i was under the belief that this was common practice?
Where are you going?
 
MD11Engineer
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RE: Man Pulls Exit Handle In Flight

Sat Jun 04, 2005 11:35 pm

The reason why emergency exit rows are only supposed to be given to able bodied persons is that the older style plug type exit doors have to be lifted up and either put on the seat or thrown outside. They weigh about 25 kgs each.

Jan
Je Suis Charlie et je suis Ahmet aussi