norcal
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China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Tue Jun 07, 2005 10:40 am

http://www.forbes.com/home/feeds/afx/2005/06/06/afx2078731.html

Edit: these are freighters

[Edited 2005-06-07 03:41:05]
 
N754PR
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Tue Jun 07, 2005 10:52 am

Great news, I assume this will be for China Cargo Airlines.
Bush, your a sad, sad man.
 
aeropiggot
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Tue Jun 07, 2005 10:57 am

This might seem to be great news, but if Boeing plan to offer the 747ADV with in the next few weeks or months, then why would China Eastern go for the older version? I can't believe they would do this knowing the 747ADV is coming down the line???
A scientist discovers that which exists, an engineer creates that which never was.
 
boeingbus
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Tue Jun 07, 2005 11:15 am

Quoting AeroPiggot (Reply 2):
why would China Eastern go for the older version?

Because the price was right.... and the ever incresing cargo from China to the rest of the world can't wait till the 747 Advanced version is out...
Airbus or Boeing - it's all good to me!
 
United Airline
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Tue Jun 07, 2005 11:34 am

Will this be able to keep Boeing's B 747 line open until the B 747 Advanced comes out?
 
monteycarlos
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Tue Jun 07, 2005 11:37 am

Quoting AeroPiggot (Reply 2):
This might seem to be great news, but if Boeing plan to offer the 747ADV with in the next few weeks or months, then why would China Eastern go for the older version?

Simple... they can't wait for Boeing to offer the 747 Advanced.

Quoting BoeingBus (Reply 3):
Because the price was right.... and the ever incresing cargo from China to the rest of the world can't wait till the 747 Advanced version is out...

Spot on!  Wink

Quoting United Airline (Reply 4):
Will this be able to keep Boeing's B 747 line open until the B 747 Advanced comes out?

Well they have a significant backlog, but with Boeing still yet to announce the 747 Advanced that question will have to remain unanswered.
It's a beautiful night to fly like a phoenix...
 
na
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Tue Jun 07, 2005 5:01 pm

Great.

Every single 747-400 ordered prolongs the line for about a month. Currently the backlog reaches into mid-2008 under this pace. Twenty more orders over the next years and it´ll be enough to leave the line open at moderate speed until the 747 Advanced hopefully comes out.
 
CX Flyboy
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Tue Jun 07, 2005 9:39 pm

Cheap 747s for everyone until they have enough to sustain the line till the 747Adv?
 
N79969
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Tue Jun 07, 2005 9:44 pm

Makes sense to me. As long as they sell just enough for the line to keep a pulse, it will save them time and trouble down the road should go with a 747Adv.
 
CX747
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Wed Jun 08, 2005 1:33 am

This has been reported on the orders forum as a possible prelude to a larger order. Maybe they order to 747-400Fs to help Boeing keep the line open and then get a nice discount on the 747Adv freighter.
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
Carpethead
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Thu Jun 09, 2005 1:09 pm

MU operates the following Airbuses A300, A310, A320, A319, A321, A330 (soon), A340.
MDs: MD-80 (did), MD-90, MD-11
Boeings: 737Classic, 73G, 738, 763, 744 (appears).
It also operates BAE 146 and used to operate Fokker 100.
Fortunately, a DC-10 nor 757 will never wear the MU colors but any chances of a 777 or A380 order soon. The latter type, most likely a when problem.
This has to be most varied fleet in the world! Never too boring (except livery)

Not to be outdone by China Southern or Air China, which operate similar number of aircraft types, some with differing engine combos.
 
na
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 1:18 am

...still nothing on Boeing´s website about this order.
 
DAYflyer
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 1:19 am

There are now 38 747's still to be built I think. I believe all but 9 of them are for cargo only.
One Nation Under God
 
B742
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 1:23 am

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 12):
There are now 38 747's still to be built I think. I believe all but 9 of them are for cargo only.

Did'nt realize there was so many, who are they for?

How many more orders does the 744 need for the line to stay open untill the Queen returns? (747ADV) Big grin

Rob!
 
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juanchito
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 2:40 am

Boeing website appears 24 on backlog

4 747-400
4 Philippine Airlines

4 747-400ERF
1 Air France
3 Korean Air

16 747-400F
2 Air China Cargo
1 Asiana
1 Cargolux
4 China Airlines
2 Malaysia Airlines
4 Nippon Cargo
2 Singapore Airlines


Juanchito
Fotografos de Aviacion de Guatemala. Spotter.
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whitehatter
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 2:47 am

The Chinese carriers need freighters like the 744F two years ago! They could easily use the 744F and the 747ADVF alongside each other.

Look at the recent deals such as IBM putting their PC manufacturing out to licence in China. You can't really send complex stuff like that on boats. China needs freighter capacity as fast as they can negotiate the deals and get it through Government restrictions.
Lead me not into temptation, I can find my own way there...
 
JAM747
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 2:57 am

I was just reading a special issue of Airliner World on the history of the 747 .It mentioned that Boeing was able to keep the 747 line going in the advent of the 400 series by using the line to do conversions on older models and selling new ones at discounts. Seems that history might repeat it self to keep the 747 line open by Boeing either giving big discounts or using the line to do conversions for existing customers. I hope the Adv gets announced soon.
 
ikramerica
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 5:02 am

Quoting United Airline (Reply 4):
Will this be able to keep Boeing's B 747 line open until the B 747 Advanced comes out?

though there is a backlog of 24, only 18 will actually be delivered. other orders are old and should be debooked.

This extra 2 puts that number at 20, or 20 months. They need 30 months before the line can be switched to building 747Advs.

So they need 10 more orders, + any others to replace any other orders customers don't want delivered before 2008 (or are converted to 747Adv). Even at cost or a loss, it would be cheaper to sell those planes and keep it going than shutting down the line. The 747 line has made enough profit for Boeing over the years to be a "loss leader" for 1 year. It'll just up the sales numbers of the 747Adv needed before profit time.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
iowa744fan
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 5:23 am

Just a quick question, I assume that these two aircraft being ordered by China Eastern are non-ER aircraft?

Also, I was noticing that only Korean Air seems to be the only Asian carrier interested in buying the ER version of the freighter. Does the additional range/payload from the ER not matter as much with most airlines stopping in ANC? I assume that Korean is in a geographic location which would allow for easier nonstops across the Pac. Any info on this? Thanks.
 
Carpethead
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 12:13 pm

All the carriers operate standard -400 pax or -400F freighters. Only KE went the to the -400ERF route probably because the number of additional deliveries and the -400ERF can take-up more load or range for European routes. Most Pacific routes have to stop in ANC anyways.

I am kind of surprised that there are orders for 4 744 to PR. Obviously these won't be built.

It will be interesting whcih variant MU decides on.
 
trevd
Posts: 332
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 2:18 pm

Quoting United Airline (Reply 4):
Will this be able to keep Boeing's B 747 line open until the B 747 Advanced comes out?

According to my sales rep at Boeing, the 747-400 line is already sold out through the advanced. Albeit mostly with freighters but when I pushed them for a firm delivery date for a 747-400F in early 2008, they said they could only offer me something that was 'subject to available position'. i.e. a back-stop to someone else's current position.

Sounds like Boeing's been busy and the 747-400 line is already full until the 747 Advanced is available.
 
ikramerica
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 2:32 pm

yep, theoretically, they are fine. but if any 744s are converted to 747A models, then a slot opens up between now and then.

could this actually explain why there are so few orders? the freight market is growing, but with the Adv all but announced and the slots all full, there isn't much room to announce any new 744 orders. All Adv orders must wait for Boeing to make it official.

Do the 777F and 747Adv sort of kill off the 744ERF, even as a stopgap?
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
ZK-NBT
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 2:51 pm

Can I ask when those 4 aircraft for PR were ordered? Just wondering cause there were/are 4 747-4F6's flying around for other airlines.

NZ's SA)">ZK-SUJ is a 4F6 delivered new to them in 1998 after NTU by PR!
SAA took delivery of 2 4F6's around the same time as the NZ one!
CP had 1 aswell, which since the AC takeover has been returned to the lessor and is now operated by PR itself!

I actually thought that these aircraft flown by NZ and SA were the aircraft you guys are talking about? Did PR ever reorder another 4 aircraft new from Boeing?
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 3:40 pm

Great news. Can Boeing try to talk some airlines with the later B-747-400F production slots into B-747-ADVF, if they launch the ADV this year?

I would like to see Boeing launch the B-747-ADV/F next week in Paris.  Wink
 
B-HOP
Posts: 693
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Fri Jun 10, 2005 10:40 pm

ZK-NBT: -

The order was for 8 signed in 1994, making it although 12. They couldn't take the one in 1995 (CP) and instead take a -469M not taken up by KU. You have summed up the four they due to take in 98. I believe one was sold to a VIP operator, that makes it three yet to be built (doubtful).

Kev
Live life to max!!!
 
ZK-NBT
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Sat Jun 11, 2005 10:51 am

Cheers B-HOP.  Smile

Thats right I remember seeing Photos of a 747-469 in PR colours.
 
trex8
Posts: 4578
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RE: China Eastern To Buy 2 747-400s

Sat Jun 11, 2005 5:22 pm

Quoting WhiteHatter (Reply 15):
Look at the recent deals such as IBM putting their PC manufacturing out to licence in China

they didn't licence anything, they SOLD their entire PC operation to a Chinese company!
As it is the vast majority of laptops are now made in China by Taiwanese owned firms which is why the Chinese carriers need freighter capacity and the Taiwanese ones already have beaucoup freighters bringing the finished products and components (LCD panels and IC wafers) around the world.

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