CO7e7
Topic Author
Posts: 2686
Joined: Thu Dec 30, 2004 3:39 pm

Infants On Long Haul

Sat Jun 11, 2005 5:47 pm

On June 4th 2005, I flew CO 084 from EWR to TLV, and I was sitting in 42L (in the back of the a/c). The duration of the flight was 9 hours and 33 min.

in seats 43 A,B,C was a mother with 3 kids. One of them was a baby. This baby cried for total of 5 hours. A lot of passengers were getting annoyed because they were trying to sleep.

I was wondering what flight attendants could do about a situation like that when a handful of passengers are complaining and a baby is crying considering that it's a pretty long flight from EWR to TLV ??

Thanks in advance
 
c172
Posts: 101
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2005 4:40 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sat Jun 11, 2005 6:03 pm

There is nothing they can do, short of diverting and having police meet the disruptive baby at the gate.
 
dutchjet
Posts: 7714
Joined: Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:13 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sat Jun 11, 2005 6:20 pm

While annoying, especially on long flights, what can a F/A do except offer the parent some help and assist in keeping the baby comfortable. A cranky infant or crying child can disrupt the peace and quiet in a cabin, the only good news is that most little ones will eventually stop crying and fall asleep.

When babies are seated near me on long haul flights, I hope for the best and prepare for the worst!
 
wunala
Posts: 898
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sat Jun 11, 2005 6:23 pm

I think that there should be a seperate area on planes for children. I was hoping the A380 could offer thiss, but it doesn't seem to be happening. That way, they can make as much noise as they want and only f*** off other parents, not the rest of us, who have paid for a flight, and end up having to listen to their brats, that they can't control in the first place. I know some children are good on flights, but, one sweeping generalisations works for me.
 
zonky
Posts: 417
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 8:31 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:06 pm

We had this problem wunala in C on Air Nz earlier this year. A 3 year old in the seat in front of us was very upset/tired crying.

They had come straight through AKL-LAX-LHR. Mum was ear plugs in, blindfold on & tryign to ignore.

Made it very difficult for my wife, I and our 18 month old to sleep in peace on our LAX-LHR sector.!

Yes- there is the generalisation bit, but in my experience of long hauling our infant:
Mammoth preperation!
Buy a seat - Take your car seat. They like the familiarity.
Stop off where possible.- 24 hours on a plane is bad for adults. For kids.....
Be responsible for your kids- keep them watered, entertained, rested.
Reasonable adult/child ratio...

To behonest, i think the problem is worse in business. I witnessed far too many passengers on this and other trips where they think beign in biz means they can go to sleep and leave it up to someone else.

I recall a poor 4 year old girl bored out of her mind ignored by her mum, mum waking up and panicing as she was gone, and she was found down in the rear galley being entertained by some great crew.
 
UPS Pilot
Posts: 831
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 1:17 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:15 pm

Please remember that their was a day when you crapped your diaper too. Some of us here still whine and cry and they are not infants.
 
dizzy8
Posts: 29
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2005 7:33 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:45 pm

I agree with UPS Pilot! Babies are innocent and "not knoweth what in blazes is happening!" We just live in an age where one's personal convenience and comfort is paramount to all else. You could try offering to help the mom, use the headset, or, as a last resort...ask the flight attendant to intervene ...see following link:


http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2003/03/14/national/main544011.shtml
dizzy8
 
Stealthz
Posts: 5549
Joined: Wed Feb 02, 2005 11:43 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:47 pm

Quote:
Mum was ear plugs in, blindfold on & tryign to ignore.



Quote:
I recall a poor 4 year old girl bored out of her mind ignored by her mum,

This is the real issue.. the parents... not the kids!!! Parents must accept that along with choosing that role also means they must take responsibility for it!!!

I have lots of sympathy(even tolerance) for distressed children.. hell, inside an airliner is a foreign and often distressing environment for many adults. If their parents ignore this and expect someone else to take the responsibility they are shirking, that is where my anger would be directed.

Having said that, it applies to much more of life than flying!!

Regards

Chris
If your camera sends text messages, that could explain why your photos are rubbish!
 
Aleksandar
Posts: 2941
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2000 11:43 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sat Jun 11, 2005 7:49 pm

Quoting Wunala (Reply 3):
That way, they can make as much noise as they want and only f*** off other parents, not the rest of us, who have paid for a flight, and end up having to listen to their brats, that they can't control in the first place.

I agree with you, it is an annoying situation, but.... Infants are very sensitive when air pressure changes and believe me, they don't cry because there is nothing better they can do, but because they are often in pain. When you feel some discomfort (a slight pain in ears) and it happens all the time in my case and I'm 31, multiply it by ten or more and you'll get the idea what the infant feels. When you do that, I believe you'll feel more simpathy.
R-E-S-P-E-C-T
 
patrickj
Posts: 88
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 11:42 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sat Jun 11, 2005 10:02 pm

Quoting Wunala (Reply 3):
That way, they can make as much noise as they want and only f*** off other parents, not the rest of us, who have paid for a flight, and end up having to listen to their brats, that they can't control in the first place.

I don't think most babies are by nature "brats", parents make em that way as they become toddlers, and the fact is any one of us could have been the crying baby when we first flew. Not a very charitable attitude.

FA's should be taught that most small children that cry during flight do so because of the pressure changes occurring on their inner ear and the fact that their estatian tubes (which equalize air pressure to the inner ear) are to small to allow air pressure to equalize. It is very painful and will cause even Mr. Wunala to cry like a baby.

Sucking on a bottle should help and/or placing a towel in a Styrofoam cup with hot water over the towel to create a little steam placed over the ear will also help the problem.

Parents should also control their children and airlines should provide some form of distraction especially on long haul flights.
 
ckfred
Posts: 4763
Joined: Wed Apr 25, 2001 12:50 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 2:54 am

Wunala:

I can tell by your attitude that you haven't had a baby or toddler. Normally, our small one went to sleep as soon as we took off, but our last trip wasnt' so easy.

Our AA flight from ORD to ATL was delayed 90 minutes, because the flight originated in PVD, and they had a foot of snow. So, AA decided to pull an arrival from PHX that was supposed to go to DCA.

If our son doesn't go to bed for his afternoon nap by 1:00, he won't take a nap, so needless to say, with a 1:30 pushback, we were doomed to a a flight with a screamer, as well as the other 20 some infants on board.

To make matters worse, we go stuck in DL's afternoon arrival bank, so we zig-zagged from BNA to ATL, adding nearly 20 minutes to our flying time.

The F/As were knocking themselves out trying to keep everyone happy. They definitely earned their pay for that trip.

By the way, we pay for our son to have a seat, knowing what can happen to lap children during emegency situations. So don't consider him a freeloader who is taking an F/As time away from the paying passengers. He is one, with his own AAdvantage account.
 
ACdreamliner
Posts: 429
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 3:12 am

my worst experiance to date was in july 1995 on a flight from PMI-EDI, SpanAir MD-80, there was a really loud baby on the flight. Problem was it was my sister who was 2 years old at the time, i was 9ish. omg, she did not stop crying the whole time! there is not much you can do really!

on the plus side, it helped as i did not have to listen to the engines  Wink
Where are you going?
 
Aleksandar
Posts: 2941
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2000 11:43 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 5:14 am

Quoting StealthZ (Reply 7):
This is the real issue.. the parents... not the kids!!! Parents must accept that along with choosing that role also means they must take responsibility for it!!!

Once I witnessed how parents can act very irresponsible. An FA had real problems to explain to a woman that she can't let her toddler stand up during taxi. I really admired the FA's calmness and her diplomatic skills for the few minutes. Eventually, even such a professional couldn't take such behavior of the parents and as an answer to statement such as: He always does what he wants and we don't want to influence them", FA yelled "Then you make him and fasten your seat belts!" Although parents took it as an insult, they obeyed.

But, it is a completely different kind of situation. The one explained above shows how the spoiled kid can make problems, while the whole thread started with crying infants.

Quoting Patrickj (Reply 9):
FA's should be taught that most small children that cry during flight do so because of the pressure changes occurring on their inner ear and the fact that their estatian tubes (which equalize air pressure to the inner ear) are to small to allow air pressure to equalize. It is very painful and will cause even Mr. Wunala to cry like a baby.

Sucking a bottle can only be a short-term solution and often even that doesn't help. One can only try to calm down his child and count the minutes before landing. As a fellow passengers and someone who often has problems with inner ear, I can understand both parents and poor kids.
R-E-S-P-E-C-T
 
Koenie
Posts: 46
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 5:20 am

The only problem I had with a child was on a MAD-BRU flight that I took after PTY-MAD.. so I was awfully tired. Here i had beside me a portuguese mother with her child... (about 6 or something)

The whole fucking flight he was hopping up and down his chair and nagging and being difficult.... and the considerate parent... did nothing but ignore it....

I didn't want to slap the child... but my god I have strangled the mother at least four times in my toughts!!!!!
 
UPS Pilot
Posts: 831
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 1:17 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 5:25 am

I have a suggestion to all of you that are annoyed with infants on flights. Go to Bose.com and order the Bose noise canceling headset. I have a pair and you can't even hear yourself talk. I have a 4 yr old and he has more Freq. Flier miles than most here. He is very good on flights. I have no problem with kids on flights.
 
katekebo
Posts: 680
Joined: Sat Apr 14, 2001 12:02 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 5:59 am

"I was wondering what flight attendants could do about a situation like that when a handful of passengers are complaining and a baby is crying considering that it's a pretty long flight from EWR to TLV ??"

I think this a completely wrong question. In a situation like that, the correct question should be: What can other fellow passengers to help the poor mother deal with a difficult situation like that?

My message to all these people who have an issue with babies or children travelling, making noise, crying, jumping, etc. - in few words, being babies and children: Your parents should have been banned from having sex and producing such narrow minded, intollerant, immature individuals like you.

I have been travelling (on airplanes, ships, sailing boats, etc.) with my two kids since they have been 5 months old. Yes, sometimes they get fed-up and make some fuzz, but it's the duty and obligation of adults to make sure that the small ones ae comfortable, at ease and can feel secure in the environment that surrounds them.

(My two cents)
 
777STL
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 6:30 am

You can always put tranquilizers in their bottles.......
PHX based
 
HOMER71
Posts: 2128
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2001 10:56 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 6:59 am

Quoting 777STL (Reply 16):
You can always put tranquilizers in their bottles.......

OK, that's a little too extreme...everyone knows a dose of Nyquil should do the trick  Wink

Is it still the parents' fault if they're doing everything they could for the child and s/he continues crying?

For the other whiners, if they never had children before, then I can understand their ignorance and intolerance: I use to feel that way before having kids. The only solution is for them to have some in order to see the idiocy of their thinking.

BTW, flying next week to California with my 7, 4, and 1 year old (oh, yeah, and my wife) and, thankfully, I got a seat for the toddler. I might have to intoduce him to chewing gum for his ears...
"On spaceship earth there are no passengers...only crew."
 
dutchjet
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 7:04 am

Quoting 777STL (Reply 16):
You can always put tranquilizers in their bottles.......

I am sure that you realize that a flight attendant for a US airline just plead guilty to charges brought against him for doing just that - he has admitted to putting Xanax, a tranquilizer, into a cup of apple juice intended for a noisy child.
 
777STL
Posts: 2770
Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2004 8:22 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 11:44 am

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 18):
I am sure that you realize that a flight attendant for a US airline just plead guilty to charges brought against him for doing just that - he has admitted to putting Xanax, a tranquilizer, into a cup of apple juice intended for a noisy child.

That's why I said it.  Wink
PHX based
 
FLY2LIM
Posts: 1095
Joined: Thu May 06, 2004 6:01 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 2:23 pm

Quoting CO7e7 (Thread starter):
I was wondering what flight attendants could do about a situation like that when a handful of passengers are complaining and a baby is crying considering that it's a pretty long flight from EWR to TLV ??

It's funny how many 21-26 year old EXPERTS on parenting we have on this forum. Many of you make me laugh.
First, flight attendants are there to ensure our safety. Not only do they not have to take care of my children, I don't want them to touch my children.

Quoting Wunala (Reply 3):
I think that there should be a seperate area on planes for children. I was hoping the A380 could offer thiss, but it doesn't seem to be happening. That way, they can make as much noise as they want and only f*** off other parents, not the rest of us, who have paid for a flight, and end up having to listen to their brats, that they can't control in the first place. I know some children are good on flights, but, one sweeping generalisations works for me.

Wunala, I think there should be a separate section for IDIOTS on an airplane. I know your seat would be waiting for you.
First, I always make sure to PAY for my flight before I board it, and while I'm doing that I also make sure that my wife's and daughters' seats are also paid for.
Second, my daughters are not brats. I have a 5 year old who appears to be a little more mature than you. Oh, and my wife and I do fine controling our children, even on airplanes.
Sweeping generalizations didn't do much for blacks, for jews, and for many other people on this Earth. I suggest you avoid them as well.
Please, DON'T HAVE CHILDREN!

Quoting Zonky (Reply 4):
Yes- there is the generalisation bit, but in my experience of long hauling our infant:
Mammoth preperation!
Buy a seat - Take your car seat. They like the familiarity.
Stop off where possible.- 24 hours on a plane is bad for adults. For kids.....
Be responsible for your kids- keep them watered, entertained, rested.
Reasonable adult/child ratio...

Don't forget to teach them expectations and consequences for bad behavior. Works wonders for us.

Quoting Katekebo (Reply 15):
I think this a completely wrong question. In a situation like that, the correct question should be: What can other fellow passengers to help the poor mother deal with a difficult situation like that?

My message to all these people who have an issue with babies or children travelling, making noise, crying, jumping, etc. - in few words, being babies and children: Your parents should have been banned from having sex and producing such narrow minded, intollerant, immature individuals like you.

I have been travelling (on airplanes, ships, sailing boats, etc.) with my two kids since they have been 5 months old. Yes, sometimes they get fed-up and make some fuzz, but it's the duty and obligation of adults to make sure that the small ones ae comfortable, at ease and can feel secure in the environment that surrounds them.

Katekebo:
Your points are excellent, except for one. Why do we keep referring to the "poor mother" who sounds so helpless and ignorant. My children have always traveled with both of their parents, and we both work and are able to afford good things for them. Therefore, neither one of us is "poor". The rest of your thread is excellent.

Quoting 777STL (Reply 16):
You can always put tranquilizers in their bottles.......

Yep, cost a NW flight attendant his job.

We have 9 and 5 year old girls. They have been traveling from California to LIM since they were born, at least once a year and often more than that. At one point, both had Aadvantage Gold status, at the ages of 7 and 3. Our girls have sat in business, in economy, in the front, the back, the left, the right. They have NEVER bothered anyone. We have often received compliments from fellow passengers, typically showing total surprise to see them seated when we were getting off the airplane. Their surprise stemmed from not realizing that two young children were on the airplane for the long journey.
My wife and I have taught them from early on that airplane travel is fun and we ensure that we make it fun for them. They love to carry their own "suitcases" that they bring on the plane with them and are filled with all the fun things they love to do, and all the goodies they love to eat.
It's really not too difficult, if you plan ahead.
FLY2LIM
Faucett. La primera linea aerea del Peru.
 
centrair
Posts: 2845
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 3:04 pm

I don't have children yet but I asked my sister and bro-in-law how they managed their two children (4 and 18 months at the time) on a 12 hour from ORD-NRT and NRT-NGO.

The secret they said, was preparing the children in advance. They spent time in front of a map talking about how long it takes. The boy loves machines, and they told him about the plane. They got him a window seat, and my father upgraded them to business. Before the flight they gave themselves plenty of time to get exercise and get their energy out. They tried to maintain a normal type schedule on the plane so that the kids had structure.

I look forward to the time when I can travel with my children. At least maybe my children will be interested in my hobby.
My name is Centrair but HND is closer. Let's Japanese Aviation!
 
katekebo
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 3:04 pm

FLY2LIM,

I like your post, too. A quick qualifier on the "poor" mother - the original post implies that the mother was travelling with three kids, without the father. Frankly, I would not like to be in her place, hence the term I used. But whenever we travel together (my wife, my children and me), we share equally the "duties".
 
wdleiser
Posts: 865
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2004 9:32 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 3:14 pm

Ok... that day when I crapped on the floor. Well I just made sure that day is still present. Now my solution to this baby crying shit is having Boeing and Airbus team up with wonderkid playpens and create a safe ballpit down in the cargo hold for children to play in. And have one FA who is lactaiding to be able to breast feed those cranky babies needing warm fresh milk. We all know the A380 will have bowling allies and casinos. So it is obvious it will have the Automatic Baby asswiper 9000.

Another thing that angers me.... the drunk snoring business man. I think we should all be able to punch him in the face until he stops snoring. Or wear earplugs.

Maybe the airline being able to provide all with complimentary earplugs or charge a small miniscule fee (like really low) but of course only for eco would there be a charge.
 
MarkATL
Posts: 486
Joined: Sat Jul 03, 2004 10:07 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 3:26 pm

I say put them all in automobile safety seats and safely strap them in the cargo hold next to the live animals.  

As a consession to jittery parents the airline could, if the parents insist offer the service as a gate check. However most would probably prefer to drop them off at check-in with their bags. Just think of the convenience of changing planes knowing that Junior and or Princess is being safely transferred via say DIAs baggage system. 

At the end of the trip, stop off have a couple of drinks while you wait for your kid to arrive at the baggage carousel. No fuss, no muss, no clumsy stroller and everyone is happy. 

[Edited 2005-06-12 08:36:38]

[Edited 2005-06-12 08:37:55]
"...left my home in Georgia, 'n headed for the "Frisco" Bay...
 
CXYYZ
Posts: 177
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 4:03 pm

Crying babies don't annoy me, so long as the parents are trying to sooth them. I just turn my music up and put up with it. I have come away from a flight with a major headache after being seated across the aisle from a screaming baby, but the mother and FAs did try their best.

My beef is with older brats and their parents. My all time worst flight was 3 children, probably between 4 and 6 who screamed the entire way from ATH-YUL. Father got himself drunk and busied himself with his newspaper (appeared as though they were connecting from TLV so I'm sure he had read it all before arriving at ATH), mother ignored them. Fellow pax eventually tried to take the kids and calm them down but to little avail. On the continuing sector to YYZ it was discovered that at least one of the children had wet his/her seat.
 
justapassenger
Posts: 75
Joined: Wed Dec 15, 2004 9:36 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 7:37 pm

I certainly agree that kids are the parent’s responsibility and all the practical suggestions made here are right-on, especially: 1) nursing/bottles for take-off and landing, 2) make the trip an adventure and 3) wear the kid out before the trip.

However, Northwest (I have no experience with other US carriers on really long haul flights) needs to be more responsive to the needs of infants as well.

First, NW’s new Detroit Terminal has to be the only modern international terminal WITHOUT a play area for kids. Every other major international airport has a place for kids to use up excess energy before a flight.

Second, Northwest needs to make a baby meal automatic with a lap child or infant ticket. We learned the hard way that lap child tickets come with a regular meal and that we should have ordered a special infant meal for our baby. Fortunately our baby was still nursing so Mom was able to make up the difference from DTW to NRT, but I would guess that many crying infants on NW’s long haul flights are learning the hard way that infant tickets don’t automatically come with infant meals.
 
Aleksandar
Posts: 2941
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2000 11:43 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 8:24 pm

Quoting Homer71 (Reply 17):
Is it still the parents' fault if they're doing everything they could for the child and s/he continues crying?

ABSOLUTELY NOT!

Quoting Homer71 (Reply 17):
For the other whiners, if they never had children before, then I can understand their ignorance and intolerance: I use to feel that way before having kids

Hey, I don't have children but I still understand how the parents feel.

Quoting Homer71 (Reply 17):
I might have to intoduce him to chewing gum for his ears...

Are you sure about that? It also sounds too extreme....
R-E-S-P-E-C-T
 
richardw
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 8:42 pm

...don't earn good revenues so why bother.
 
UPS Pilot
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 8:45 pm

FLY2LIM

Just added you to my respected users. Amen
 
ltbewr
Posts: 12501
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 9:48 pm

Infants and toddlers can be a challange to a decent experience to others on a flight. There are a number of issues, some of which were mentioned above. Ear problems due to pressurization. The difficulty many childeren (and some adults) to maintain decorum in the enclosed enviroment of an airplane. Overwhelmed parent(s) tired from the final prep for the travel, getting to and through the airport, handling the child's carry ons as well as their own. Some parents think the f/a's are babysitters. Besides the annoyance to other pax, crying babies/children or otherwise poor acting children can create an unsafe enviroment. I understand that babies/toddlers/infants are human and sometimes there is nothing anyone can do about their beheavors and we have to face reality. IFE, or in my case a CD player with headphones, can help with these circumstances.
In December 2003, I had to fly for work EWR-SJU, on AA on a A-300. In the middle section in a row back across to my right was a woman with 2 crying, crawling and disruptive toddlers (2 & 4 years old?). Worse, we had a 2 hour delay in take off due to snow/de-icing. Fortuntaly this was a flight in the later morning/early afternoon. We were seated in the forward coach section, only a few rows back from the biz/first section. One child was constantly clinging and annoying his mother and cried almost 80% of the flight time. Practically the whole flight, even during takeoff and landing, at least one of the two toddlers was NEVER belted in their seat. Their crying was very annoying to me and my fellow pax. The F/A's seemed to avoid helping the mother/children in question, their only contact during food/beverage service. This put the children as well as the other pax at considerable risk had their been serious turbulance. I kinda felt sorry for the mother, but was annoyed for her lack of ability to control her children better. While not a full flight, it wouldn't have been easy to move around to other seats. Besides, I had no one seated next to me and the ride is better in the front coach section. (had the advantage of an aisle seat and be able to look out the window).
I do feel that all babies/infants should be in car seats or booster seats and always belted in to keep them secure for safety and keep them from 'escaping' their parents. Parents should try to prepare their children and them selves to be able to deal as best as possible with potential ear beheavor problems. I wish that f/a's would be firm upon parents to keep control of their children for everybody's safety and other pax's peace.
 
HOMER71
Posts: 2128
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2001 10:56 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 10:01 pm

Quoting Aleksandar (Reply 27):
Hey, I don't have children but I still understand how the parents feel.

That's nice to know, too bad not all childless adults are like you  bigthumbsup 

Quoting Aleksandar (Reply 27):
Are you sure about that? It also sounds too extreme....

I kind of meant it tongue-in-cheek, but he'll definitely have snacks to chew on to help with the ears.
"On spaceship earth there are no passengers...only crew."
 
Aleksandar
Posts: 2941
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2000 11:43 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Sun Jun 12, 2005 10:40 pm

Quoting Homer71 (Reply 31):
That's nice to know, too bad not all childless adults are like you

Well, they should have in mind that it's not easy to travel with three kids.

Quoting Homer71 (Reply 31):
I kind of meant it tongue-in-cheek, but he'll definitely have snacks to chew on to help with the ears.

There are some medications, like ear-drops (or nose, forget me I'm not too familiar with medicine). It might help. Why don't you ask a pediatrician for the advice or prescription?

After all, you should try everything that the new generation of A.netters feel the joy of flying and not pain during flight. It is not your obligation as parent, but as airline enthusiast, as well  smile 
R-E-S-P-E-C-T
 
User avatar
PA110
Posts: 1897
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Mon Jun 13, 2005 12:00 am

Quoting Wunala (Reply 3):
I think that there should be a seperate area on planes for children.

That's so not going to happen! Airlines cannot forecast how many children will be on any given flight, and they're not going to risk setting aside precious space that ends up going unused.
It's been swell, but the swelling has gone down.
 
N867BX
Posts: 295
Joined: Thu Nov 25, 2004 10:19 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Mon Jun 13, 2005 12:58 am

Quoting Wdleiser (Reply 23):
Another thing that angers me.... the drunk snoring business man. I think we should all be able to punch him in the face until he stops snoring. Or wear earplugs.

If you break his nose he may snore even louder!

Quoting Wunala (Reply 3):
I think that there should be a separate area on planes for children

I wonder if the overhead bins are soundproof.
 
FLY2LIM
Posts: 1095
Joined: Thu May 06, 2004 6:01 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Mon Jun 13, 2005 1:24 am

Quoting Katekebo (Reply 22):
FLY2LIM,

I like your post, too. A quick qualifier on the "poor" mother - the original post implies that the mother was travelling with three kids, without the father. Frankly, I would not like to be in her place, hence the term I used. But whenever we travel together (my wife, my children and me), we share equally the "duties".

Katekebo:
I totally figured that. I was just standing up for the FATHERS of this world who give a damn about their kids (I actually do more than that, I LOVE mine) and don't set them up for failure in life. Heck, I'm not done, but I'm TRYING. But, I did understand what you meant and why you wrote it.

Quoting UPS Pilot (Reply 29):
FLY2LIM

Just added you to my respected users. Amen

Katekebo, UPS Pilot, welcome to my respected users list.

FLY2LIM
Faucett. La primera linea aerea del Peru.
 
JrMafia90
Posts: 205
Joined: Tue Mar 30, 2004 7:36 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Mon Jun 13, 2005 1:33 am

Quoting Wunala (Reply 3):
I think that there should be a seperate area on planes for children.

That would be a good idea.

I was on a flight from FCO-EWR and there was a baby in the row right in front of us and it didn't make one sound! I was shocked, but it was a nice quiet flight.
 
wdleiser
Posts: 865
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2004 9:32 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Mon Jun 13, 2005 7:09 am

Well one NW FA had the brilliant idea of putting good ole valium into baby formula. Shut the baby up and got him fired. A double wammy!
 
Trolley Dolley
Posts: 548
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2000 1:57 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Mon Jun 13, 2005 7:26 am

Sigh. Thankfully there are some airlines that understand what it's like to travel with children. On one LAN flight, the purser made an annoucement, at top of descent, that the best way for children to clear their ears is to have a good cry. Anger turned into hostility. In my experience, including travelling for 36 hours from Africa to New Zealand with a 3 year old and a 7 year old, I try to exhaust the kids at the airport, run around, play games etc. Exercise, a full tummy and a dark cabin with the drone of the engines soon puts them to sleep. (I'm not a parent, this was the niece and nephew. But then kids are always better behaved with other people, aren't they mums and dads out there?)

I don't mind children on planes. They can be as well behaved or troublesome as big people. Indeed I remember travelling with a school band from Australia to London. The band took up an entire 747 cabin, except for a couple with a baby in the bassinet seat. At the start of the flight, everyone looked at teh baby in horror and thought "screaming kid" and they looked at us in horror and thought "rowdy boys". By the end of the long flight, the baby had been adopted by 70 or so "uncles" (it was an all boys school). The little fella was passed around the cabin so much that mum had to politely ask for him back! A great time was had by all.
 
DarthRandall
Posts: 294
Joined: Wed Mar 30, 2005 8:17 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Mon Jun 13, 2005 8:38 am

Quoting Wunala (Reply 3):
I think that there should be a seperate area on planes for children. I was hoping the A380 could offer thiss, but it doesn't seem to be happening. That way, they can make as much noise as they want and only f*** off other parents, not the rest of us, who have paid for a flight, and end up having to listen to their brats, that they can't control in the first place. I know some children are good on flights, but, one sweeping generalisations works for me.

We could call it "Quiet Economy." I'd pay an extra twenty-five bucks, fifty on a longer flight.

And you parents bitching that we non-parents aren't sympathetic, let's try a little role reversal. Imagine that it isn't your little angel but rather somebody else's abomination that is keeping the plane awake on the eight-hour redeye. Imagine that your ears haven't spent months and months getting used to that miserable ear-splitting scream and that you're someone who is used to sleeping through the night without having to get up and take care of a crying baby. By bringing a child that you know is going to cry on the plane, you willingly do a disservice to everyone else that will be on it. Yes, it probably is difficult for parents to take care of their children on a plane, but it's also their own damn responsibility. Don't expect sympathy.
Ninjas can kill anyone they want! Ninjas cut off heads all the time and don't even think twice about it.
 
HOMER71
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Mon Jun 13, 2005 10:23 am

Quoting Aleksandar (Reply 32):
you should try everything that the new generation of A.netters feel the joy of flying and not pain during flight. It is not your obligation as parent, but as airline enthusiast, as well

Good point...especially since the 9th word he has learned to say is "airplane" (of course, he pronounces it "eh-pane")
"On spaceship earth there are no passengers...only crew."
 
ikramerica
Posts: 13808
Joined: Mon May 23, 2005 9:33 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Mon Jun 13, 2005 11:02 am

I do think there should be a "family" section on longhaul aircraft. It would not be hard to do, since the Airlines know full well where the 1/2 price pax are sitting. They can sit them all together, and only offer X number of 1/2 fare seats on a plane. The section need not be small. I'm not trying to make it hard to fly, just a better experience for all. If they can limit other fares, there is no reason they can't limit those. Which is not to say you still can't fly with kids, but if the 1/2 fare seats are full, you'd have to pay full fare, and it might encourage you to try a different day.

Also, jelly beans are GREAT for clearing ears. They are harder and chewier than gum, kids (and adults) will keep eating them. Also, to shut up a kid, the parents can always add some Bailey's or Kahlua to the milk bottle. My parents did that. Not much, just enough to calm us down and make us sleepy. I turned out fine. Of course, I still love both of those drinks.

Gulf Air advertises Sky Nannies on every flight. How does that work? Is it for all cabins?
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
Aleksandar
Posts: 2941
Joined: Sat Jul 29, 2000 11:43 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Mon Jun 13, 2005 1:30 pm

Quoting Homer71 (Reply 40):
Good point...especially since the 9th word he has learned to say is "airplane" (of course, he pronounces it "eh-pane")

Great!  bigthumbsup 

Few more words like the "airplane" and you should open First Class account for young gentleman.  biggrin  In just a few years time (or better said "in a blink of an eye") he will be taking his old man for some plane spotting and if "old man" behaves well, maybe even few flights.
R-E-S-P-E-C-T
 
jacobin777
Posts: 12262
Joined: Sat Sep 11, 2004 6:29 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Mon Jun 13, 2005 2:32 pm

Quoting UPS Pilot (Reply 14):
I have a suggestion to all of you that are annoyed with infants on flights. Go to Bose.com and order the Bose noise canceling headset. I have a pair and you can't even hear yourself talk. I have a 4 yr old and he has more Freq. Flier miles than most here. He is very good on flights. I have no problem with kids on flights.

lol...I had one on my flight yesterday, and it was smoooooth sailing (er...flying)

Quoting Katekebo (Reply 15):
I think this a completely wrong question. In a situation like that, the correct question should be: What can other fellow passengers to help the poor mother deal with a difficult situation like that?

sure, but if the mom doesn't care, why should I???  confused 

Quoting FLY2LIM (Reply 20):
Wunala, I think there should be a separate section for IDIOTS on an airplane. I know your seat would be waiting for you.
First, I always make sure to PAY for my flight before I board it, and while I'm doing that I also make sure that my wife's and daughters' seats are also paid for.
Second, my daughters are not brats. I have a 5 year old who appears to be a little more mature than you. Oh, and my wife and I do fine controling our children, even on airplanes.
Sweeping generalizations didn't do much for blacks, for jews, and for many other people on this Earth. I suggest you avoid them as well.
Please, DON'T HAVE CHILDREN!

don't get your knickers in a twist.., not every kid is bad...but there are some who are and the parents don't care...those are the one's who I personally dislike...

Quoting CXYYZ (Reply 25):

My beef is with older brats and their parents

ditto that!!

Quoting CXYYZ (Reply 25):
On the continuing sector to YYZ it was discovered that at least one of the children had wet his/her seat.

great, now I have to bring a can of lysol with me...and how will I get that past the TSA?? Even if I don't bring it in the can, the lysol will probably emit some "flammable" items on the scan.......
"Up the Irons!"
 
BCAL
Posts: 2925
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RE: Infants On Long Haul

Mon Jun 13, 2005 5:48 pm

I was flying on a VS flight from LHR and this child behind me kept kicking the back of my seat, exceptionally hard for a small child. After enduring this for over an hour, I was fed up and politely asked the parents if they could stop their kid kicking my seat. "Relax, buddy, he is only 4½ years old and totally uncontrollable! Kids will be kids." was his father's reply.

Rather than upsetting his precious kid, the father subsequently joined in with the kicking and whenever he left his seat to go to the toilet he made sure that he knocked my seat hard in the process. Unfortunately, the flight was full and there were no other seats to move to, so I just had to endure this for the remainder of the flight. The flight attendants could hardly perform their normal duties, and I realised it would be a waste of time asking them.

It seems that VS goes out of their way to attract families with kids, so you are more likely to be sitting next to a misbehaved kid when flying VS then you would be if you flew with BA. This is a reason why I prefer BA over VS.
MOL on SRB's latest attack at BA: "It's like a little Chihuahua barking at a dying Labrador. Nobody cares."
 
wdleiser
Posts: 865
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2004 9:32 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Tue Jun 14, 2005 1:00 am

The problem with little kids and gum and small candies like Jelly beans is them choking on it. That is the last thing you want... a choking baby and a histerical mother.
 
ikramerica
Posts: 13808
Joined: Mon May 23, 2005 9:33 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Tue Jun 14, 2005 2:53 am

well no, little babies can't chew gum or candy. but toddlers can chew candy, while they can't chew gum because they try to swallow it. and toddlers cry due to pressure, too.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
YYZYYT
Posts: 909
Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2005 12:41 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Tue Jun 14, 2005 3:20 am

Quoting Homer71 (Reply 40):
Quoting Aleksandar (Reply 32):
you should try everything that the new generation of A.netters feel the joy of flying and not pain during flight. It is not your obligation as parent, but as airline enthusiast, as well

Good point...especially since the 9th word he has learned to say is "airplane" (of course, he pronounces it "eh-pane")

I know what you mean. My kids are the only people I will voluntarily surrender my window seat for!

I am at present trying to teach my 3-year old how to distinguish a 737 from a 320.... She associates the Air Canada logo with the 320, and can figure it out that way. She also loves the flaps, and in particular looks for the pilot to test the ailerons and spoilers during our taxi to the runway.

This thread is great. It's good to see there are others out there who travel a lot with children - and interesting that many have discovered the same techniques for pain-free traveling as work for us. As a result, my 3 year-old: 50 flights, 6 countries, 4 transatlantic crossings... only 1 crying fit (not counting ears on descent as an infant, which happened occasionally).

One more thing - event the best behaved child is still a child, and so if she kicks the seat in front, throws something, etc, not only do I make her stop, but a quick apology to the person affected works miracles. It makes sure they know you are trying your best.

PS:

Quoting FLY2LIM (Reply 20):
Wunala, I think there should be a separate section for IDIOTS on an airplane. I know your seat would be waiting for you.

brilliant! couldn't have said it better.
 
Jetblue15
Posts: 269
Joined: Fri Mar 26, 2004 3:27 am

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Tue Jun 14, 2005 4:05 am

Plain and simply. Suck it up. God knows most of us had to do it once in our life. I'll be that parent with that crying kid soon enough and I would want help not people yelling at me or giving me dirty looks. Who ever said life was easy. Just know that the flight will be over evantually.

Jetblue15
racecar spelled backwards spells racecar
 
spinzels
Posts: 332
Joined: Fri Jun 04, 2004 11:00 pm

RE: Infants On Long Haul

Tue Jun 14, 2005 5:10 am

Thanks for this thread, very helpful for a father anxiously anticipating his first long haul trip with a small infant. Thanks in particular FLY2LIM and Zonky.

Quoting Zonky (Reply 4):
Buy a seat - Take your car seat. They like the familiarity.

You mean the seat that you put in your car? I thought that only special FAA airplane child seats were allowed on board? For a small infant (about 5 months at time of flight) would you recommend buying a designated seat for the infant or simply paying the infant "surcharge"?

What about other things like getting a bottle warmed-up? Do you recommend reserving a bassinet?
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