teahan
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Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:06 pm

AFP reports GECAS has signed an LOI for 10 A350.
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monteycarlos
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:16 pm

This was rumoured here in Australia earlier today, expected to be confirmed at Paris this morning so good to see it has been now.

Thats 112 "commitments" for the A350 now which will satisfy Airbus and EADS.

Any other news out of Paris this morning?
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teahan
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:19 pm

These are -800s but can be converted to -900s.
Deliveries in 2010, 2011, 2012.
"No similar commitments for the Boeing 787 yet"
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CHRISBA777ER
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:20 pm

Who are these for do we think?
What do you mean you dont have any bourbon? Do you know how far it is to Houston? What kind of airline is this???
 
teahan
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:22 pm

GECAS definitely continues to study the A380.
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scbriml
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:27 pm

Quoting Teahan (Reply 4):
GECAS definitely continues to study the A380.

It would be very surprising if GECAS didn't order A380s or ILFC order A350s.
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BestWestern
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:30 pm

Still very very few A32x orders.
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teahan
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:32 pm

Indeed BestWestern.
Today's 12:30 announcement got cancelled.
A few 'nice' orders but no surprises to blow us away.
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monteycarlos
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:33 pm

Quoting Teahan (Reply 2):
"No similar commitments for the Boeing 787 yet"



Quoting Teahan (Reply 4):
GECAS definitely continues to study the A380.

I think these comments go hand in hand, possible explinations:

A) The 787 is not an ideal lease plane because it is going to be cheap and readily available meaning that many airlines will be able to buy them as opposed to leasing them? Having said that eventually there will be an airline that will wish to lease them but possibly not yet due to the time periods involved.

B)The A380 has many "interested" customers yet they do not wish to commit large amounts of capital towards these aircraft meaning the lease companies would be the go-to for the planes. No firm interest or deals exist yet which is why GECAS has not yet signed on.
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777ER
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:36 pm

airline that will wish to lease them Weren't Primaris going to lease their B787s?
 
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scbriml
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:41 pm

Quoting Teahan (Reply 7):
A few 'nice' orders but no surprises to blow us away.

You're a hard man to please! Airbus has so far announced orders and commitments for nearly 100 widebodies (with I believe more to come), and you're not blown away?  crazy 
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monteycarlos
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:43 pm

Quoting 777ER (Reply 9):
Weren't Primaris going to lease their B787s?

Well they were supposedly the launch customer... I'm not sure as to whether it was a lease agreement or not but I guess its all pending on the state of their finances.
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AirbusDriver
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 9:19 pm

Wander who going to pick them up?
 
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jetjack74
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 9:26 pm

Quoting Monteycarlos (Reply 11):
Well they were supposedly the launch customer...

NW will be the US launch customer. Eventhough they weren't the first, behing CO and Primaris, NW will be the first US carrier to recieve them.
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DAYflyer
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 9:52 pm

Quoting Monteycarlos (Reply 8):
A) The 787 is not an ideal lease plane because it is going to be cheap and readily available meaning that many airlines will be able to buy them as opposed to leasing them? Having said that eventually there will be an airline that will wish to lease them but possibly not yet due to the time periods involved.

Then why this comment from ILFC? See paragraphs 3,4,5 below:

Wednesday, June 15, 2005

Dozens of jet orders flow in for Boeing and Airbus

SEATTLE POST-INTELLIGENCER NEWS SERVICES

LE BOURGET, France -- The Boeing Co. extended its lead over Airbus in new business this year, winning new orders for 88 planes and a deal to convert five more options into firm orders at the Paris Air Show. That compared with 82 new orders for the European company.

Indian carrier Jet Airways agreed to buy 10 Boeing 777s and 10 737s -- together worth $2.8 billion at list price -- as well as 10 Airbus A330 planes with a sticker value of $1.6 billion. Boeing said GE Commercial Aviation Services, a plane leasing company, had ordered 20 737s worth $1.1 billion at list prices. None of the actual transaction values were disclosed.

Boeing also said International Lease Finance Corp. had ordered 20 next-generation 737s and eight 777s -- together worth almost $2.9 billion at list prices. Another leasing company, Kuwait-based ALAFCO, signed up with Airbus for 12 of the planned A350, the main rival to Boeing's 787 "Dreamliner," in a deal worth about $1.9 billion at list prices.

So far absent from the air show announcements have been orders for Boeing's all-new airplane, the 787 Dreamliner. But they may not be far off -- even if they don't come at this week's show.

"We are also very hopeful to announce a 787 order by year-end," said International Lease Chief Executive Steven Udvar-Hazy at a news conference at the show. "It is a mutual goal with Boeing to have something by then. Price is a small issue."

Jet Airways also said it is "seriously" looking at buying Boeing's 787, Chairman Naresh Goyal said at a news conference.

"Boeing is looking at how to make sure we take that plane," he said, adding that he also is considering the Airbus A350.

And Spanish airline Air Europa is preparing to sign an order for as many as 30 Boeing 737-800 jets, said a spokeswoman for the carrier, who spoke to Bloomberg News on condition of anonymity. The agreement is "imminent," she said. Air Europa is owned by Globalia Corporacion Empresarial SA, which also operates travel agencies.

The ALAFCO deal takes to 102 the number of non-binding A350 orders on Airbus' books. Airbus CEO Noel Forgeard said he hopes that total will rise to between 110 and 120 planes during the week.



Of those, up to 90 would have been announced at the show -- still short of the 100-plus orders that chief Airbus salesman John Leahy had promised to unveil.

Dubai-based carrier Emirates, which had been expected to announce plans to buy 50 of the planes, said Friday it was putting off any decision.

"Boeing is clearly taking quite a big lead this year," said Zafar Khan, an analyst at SG Securities in London.

"It's interesting that the leasing companies are coming back, since they've been mostly out of the market for the last three years."

Until this week, Boeing had won every sales contest between its 787 model and Airbus' similar-sized A350 since January. Airbus has been under growing pressure amid the slew of recent 787 sales, now 128 firm orders and 138 non-binding commitments.

Unlike the A350, which is derived from the A330, the 787 is an all-new design set to enter service in 2008, two years ahead of the Airbus. Analysts say the Dreamliner's buoyant sales and its two-year lead on its rival could make it hard for Airbus to keep up with Boeing deliveries in 2008 and 2009.

However, Forgeard is predicting strong growth in overall Airbus deliveries -- yesterday upgrading his 2005 forecast for delivery of all Airbus planes to "at least 360" planes from the earlier 350-360 target and promising to "pass the 400 point next year."


Here's how the announcements for planes stacked up yesterday after the second day of the Paris Air Show at Le Bourget, France:

BOEING AIRBUS
737 55* A350 72
777 18 A380 10
787 0
Total 93* Total 82


* Includes five options converted to firm orders by Ryanair.
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monteycarlos
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 10:07 pm

Quoting Jetjack74 (Reply 13):
NW will be the US launch customer. Eventhough they weren't the first, behing CO and Primaris, NW will be the first US carrier to recieve them.

Yeah but wasn't it initially slated to be Primaris before they get those prized NW orders?

Quoting DAYflyer (Reply 14):
Then why this comment from ILFC? See paragraphs 3,4,5 below:

As I said they were only possible explinations, and it is indeed my belief that the lease company orders will come for the 787. Thanks for the article though - seems like a price agreement is what we're waiting on and then there will be a fresh 787 order and customer!
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dalecary
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Wed Jun 15, 2005 10:12 pm

Seattle Times is quoting ILFC's Udvar-Hazy as saying they are working with Boeing to make sure a 787 commitment is decided this year. They are not interested in the A350 until 2010 at least, according to Udvar-Hazy. This surprises me, but ILFC seem to think the 787 has the best potential for sales at this stage.
 
starrion
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Thu Jun 16, 2005 1:03 pm

Are the GECAS orders to cover the MOU from Air Europa?
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teahan
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Thu Jun 16, 2005 5:33 pm

Quoting Dalecary (Reply 16):
They are not interested in the A350 until 2010 at least, according to Udvar-Hazy.

I'd like to see where exactly he said "2010 at the earliest". That was a misquote.

Quoting Starrion (Reply 17):
Are the GECAS orders to cover the MOU from Air Europa?

No.
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runway23
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RE: Paris: Gecas Orders 10 A350s

Thu Jun 16, 2005 6:24 pm

TAM is also rumoured to be announcing an A350 order today or tomorrow. No exact number's but I'd guess it'd be around 10 to allow for future expansion and replacement for A330s.