WINGS
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Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 1:03 am

I've been trying to find some information regarding the new A340-600IGW, its specs and how it will compare to the B777-300. Does anyone have any news as to the first flight and entry into commercial service? Any news would be very appreciated, thanks.

Regards,
Wings
Aviation Is A Passion.
 
gigneil
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 1:09 am

The current information on airbus.com reflects the upgrade to 380t.

I do not know when the first frame will be delivered.

N
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 1:10 am

>> I've been trying to find some information regarding the new A340-600IGW, its specs and how it will compare to the B777-300.

First, the A346 upgrade is called the HGW, for High Gross Weight, not IGW. And of course, you are looking to compare the 773ER not the baseline 773A.

Nitpicking done, here is some data-

http://www.airbus.com/en/aircraftfam...0a340/a340-600/specifications.html

http://www.boeing.com/assocproducts/aircompat/acaps/777rsec2.pdf (page 4)
http://www.boeing.com/commercial/777family/pf/pf_lrproduct.html

>> Does anyone have any news as to the first flight and entry into commercial service?

I believe the first delivery is to EK in 2006?
 
WINGS
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 2:29 am

Will the A340-600 HGW/ IGW become the sole baseline for the A340-600 or will the current versions be offered as well?

So basically the A340-600HGW will offer the following compared to the B777-300ER

AIRBUS A340-600HGW

Seats: 380 (3 class)
MTOW: 380T
Max Range 7900 nm

BOEING 777-300ER

Seats: 365(3 class)
MTOW: 350T
Max Range: 7,880 nm

Regards,
Wings
Aviation Is A Passion.
 
gigneil
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 2:39 am

Most aircraft are offered in a variety of MTOW options. I'm sure the 346 will be the same.

N
 
OldAeroGuy
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 2:47 am

Beware manufacturer's seat counts. They may not be based on the same set of rules. This makes it difficult to draw conclusions on the relative passenger capability.

Airline seats counts are usually quite different.
Airplane design is easy, the difficulty is getting them to fly - Barnes Wallis
 
OHLHD
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 2:50 am

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 2):
>> Does anyone have any news as to the first flight and entry into commercial service?

I believe the first delivery is to EK in 2006?

There was some talk about EK not getting those a/c, but rather giving them back for A380 + A350 orders. Can´t remember were I read it, so not sure if this is true or not.

QR will get them from 2006 as well.

This is taken from their homepage.

Qatar Airways is the launch customer for the A340-600 High Gross Weight aircraft that will be delivered in 2006.
 
WINGS
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 4:57 am

Does anyone have any ideas what changes Airbus will be making to improve the baseline? Will we see an updated and lighter wing. More use of composites or even glare?

Regards,
Wings
Aviation Is A Passion.
 
KL808
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 5:36 am

Quoting OHLHD (Reply 6):
There was some talk about EK not getting those a/c, but rather giving them back for A380 + A350 orders

I wouldn't believe this at all. These are the same people that said EK wasn't going to receive the last of 2 A340-500's. EK will take delivery of those jets. They need the extra capacity.

Quoting WINGS (Reply 7):
Does anyone have any ideas what changes Airbus will be making to improve the baseline? Will we see an updated and lighter wing. More use of composites or even glare?

Im not 100% sure but I think parts of the wings have been modified, by making it lighter by adding composites. I don't think GLARE is used at all.

Isnt GLARE used for the body only, never heard of it being used for wings? I might be mistaken.

Drew
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flyAUA
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 6:00 am

Quoting KL808 (Reply 8):
Isnt GLARE used for the body only, never heard of it being used for wings?

You are right. Glare is used only for the upper parts of fuselage sections. But I've heard that they will indeed be using composites for the HGW wing.

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 2):
First, the A346 upgrade is called the HGW, for High Gross Weight, not IGW.

Maybe he heard it from a French colleague/friend... Igh Gross Weight  Wink
Not drinking, also isn't a solution!
 
gigneil
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 6:03 am

The new wing panels will be CFRP. Not GLARE.

N
 
atmx2000
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 7:55 am

Quoting KL808 (Reply 8):
I wouldn't believe this at all. These are the same people that said EK wasn't going to receive the last of 2 A340-500's. EK will take delivery of those jets. They need the extra capacity.

I thought they were going to lease them to Jet.
ConcordeBoy is a twin supremacist!! He supports quadicide!!
 
6thfreedom
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:07 am

Quoting OldAeroGuy (Reply 5):
Beware manufacturer's seat counts. They may not be based on the same set of rules. This makes it difficult to draw conclusions on the relative passenger capability.

Airline seats counts are usually quite different.

EG. Thai Airways 2 class A346 having only 267 seats!
 
ImperialAero
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:12 am

I think you mean Thai's A345's are 267 seat configurations.
ICURFC - Who Is Sylvia?
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 11:10 am

>> Maybe he heard it from a French colleague/friend... Igh Gross Weight

We are speaking in English here and the English marketing name for the A340 upgrade is HGW...
 
6thfreedom
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 11:52 am

Quoting ImperialAero (Reply 13):
I think you mean Thai's A345's are 267 seat configurations.

No, I know what I mean....

A345 = 215 seats [60+42+113]
http://www.thaiairways.com/About_Tha...tion/Information/AircraftFleet.htm

A346 = 267 seats [6+60+199]
http://www.thaiairways.com/Travel_De...tion/Aircraft_Seatmaps/A3461_l.htm
 
N1120A
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 12:50 pm

Quoting WINGS (Reply 3):
AIRBUS A340-600HGW

Seats: 380 (3 class)
MTOW: 380T
Max Range 7900 nm

BOEING 777-300ER

Seats: 365(3 class)
MTOW: 350T
Max Range: 7,880 nm

Actually, the 773ER has more floor space than the A346 and should hold more in a typical 3 class configuration.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
Xkorpyoh
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 1:11 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 16):
Quoting WINGS (Reply 3):AIRBUS A340-600HGW

Seats: 380 (3 class)
MTOW: 380T
Max Range 7900 nm

BOEING 777-300ER

Seats: 365(3 class)
MTOW: 350T
Max Range: 7,880 nm
Actually, the 773ER has more floor space than the A346 and should hold more in a typical 3 class configuration."I'm the king of Bongo baby, I'm the king of Bongo Bong" Manu Chau. End the Hipocrisy, free Fre

what is your guess about total capacity of the 773 with a 3x4x3 seat configuration (like the one used by EK and Thai)?

Also, how do those 2 planes compare regarding fuel consumption considering one is a twin engine and the other a 4holer?
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 1:23 pm

>> what is your guess about total capacity of the 773 with a 3x4x3 seat configuration (like the one used by EK and Thai)?

Disregarding high-capacity configurations like those that EK uses, the 773ER in 9-abreast econ has more seats than the A346. Take a look at the percentage of economy seats Airbus uses when they say the A346 "seats 380."

The 773ER is simply a bigger airplane despire weighing less and burning less fuel  Wink
 
norcal
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 1:38 pm

what advantages does and HGW offer airlines?
 
Xkorpyoh
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 1:40 pm

Quoting NorCal (Reply 19):
what advantages does and HGW offer airlines?

i guess it is just trying to match the 773ER..trying to compete
 
norcal
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 1:43 pm

Quoting Xkorpyoh (Reply 20):

Well to get the increased payload won't they have to add structural reinforcement, hence adding more OEW? Or is this mostly for range? What about landing fees?
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 1:59 pm

>> i guess it is just trying to match the 773ER..trying to compete

I'm fairly certain that the HGW was available before the full extent of the 773ER performance increases were revealed. Remember that in 2003 EK ordered both the 773ER and A346-HGW because the HGW offered a commanding range advantage. It wasn't until certification and EOS in 2004 that Boeing was advertising the 773ER as neck-in-neck with the HGW for range.

Heck, the first 773ERs that went to AF were manufactured before one of the performance increases and will require a modification package to take advantage of the update.

>> Well to get the increased payload won't they have to add structural reinforcement, hence adding more OEW? Or is this mostly for range?

Airbus is getting some of the performance increases by decreasing the weight of some components via new materials like CFRP skins. The HGW will also have added fuel capacity and uprated engines. Here is how the two A340 variants stack-up

Stat ======= A340-600 ======= A340-600HGW

MTOW (365 metric tons) (380)
Max Zero Fuel weight (242 metric tons) (251)
Maximum fuel capacity (51,379 gallons) (54,023)
OEW (177.8 metric tons) (181.9)
Range w/ max passengers (7,500 nautical miles) (7,900)

I have to love this one tidbit that Airbus threw in the stat bin-

Passenger capacity (metric) - 380.0
Passenger capacity (imperial) - 380.0

Well damn, I was thinking that they could fit .2 imperial passengers in there  Wink
 
astuteman
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 4:06 pm

Has the same HGW increase been done for the A345?

If so, what is the result?
 
YULMRS
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 4:27 pm

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 14):
>> Maybe he heard it from a French colleague/friend... Igh Gross Weight

We are speaking in English here and the English marketing name for the A340 upgrade is HGW...

Poor baby  Wink
To any North American carrier, send us a regular flight in MRS !!!!!
 
jcded
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 6:24 pm

DfwRevolution:

it was a joke, as in the stereotypical french accent has problem with the "h"...
You breathe to do good and have fun.
 
WINGS
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 6:30 pm

Quoting Astuteman (Reply 23):
Has the same HGW increase been done for the A345?

Yes I believe that the A340-500 will also incorporate the same upgrades, considering that they use the same wing.

I always thought that Airbus used the term IGW Increased Gross Weight for its aircraft.

Regards,
Wings
Aviation Is A Passion.
 
ComeAndGo
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 6:40 pm

Quoting Astuteman (Reply 23):
Has the same HGW increase been done for the A345?

If so, what is the result?

Non-Stop around the world.
 
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glideslope
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:22 pm

Quoting ComeAndGo (Reply 27):
Non-Stop around the world.

Sorry. This will be flown by the 772LR this fall.  Smile

It's easier to catch up, than it is to pass.  Sad
To know your Enemy, you must become your Enemy.” Sun Tzu
 
OHLHD
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 9:59 pm

Quoting KL808 (Reply 8):
Quoting OHLHD (Reply 6):
There was some talk about EK not getting those a/c, but rather giving them back for A380 + A350 orders

I wouldn't believe this at all. These are the same people that said EK wasn't going to receive the last of 2 A340-500's. EK will take delivery of those jets. They need the extra capacity.

Agree 100%
Must have read it on one of those intelligent A vs B threads  Smile
They surely need them!
 
KL808
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 11:20 pm

Quoting Atmx2000 (Reply 11):
I thought they were going to lease them to Jet.

Nope, that was just a rumor. The remaining 2 A340-500's will be delivered and one of them will be used for the Nagoya route. The remaining will be used across the A345 network.

Quoting OHLHD (Reply 29):
Agree 100%
Must have read it on one of those intelligent A vs B threads
They surely need them!

LOL  Wink

Drew
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N1120A
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 11:25 pm

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 22):
Remember that in 2003 EK ordered both the 773ER and A346-HGW because the HGW offered a commanding range advantage

Actually, the main reason EK ordered the A346HGW is because of engine out issues at DXB. That is one of the reasons they are screaming at GE for a 125K version of the GE90.

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 22):
Heck, the first 773ERs that went to AF were manufactured before one of the performance increases and will require a modification package to take advantage of the update.

Actually, it was those first 773ERs that gave the clue to the increased range. AF was experiencing something like a 1.5% lower fuel burn

Quoting Astuteman (Reply 23):
Has the same HGW increase been done for the A345?

If so, what is the result?

There is a higher gross weight A345 on offer, and it still falls well short of the range of the 772LR

Quoting WINGS (Reply 26):
I always thought that Airbus used the term IGW Increased Gross Weight for its aircraft.

They use the term HGW for the A346.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
flyAUA
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 11:28 pm

Quoting DfwRevolution (Reply 14):
We are speaking in English here and the English marketing name for the A340 upgrade is HGW...

D'oh, I was joking! Where's your sense of humour...
Not drinking, also isn't a solution!
 
irishpower
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 11:43 pm

I love how on the Airbus website for the A346 they show passenger count as 380.0--like they could get 380.5 or 380.675. Funny stuff. I guess they've been having trouble with squeezing in 1/2 or 3/4 of a passenger. HA HA HA.
 
WINGS
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Wed Jun 29, 2005 11:47 pm

Quoting Irishpower (Reply 33):
love how on the Airbus website for the A346 they show passenger count as 380.0--like they could get 380.5 or 380.675

Maybe they are counting a child or who knows even a midget.  Silly
Aviation Is A Passion.
 
DfwRevolution
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RE: Airbus A340-600IGW

Thu Jun 30, 2005 12:31 am

>> Where's your sense of humour...

Where have you said something funny...  Wink

>> Actually, it was those first 773ERs that gave the clue to the increased range. AF was experiencing something like a 1.5% lower fuel burn

Yes but the range was uped again once Boeing completed the 772LR work, this upgrade won't be available until September for the first few 773ER built.

>> Has the same HGW increase been done for the A345?

It would still fall way short of the 772LR. At this point, the A345's rediculous OEW is an insurmountable challenge...

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