favre
Posts: 561
Joined: Sat Apr 29, 2000 1:34 am

NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 6:43 am

Heres the breakdown for DC-9 Aircraft to be parked..
6 DC-9-50's
4 DC-9-40's
21 DC-9-30's
and the 5 757-200's will remain in long term storage..
Nwa will be adding 2 more 757-200's to the NRT operation for a total of 6..
747-200 #6632 is due out of TLV as #6732 747F on july 29th..
BAE 146 ARJ CV-580 YS-11 SH360 DASH8 SAAB340 EMB 120-135-145-175 DC9/10/30/40/50 MD80/90 DC10 717 727 737 747 757 767 77
 
isitsafenow
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 7:58 am

This is interesting to me. Thx Fave...nice to hear from you again.
safe
If two people agree on EVERYTHING, then one isn't necessary.
 
cslusarc
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 8:58 am

Wow! Bye Bye 31 DC9s.
--cslusarc from YWG
 
N801NW
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 9:02 am

Are the 9's being parked temporarily or permanently retired? AFAIK, NWA hasn't been clear of whether they will return to the fleet, if ever.
 
m404
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 9:16 am

What is the time span for these -9s to be taken OTS? By when? It's hard to believe we park 757s while the same 319/320 flts are filled to the brim everyday. Last years 757 flts that were consistantly filled have been downgraded to a 319. I know we can't see the full days costs per acft put it sure makes you wonder.
Less sarcasm and more thought equal better understanding
 
AirWest
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 10:15 am

Quoting N801NW (Reply 3):
Are the 9's being parked temporarily or permanently retired? AFAIK, NWA hasn't been clear of whether they will return to the fleet, if ever.

With oil as expensive as it is, and the financial state of NWA as it is. They probably won't be back for a while.
"And now I wish I was somewhere other than here"- JB
 
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JBo
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 10:26 am

Everybody is thinking it, so I might as well ask it:

Will the 742 that's being converted to freighter be painted in the new livery, or have they not yet decided on applying the new livery to the NWCargo fleet?
I'd take the awe of understanding over the awe of ignorance any day.
 
dutchjet
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 10:32 am

31 DC9s to be parked and 2 more 757s to the Tokyo hub, that is a huge reduction in domestic capacity - are there any aircraft being delivered during the period to compensate, in part, for this big fleet reduction? I know that there are schedule cutbacks for the winter period, but this seems to inidicate that there will be a very signficant schedule cutback on domestic routes. More RJs? Any cities losing mainline service or being cut from the system altogether?

I, too, find it strange that five NW 757-200s remain in long-term storage - the 757 is real money-maker for most airlines and its odd that they cannot be put to use in NW's vast route system.
 
AirWest
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 10:40 am

Increased fleet utilization will aid some of the reduction. NW still has a few 319s due to help as well. There aren't many cities that are losing mainline service, many of the traditional DC-9 cities have a lot of Airbus flying now.
"And now I wish I was somewhere other than here"- JB
 
centrair
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 10:49 am

It is sad to see the DC9s go...but well times change.

The 757s are to me a surprise. I know that they are increasing the Nagoya ops with 757s. Are the 5 going to long term old?
Yes...I am not a KIX fan. Let's Japanese Aviation!
 
burnsie28
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 11:44 am

Quoting Favre (Thread starter):
6 DC-9-50's
4 DC-9-40's
21 DC-9-30's
and the 5 757-200's will remain in long term storage..

Goodie, I can see that Steenland is now trying to destroy the company, that dick. Nobody freakin likes him.
 
AirWest
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 11:51 am

Wait until later this year. It'll get worse.
"And now I wish I was somewhere other than here"- JB
 
N867BX
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 2:26 pm

When is the last DC9 going to be retired? Has this been discussed yet?
 
gigneil
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 2:35 pm

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 10):
Goodie, I can see that Steenland is now trying to destroy the company, that dick. Nobody freakin likes him.

By reducing unprofitable domestic capacity and downsizing oil-guzzling older airframes near their cycle limit?

That bastard!!

N
 
burnsie28
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 10:25 pm

Quoting Gigneil (Reply 13):
UOTE SELECTED TEXT
Gigneil

Exactly  Wink

In all seriousness though, its more of what he has done with this Spinzels and everything else, I was told everytime he opens his mouth employee confidence goes down even more. Oh and the DC-9's are NOT that close to cycle limit, they still could have 2-3 years on them.
 
N801NW
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RE: NWA News/Update

Mon Jul 04, 2005 10:48 pm

FWIW, Steenland said about the Spinzels and the magazines that if they are indeed missed the change could be "easily reversed." They bet that most passengers, especially leisure, don't care.
 
bobnwa
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RE: NWA News/Update

Tue Jul 05, 2005 1:01 am

Quoting Burnsie28 (Reply 14):
I was told everytime he opens his mouth employee confidence goes down even more.

Do you think you have talked to enough of a cross section of NW employees to make that statement? I don't think so! Is this you speaking or your Dad?
 
RyanAFAMSP
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RE: NWA News/Update

Tue Jul 05, 2005 2:12 am

So with N632US going to the freighter fleet, what does this mean to 747-200 pax operations? What is the time frame for LAX getting the A330? Who will keep the 747 classic to the end? HNL? The Pacific beach destinations like Saipan?

The word on the street here in Minneapolis is that the west coast trans pacific flights have been poor performers as of late for Northwest. Not really because of anything NW is doing wrong - but because there are waaay too many seats in the market, emerging markets is china are seeing much more service, and United continues to use the chapter 11 process to prune away whatever costs it wants. Any rumors about how these dynamics will affect fleet and route plans out west?
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: NWA News/Update

Tue Jul 05, 2005 2:20 am

Most of these aircraft retirements will occur in the fall/early winter of '05 and into '06. NW already has 8 DC-9's in storage, which is included in these 31 aircraft to be retired. The aircraft will come from the annual seasonal reduction of flying, reduction of spares, and increased utilization of other aircraft types. The -9's that will be going will be the oldest, more problematic, or ones pending heavy maintenance. No cities will be cut, and as of now none will lose what mainline service they have. What will happen is changes in frequencies and aircraft type.

Remember that there are about 20 more CRJ's on order. About 5 more for Pinnacle through the end of the summer, and then Mesaba will receive 15 beginning in Oct '05-March '06. Also, NW will/has take delivery of 4 A319/A320 aircraft this year. Not to mention the additional A330's for the widebody fleet, but that doesn't impact narrowbody domestic flying.

NW has taken delivery of a ton of narrowbody & regional aircraft in the past 4 years - A319/A320, CRJ's, 752's, and 753's, yet has not significantly retired any DC-9 aircraft, other than the -10's. The DC-9 fleet utilization is down significantly over the past few years and will still cover most operations with the remaining fleet. Increased utilization of the CRJ's, Avro's, and A319/A320 aircraft will pick up the slack.

As for the 757's, most of those, if not all are pending heavy maintenance. I do agree that NW could likely use them in service though, but the accountants and planners must know better. NW has been running with an absurdly high load factor so far this summer. Just about every day has been in the high 80's, if not into the 90% range.

One concern is that going forward into next summer, if this trend continues, that NW won't have the capacity necessary to handle increased demand. This summer has been absolutely nuts, it brings back memories of 2000. So who knows if all the -9's will be fully retired or will be parked and could be returned to service.

I actually have to side with Burnsie on this one. In my opinion, Steeland isn't exactly taking the best road here. He's not Richard Anderson. Not to place all the blame on Steeland, and numerous execs have been running for the door, but the PR surrounding the service cuts and labor unrest have been handled very poorly. Not to mention the whole labor situation that is boiling over.
 
N801NW
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RE: NWA News/Update

Tue Jul 05, 2005 4:04 am

A NWA FA from the DTW base happened to be seated next to me at the end of March and she had an interesting theory. She believed Andersen may have been shown the door because the labor cuts hadn't come and Steenland's mandate was to get them regardless.
 
nwafflyer
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RE: NWA News/Update

Tue Jul 05, 2005 4:41 am

I can live without a pretzel, sure - no problem, and I can bring my own magazine. But I hate the CRJ - it's so small and cramped, I actually hurt after a 45 minute flight.

I prefer the SAAB 340's - the "A" side is very comfortable. For that matter, Continental's Express Jet's have a viable "A" side, it's just the CRJ 200 that doesn't.

As far as Steenland vs. Richard Andersen -- even the magazine has gone downhill since Andersen left
 
N801NW
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Joined: Mon Jul 12, 2004 8:56 am

RE: NWA News/Update

Tue Jul 05, 2005 5:04 am

Quoting Nwafflyer (Reply 20):
As far as Steenland vs. Richard Andersen -- even the magazine has gone downhill since Andersen left

I've noticed a decline in the amount and quality of the Richard Reports, now "A Word from Doug." But I probably shouldn't have access to them anyway as a non-employee.
 
nwcoflyer
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RE: NWA News/Update

Tue Jul 05, 2005 5:35 am

Quoting N801NW (Reply 19):
A NWA FA from the DTW base happened to be seated next to me at the end of March and she had an interesting theory. She believed Andersen may have been shown the door because the labor cuts hadn't come and Steenland's mandate was to get them regardless.

BINGO! This is what I thought, and many NW FA's have mentioned that to me as well. I think that Anderson was a decent guy, probably one of the better CEO's NW has had in a while. Anderson probably also saw bigger problems at NW, and decided to take on an easier industry.
The New American is arriving.
 
flypdx
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RE: NWA News/Update

Tue Jul 05, 2005 6:00 am

Quoting Nwafflyer (Reply 20):
I can live without a pretzel, sure - no problem, and I can bring my own magazine. But I hate the CRJ - it's so small and cramped, I actually hurt after a 45 minute flight.

I didn't find Pinnacles CRJ to be too bad on the PIT-MSP flight, yes a bit small but not terrible..It was quieter and more comfortablet ahn the DC9.
 
hammer
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RE: NWA News/Update

Tue Jul 05, 2005 8:15 am

a few notes from the AMFA side of NWA....the cleaners in all stations except for DTW/MSP have been let go, or will be soon. They were offered to stay on at $11.00 per hour or a take a sevrance package of 26 weeks of pay/benefits....also Prospect has been cleaning the planes here in DTW with AMFA knowing about it and they have done nothing to stop NWA from allowing this. A sign of what is to come at NWA.....
 
Adam727
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RE: NWA News/Update

Tue Jul 05, 2005 2:26 pm

When I went from PHXto MCI I took an A319 to DTW redeye flight. it was full then the DC-9 to MCI fro DTW. was full to. When I returned to phx I was on another DC-9 and there was know one on board. So I can see them storing the DC-9's but the 757's come on.
 
burnsie28
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RE: NWA News/Update

Wed Jul 06, 2005 2:00 am

Quoting Adam727 (Reply 25):
When I went from PHXto MCI I took an A319 to DTW redeye flight. it was full then the DC-9 to MCI fro DTW. was full to. When I returned to phx I was on another DC-9 and there was know one on board. So I can see them storing the DC-9's but the 757's come on.

To base that off of such few flights, come on. NW June system wide load factor was 87.5%
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: NWA News/Update

Wed Jul 06, 2005 2:38 am

87.5% !!!!!!

That is rediculous. Too bad yields are any better, but this proves how much demand there is more air travel. Too bad this industry is so messed up they can't price at or above cost.
 
burnsie28
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RE: NWA News/Update

Wed Jul 06, 2005 2:58 am

Quoting PSU.DTW.SCE (Reply 27):
87.5% !!!!!!

That is rediculous. Too bad yields are any better, but this proves how much demand there is more air travel. Too bad this industry is so messed up they can't price at or above cos

Thats what Pars was showing for the end, it may be higher when they release the official results.
 
m404
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RE: NWA News/Update

Wed Jul 06, 2005 3:53 am

Burnsie

I think he's saying the it's ridiculous that the LF is so high and profits are still impossible.

Hammer

Every since the cleaners were surprisingly (to some) foisted on AMFA it has certainly been no secret that they could care less, at least they got a severance. I'd like to know if the monthly cleaning stats in Passages are for contracted or mainline or both. I just notice MEM is never listed.
Less sarcasm and more thought equal better understanding
 
rjpieces
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RE: NWA News/Update

Wed Jul 06, 2005 3:59 am

747-200 #6632 is due out of TLV as #6732 747F on july 29th..

She's being converted in TLV? Do they do a lot of conversions there?
"Millions long for immortality who do not know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon"
 
burnsie28
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RE: NWA News/Update

Wed Jul 06, 2005 4:45 am

Quoting M404 (Reply 29):
Burnsie

I think he's saying the it's ridiculous that the LF is so high and profits are still impossible.

I know, but what I was just pointing to the source and that it may be higher when the official results come out, because that I dont think it included last day of June.
 
Trvlr
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RE: NWA News/Update

Wed Jul 06, 2005 4:56 am

Quoting RJpieces (Reply 30):
She's being converted in TLV? Do they do a lot of conversions there?

Yes. IAI Bedek, based at TLV, is a leader in freight conversion. I believe they're doing some 747-400 freighter conversions right now too (though not for NW).

Aaron G.
 
Rhino4ever
Posts: 142
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RE: NWA News/Update

Wed Jul 06, 2005 6:40 am

Anderson left for many reasons. Potential to make $10 Million+ vs. a few $100,000 and trying to compete against bankrupt carriers for years, easy choice. He was a good guy. Talked with him a few times. A real loss for the company but the board and management are following the 10 year plan he developed to a tee.
 
rjpieces
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RE: NWA News/Update

Wed Jul 06, 2005 9:30 am

Potential to make $10 Million

Where did he move to?
"Millions long for immortality who do not know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon"
 
N801NW
Posts: 558
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RE: NWA News/Update

Wed Jul 06, 2005 9:45 am

Anderson moved to another Minneapolis company, UnitedHealth Group. It's an insurance provider.
 
PSU.DTW.SCE
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RE: NWA News/Update

Wed Jul 06, 2005 9:47 am

United Healthcare

CEO's in the airline industry make a small fraction of the bloated salaries that CEO's make in other industries.
 
KaiGywer
Crew
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RE: NWA News/Update

Wed Jul 06, 2005 9:49 am

“Once you have tasted flight, you will forever walk the earth with your eyes turned skyward, for there you have been, an
 
m404
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RE: NWA News/Update

Wed Jul 06, 2005 10:21 am

Need backing for this if anyone has it but I thought I'd heard Mr. Anderson had been lured by a huge pay increase at UH. Somewhere in the 7.5 mil area. Can you imagine what would have hit the fan if he'd got that at NW? Like the MPR article alludes, what kind of quality CEO and other leaders can the troubled carriers get?
Less sarcasm and more thought equal better understanding
 
757dc10fltmech
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RE: NWA News/Update

Thu Jul 07, 2005 12:35 am

http://myaviation.net/?pid=00312774

N632US in MSP this winter getting ready for the conversion.
CAN DO!
 
Squid
Posts: 192
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RE: NWA News/Update

Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:42 am

Quoting M404 (Reply 38):
Like the MPR article alludes, what kind of quality CEO and other leaders can the troubled carriers get?

Airline's need CEO's and VP's that do it for the love of aviation, not money. I'm sure there are many people who could and would jump on the chance to be the CEO of NWA for only $150,000 per year, and limited bonuses and stock options until the airline became profitable.

By hiring people in upper management who didn't demand or expect huge wages and options, it would be much easier for NWA to get the necessary wages cuts from the employees because they would see that even the CEO feels that they are all in this together.
 
burnsie28
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RE: NWA News/Update

Thu Jul 07, 2005 2:53 am

Quoting Squid (Reply 40):
Airline's need CEO's and VP's that do it for the love of aviation, not money. I'm sure there are many people who could and would jump on the chance to be the CEO of NWA for only $150,000 per year, and limited bonuses and stock options until the airline became profitable.

Raises hand an jumps up and down, pick me, pick me  Smile
 
B744F
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RE: NWA News/Update

Thu Jul 07, 2005 3:49 am

Quoting Squid (Reply 40):
for only $150,000 per year

Those poor guys, how do they ever put food on the table???
 
m404
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RE: NWA News/Update

Thu Jul 07, 2005 6:31 am

Squid

Gee, that's what management has been telling line workers for awhile now. "If you really love it you'd work for the same as a new hire who expects to move on to higher wages based on his wonderful performance.

Just how many of the people that depend on the carrier would trust it's future to the new kid on the block who took the job for "the love of aviation" and did not have a record of success to guide a multi-billion dollar business and the lives of 45,000 or so employees and all it's stockholders and debtors. That's not what makes the real world run. Of course with some idealistic venture capital and totally new concepts and products this "new kid" has a better chance if he was the entrepreneur that started it all but these are old companies, not clean slate startups that are called "Legacy" for a reason. Legacy means baggage. Corporate, financial, labor, and government enforced rules and obligations that no whiz kid can wave a wand at to make go away. That's what the BK lawyers are for and you can be darn sure they are not working for the wages you mention. This is not a game.

Of course lower wages are in the future. That's part of the package Legacies seem to have inherited. We are subsidizing higher fuel prices but we know that they will always go up with greed of profit and higher demand. Will this always means that labor must always lower it's price to support it? If so, how will labor (and customers who buy tickets) afford it? Labor prices are not a bottomless well and the worker who cools off enough can hope the CEOs ect are smart enough to somehow stabilize the situation to offer a promising, non-diminishing career ahead for all. Currently it's unsustainable.

Sorry for the digression into all the ills the industry but we really don't need a rookie.
Less sarcasm and more thought equal better understanding
 
N801NW
Posts: 558
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RE: NWA News/Update

Fri Jul 08, 2005 1:08 am

Just saw that "A Word from Doug" has been locked away into the intranet and the secure employee website. Not surprised but disappointed.  sigh 
 
FI642
Posts: 992
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RE: NWA News/Update

Fri Jul 08, 2005 10:06 am

News wire call in still has the Dug-line from June 27. The topic du jour was fuel cost.

It's a bad thing Richard is gone. Very bad.
737MAX, Cool Planes for the Worlds Coolest Airline.