FLAIRPORT
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Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 7:35 am

http://www.local10.com/news/4693147/detail.html
The memorial of the Crash of Valujet 592 has been vandelized  Sad

I did not even know there was a memorial. Anyone know if its open to the public?
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Newark777
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 7:40 am

My God, what is wrong with people? What they painted was bad enough, but where they did it was even worse. I hope they are caught, but I doubt they will. This type of stuff really makes me angry.  banghead 

Harry
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Wayfarer
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 9:15 am

I'm shocked. I never saw that picture (on the article in the link) of the memorial itself. Someone posted a list of Flight 592 passengers and crew members in the other thread.

I suspect that those vandals did not know that the Memorial site was dedicated to victims of ValuJet 592. I could be wrong. I am sure it took place overnight (dark outside).

photo of ValuJet 592 DC-9


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Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Jörg Tegen



 camera  description: N904VJ (cn 47377/496) This aircraft, operating as flight 592 crashed into the Everglades on May 11, 1996.
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srbmod
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 9:26 am

Quoting FLAIRPORT (Thread starter):
vandelized

The word is vandalized.....

Wayfarer, do you have to put your  twocents  with unrequested and or somewhat pointless info in your posts?


As for those who did this, how would they like it if somebody tagged the headstone of a loved one? Not everyone who lost a loved one in this crash had a body to bury, so this memorial is the headstone to that person's grave.
 
TedTAce
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 9:45 am

Quoting FLAIRPORT (Thread starter):
Anyone know if its open to the public?

It's hard to explain... in the grand scheme of things it's VERY open to the public.. Go several miles out TMB trail and you'll see it on the right hand side across the canal. There is a passage over the canal that leads to the dirt road the memorial is 'on'. There are no 'real' parking spots, and a lot of the time it is buried in grass. It's a touch tricky, and definitely not tourist in a rental car friendly unless you like trashing rentals (not that you have to, but if your that kind of driver it wouldn't matter) but if you are paranoid about so much as a scratch on the rental, it's in a bad spot.

These pussies picked a great target; cement posts in 'the middle of nowhere' with no lights and no witnesses. I hope karma does a REALLY nasty job to these losers, they deserve a fate worse then the victims of 592.

Quoting Wayfarer (Reply 2):
I suspect that those vandals did not know that the Memorial site was dedicated to victims of ValuJet 592. I could be wrong. I am sure it took place overnight (dark outside).

Why do you INSIST on speculating about things you have obviously NO CLUE about???? If you had been at the memorial I could understand your comments, but your remarks are as insulting as the idiots who perpetrated this heinous act.
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hawk44
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 9:46 am

I saw this on the news yesterday but did not hear the whole story, sad thing is I read the other article about trash all over the memorial, also sidewalks are being grown over by weeds and how this memorial site has no real parking lot those issues should be addressed while removing the graffiti.

Quoting Srbmod (Reply 3):
Wayfarer, do you have to put your with unrequested and or somewhat pointless info in your posts?



Quoting Wayfarer (Reply 2):
I could be wrong. I am sure it took place overnight (dark outside).

As opposed to day time (bright outside)?  sarcastic 

Sad to say but I agree with Srbmod, kind of sounds like your talking down to the board when you have to explain how it gets dark at night.

Hawk44
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ltbewr
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 9:57 am

Seems to be some young drunk/high yahoos who sadly have no values in their lives. I do hope they do something stupid some day and become a canidate for their own 'memorial' or maybe a nice long jail term with a very horny cellmate.
 
MarkATL
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 11:23 am

It was probably the last concrete surface in MIA not yet tagged.
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ouboy79
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 11:24 am

Just think of him like FOX News. They give you the perspective around or below the story...that other people wouldn't touch.
 
sprout5199
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 11:42 am

Quoting Srbmod (Reply 3):
Wayfarer, do you have to put your with unrequested and or somewhat pointless info in your posts?

I just want to say that maybe he is giving them the benefit of doubt. I live in south Florida and most "taggers" dont hit places that will incense the public. This is one of those places. I believe that they did not know what they were hitting. As much as they want attention, this is not the kind they want. So give Wayfarer a break. At least he is trying to see some good in his fellow man.

Dan in Jupiter
 
srbmod
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 12:02 pm

Quoting Sprout5199 (Reply 9):
I just want to say that maybe he is giving them the benefit of doubt. I live in south Florida and most "taggers" dont hit places that will incense the public. This is one of those places. I believe that they did not know what they were hitting. As much as they want attention, this is not the kind they want. So give Wayfarer a break. At least he is trying to see some good in his fellow man.

I made my comment in regards to him posting info on and an A.net picture of the a/c in the VJ592 crash, nobody was asking about it at all, and he just had to post it out of the blue. He has done this for quite some time under this new name and his previous name, September11. Just run a search and you'll see what I'm talking about.

And for further reading:
http://www.airwhiners.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=711
http://www.airwhiners.net/forums/viewtopic.php?t=653
 
Wayfarer
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 12:35 pm

Quoting Sprout5199 (Reply 9):
just want to say that maybe he is giving them the benefit of doubt. I live in south Florida and most "taggers" dont hit places that will incense the public. This is one of those places. I believe that they did not know what they were hitting. As much as they want attention, this is not the kind they want.

Thanks for that information. I have been on the Everglades (by boat with friends) I like that area -- I was looking for the memorial around the Everglades and I did not see it.

[Edited 2005-07-09 05:37:05]
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DB777
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 1:26 pm

An acquaintance of mine has a gallery of shots from the memorial (pre-vandalism) at:

http://www.pbase.com/lautermilch/flight592
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UPS Pilot
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 7:33 pm

It's South Florida. Nobody there has any respect for other people or property.
 
DAYflyer
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 11:20 pm

What kind of a dirt bag would do something so low? And of all things to paint, they put a swastica. How disgusting.
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Gib
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 11:31 pm

Too bad a hungry & pissed off 6 ft. gator wasn't hanging out that night to greet these nad lickers...

DB777 .... Thanks much for the link!
 
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HAWK21M
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 11:36 pm

Maybe there is a way to teach these Weirdos a Lesson.
regds
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CanadianNorth
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sat Jul 09, 2005 11:44 pm

Quoting Wayfarer (Reply 2):
I am sure it took place overnight (dark outside).



Quoting Hawk44 (Reply 5):
As opposed to day time (bright outside)?

Just to point out, there are places where during summer it is light outside during the night as well. And if you go further north you can also get it dark for most of the day during winter...



CanadianNorth  yes 
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vanguard737
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:01 am

I visited this memorial in 2003 and was shocked at all the weeds growing even back then, no maintanance at all!

BTW, www.flight592.com is a wonderful resource, complete with photos of most passengers.

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Northwest717
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:25 am

Well that is absolutely appalling! To think that someone would vandalize such a thing is unthinkable! This truly breaks my heart to see something like this happen.

-Tim  Sad
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srbmod
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:59 am

Quoting VANGUARD737 (Reply 18):

BTW, www.flight592.com is a wonderful resource, complete with photos of most passengers.

Well their forum is nothing more than a bash AirTran forum, but I do like how the place is getting spammed. Serves them right for trying to slander an airline that is lightyears away from Valujet. Some of these folks nearly 10 years later still want the airline shut down, like that's going to bring back the dead.
 
hawk44
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 1:16 am

Quoting CanadianNorth (Reply 17):
Just to point out, there are places where during summer it is light outside during the night as well. And if you go further north you can also get it dark for most of the day during winter...

Not anywhere near this memorial  biggrin 

Hawk44
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MD80Nut
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 1:28 am

Quoting Srbmod (Reply 20):
Well their forum is nothing more than a bash AirTran forum

I don't agree with you there. While there is some of that not everything there is. I do agree that AirTran is light years away from ValueJet. They fly new state of the art planes and are a lot more professional based on my experiences with them. I fly them with confidence.

But I've followed the investigation of Flt 592 and while I'm still convinced the oxygen generators are the cause, those who theorize that an electrical fire was the cause have raised some interesting points. I think they should be looked into. It won't bring the dead back, and I believe it will confirm the oxygen generators as the cause of the fire, but if there's a chance it was an electrical fire, then we're better off knowing the truth.

Cheers, Ralph
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 1:37 am

DB777 thanks, those are excellent pictures. That is a nice memorial.

I have no idea why some stupid ass feels the need to graffiti it. Whoever did it probably doesn't now what it is because he can't read. Highly unlikely to know what a swastika means or where it came from either. I have no sympathy for purveyors of graffiti. It isn't art, it's crap, and that goes for the idiot who did my garden wall a couple of weeks ago too. Come back and do some more when I'm home, and when I catch you I'll spray paint your face, then take you to the cops. 10 years ago you never saw it in Portugal, now it's everywhere. Pisses me right off.
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777STL
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 1:39 am

Quoting MD80Nut (Reply 22):
It won't bring the dead back, and I believe it will confirm the oxygen generators as the cause of the fire, but if there's a chance it was an electrical fire, then we're better off knowing the truth.


What difference does it make? It's rather irrelevant at this point.
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MD80Nut
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 1:52 am

Quoting 777STL (Reply 24):
What difference does it make? It's rather irrelevant at this point.

I don't know, wouldn't you think that knowing the truth about an accident which killed so many people is better? I believe it is. If an electrical fire caused it, say because of problems with wire insulation or sub-standard parts, for example, it may lead to a more thorough inspections of electrical components and prevent another tragedy. Sadly, we learn a lot about airplanes and how we operate them from crashes.

Also, there's this thing called justice. Remember that a number of people & corporate entities were blamed for the fire due to the oxygen generator cause. If the oxygen generators did not cause the fire, then the burden of blame for this tragedy that has been placed on them is an injustice.

Cheers, Ralph
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miamix707
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 1:53 am

Quoting MarkATL (Reply 7):
It was probably the last concrete surface in MIA not yet tagged.

I've always wondered WTF is wrong with Miami teens these days. I realize there isn't much for teens to do down there but c'mon now.

By the way how far is the memorial from the actual crash site? and someone said it's off Tamiami trail so.. how many miles from say.. FIU?
 
777STL
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:17 am

Quoting MD80Nut (Reply 25):
I don't know, wouldn't you think that knowing the truth about an accident which killed so many people is better? I believe it is. If an electrical fire caused it, say because of problems with wire insulation or sub-standard parts, for example, it may lead to a more thorough inspections of electrical components and prevent another tragedy. Sadly, we learn a lot about airplanes and how we operate them from crashes.

Also, there's this thing called justice. Remember that a number of people & corporate entities were blamed for the fire due to the oxygen generator cause. If the oxygen generators did not cause the fire, then the burden of blame for this tragedy that has been placed on them is an injustice.

They generally don't reopen investigations after they've come to a decisive conclusion. And they're certainly not going to reopen it at the behest of a few conspiracy theorists with too much time on their hands. If this is an inherent design problem with the DC9 as you suggest, where are all the other DC9s with electrical problems? DC9s have been flying since what, the late 60s, don't you think those problems you suggest would have become apparent before 1996?

The very fact that they improperly loaded those oxygen generators makes them at fault in some capacity, even in the extremely unlikely event you are right.

So yeah, that's a great idea, let's go piss away a few more million dollars to affirm what we already know, to satisfy the conspiracy theorists.
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srbmod
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:38 am

Quoting MD80Nut (Reply 22):

I don't agree with you there. While there is some of that not everything there is. I do agree that AirTran is light years away from ValueJet. They fly new state of the art planes and are a lot more professional based on my experiences with them. I fly them with confidence.

You obviously didn't scroll too far down in their forums. The only site worse than this one in regards to AirTran bashing is I Travel, You Travel Their forum on AirTran is half bashing and half defending the airline, and actually in their forums listing still use the Valujet name.
 
komododx
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 2:57 am

The memorial should've been put somewhere else. Tamiami and Krome? Not a nice place to be around, anyway.

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TedTAce
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 3:49 am

Quoting UPS Pilot (Reply 13):
It's South Florida. Nobody there has any respect for other people or property.

Reason #1 that I moved from the shithole.

Quoting CanadianNorth (Reply 17):
Just to point out, there are places where during summer it is light outside during the night as well. And if you go further north you can also get it dark for most of the day during winter...



Quoting Hawk44 (Reply 21):
Not anywhere near this memorial

Canadian, this place is so dark at night that even the stars don't bother to shine on clear nights...ok, I'm exagerating, but it's DAMN dark.

Quoting MIAMIx707 (Reply 26):
By the way how far is the memorial from the actual crash site? and someone said it's off Tamiami trail so.. how many miles from say.. FIU?

I'd say 10-15

Quoting Komododx (Reply 29):
Tamiami and Krome?

It's at LEAST 3 miles west of Krome. Unfortunately it's the only place that's close enough to where 'normal' people can get to in relation to the crash site. The memorial points in the direction of the site, which I want to say is 8 miles away.

You can hire an airboat to get there, but

Quoting Wayfarer (Reply 11):
I have been on the Everglades (by boat with friends) I like that area

you are nowhere near the 'real' everglades if you are on a conventional boat.
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Douglas7Seas
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 4:25 am

I have had the "fun" of working with juveniles who engage in the kind of destruction visited on the Valuejet memorial. Typically, they are immature, poorly educated and on the lower end of the intellectual spectrum.All you have to do is look at the NAZI insignia in the article photograph to know you're not dealing with real bright people.

I'm a social worker, that's my profession. Perhaps I take a different view of how these vandals should be treated that most people on this site. In my view, first you find the perpetrators. You explain to them the inappropriate nature of their behaviors, and have them repair the damage. Then you apply rigorous corporal punishment, followed by a period of perhaps five years of social isolation.

Just my quirky social worker view of how this incident should be handled.

John
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ERJ170
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 4:28 am

Here's the image for those too lazy to open the link, much like I almost was.. Big grin

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fbgdavidson
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 4:30 am

Quoting DB777 (Reply 12):
An acquaintance of mine has a gallery of shots from the memorial (pre-vandalism) at:

http://www.pbase.com/lautermilch/fli...ht592

Wow, some amazing photos on there!

http://i.pbase.com/v3/94/465494/2/44842415.DSC_4671.jpg
http://i.pbase.com/v3/94/465494/2/44729413.DSC_4553.jpg
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VEEREF
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 4:41 am

Looks like some punks out on a bender. Don't think a swastika has anything to do with the accident. Just some unspoiled concrete for some bored teenagers who were probably still in elementary school when it happened.
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TedTAce
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 5:07 am

This shot:

http://mishilo.image.pbase.com/v3/94/465494/2/44728141.DSC_4443.jpg

Is facing away from the crash site, but illustrates how the memorial 'faces' the site.. as you can see, no parking lot/spaces, the shot gives the illusion there is no canal between it and Tamiami Trail; but you can see Tamiami trail is the road in the background
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Wayfarer
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RE: Valujet Crash Memorial Vandelized

Sun Jul 10, 2005 6:54 am

very nice memorial ... thanks for the photos.  tombstone  I hope they will remove the spray-painted graffiti ASAP.
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