aircanada333
Posts: 458
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Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:01 am

Air Transat has an only airbus fleet, as everyone knows. I've been wondering these couple of days....how can they t/o overweight (pasenger wise)? I'll explain, TS's A330-300 has 362 passengers compared to Air Canada who only has 274!!!!Thats a difference of more than 100 passengers. And its the same thing the other aircraft they posses. Can someone explain?
De-icing RULZ!!!
 
CRJ900
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:06 am

Same with MyTravel Airways, their A333 take off with 410 pax and make it to the Canary Islands 4,100 kms away. Amazing aircraft...
Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
 
aircanada333
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:11 am

Ya thats cheap for the passengers. Their knees are literally in their face!
De-icing RULZ!!!
 
Cessnapimp
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:12 am

IMO, you pay that kind of price to go somewhere, you surrender your right to complain!  Wink
 
krisyyz
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:15 am

I flew to Cayo Coco, Cuba (MUCC) from YYZ on C-GPTS an A332. It was a full house (363 pax) and we carried fuel for both legs and the aircraft didn't seem overweight at all to me. We lifted off of rwy 24R right after rwy 33R and cruised at 910km @FL410. I was suprised to at the crammed A332 too, I've known friends that have flown on the same plane, full house to FCO. Air Transat must put heavy cargo weight restrictions on those flights. Its the cargo and fuel that add the most weight to any aircraft.

Krisyyz
 
DLKAPA
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:15 am

So then how is their Airbus overweight?
And all at once the crowd begins to sing: Sometimes the hardest thing and the right thing are the same
 
Avianca
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:19 am

Quoting KrisYYZ (Reply 4):
Air Transat must put heavy cargo weight restrictions on those flights.

well Air Transat is selling the cargo space from europe to canada rock-bottom.... half price than ac for example offers....and they have always freight on the flight....so they could not have such a big restriction on the flights
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
antonovman
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:20 am

I think header lines (subjects) like this should be deleted
it is implying the airline is operating an overweight a/c when in fact they are just
packing in passengers instead of cargo
and people like KrisYYZ - "and we carried fuel for both legs and the aircraft didn't seem overweight at all to me. "
How on earth does he know if its overweight or not sitting down the back with the rest of the passengers ??
 
WunalaYann
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:21 am

Quoting DLKAPA (Reply 5):
So then how is their Airbus overweight?

Good question.

My limited knowledge of aviation leads me to believe that an "overweight" aircraft would simply not be allowed to take off and/or land as such.

And a responsible airline like TS would simply NOT fill an aircraft beyond its capacity.

Now if you mean "over-crowded" in the comfort-related sense of the term, I definitely agree. I have flown on TS's L1011 and A310 (the latter in 3-3-3 configuration, if I recall, perhaps 3-4-3, but I doubt it) and yes, my knees were in my chin. And I wish we had chopsticks for the meal, since I could barely move my elbows without smashing my neighbour's cheekbones.

 Smile

Cheers.
 
aircanada333
Posts: 458
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:29 am

Quoting WunalaYann (Reply 8):
Now if you mean "over-crowded

Ya thats what I meant SORRY!!! Big grin
De-icing RULZ!!!
 
krisyyz
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 10:38 am

Quoting Antonovman (Reply 7):
KrisYYZ - "and we carried fuel for both legs and the aircraft didn't seem overweight at all to me. "
How on earth does he know if its overweight or not sitting down the back with the rest of the passengers ??

I never said the plane was overweight, I wouldn't think for a second that any airline would operate an overweight aircraft.
The only reason I knew that we carried fuel for both legs is because the Captain told us; due to the fact that we had to circle Cayo Coco for 90 min.
The fact that we climbed straight to FL410 after departure would indicate to me that the plane was not at MTOW.

After all this is an discussion forum!!

Air Transat operates thier A310 in 3x3x3, A332 3x3x3 and A333 2x4x2.

Krisyyz

[Edited 2005-07-10 03:39:53]
 
STARalliance24
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:10 am

Is it the only company that sacraficies cargo for more passengers? (exept for MyTravel Airways)
 
yul332LX
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:24 am

Considering that the A330 is certified to carry as many as 440 pax, TS' 330s are not even close to be "overcrowded" (legally speaking).

Quoting STARalliance24 (Reply 11):
Is it the only company that sacrifices cargo for more passengers?

Most charters do that. Their core business is simply not cargo-related. They concentrate their efforts on selling seats rather than cargo space.
E volavo, volavo felice più in alto del sole, e ancora più su mentre il mondo pian piano spariva lontano laggiù ...
 
STARalliance24
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:25 am

Quoting YUL332LX (Reply 12):
Most charters do that. Their core business is simply not cargo-related. They concentrate their efforts on selling seats rather than cargo space.

Thanx for the info.
 
Avianca
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:27 am

Quoting YUL332LX (Reply 12):
Quoting STARalliance24 (Reply 11):
Is it the only company that sacrifices cargo for more passengers?

Most charters do that. Their core business is simply not cargo-related. They concentrate their efforts on selling seats rather than cargo space.

i would say, all airlines prefers first passengers than cargo, cargo has always second priority...
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
STARalliance24
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:33 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 14):
i would say, all airlines prefers first passengers than cargo, cargo has always second priority...

What about UPS and FEDEX. I don't think they take too many passengers. LOL
 Wink
 
Avianca
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:36 am

Quoting STARalliance24 (Reply 15):
What about UPS and FEDEX. I don't think they take too many passengers. LOL

what? check the check-in hall at your homeairport, the fedex and ups check-in lanes are so loooooooooonnnnng  bigthumbsup 
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
STARalliance24
Posts: 371
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:38 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 16):
what? check the check-in hall at your homeairport, the fedex and ups check-in lanes are so loooooooooonnnnng

Dude theres no UPS or FEDEX at Montreal YUL!!!!!  hissyfit 
 
STARalliance24
Posts: 371
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:40 am

You can try YYZ it has some of those.
 
Avianca
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 11:40 am

Quoting STARalliance24 (Reply 17):
Dude theres no UPS or FEDEX at Montreal YUL!!!!!

go to mirabel....or?
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
STARalliance24
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:00 pm

Quoting Avianca (Reply 19):
go to mirabel....or?

Na too far!  Embarrassment
 
yul332LX
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:08 pm

Quoting Avianca (Reply 14):
i would say, all airlines prefers first passengers than cargo, cargo has always second priority...

Sure, but plenty of routes are not viable without decent cargo loads, especially when demand for premium seats is weak.

For instance, LX cargo loads are astronomical year-round on the YUL-ZRH flight. The A332 might be more profitable elsewhere for LX during wintertime without these cargo loads.

Quoting Avianca (Reply 19):
go to mirabel....or?

Yep.
E volavo, volavo felice più in alto del sole, e ancora più su mentre il mondo pian piano spariva lontano laggiù ...
 
STARalliance24
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:11 pm

But anyways...coming back to the subject, I think what TS is doing isn't really smart.
 
Avianca
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:16 pm

Quoting YUL332LX (Reply 21):
Sure, but plenty of routes are not viable without decent cargo loads, especially when demand for premium seats is weak.

For instance, LX cargo loads are astronomical year-round on the YUL-ZRH flight. The A332 might be more profitable elsewhere for LX during wintertime without these cargo loads.

cargo rates are these day not really high, so it makes often more money to sell 4 premium seats more on the flights than carring 10 to 15 tons cargo.

for example fares from central euorope to yul are wide under 1 euro + fuel and securtiy surcharges per kg and from northamerica to europe the rates are normally the half or less one.
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
yul332LX
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:16 pm

Quoting STARalliance24 (Reply 22):
I think what TS is doing isn't really smart

Why?

They are extremely successful at what they're doing. In fact, TS was rated the number one airline (tied with Ryanair) in the medium-size category by the AW&ST last month.
E volavo, volavo felice più in alto del sole, e ancora più su mentre il mondo pian piano spariva lontano laggiù ...
 
yul332LX
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:21 pm

Quoting Avianca (Reply 23):
cargo rates are these day not really high, so it makes often more money to sell 4 premium seats more on the flights than carring 10 to 15 tons cargo.


Selling several more premium seat is easier said than done, sadly, especially out of YUL.

Concentrating on cargo is a wise thing to do and it is someting that SR/LX have always done very well.
E volavo, volavo felice più in alto del sole, e ancora più su mentre il mondo pian piano spariva lontano laggiù ...
 
Avianca
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:24 pm

Quoting YUL332LX (Reply 25):
Selling several more premium seat is easier said than done, sadly, especially out of YUL.

Concentrating on cargo is a wise thing to do and it is someting that SR/LX have always done very well.

absolut correct, and airlines will coload the freight if they can no question, but they prefer the passengers.

we will see what the future will bring, very good possible that in some years the coloading of freight on pax flights will be not more allowed
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
STARalliance24
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 12:39 pm

Quoting YUL332LX (Reply 24):
Why?

I'm talking passenger wise, they don't think about their passenger's comfort too much. They might be a good airline but I wouldn't take it.
 
captaingomes
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Sun Jul 10, 2005 1:18 pm

But anyways...coming back to the subject, I think what TS is doing isn't really smart.

Considering that Transat is very profitable and is sitting on a large pile of cash, I would say they are VERY smart. In the package tour market, $10 or $20 can make a difference between somebody booking on one package or another. Every dollar counts unfortunately, and by having tighter seating, the cost per person decreases significantly. It is the nature of the market to squeeze as many people into the aircraft as possible to lower the price. There is a limit of course, but Transat has been very successful in managing passenger expectations.
"it's kind of like an Airbus, it's an engineering marvel, but there's no sense of passion" -- J. Clarkson re: Coxster
 
TheSonntag
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Mon Jul 11, 2005 12:15 am

Maybe Air Transat is just flying without Fuel Big grin
 
yul332LX
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Mon Jul 11, 2005 1:15 am

Quoting STARalliance24 (Reply 27):
I'm talking passenger wise, they don't think about their passenger's comfort too much

I agree, but YGWYPF!
E volavo, volavo felice più in alto del sole, e ancora più su mentre il mondo pian piano spariva lontano laggiù ...
 
flyingzacko
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Mon Jul 11, 2005 3:10 am

Quoting Aircanada333 (Thread starter):
I'll explain, TS's A330-300 has 362 passengers compared to Air Canada who only has 274!!!!Thats a difference of more than 100 passengers.

I don't wanna burst your bubble here, but 362-274 is only 88 and not more than 100 passengers, but I still get your point.

Cheers,
Sebastian
Canon 40D + 24-70 f/2.8 L + 70-200 f/4 L + Speedlite 430EX
 
captaingomes
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Mon Jul 11, 2005 3:33 am

You also have to take into consideration that Air Transat has a small Club Class at the front with only 3 rows, and Air Canada has a large J Class section. If both airlines had an all Y class configuration, you would see a smaller difference in the number of seats.
"it's kind of like an Airbus, it's an engineering marvel, but there's no sense of passion" -- J. Clarkson re: Coxster
 
CanadianNorth
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Mon Jul 11, 2005 4:44 am

Quoting WunalaYann (Reply 8):
a responsible airline like TS would simply NOT

Not trying to be mean or anything just pointing out that Air Transat is a airline responsible enough to...
a) dump the lavs all over the ramp here at YXY one time
b) land an L1011 over half way down the runway and floor the brakes and reversers and all and berily stop in time when there was no reason why they couldn't have done a go-around which they should have
c) put a wrong part in which caused a fuel leak which the pilots took way to long to clue in to what was happening and were then forced to glide part way across the atlantic to some island for an emergency landing
d) have a rather large chunk of rudder come off one of their planes



CanadianNorth
What could possibly go wrong?
 
ciaomc2002
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Mon Jul 11, 2005 4:50 am

362 - 274 = 88, not more than 100 passengers!
 
captaingomes
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Mon Jul 11, 2005 4:54 am

CanadianNorth, respectfully you can pick any airline and come up with a list of items to "prove" it is irresponsible. Air Transat has had its issues, but they are a very strong, and very profitable airline these days.
"it's kind of like an Airbus, it's an engineering marvel, but there's no sense of passion" -- J. Clarkson re: Coxster
 
CanadianNorth
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Tue Jul 12, 2005 3:31 am

Quoting Captaingomes (Reply 35):
CanadianNorth, respectfully you can pick any airline and come up with a list of items to "prove" it is irresponsible. Air Transat has had its issues

I know, I was just having some fun. But although almost all airlines have a major problem every now and then, in the last few years Air Transat seems to have had more than most airlines in this part of the world. But still, if it weren't for the fact that I'd have a hard time fitting in their seats I'd fly them.  Smile


CanadianNorth
What could possibly go wrong?
 
yulqc
Posts: 51
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Tue Jul 12, 2005 8:17 am

I worked as an F/A for TS for 4 years and I would not hesitate to fly them one second. As for the seating, it is tight but no worse than most of the charter industry. Also a fun company to work for, I actually miss to work for them from time to time.. Those were the days! Very well managed company considering the size of the fleet that they have now. Sensitive to delays a lot more than bigger carriers, if an A/C goes Mx in YYC for example, they do not have spare all over the country. Although as said, they are doing pretty well in their market and their market.. is the holidays, packages.. people that want to fly for nothing and enjoy their "Cuba Libre" in VRA ASAP...

Why did I go back to work in an office...  Smile
319, 320, 321, 332, 333, 343, 388, 717, 732, 733, 734, 735, 736, 737, 738, 744, 752, 763, 772, 77W, MD88, L-1011, Dash-8
 
jpetekyxmd80
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Tue Jul 12, 2005 8:41 am

Quoting STARalliance24 (Reply 27):
I'm talking passenger wise, they don't think about their passenger's comfort too much. They might be a good airline but I wouldn't take it.

What they and other charter airlines do is 'smart' any way you look at it. They don't care what you think, there are more than enough people out there to book by lowest prices. Passenger wise, they get more passengers and the passengers are paying less. Charters fly to leisure destinations so theres hardly any business traffic, just people going on vacation and looking for a good deal.

Quoting Aircanada333 (Reply 9):
Quoting WunalaYann (Reply 8):
Now if you mean "over-crowded

Ya thats what I meant SORRY!!! Big grin

Do we look stupid? You are not talking about an over crowded/cramped passenger cabin exclusively when your thread starter talks about overWEIGHT and difficulties taking off. Realize passengers are only a part of what makes the weight of an aircraft. Fuel and baggage/cargo exist too.

Might want to work on your arithmetic as well...
The Best Care in the Air, 1984-2009
 
STARalliance24
Posts: 371
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RE: Air Transat And Their (overweight) Airbus.

Tue Jul 12, 2005 9:13 pm

Quoting JpetekYXMD80 (Reply 38):
What they and other charter airlines do is 'smart' any way you look at it. They don't care what you think, there are more than enough people out there to book by lowest prices. Passenger wise, they get more passengers and the passengers are paying less. Charters fly to leisure destinations so theres hardly any business traffic, just people going on vacation and looking for a good deal.

Ok ok I can agree with you on that. But I'd rather travel with Air Canada. It might be more expenive but when you're doing something like YVR to FRA being comfortable will make a big difference.

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