Aware
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Qantas To Send BIG$$$

Fri Apr 28, 2000 3:20 pm

The Australian Financial Review (28/4) is reporting that Qantas is poised to announce an order in the next 2 months for potentially US$4.5billion worth of aircraft. The article states that the order is likely to consist of 10 firm & 20 options on a 300 seat aircraft, with both the 777 and the 330/340 being considered. The aircraft ordered would replace the 13 "classic" 747s currently owned by Qantas.
 
Aware
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Sorry: Qantas To Spend BIG$$$

Fri Apr 28, 2000 3:23 pm

The curse of the temperamental 'p' button!
 
Guest

RE: Qantas To Send BIG$$$

Fri Apr 28, 2000 3:32 pm

Finally some good news for Boeing!
 
CX747
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RE: Qantas To Send BIG$$$

Sat Apr 29, 2000 12:28 am

It has been said Boeing has the inside track on this order. 777-200LRs being preferred over the A340-500. Also the 747-400ER entering the fray. If they are choosen it won't be long until Australia has some 737NGS also!!!!!
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
Guest

RE: Qantas To Send BIG$$$

Sat Apr 29, 2000 12:41 am

>>>It has been said Boeing has the inside track on this order<<<

You betcha. The reasons are many, not least of which is the fact that Qantas doesn't like Airbus. The 330/340 cannot capacity-wise take over from the 747 Classics; I assume the 340NG model and the 777LR were fighting out this one. A Boeing deal would open the door for the 737NG not to mention the 764ER and 764ERX.

I would be very surprised if Airbus wins this one.
 
kaitak
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RE: Mais Non - Ne Celebratez Pas Too Soon!

Sat Apr 29, 2000 3:28 am

Excuse the liberal use of franglais! Don't count Airbus out on this one too soon. I will admit that the Boeings have the inside track and a joint order is a strong possibility, but the reality of the situation is that the first order will be for about 7-10 aircraft for flights to Asian destinations. There is no way you can get a 777 to look better than an A330-300X for this job, much as I love the 777 (and I do! - no kidding!)

Financial considerations will of course dictate the final deal, but there again, Airbus knows it has a lot to do and with two senior QF people - Strong and Dixon - in Toulouse this week, you can bet they'll be schmoozed as only the French know how.

Although QF operated A300s for only a short time, these aircraft were much more popular with passengers than the 767s, being wider and passenger preference will have a lot to do with it. Also, the Business Class section of the 777 is mostly seven abreast; why have a centre seat when the A340 will give you a nice 6 abreast layout, excellent freight capacity and none of the ETOPs concerns that would cause problems for flights to places like South America, South Africa, Dallas and such places. Bear in mind also that the need for the 777 to keep to ETOPs flight lanes, even with 207 minute clearance will require longer flying times (putting the 777 at a disadvantage against the 777) and it will affect the aircraft's flexibility.

The short haul fleet was mentioned as well; the A321 would be an ideal 762 replacement and given that AN is likely to go for another A320 order soon, to replace its 737s, QF might not like to lose the advantage. Don't get me wrong; Qantas would do very well with a 777/737NG fleet (not sure about the 767-400), but the A345/6, A330, A32X would serve it SO much better.
 
CX747
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RE: Mais Non - Ne Celebratez Pas Too Soon!

Sat Apr 29, 2000 3:35 am

Well, I guess we will have to wait and see. I have a friend who works for Qantas and he has stated that the entire company prefers the 777-200LR/300ER over the Airbus equivalents.
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
tullamarine
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RE: Qantas To Send BIG$$$

Sat Apr 29, 2000 1:33 pm

Unless ETOPS rules the day, QF will probably opt for the 777 though I'm sure the Airbus deal will be attractive financially and Strong and Dixon have great financial nouse and if it came to a choice between a Boeing tradition and a good financial deal, the financial deal will win easily.

Whilst the 777 is a favorite I don't know if the same applies to the 737NG. Now that QF's major shareholder BA has opted for A32X the attraction of the Airbus narrowbodies will have increased.
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Guest

RE: Kaitak

Sun Apr 30, 2000 4:45 am

Since the new fleet type will be primarily replacing 747 Classics, its Business class will most likely be in a 2-2-2 configuration ala Delta's Business Elite, etc since the Classics only operate in a 2 class configuration. None of QF's classics have 2-3-2 seating in Business at present.

Choosing a combination of mainly 777-300ER and 772LR allows Qantas to maximize economies of scale because both are long haul twins. Going with airbus would mean primarily a 340NG order coupled with a 330 order at a later point in time for the regional runs. This is where it starts to get messy with several different engine types and aircraft with different numbers of engines. The 340NG's will offer only RR Trent 500's and there will be 4 of them; the 333 offers Trent 700's.
Contrast that with the 777LR's same GE Engines for both new types. Despite the fact that QF operate all kinds of engines, most of them are GE's.

The primary focus will not simply be on ultra long range new aircraft, but also in replacing the older 747's. The 773 is simply a better replacement for the classics than the 340NG would be, both cargo and capacity wise.

I don't doubt Airbus have bent over backwards for this one, but they didn't get the order.
 
ryanair
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RE: Qantas To Send BIG$$$

Sun Apr 30, 2000 6:05 am

Both of QFs major Oneworld partners are 777 airlines (ie Ba and AA) which has got to mean something. Plus ETOPS wouldn't be that important surely as the 767's get all over and the classic 747's don't operate over any major trans oceanic routes (like acros the PAcific or Indian). Talking about the narrow bodies I think BA buying Airbus was more to do with Aylings links with the Blair Govt which is always trying to prove it's a power within the EU, something I wouldn't have thought would effect the Qantas Narrow Body Fleet. Plus Bob Ayling as head of BA had a seat on the QF Board, will Rob Ellington take up such a place I wonder?
 
tullamarine
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Ryanair

Sun Apr 30, 2000 11:05 am

The new BA CEO's name is Rod Eddington not Rob Ellington.

Whilst at Ansett he was known to be very pleased with the operations of the 19 A320s in Ansett's fleet.
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v jet
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RE: Qantas To Send BIG$$$

Wed May 03, 2000 1:48 pm

A correction to the post by Chieftain. Qantas has a Business Class configuration of 2-3-2 in 744 and 742 acft.
Regards
 
B727-200
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Tullamarine

Wed May 03, 2000 3:04 pm


The number of A320's in Ansett's fleet is 20, not 19, and yes, Rod was more than pleased with them. He is also a big fan of the B777. He believes the way to go is running smaller aircraft, more often, with a greater average high-yield content.

It will be interesting to see what influence Rod has on QF through his role at BA. He already knows what medium-term strategies (1-5 years) are going on at Ansett, plus he should have a fair idea of what long-term strategies are going ahead.

B727-200.
 
Laserjet
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RE: Qantas To Send BIG$$$

Wed May 03, 2000 4:31 pm

I think that Boeing will win the order, at the end of the day, considering all the factors that have already been mentioned above.
 
Guest

RE: Qantas To Send BIG$$$

Wed May 03, 2000 8:54 pm

What will happen to the replaced 747´s ?
 
CX747
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RE: Qantas To Send BIG$$$

Wed May 03, 2000 10:01 pm

The 747-200s, 747-300s and 2 747SPs that are being replaced will either be sold or stored in the desert. Seeing that QF takes immaculate care of their birds I think we will see most of them flying for other carriers or maybe Atlas Air Cargo. I know that VS was looking for more 747-200s this year.
"History does not long entrust the care of freedom to the weak or timid." D. Eisenhower
 
wingman
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RE: Qantas To Send BIG$$$

Thu May 04, 2000 9:41 am

For what it's worth, the Aussie government just ordered two new BBJs as replacements for their 707 VIP aircraft. The BBJs were awarded under contract (lease?) to Qantas. The competitor for the larger aircraft was the 319. Perhaps another indication of Qantas staying with Boeing on their own order...