emrecan
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Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 4:43 pm

Hi everyone..


Is it possible or permitted for a married couple to be a pilot and co-pilot on the same plane? (husband is the captain, wife is the co-pilot)

The airlines accept it or there are some rules against this?

thnx for replies
 
je89_w
Crew
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 4:50 pm

There was an article in Hawaii's Midweek (I think that was the newspaper) about a brother captain and sister first officer, flying together for the first time on an Aloha Airlines B737-700.

Obviously siblings flying together is allowed for AQ, not too sure about other airlines. Not sure about married couples flying together either.
 
dogfighter2111
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 4:50 pm

No, I don't think so.

On Airline USA, it showed you a Captain and Co-Pilot who were engaged.

Why would it really make a difference?

Thanks
Mike

EDIT: This was Southwest Airlines

[Edited 2005-07-25 09:51:42]
 
MidnightMike
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 4:52 pm

Quoting Emrecan (Thread starter):
Hi everyone..


Is it possible or permitted for a married couple to be a pilot and co-pilot on the same plane? (husband is the captain, wife is the co-pilot)

The airlines accept it or there are some rules against this?

thnx for replies

Pretty much up to the airlines, I have heard of only one husband/wife cockpit crew, except, it was the wife that was the Captain & the husband that was the first officer.
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emrecan
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 5:04 pm

yeap I also know some couples lying together for ex: captain and cabin crew but I am wondering captain and co-pilot..

It would be interesting  Smile
 
ha763
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 5:05 pm

Actually, I remember an article about a husband and wife who are pilots at AQ. I don't remember if the article mentioned if they flew together at AQ, but they do fly together in the Hawaii Air National Guard as KC-135 pilots.

Quoting Je89_w (Reply 1):
There was an article in Hawaii's Midweek (I think that was the newspaper) about a brother captain and sister first officer, flying together for the first time on an Aloha Airlines B737-700.

It was in the Midweek. They are Mike and Kelly Feeney. Also, their father, Jim, was also a pilot for AQ. I actually met Kelly when she was doing her 100hrs.
 
Euclid
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 5:38 pm

It has happened at SAA, and may still be happening. A few years ago there was a report in a local newspaper when it happened for the first time at SAA that a husband and wife flew together in the cockpit. Obviously once the first time is over and done with, the newsworthiness of it is also gone, so we won't know of any other time afterwards, but I'm sure it still happens.

In this case the captain was the husband, and wife was the first officer on a B737. The wife used to be a cabin attendant before becoming a commercial pilot.

I've met both of them. The captain used to be the chief flying instructor at the flying school I did my PPL at way back in 1989.
 
ACDC8
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 7:18 pm

There was an article years ago in some UK aviation magazine, it had a picture of a man and woman (captain and F/O) who were married and flew for the first time together on a VS 747.
A Grumpy German Is A Sauerkraut
 
jorge1812
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 7:33 pm

My guess is, that it won't be allowed. Because you might make far more mistakes when you're working with your wife/husband because of the routine you have from living together. But that's just my thought. I also think there are many pilot-F/O and Pilots-F/A marriages, because the most relationships start at work.

Georg.
 
gg190
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 8:29 pm

There was an artical a few years ago in a newspaper about a Husband and Wife, who were pilot and co-pilot respectively.

They flew for Brittania. So I guess it is permitted in the UK. Can't remeber the newspaper it was in, may have been the Daily Mirror
 
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aloha73g
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 8:39 pm

I remember hearing about a Southwest Captain who's daughter is and F/O for Southwest as well. They flew together as much as possible accoriding to article in Southwest's Magazine.

Aloha!
Aloha Airlines - The Spirit Moves Us. Gone but NEVER Forgotten. Aloha, A Hui Hou!
 
akelley728
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 10:22 pm

Quoting Jorge1812 (Reply 8):
My guess is, that it won't be allowed.

Yet there were a half a dozen posts before you that said otherwise.
 irked 
 
Orion737
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 10:38 pm

If it is, it shouldnt be. Imagine the informality that might possibly creep into the flight deck preocedures.;

Check
Check, by the way is your mother fethcing her pussycat?

Ridiculous!
 
jorge1812
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Mon Jul 25, 2005 10:59 pm

Quoting AKelley728 (Reply 11):
Yet there were a half a dozen posts before you that said otherwise.

Yes, but nearly all said there was an article in newspaper several years ago IIRC...
But let's say it's not allowed at every airline.

Georg.
 
gg190
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 12:42 am

I would agree that it probably depends upon the airline. Some airlines like VS will see it as a nice gimmick for their airline, something to get them into the papers.

I'm sure Brittania would not have objected to the free advertising the article I mentioned earlier would have brought them. I seem to remember that the article stressed that the husband and wife were completely professional when in the cockpit.
 
uadc8contrail
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 4:00 am

ZW had a married couple flying the 146 for some time.....husband was the capt, he ran into some trouble and was put back into the right seat, wife went to the left seat...she since has quit and he retired a bitter man
bus driver.......move that bus:)
 
desertjets
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 4:07 am

I'm not particularly sure why it would not be allowed. A professional flight crew is just that, professional. Regardless of whether the other pilot is your spouse/partner/next door neighbor, you still follow the same procedures, use the same checklist, and stick to the same CRM policies.

Unlike in some other work environments; where a spouse is a superior/supervisor to the other spouse, this not a particular environment where one can easily abuse power or use the relationship to one's advantage. And if one did the results could well be disastrous.
Stop drop and roll will not save you in hell. --- seen on a church marque in rural Virginia
 
gman3
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 4:13 am

It is allowed at United. I flew with a couple on the 757. I do rememer saying to myself... " Self, I really hope they don't get into an argument!"
 
malaysia
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 4:15 am

Some Airlines even have rules where the Captain and F/O cannot eat the same type of meal, just in case one gets food poisoning.
There Are Those Who Believe That There May Yet Be Other Airlines Who Even Now Fight To Survive Beyond The Heavens
 
Lee
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 4:23 am

Quoting Malaysia (Reply 18):

i thought this was the usual practice ?
 
Boeing727
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 4:23 am

I jumpseated on a Mesa ERJ earlier this years from Louisville (SDF) to Charlotte (CLT) and during the flight it came out that the captain (he) and the f/o (she) where married, quite an imazing story...

Boeing727
 
trident2e
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 4:40 am

Quoting Emrecan (Thread starter):
Is it possible or permitted for a married couple to be a pilot and co-pilot on the same plane? (husband is the captain, wife is the co-pilot)

What a sexest comment! Did it never occur to you that the woman could be the captain?
 
emrecan
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 4:47 am

Trident2e:

bravo!! You understood the subject false I guess... I just gave an example.. I dont care who will be the captain man or woman! I just wondered if the married couples are permitted to fly together. Please reply if you know something about it, don`t change the subject
 
PIA777
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 6:49 am

There was an episode of "Airline" Where a Southwest Capt. and F/O
were about to get married. I don't know if they fly together now.

PIA777
GO CUBS!!
 
barney captain
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 6:58 am

Here at the "Luv" airline, it is not at all unusual. I've seen just about any combination you could imagine including spouses, siblings, and parents.
Southeast Of Disorder
 
trident2e
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 6:59 am

Quoting Emrecan (Reply 22):
You understood the subject false I guess...

I guess I didn't - your sexist attitude was perfectly transparent!
 
An225
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 7:27 am

I see from the replies that this situation has happened in a lot of airlines, but I wonder - why?
Lets take for example a situation where the man or his wife are making a mistake and the other flightdeck crewmember should report about it. What are the chances that one of these guys is going to report on his/her spouse? And please don't repeat again the regular say that "pilots, when they are entering the cockpit - they are professionals". I don't believe it happens on 100%, because life are complicated enough.
Also, what happens if the man and wife are in the middle of a difficult phase in their marriage? do you actually belief that they won't argue and maybe shout at each other?
These are only two scenarios, which can lead to real problems. IMHO, these airlines should put a stop to the practice of assigning married couples as captain and F/O (maybe only on 727s/747-200s/DC-10s/etc., where there is a three-persons crew).


Uzi
 
wdleiser
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 7:35 am

... i see 1 problem. Mile high club in the cockpit. Especially if they are flying to their honey moon  Wink
 
s.p.a.s.
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 8:14 am

Varig has a couple flying the 777. He is on the left seat, she on the right.

Never heard about any problems...

Cheers

Salz
"ad astra per aspera"
 
N867BX
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 8:16 am

Quoting Malaysia (Reply 18):
Some Airlines even have rules where the Captain and F/O cannot eat the same type of meal, just in case one gets food poisoning.

Yes, a lesson we learned when Victor, Roger, and Clarence ate the same meal. Were it not for the heroic efforts of Ted and Elaine a catastrophe would most certainly have occurred.
 
BR715-A1-30
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 11:13 am

Quoting Emrecan (Reply 4):
It would be interesting

Picture this...

A Married couple is about to fly the DC-10 as captain and co-pilot... they have WONDERFUL plans in store while the craft is on autopilot... So, they board the plane, and take their seats and give a sneaky look to each other.

5 minutes later, the second officer walks in... The Captain's Father in Law happened to take this trip as well

BUSTED!!!
Puhdiddle
 
phxpilot
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 11:17 am

My wife and I are both pilots for the same airline (YV) here in the US. We flew together nearly every month for over two years, with myself as captain and she as first officer. For quite a while we were the only married captain and FO at out company that were actually able to fly together,

Anyone who travels for a living knows how difficult it can be to find enough time to spend with your spouse. We suffered from the same issue until she was hired at my airline. When we flew together it was wonderful. We shared many experiences that we otherwise would have missed, and it brought us even closer together, if that is possible.

As far as arguments in the cockpit, my wife and I get along extremely well. We rarely so much as disagree. Although, "What happens when you two fight in the cockpit?" was an often asked question. We are both professionals and work was kept separate from home. In the airplane we worked together as a crew should. There was no joining the mile high club or any other similar activity. One upside was the outstanding CRM between us which contributed to the safety of our passengers.

Unfortunately, my wife decided to upgrade to captain since her seniority has risen substantially. As a result, I moved on to another aircraft type. Our chances of flying together again, at least professionally, is slim to none. Many days go by when I may see her for only 5 minutes in passing at the airport. We try to bid for the same days off, but that is often hit or miss. We still talk each night by phone, but I sure miss the time we used to have together.

Sorry about the long post, I hope it answers your question.
 
c172
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 11:28 am

I've never had a wife with me in the cockpit. I have dated female pilots in the airline and I've had two flights with girlfriend f/o's. Naturally, being the male I'd be the Captain (that's just for Trident 2E). MD-80 cockpits don't allow much space for a mile high club.

On another note, why would someone want to risk their career in such a stupid way anyhow? I know it's happened before, and folks have gotten away with it. Stupid, still.
 
BBJII
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 9:24 pm

The simple answer is yes.

Once in the flightdeck, it's the ability to fly that counts, not who cooking, doing the dishes or cleaning the house.

I once dispatched a LX (crossair not swiss) RJ with the Captain (wife), F/O (husband) and there daughter was the senior FA.

Now where in any rulebook does it stipulate that this procedure would be illegal.

Maybe an airline will look at the possibilities of cover ups due to "Friendly" crew operating, but each airline has its own rules, hopefully with the law.

The regulations are quiet clear - it's not illegal
Remember: The Bird Hit You, You Didn't Hit The Bird.....
 
SA006
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 9:48 pm

I think it was UA. There was a doc on Discovery and the pilots were father and daughter. Daughter had just become a F/O.

At SAA there is a father and son both flying A340's.

-SA006
Proudly South African
 
Euclid
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 10:07 pm

Quoting SA006 (Reply 34):
At SAA there is a father and son both flying A340's.

Yes, that also made the papers over here the first time they were scheduled on a flight together, but I doubt it happened again afterwards, because the father was one month away from retirement when this flight took place.

While on the subject of unusual pairings, something else at SAA also made the papers a few months before the father and son. Another first for SAA happened when two pilots flew together for the first time (both male) that both used to be cabin attendants at SAA before moving into the cockpit.
 
Eric777
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Tue Jul 26, 2005 10:40 pm

I flew from CLE-HPN in February of this year on Continental Express / ExpressJet where the Captain and F/o were husband and wife. Obviously there were no issues of them being in the cockpit together. Professionalism should always come first on the flight deck ahead of personal feelings. Otherwise I probably would not be here to type this.
-Eric
 
A350
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A

Wed Jul 27, 2005 12:09 am

Quoting Emrecan (Thread starter):
Is it possible or permitted for a married couple to be a pilot and co-pilot on the same plane? (husband is the captain, wife is the co-pilot)

Emrecan, two questions:

  • What's different if the couple is not married  confused 
  • What's different if she is the Captain and he is the First Officer  confused  confused 


A350
 
RogerThat
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Wed Jul 27, 2005 12:45 am

American Eagle had a husband and wife fly an ERJ a few years ago.
 
md80fanatic
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A

Wed Jul 27, 2005 12:56 am

What? I could have predicted well in advance the lunacy of the replies here. Oh GAWD, the dreaded MARRIED couple....they will start smootching and hugging and whispering sweet nothings.....hogwash!!!

In an emergency, the married couple know more about each other, and how the other will react, than ANYONE ELSE IN THE WORLD. Goodness gracious, relax already. All of your parents were married, remember? Would you feel comfortable riding along with them as Capt/FO?

I guess it needs not be said....but I will say it anyway. What happens if two gay people are flying the plane together? Does the same short sighted opinion cover that situation as well?  Yeah sure
 
SpdBrdConcorde
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A

Wed Jul 27, 2005 1:26 am

Quoting N867BX (Reply 29):
Yes, a lesson we learned when Victor, Roger, and Clarence ate the same meal. Were it not for the heroic efforts of Ted and Elaine a catastrophe would most certainly have occurred

 rotfl  Big grin  bigthumbsup 
 
RogerThat
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Wed Jul 27, 2005 1:29 am

Quoting Md80fanatic (Reply 39):
All of your parents were married

Marriage is not a prerequisite for bearing children. I have a few cousins who proved it.
 
CX Flyboy
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Wed Jul 27, 2005 2:37 am

I know of a a colleague couple who operated as part of a 4 person cockpit crew.

Recently on a CX flight, three brothers flew together (Captain, 2 FOs). it was in the newspaper and claimed to be the first time in the world that a 3 man cockpit crew was made up of 3 brothers.
 
emrecan
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Wed Jul 27, 2005 2:46 am

A350:


1- I just wondered if it is allowed. On some business branches it is not allowed so I wondered about airlines. OK????

2- I dont care if the wife is captain. Read the article again, it is written there `for ex:`

All that replies you could have found only this questions to ask?
 
rduramper
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Wed Jul 27, 2005 3:03 am

The "WN couple" flew in on a terminating flight a couple of months ago so they do still fly together. We thought something was unusual when we saw him (the captain) doing the walkaround! Then we realized who it was and we all had a good laugh.

Quoting CX flyboy (Reply 42):
Recently on a CX flight, three brothers flew together (Captain, 2 FOs). it was in the newspaper and claimed to be the first time in the world that a 3 man cockpit crew was made up of 3 brothers.

Apparantly, all hell broke loose in the cockpit when the two older brothers got the younger one in a headlock, gave him a bunch of "head noogies" and hung him up by his shorts on the cockpit door!
My mind is a raging torrent, flooded with rivulets of thought cascading into a waterfall of creative alternatives!
 
SA006
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Wed Jul 27, 2005 3:20 am

Euclid , I don't really want to mention names , but I am sure that the father and son are still flying. The father , I'll give you a hint , is the veteran aerobatic pilot famous for landing a cub on the back of a pickup. You know who I am talking about? His son is F/O on A340's at SAA and is also an aerobatic pilot in the same Harvard team as his father.

-SA006
Proudly South African
 
Euclid
Posts: 324
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Wed Jul 27, 2005 5:34 am

Okay, I stand corrected. Yes, I know who you are talking about. You've got the advantage of still being young with a sharp memory. My memory hasn't started going, it is already long gone!  biggrin 

Cheers!
 
SA006
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RE: Is It Permitted, A Married Couple To Fly The A/C?

Wed Jul 27, 2005 6:00 am

Quoting Euclid (Reply 46):

 tongue 

Very good pilot he is  Smile

-SA006
Proudly South African