FLYiCRJ
Topic Author
Posts: 54
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 3:57 am

Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 12:52 pm

Ive been photographing aircraft at EWR for 4 years now, unfortuantly none of my photos passed the A.net screening tests. However, every time I go to shoot pictures at EWR I get kicked out and warned. The other day I recieved a police report in the mail about my "suspicious activities". I go to the Ikea parking lot and get kicked out...go into their glass cafeteria (great view of 4L and 4R arrivals and departures) and get kicked out...I pull of on the bridge before 4L and 4R and get chased away...I pull into parking lots just before the 22 runways and get chased away.....I pull over on the turnpike and 5 squad cars pull up...now if i really need help or it was an emergency, I would be sitting their all night without anyone coming. I know they are on high alert with terrorism and homeland security, and I appreciate the fact that people are watching around the airports, but I am a 17 yr old aviation enthusiast, and when I go to the airport I have a camera in my hands..not a RPG or a anti-aircraft gun. So can any of you EWR spotters give me some good places to spot without running into trouble with law enforcement.
 
MaverickM11
Posts: 15276
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Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 1:14 pm

Unfortunately it's the government, and they're all mentally retarded and immune to reason so no matter what you're screwed.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
FLYiCRJ
Topic Author
Posts: 54
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 3:57 am

Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 1:28 pm

Yea...thats what i pretty much figured...me and my friend now take bets on how long it would be before we get caught...so far the record high is 8 mins in the long-term parking lot.
 
COEWRNJ
Posts: 1000
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Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 4:27 pm

FLYiCRJ,
I totally feel for you. Every time I try to spot over at the IKEA I get chased away. I've had them take down the information from my DL as well as my license plate number. Nothing ever came of it but they are real ass holes. It's the world we live in.. I just keep trying and some times I luck out and other times I don't.

Good Luck!
 
Bsmalls35
Posts: 72
Joined: Wed Apr 21, 2004 1:32 am

Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 5:40 pm

I used to spot at Newark for hours on end (always liked the view from the virgin atlantic cargo parking lot). With the tight security in place around Newark I've had to channel my love for spotting to spending countless hours here on A-net. Oh well, at least I found an alternative.
 
Flying Belgian
Posts: 1906
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Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 5:45 pm

That's a pitty for you guys... SAD !!

Let's hope the situation improves soon.

FB.
Life is great at 41.000 feet...
 
jamman
Posts: 475
Joined: Mon May 21, 2007 4:33 am

Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 5:52 pm

Sorry to hear all you guys in the states have a rough time spotting, you would think it would be in the interest of airports to create viewing parks, atleast they would then know where all the spotters are!

Regards,
Phoning it in from a place with no phones.
 
MidnightMike
Posts: 2810
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Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 5:56 pm

Quoting FLYiCRJ (Thread starter):
Ive been photographing aircraft at EWR for 4 years now, unfortuantly none of my photos passed the A.net screening tests. However, every time I go to shoot pictures at EWR I get kicked out and warned. The other day I recieved a police report in the mail about my "suspicious activities". I go to the Ikea parking lot and get kicked out...go into their glass cafeteria (great view of 4L and 4R arrivals and departures) and get kicked out...I pull of on the bridge before 4L and 4R and get chased away...I pull into parking lots just before the 22 runways and get chased away.....I pull over on the turnpike and 5 squad cars pull up...now if i really need help or it was an emergency, I would be sitting their all night without anyone coming. I know they are on high alert with terrorism and homeland security, and I appreciate the fact that people are watching around the airports, but I am a 17 yr old aviation enthusiast, and when I go to the airport I have a camera in my hands..not a RPG or a anti-aircraft gun. So can any of you EWR spotters give me some good places to spot without running into trouble with law enforcement.

Go down to the Police Station and speak with the on-shift supervisor, bring down some of your photos to show them your passion of your hobby. Speak with your local congress-person, once again, explain the passion for your hobby.

You said that you are 17 years old, does your school have some sort of Photographers club? Perhaps you can have a teacher write a letter of reference for you?

Unfortunately, the general public is not familar with aircraft-watchers, so, the education of the general public is required.

If you visit the Police Station, tell them I am going to Ikea on xxx Date & at xxx time, I am driving xxxx Car, etc....

This is what I would do if I enjoyed doing something that was not against the law and was running into interference.
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oly720man
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Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 6:07 pm

Quoting MidnightMike (Reply 7):

Unfortunately, the general public is not familar with aircraft-watchers, so, the education of the general public is required.

Should get this and see the "Cleared for Take off" bit. Lots of ORD action, from a few years ago admittedly, but with a pilot EXPLICITLY stating that people like to go to airports to watch the planes. Maybe people should be told....

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...32-7230232?v=glance&s=dvd&n=507846
wheat and dairy can screw up your brain
 
CV747
Posts: 166
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Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 6:17 pm

MidnightMike is right.
I did the same in CDG last week-end. We went to the MP and asked them if we could take pictures of aircraft and where we were allowed and where not. Worked fine and we were left alone ever after. (BTW, Does not work in Italy!)
 
MidnightMike
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Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 6:26 pm

Quoting CV747 (Reply 9):
MidnightMike is right.
I did the same in CDG last week-end. We went to the MP and asked them if we could take pictures of aircraft and where we were allowed and where not. Worked fine and we were left alone ever after. (BTW, Does not work in Italy!)

I was with a buddy in Seattle sometime ago, and he wanted to take some photos in a secured place, I went up to the Security guard showed the guard my ID card and asked if it was ok to take some photos, worked like a charm....
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B707Stu
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Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 7:58 pm

Quoting COEWRNJ (Reply 3):
FLYiCRJ,
I totally feel for you. Every time I try to spot over at the IKEA I get chased away. I've had them take down the information from my DL as well as my license plate number. Nothing ever came of it but they are real ass holes. It's the world we live in.. I just keep trying and some times I luck out and other times I don't.

Good Luck!

Welcome to "the list." I don't know if you've flown lately but if you're a spotter and have info taken you are often placed on the government "list." Meaning, you'll be stopped when boarding outside the US coming into the US. THat's been my experience though I was apparently put on "the list" because the last time I entered the UK the immigration officer didn't like the fact I answered her honestly. Very odd these times we live in.
 
Udo
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Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 8:06 pm

Quoting B707Stu (Reply 11):
Welcome to "the list." I don't know if you've flown lately but if you're a spotter and have info taken you are often placed on the government "list." Meaning, you'll be stopped when boarding outside the US coming into the US.

I have already been checked several times at different occasions by police and airport police in the US. Once a NWA flight was delayed by some minutes just because a woman didn't like my binoculars. And in Septemper last year I was called and questioned by Homeland Security at MSP prior to my departure to AMS after another lady had seen me using my binoculars on a LAX-MSP flight. I'm sure I have been put on certain "lists" but had no trouble at all when entering the US in April.


Regards
Udo
Me & You & a Plane Named Blue...
 
Twistedwhisper
Posts: 689
Joined: Mon Aug 18, 2003 11:52 pm

Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 8:24 pm

Quoting Udo (Reply 12):
Once a NWA flight was delayed by some minutes just because a woman didn't like my binoculars.

I begin to realise now why people on the UA flight from Louisville, KY to O'hare was upset over my palmtop with GPS...

Anyway, shouldn't this thread be in the Aviation Hobby or Avaiation Photo section?
Read between the lines.
 
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tjwgrr
Posts: 2002
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Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 11:33 pm

Quoting MidnightMike (Reply 7):
Go down to the Police Station and speak with the on-shift supervisor, bring down some of your photos to show them your passion of your hobby.

LOL- you're dealing with the Port Authority PD. They'll probably still tell you to get lost and don't ever come back. Elizabeth PD isn't any better. My brother-in-law and I have had numerous run-ins with both agencies....

The only "success" my brother-in-law has recently had is in the Virgin Atlantic Cargo area parking lot. (Oh yes, we've been busted there too a number of times.) Go when it's busy- i.e. cars parked in the VS lot, lots of coming and going of other vehicles. Park in a parking space, DO NOT get out of your car. Not good for photos, but if you lay low, you may be able to sit there awhile. Getting out of your car and standing is a guaranteed way to get kicked out- PAPD patrols the fence & VS Cargo has cameras monitoring their parking lot.

Otherwise, sorry to say it's futile. My only other suggestion is to find a place a short distance away from the immediate EWR perimeter and spot from there.
Direct KNOBS, maintain 2700' until established on the localizer, cleared ILS runway 26 left approach.
 
MidnightMike
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Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2003 10:07 am

Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Wed Aug 03, 2005 11:39 pm

Quoting Tjwgrr (Reply 14):
LOL- you're dealing with the Port Authority PD. They'll probably still tell you to get lost and don't ever come back. Elizabeth PD isn't any better. My brother-in-law and I have had numerous run-ins with both agencies....

The only "success" my brother-in-law has recently had is in the Virgin Atlantic Cargo area parking lot. (Oh yes, we've been busted there too a number of times.) Go when it's busy- i.e. cars parked in the VS lot, lots of coming and going of other vehicles. Park in a parking space, DO NOT get out of your car. Not good for photos, but if you lay low, you may be able to sit there awhile. Getting out of your car and standing is a guaranteed way to get kicked out- PAPD patrols the fence & VS Cargo has cameras monitoring their parking lot.

Otherwise, sorry to say it's futile. My only other suggestion is to find a place a short distance away from the immediate EWR perimeter and spot from there.

I used to live in New York & worked out of JFK airport for about 5 years. Saying all that, it is worth trying, just like anybody else, the Port Authority are human. (sometimes)

The next thing is to contact your local congress-person, if you write a letter, they are probably going to tell you about Airport Security, when you get that letter, visit your local Congress-Person.

Once again, if it was a hobby of mine & somebody told me that I can not do it anymore, I would do all possible for the right to do so, rather than just giving up...
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jacobin777
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Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Thu Aug 04, 2005 12:09 am

Fortunately, here @ SFO, there is a park called BayShore park, right next to the airport......though the airport gestapo has put up a fence in certain parts of the taxiway (parallel to the 1's), it still not that bad.....and many people come to spot, etc...

the Millbrae police show up occasionally, but as long as one isn't doing anything illegal, they don't tend to bother anyone...
"Up the Irons!"
 
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United_fan
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RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Thu Aug 04, 2005 12:34 am

Don't feel bad,I have been kicked out of ROC 3 times . Once the cop had his hand on his Glock like I was some kind of criminal . He stated that the signs say 'No Trespassing',I said that means on the other side of the fence. To which I was told to leave or you'll be arrested. You see cops don't like it when people know their rights and stand up for them . They like little pu$$y's who cower and do whatever they're told .
Last year I was sitting in my car and a cop pulled up and asked the usual questions. Whn I told him what I was doing I was given a look like I had 3 heads. Why on earth would someone want to watch planes ?

But that's okay,I found 2 new spots off airport property that are deserted during the weekends and are good for shots after 3 pm !
I even got 3 accepted !

[Edited 2005-08-03 17:37:27]
Champagne For My Real Friends,and Real Pain For My Sham Friends
 
FutureFO
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Joined: Sat Oct 06, 2001 10:58 pm

RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Thu Aug 04, 2005 1:05 am

Lets see in MKE we have a spotters park at the end of the runway. DCA also has a spotters park more or less. But at EWR I have done photos from inside the terminal with noone approaching me.


Sean from MCO and MKE
I Don't know where I am anymore
 
BigOrange
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RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Thu Aug 04, 2005 2:11 am

Welcome to my world FLYiCRJ

I've not spent any time spotting at EWR for 2 years, since I got kicked out of IKEA and the film confiscated from my camera.

I usually go out to LGA now, but even out there at Plane View Park, I've been interrogated by the cops.

Next time I go to EWR, I'm going to go to the police station and ask. I did that the first time I went there after I moved here and was given a good explanation about my right to spot aircraft from the parking lot.
The police station is right behind Signature, just in case you're not familiar with it!
 
ikramerica
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RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Thu Aug 04, 2005 2:21 am

Quoting MaverickM11 (Reply 1):
Unfortunately it's the government, and they're all mentally retarded and immune to reason so no matter what you're screwed.

Well, the 9/11 terrorists and associates spent many years photographing landmarks and airports from all angles, often just as "picnickers" with full picnic gear, looking nothing more than tourists. Sad, but true.

So calling people retarded is a little strong. Over reacting, yes. If they question you, then run your ID, then they should let you keep on doing it.

But, sorry, being 17 is not proof you are harmless. So many bombers have been 17, so many murders committed by 17 year olds...
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
FutureFO
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RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Thu Aug 04, 2005 3:00 am

Also many suicide bombers are younger than that. Trying to give their family honor. But then again the 9/11 hijackers were in their 20's-40's.


Sean from MCO and MKE
I Don't know where I am anymore
 
visityyj
Posts: 380
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RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Thu Aug 04, 2005 5:50 am

Well, the 9/11 terrorists and associates spent many years photographing landmarks and airports from all angles, often just as "picnickers" with full picnic gear, looking nothing more than tourists. Sad, but true.

Source please. And not Tom Ridge's speech thank you, something a bit more tenable.
 
B744F
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RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Thu Aug 04, 2005 5:55 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 20):
Well, the 9/11 terrorists and associates spent many years photographing landmarks and airports from all angles, often just as "picnickers" with full picnic gear, looking nothing more than tourists. Sad, but true.

That's a load of nonsense. They went to flight schools, used MS flight simulator, and went to strip clubs in vegas after their training in some middle eastern country
 
727LOVER
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RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Thu Aug 04, 2005 7:31 am

Quoting Tjwgrr (Reply 14):
LOL- you're dealing with the Port Authority PD.

The part that is confusing to me is that PA runs all 3 NYC airports. I've heard LGA and JFK are way more tolerable. Is this true? If yes, then WHY? What's up EWR's butt?


Edited to add:

If flying CO, has anyone had trouble spot/photo in Term C?

[Edited 2005-08-04 00:33:54]
Love Trumps Hate
 
FLYiCRJ
Topic Author
Posts: 54
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 3:57 am

RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Thu Aug 04, 2005 8:23 am

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 24):
The part that is confusing to me is that PA runs all 3 NYC airports. I've heard LGA and JFK are way more tolerable

You got that right 727Lover....when me and my friend spot at JFK...we are practically on the runways and taxiways without being bothered. In fact we were standing on top of a snow mound in the parking lot of the International customs and gate security buiding for 3 hours, and no-one said a word to us!!
 
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tjwgrr
Posts: 2002
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RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Thu Aug 04, 2005 10:33 pm

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 24):
The part that is confusing to me is that PA runs all 3 NYC airports. I've heard LGA and JFK are way more tolerable. Is this true? If yes, then WHY? What's up EWR's butt?

The PAPD are totally intolerant at EWR. Perhaps their post commander is really gung ho?

Are they still patrolling the EWR perimeter with the S-76?

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Brian Futterman

Direct KNOBS, maintain 2700' until established on the localizer, cleared ILS runway 26 left approach.
 
727LOVER
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RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Thu Aug 04, 2005 10:52 pm

Quoting FLYiCRJ (Thread starter):
The other day I received a police report in the mail about my "suspicious activities".

If you don't mind, could you share the text of what you received? I'm very curious.  Smile
Love Trumps Hate
 
FLYiCRJ
Topic Author
Posts: 54
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 3:57 am

RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Thu Aug 04, 2005 11:12 pm

Quoting Tjwgrr (Reply 26):
Are they still patrolling the EWR perimeter with the S-76?

Yes, everytime i go...i see that helicopter buzzing around the airport...when I listen on my scanner...its constantly talking to the tower. I would if the helicopter bothers airline pilots on departures and arrivals??
 
BigOrange
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RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Fri Aug 05, 2005 12:03 am

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 24):
The part that is confusing to me is that PA runs all 3 NYC airports. I've heard LGA and JFK are way more tolerable. Is this true? If yes, then WHY? What's up EWR's butt?

It's probably something to do with the fact that one of the 9/11 flights left from EWR. They probably got their a--es kicked for that, plus the fact that a lot of their colleagues died in the WTC.

Most of the cops at LGA are more tolerable, however there is one sergeant who isn't. Luckily the lieutenant is very tolerant and understanding of the hobby.
 
mikephotos
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Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2000 12:52 am

RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Fri Aug 05, 2005 12:09 am

Quoting Tjwgrr (Reply 26):
Are they still patrolling the EWR perimeter with the S-76?

They do perimeter runs around JFK daily also, for a while now.

Mike
 
ltbewr
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RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Fri Aug 05, 2005 12:22 am

Other factors as to the paranoia as to EWR is that is not only a major airport itself, but it is adjacent to: 1) a major seaport (Port Newark/Elizabeth, one of the largest on the East coast of the USA); 2) A major highway - the New Jersey Turnpike; 3) not far from major railway lines for pax and freight; 4) near the home of a major financial company (Prudential Insurance is in downtown Newark); 5) near major chemical and refining facilities. I do believe that the IKEA site is on Port Authority owned land, with developers having long term leaseholds on it.
As EWR was a departure point for some of the a/c's used in 9/11, has major US and international airlines operating there (including ELAL), that the public has access quite close to the range of 'Stinger' and other portable ground to air missles also adds to the harassment of even casual spotters.
 
BigOrange
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RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Fri Aug 05, 2005 2:06 am

Can anyone explain the advice given to me two years ago, that if I wanted to pursue the hobby without hassle, to go find a quiet side street in Elizabeth.

As I told the cop

1) I value my life and my car and sitting in a quiet side street in Elizabeth is not my idea of fun.

2) That is exactly what a terrorist would do to avoid suspicion and would integrate into the neighborhood easier.
 
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jetpixx
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RE: Spotting At EWR.....Impossible!

Fri Aug 05, 2005 3:25 am

Do yourself a favor - take a ride over the JFK and ride the AirTrain to your heart's content. I rode around on this for six hours before my flight and visited the food court in Terminal 1 and got great pics.

I realize this might not be totally convenient and probably would take an hour or so from EWR via public transportation, but you'll see the same, if not better.

Either that or hop a plane from LGA or JFK and get a cheap flight to FLL - then spot here or MIA, where it is extremely spotter friendly, with holes in the fences at MIA to get great photographs!