thelowfarehero
Posts: 139
Joined: Sat Aug 06, 2005 3:55 am

US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 7:19 am

Maybe someone can shed some light on this. But it seems that all flights that have gone through pre-clearance US Customs overseas ( Canada, Bahamas, Ireland, Mexico, etc...) all land at major int'l airports. Is there any reason why they couldnt service a non-int'l domestic airport?
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ACAfan
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Joined: Fri Apr 30, 2004 11:25 pm

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 7:23 am

RIC gets charter service to Grand Bahama. But RIC has its own customs and immigration centre.

I have never flown it so I am not sure where customs are done on that flight.
Freddie Laker ... May be at peace with his maker ... But he is a persona non grata ... with IATA
 
MAH4546
Posts: 24558
Joined: Wed Jan 24, 2001 1:44 pm

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 7:24 am

Quoting Thelowfarehero (Thread starter):
Maybe someone can shed some light on this. But it seems that all flights that have gone through pre-clearance US Customs overseas ( Canada, Bahamas, Ireland, Mexico, etc...) all land at major int'l airports. Is there any reason why they couldnt service a non-int'l domestic airport?

No. Even if a destination pre-clears, they still have to land at an international airport.

In 2002, Alaska Airlines announced SNA-YVR. The inaguaral flight actually took off, in which they discovered it couldn't land in Orange County because it is not a designated international airport. The flight diverted to Ontario. The route never even completed its inagural trip. AS and SNA did their homework on that one.

Also, Canada and the Bahamas have flights to non-major airports that are international...West Palm Beach, White Plains, Manchester (NH), Allentown, and others.

Quoting ACAfan (Reply 1):
RIC gets charter service to Grand Bahama. But RIC has its own customs and immigration centre.

That flight is long gone.

[Edited 2005-08-09 00:25:01]
a.
 
planemannyc
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Joined: Wed Aug 06, 2003 12:54 am

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 7:27 am

I don't see why not. Allentown, PA (ABE) gets service from YYZ on AC. Now, ABE is not at all big -- it is a domestic airport that seems to get an international billing because of the flights to Canada.

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COSPN
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Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2001 6:33 am

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 7:32 am

Its is much faster to arrive and deplane or connect.....Also if PAX is denied entry the gest go back home from the Airport in YYZ or wherever, get the papers in order and come back the next day...no rt ticket wasted..A great Idea, glad it is going to other places like Aruba..Ect..
 
exFATboy
Posts: 1887
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2003 11:15 am

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 7:32 am

Actually, they do all the time...for example, Air Canada and AC Jazz fly to several airports in the US which does not have C&I facilties. La Guardia's probably the biggest example.

In other cases, pre-clearance simply allows airlines (particularly Air Canada) to use domestic terminals rather than international. In cases where an airport may have a small C&I facility or the facility is overloaded, this can make things much easier on the passengers. For example, Air Canada flies into T7 at JFK - the C&I facility there backs up badly in the evening when the big BA and Cathay Pacific birds come in.
 
HKGKaiTak
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RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 12:57 pm

Do all Canadian airports that have US flights have this? I have gone thru this process at YYZ and YOW . . . it just allows the planes to land in at the domestic terminals, which makes it much easier.

And is it just me or does US Customs people based in Canada are "nicer" and not nearly as grumpy as those based in the States?

Btw many Aussies (esp old people) who fly YVR-SYD on the AC flight are often confused and sometimes upset (?) that they head straight into US Customs and not when they land at HNL.
4 Engines 4 LongHaul
 
MAH4546
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RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 1:20 pm

Quoting ExFATboy (Reply 5):
Actually, they do all the time...for example, Air Canada and AC Jazz fly to several airports in the US which does not have C&I facilties. La Guardia's probably the biggest example.

An airport does not need C&I facilities, but it does need to be a qualified international airport with immigration/customs services on-call.
a.
 
COSPN
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Joined: Fri Oct 12, 2001 6:33 am

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 2:12 pm

Btw many Aussies (esp old people) who fly YVR-SYD on the AC flight are often confused and sometimes upset (?) that they head straight into US Customs and not when they land at HNL.

Why would they be upset it is for PAX comfort ..one less thing to worry about on arrival..so nice to arrive and not wait in line wish we had Cadiadian Customs/ Immigeation pre-clearance in the US...but would involve 2 many locations...Ireland has Immigrations but not Customs right ??? Dont Understand that one..
 
squared
Posts: 352
Joined: Sun May 29, 2005 1:48 am

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 2:51 pm

Quoting HKGKaiTak (Reply 6):
Do all Canadian airports that have US flights have this?

No. YHZ has flights to BOS, JFK, & EWR, but does not have pre-clearance yet. It has been approved however, and will be instituted soon.

SQuared
 
Lt-AWACS
Posts: 2120
Joined: Mon Jan 14, 2002 2:40 am

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 3:03 pm

http://www.customs.gov/xp/cgov/toolbox/contacts/preclear_locations.xml

Lists 14 locations:

Canada
Calgary Preclearance
Calgary International Airport
P.O. Box 155
2000 Airport Road, Northeast
Calgary, Alberta, Canada T2E 6W5
Officer in Charge
Phone: 403-221-1734


Edmonton Preclearance
Edmonton International Airport
P.O. Box 9830
Edmonton, Alberta, Canada T5J 2T2
Officer in Charge
Phone: 780-890-4515


Montreal Preclearance
Montreal Trudeau International Airport
975 Romeo Vachon Boulevard, North
Room 109
Dorval, Quebec, Canada H4Y 1H1
Officer in Charge
Phone: 514-636-3859


Ottawa Preclearance
Ottawa MacDonald-Cartier International Airport
1000 Airport Road, Private
Gloucester, Ontario, Canada K1V 9B4
Officer in Charge
Phone: 613-523-8120


Toronto Preclearance
Lester B. Pearson International Airport
P.O. Box 115
Toronto AMF
Toronto, Ontario, Canada L5P 1A2
Officer in Charge
Phone: 905-676-2606


Vancouver Preclearance
Vancouver International Airport
International Terminal - Level 3
Room C3742.0
Richmond, British Columbia V7B 1Y7
Officer in Charge
Phone: 604-278-7422


Victoria Preclearance
c/o Victoria Preclearance
139 West First Street
Room 204
Port Angeles, Washington 98362
Officer in Charge
Phone: 250-384-1894


Winnipeg Preclearance
Winnipeg International Airport
2000 Wellington Avenue
P.O. Box 15
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada R3H 1C1
Officer in Charge
Phone: 204-783-2062


Caribbean
Bahamas - Freeport Preclearance
U.S. Customs & Border Protection
P.O. Box 22400
Ft. Lauderdale, Florida 33335
Officer in Charge
Phone: 242-352-7256


Bahamas - Nassau Preclearance
American Embassy - Nassau
P.O. Box 9009
Miami, Florida 33159
Officer in Charge
Phone: 242-377-8461


Bermuda Preclearance
U.S. Customs & Border Protection
5300 Hamilton Place
Washington, D.C. 20521-5300
Officer in Charge
Phone: 441-293-2560


Aruba
Aruba Preclearance
P.O. Box 592338
Miami, Florida 33159-2338
Officer in Charge
Phone: 011-297-588-7240



Ireland
U.S. Customs & Border Protection
c/o Aer-Rianta
Shannon Airport
Shannon, County Clare, Ireland
Officer in Charge
Phone: 011-353-6147-2297


U.S. Customs & Border Protection
Dublin International Airport
Pier B
Dubland, Ireland
Officer in Charge
Phone: 011-353-1814-4818

From the since amended law in 2001:
"Customs preclearance operations have been in existence since 1952.
There are presently 11 preclearance facilities operating in both Canada
and the Caribbean. Each facility is responsible for preclearing U.S.
bound passengers and their personal effects and baggage. In most cases,
U.S. bound passengers who are precleared in either Canada or the
Caribbean are permitted to arrive at a U.S. domestic facility and
either directly connect to a U.S. domestic flight or leave the airport.
Preclearance facilities primarily serve to facilitate low risk
passengers and to relieve passenger congestion at federal inspection
facilities in the United States. In fiscal year 2000, 12.5 million
passengers were precleared. This figure represents 15% of all
commercial air passengers cleared by Customs."

Ciao, and Hook 'em Horns,
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philb
Posts: 2645
Joined: Mon May 24, 1999 5:53 am

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 6:12 pm

Using the facility at SNN in April, we pre-cleared Immigration only.

After leaving our EIN flight at ORD we were led through the immigration booths without further checks but had to go into line for Customs and hand in the Customs form. US Citizens were singled out and placed in a different line -and were given longer checks.
 
exFATboy
Posts: 1887
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2003 11:15 am

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 10:35 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 7):
An airport does not need C&I facilities, but it does need to be a qualified international airport with immigration/customs services on-call.

True, and I believe LGA has C&I on call for arriving business jets.

Theoretically, you can have your C&I on-call, but as a practical matter, if you're going to run frequent international arrivals, you need to have arrival areas physically configured to run C&I. Many smaller US airports (and even some bigger ones, like LGA) simply don't have this, and since most of them only receive int'l flights from Canada, pre-clearance makes much more sense.

Speaking of LGA, barring a huge capital project there's simply nowhere to put an arrival hall, even if PANYNJ wanted to. Which, of course, they don't, since Kennedy and Newark are both amply equipped for international arrivals.
 
MyOthrCarsA777
Posts: 52
Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2005 12:59 pm

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 10:54 pm

Quoting HKGKaiTak (Reply 6):
Do all Canadian airports that have US flights have this?

Off the top of my head, YYT, YHZ, YYG, YQB, YKF, YXU, YQT, YQR, YXE, YLW, YKA, and maybe YXY all have non-stop service from Canada to the U.S. and none of those airports have U.S. Customs pre-clearance.
 
airbusfanyyz
Posts: 1410
Joined: Tue Oct 29, 2002 1:01 am

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Tue Aug 09, 2005 11:02 pm

Quoting HKGKaiTak (Reply 6):
And is it just me or does US Customs people based in Canada are "nicer" and not nearly as grumpy as those based in the States?

God Bless Canada! Big grin

Cheers,
Kaz
 
fedexexpress
Posts: 275
Joined: Thu Jun 09, 2005 9:35 am

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Wed Aug 10, 2005 9:25 am

IND needs a new customs building!!!!!
"Its not what your country can do for you its what you can do for your country" JFK
 
sebwhite
Posts: 390
Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2003 11:35 pm

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:06 am

MyOthrCarsA777 - no YXY service to U.S.
 
MyOthrCarsA777
Posts: 52
Joined: Tue Jul 19, 2005 12:59 pm

RE: US Overseas Customs And Non-Int'l Airports

Wed Aug 10, 2005 1:06 pm

Quoting Sebwhite (Reply 16):
MyOthrCarsA777 - no YXY service to U.S.

I was thinking of the FRA-YXY-ANC-FRA route flown by Condor during the summer. Even if fifth freedom rights weren't given to Condor to allow the flying of passengers on only the YXY-ANC leg, wouldn't passengers travelling YXY-ANC-FRA have to clear U.S. customs at some point along the way?