FlyPNS1
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DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Wed Aug 10, 2005 9:59 pm

DL has applied with the DOT to provide service from LAX to CZM and SLC to CZM. The flights would be operated on 2x weekly (SaSu) using the 738 starting in March 2006.

http://dmses.dot.gov/docimages/p81/341787.pdf

The SLC-CZM route is no surprise, but the LAX-CZM route is quite odd. First, I didn't think traffic from LAX to CZM would be that strong as most in LAX would head to the western mexican resorts (SJD, MZT, PVT, etc). Second, DL has shown very little interest in growing LAX over the last few years. It'll be interesting to see if the LAX-CZM route actually comes to fruition.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Wed Aug 10, 2005 10:03 pm

They drop LAX-MEX, yet want to launch LAX-CZM?!? It'll take some time before I can see any sense in that. But SLC-CZM sounds like a good idea, seeing as how DL is constanstantly adding more Mexican destinations out of SLC.
 
commavia
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Wed Aug 10, 2005 10:05 pm

I agree -- SLC-CZM makes perfect sense, but LAX-CZM is a surprise. DL has been shrinking at LAX for five years, and they are now a bit player in the market relative to AA and UA. However, if DL feels that they can fill these weekly 738 flights LAX-CZM with almost all O&D customers and produce a premium load/yield mix because of their monopoly on nonstop service on the route, then good for them for recognizing this opportunity and jumping on it before another airline does.
 
BigGSFO
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Wed Aug 10, 2005 10:07 pm

I am wondering if LAX-CZM will be a Song flight...
 
MAH4546
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Wed Aug 10, 2005 10:14 pm

Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 3):
I am wondering if LAX-CZM will be a Song flight...

No, it won't be, it is a 737-800.

Cozumel has seen a lot of growth in recent years. From just Charlotte and Houston and now...Newark, Philadelphia, Atlanta, Denver, Chicago, Los Angeles, Dallas, Salt Lake City, Detroit...impressive. And AA is tentativly planning Miami flights to launch next February (they already have the route authority). And, I wouldn't be shocked to see US/HP to Phoenix.

The thing with Cozumel is the yields...very strong.
a.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:25 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 4):
The thing with Cozumel is the yields...very strong.

How much better off is "Cancun-South", as Ryanair would call it, with regards to the yields? Those two cities are not that far apart.
 
MAH4546
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:30 pm

Quoting DAL767400ER (Reply 5):
How much better off is "Cancun-South", as Ryanair would call it, with regards to the yields? Those two cities are not that far apart.

Significantly.

To put it in simple terms: the rich go to Cozumel, the masses go to Cancun.

There is also Merida, but Merida has not grown as a tourist destination for Americans, which is unfortunate, because, IMO, it is the most beautiful city in the Yucatan. Not touristy at all...for now...but a lot to see. Only transborder service is Continental to Houston and AeroMexico to Miami.
a.
 
padcrasher
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:36 pm

LAX Nomenclature

Largest Carrier - 15% Market Share

"Bit Player" - 8% Market Share
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:37 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 6):
Significantly.

To put it in simple terms: the rich go to Cozumel, the masses go to Cancun.

I see. No wonder AA wants to launch a direct South Beach - Cozumel flight Big grin .
 
ord
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:42 pm

In the request Delta says they want to add to their growing list of Mexican destinations served nonstop from SLC. They mention serving Mexico City from SLC but as far as I know they don't offer this service nor do they plan to.
 
tinpusher007
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:43 pm

DL can't make LAX-MEX work when AM is their codeshare partner and they start up LAX-CZM? I am positively perplexed. WTF? I guess thats why the big-wigs make all that money.
"Flying isn't inherently dangerous...but very unforgiving of carelessness, incapacity or neglect."
 
MAH4546
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:51 pm

Quoting ORD (Reply 9):
In the request Delta says they want to add to their growing list of Mexican destinations served nonstop from SLC. They mention serving Mexico City from SLC but as far as I know they don't offer this service nor do they plan to.

They serve SLC-MEX via AM codeshare.

Quoting TinPusher007 (Reply 10):
DL can't make LAX-MEX work when AM is their codeshare partner and they start up LAX-CZM? I am positively perplexed. WTF? I guess thats why the big-wigs make all that money.

I fail to see what is so hard to understand. LAX-CZM is a strong yielding tourist market, LAX-MEX is a crowded and served by three other airlines with mutliple daily flights.

And, besides, contrary to popular belief, LAX isn't MEX's biggest transborder market in terms of local traffic (it is in terms of seats per day). Both New York City and Miami have more local traffic to Mexico City than Los Angeles.
a.
 
DAL767400ER
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Wed Aug 10, 2005 11:53 pm

Quoting ORD (Reply 9):
They mention serving Mexico City from SLC but as far as I know they don't offer this service nor do they plan to.

They do, via their codeshare with MEX. Though if you only want to count destinations served by DL or DCI, you still get an impressively growing list, with CUN, SJD, PVR, MZT and now CZM, with all of them rather new markets.
 
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EA CO AS
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Thu Aug 11, 2005 12:01 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 4):
The thing with Cozumel is the yields...very strong.

Exactly. While CUN is loaded with traffic - many on low yield bulk and wholesale fares - CZM is a high-yield market. I've been telling our planning people for 2 years now that our (AS) existing LAX-CUN flight would be an even bigger moneymaker if we added a CZM tag onto it. LAX-CUN-CZM/CZM-CUN-LAX would just about guarantee full planes and higher yields each and every time.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
MAH4546
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Thu Aug 11, 2005 12:10 am

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 13):
Exactly. While CUN is loaded with traffic - many on low yield bulk and wholesale fares - CZM is a high-yield market. I've been telling our planning people for 2 years now that our (AS) existing LAX-CUN flight would be an even bigger moneymaker if we added a CZM tag onto it. LAX-CUN-CZM/CZM-CUN-LAX would just about guarantee full planes and higher yields each and every time.

Until you factor in the added take off/landing operation costs of flying a 737 for a 36 mile, 15 in air minute tag-on segment.
a.
 
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EA CO AS
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Thu Aug 11, 2005 12:16 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 14):
Until you factor in the added take off/landing operation costs of flying a 737 for a 36 mile, 15 in air minute tag-on segment.

Which can be offset by capacity-controlling the mix of inventory on both the local LAX-CUN and CZM legs to allow much more of the higher-yield traffic.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
tinpusher007
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Thu Aug 11, 2005 1:59 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 11):
I fail to see what is so hard to understand. LAX-CZM is a strong yielding tourist market, LAX-MEX is a crowded and served by three other airlines with mutliple daily flights.

Point taken...and its good to see DL going after high-yielding premium traffic, but it just seems odd. When have you known them to abandon the crowded "mainstream" routes. One word...FLORIDA!
"Flying isn't inherently dangerous...but very unforgiving of carelessness, incapacity or neglect."
 
EddieDude
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RE: DL To Fly LAX-CZM And SLC-CZM

Thu Aug 11, 2005 2:31 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 11):
They serve SLC-MEX via AM codeshare.

However, AM's 3 or 4x weekly non-stop MEX-SLC service is no longer in the system. I don't know if they are going to suspend the flights for a few months or what.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738