as739x
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United 747 On Tail At SFO

Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:29 pm

There is a United 747 on its tail here at SFO. Its over at "Super Bay" hanger. I can get out of the office to get pics, but local spotter could see it from the bay side. Apparently some pins were not in place and the plane was put into flight mode by the mechanics. Let you knwo more when I get it!

ASSFO
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
Gary2880
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:35 pm

Just saw it on the news, one in the new colours as well, doesn't look healthy!
Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel :- Samuel Johnson
 
QQFLYER28
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:37 pm

Quoting AS739X (Thread starter):

I just saw it on Channel 2, looks like it is rotating. Someone is going to catch hell for it.
 
gamps
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:37 pm

Just heard it on Morning News - they said it is a "strange sight".

It was a NRT bound flight which returned due to hydraulic problems yesterday. At mid-night the tail started sinking apparently - it was so slow that crews did not realize that tail is sinking. They are now placing airbags to lift it.

That is the summary of what I heard on KGO.
 
fraspotter
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:42 pm

Anybody have any pics?
"Taking off is optional. It’s landing that’s mandatory."
 
as739x
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:46 pm

FRASpotter: My friend got some on his phone, but there not good quality. Some of out mechanics may go over there in a little while, but the plane may be upright by then. I'll search around.

One of our crew that just arrived from the hotel said you can see it ffrom the freeway!

ASSFO
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
air2gxs
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:47 pm

I've seen this happen twice. Both times the body gear retracted inadvertantly due to procedures not followed.
 
juventus
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:48 pm

Just saw it on CNN. Boy, UAL just can't catch a brake. I'm sure Jay Leno and D. Letterman will be on top of that one.
 
UA744Flagship
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Tue Aug 16, 2005 10:49 pm

Jeebus. And it had to be in the n/c as well. Great for PR.

/// U N I T E D is R I S I N G


(gotta make the situation a little light-hearted  Wink )

Link with pics:
http://abclocal.go.com/kgo/story?section=local&id=3353533





[Edited 2005-08-16 15:50:48]
no wire hangers!
 
as739x
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 12:05 am

The tail just sinking doesn't sound right!

Accoring to some UA mechanics our supervisor talked to, the plane didn't have by-pass pin in the gear while doing a gear inspection. When the gear lever was place in the retract position the plane went into flight mode. Which make more sense and has happened before.

ASSFO
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 12:15 am

This happens more often than you think. Usually, someone moved the CG aft. This could have been done by fuel transfer.

Maybe following the checklist is in order here?

Now they have to be very careful to right the airplane without damaging it.

BTW, this also happened recently at PDX to a Capital Cargo B-727-200F.
 
air2gxs
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 1:07 am

Putting the gear handle up will not place the aircraft in air mode. Pulling circuit breakers or installing targets/slugs will do that. But placing an aircraft in air mode will not cause the aircraft to do anything with the gear.

What MAY have happened is that maintenance was looking for a hydraulic leak and failed to pin the gear. The handle was moved into the up position and the bodygear retracted, or began to retract. An empty B747 will tip to the tail if the body gear retracts and the front end is not ballasted.

Been there, seen that, can write the book.
 
TonyBurr
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 1:22 am

I bet someone will be out on their tail after this!
 
Web
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 1:42 am

Quoting QQFLYER28 (Reply 2):
looks like it is rotating.

Yeah, but the wings are drooping down, which makes it look kind of wierd.

How much damage is usually sustained in this kind of accident?
 
dan2002
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 1:47 am

Quoting Web (Reply 13):
Yeah, but the wings are drooping down, which makes it look kind of wierd.

How much damage is usually sustained in this kind of accident?

If the a/c was actucally resting on the tail, probally fuselage skin, rear pressure bulkhead and internal structure damage at worst. But I believe RPB damage is taken very seriously after a crash of a 747 in Asia, due to the RPB failing.


-Dan
A guy asks 'What's Punk?'. I kick over a trash can and its punk. He knocks over a trash can and its trendy.
 
luv2fly
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 1:53 am

Well guess it is true that UA is top heavy when it comes to upper management.
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
AlitaliaMD11
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:10 am

I hope the plane doesn't get written off because it is the only B747-400 in new colors!
No Vueling No Party
 
Superfly
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:14 am

Does this 744 fly flight 770?
I'll be pissed if there is an equipment change on my flight next week!
Bring back the Concorde
 
air2gxs
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:15 am

Both times I saw this happen the APU doors were replaced and an aft drain mast. Some substructure around the APU doors was also repaired. We also inpected the maingear attach fittings.
 
ourboeing
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:15 am

Here is a video:

http://cbs5.com/video/?cid=130

OURBOEING
 
akelley728
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:28 am

Quoting OURBOEING (Reply 19):
Here is a video:

http://cbs5.com/video/?cid=130

OURBOEING

You can hear someone towards the end say that the landing gear wasn't pinned, confirming what was said earlier. They give a closeup of the aft fuselage right at the end and it doesn't look like there is too much, if any damage to the fuselage, but I'm sure they'll be checking throughly.
 
BigGSFO
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:32 am

 
Superfly
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:45 am

I have an image in my head of a cigar-chomping George Kennedy cussing out the ground crew guys for not pinning the landing gear. Big grin
Bring back the Concorde
 
as739x
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 2:53 am

AZMD11....don't be silly. This will not be a write off. The damage is not going to be that bad. Specially if it slowly went down like witness claim. This happen often like boom said!

ASSFO
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
WesternDC1010
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 3:27 am

I can just hear someone shouting... 'Get Me Patroni!'

- Ron
Western DC-10-10
Western Airlines - The Only Way To Fly
 
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N328KF
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 3:33 am

Quoting WesternDC1010 (Reply 24):
I can just hear someone shouting... 'Get Me Patroni!'

Not me. Were it me in that situation, I would shout, "Get me Patrón!"
When they call the roll in the Senate, the Senators do not know whether to answer 'Present' or 'Not guilty.' -Theodore Roosevelt
 
n471wn
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 3:34 am

The plane is N196UA.....
 
roots
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 3:51 am

I just came back from Bayfront Park. The airplane is visible from there but due to the distance and terrible heat haze, I couldn't get any worthy photo. I also tried the airtrain terminal but the view from there was blocked. I'll post the photo later.
 
roots
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 3:57 am

Here's a shot:

http://home.earthlink.net/~adotnet/ua_tail.jpg
 
StarGoldLHR
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 4:12 am

Anyone know which a/c this is ?
So far in 2008 45 flights and Gold already. JFK, IAD, LGA, SIN, HKG, NRT, AKL, PPT, LAX still to book ! Home Airport LCY
 
as739x
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 4:13 am

I just came back from over there. There is no visible damage to the back side. No ripples or anything. There is however a leak of some kind on the right side behind the wing. Looks like its hydraulic cause I could not smell any fuel odor. They are currently strapping the front section via crane so they can lower it with the inflatable in the back. Looks like in fact the nose gear is not locked. The main gear dorrs were in a slightly restracted position. It looks like the nose gear is going to be locked, then the mains jacket up to they can be locked. Let you know when I hear more.

AASFO
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
bazzaldonbond
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 4:26 am

THE AIRCRAFT IS N196UA
 
CWAFlyer
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 5:15 am

Quoting Superfly (Reply 17):
Does this 744 fly flight 770?
I'll be pissed if there is an equipment change on my flight next week!

You'll be even more pissed if the flight cancels instead.
 
Superfly
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 5:32 am

Quoting CWAFlyer (Reply 32):
You'll be even more pissed if the flight cancels instead.

True!
Bring back the Concorde
 
Jetter2
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 5:36 am

When a aircraft rolls on its tail is it really that damaging to it? Once they wright it again, is alot of structural intregrity lost or something? I figure that lowering it back to the nose should reaisly remedy the problem, as when they do the VMU tests, they practically drag the tail around.
 
ua777222
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 6:18 am

Just got off the phone with my uncle.

It appears as though this aircraft will be out of service for some time. He hasn't taken time to go and inspect the aircraft as there is a supposed water leak in one of the warehouses so once all that is taken care of he'll be over there and will update me.

Take care,

Matt
"It wasn't raining when Noah built the ark."
 
jeb94
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 6:20 am

There are inspections that are required but usually the damage isn't that severe. It'll be out of service for several days but will probably be back flying by the end of the month, depending on what all is found during the inspections. A gentle sag onto the tail does do damage but not a huge amount. It sure looks spectacular though!
 
philb
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 6:30 am

New B747 sub type B747-422TW

Tail draggers are best!
 
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chrisnh
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 6:37 am

I'm shocked that UAL gave the media access to film that TV piece. You know, 'the media' that can't tell a 747 from a tangerine. 'The media' that no one pays any attention to any more because they are (A) late with (B) incorrect news.

Chris in NH
 
Superfly
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 7:00 am

Quoting ChrisNH (Reply 38):
I'm shocked that UAL gave the media access to film that TV piece.

Well it's kind of hard to hide a 747-400 laying on it's tail out in the open. People are going to ask questions and speculate. That can be more damaging.
Bring back the Concorde
 
tfsphoto
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 7:01 am

Heres another shot:



Lew
 
B707Stu
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 7:36 am

Quoting Superfly (Reply 22):
I have an image in my head of a cigar-chomping George Kennedy cussing out the ground crew guys for not pinning the landing gear.

PERFECT. An airliner after my own heart!
 
smf757
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 8:32 am

Quoting WesternDC1010 (Reply 24):
can just hear someone shouting... 'Get Me Patroni!'

- Ron
Western DC-10-10

LOL
Gotta love that 757
 
aussieindc
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 8:35 am

You can just see all the red faces now!!!!!  Angry
 
AirTranTUS
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 10:44 am

In the ABC 7 video the reporter said that it was on its tail because the hydraulics in the tail section failed. Can anyone tell me how the hydraulics failing in the back can cause it to fall back on its tail??  Confused
I love ASO!
 
FlyingTexan
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 10:51 am

Quoting WesternDC1010 (Reply 24):
I can just hear someone shouting... 'Get Me Patroni!'

 rotfl 

Quoting N328KF (Reply 25):
Not me. Were it me in that situation, I would shout, "Get me Patrón!"

 rotfl  rotfl  rotfl  to the power of 3...
"Wouldn't your boss like to fly home nonstop at 4:30 on a Friday afternoon?" -Airline Exec to Congressional Staffer
 
TropicBird
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 12:04 pm

The story I heard is that they pinned the gear, but put the "body" gear pins in the "wrong hole" and then put the gear handle "up" to check for a hydraulic leak (on the pressure side of the gear retraction system). The body gear being unpinned allowed the body gear to begin to retract and the CG was now shifted too far aft and down it came. I understand it had over 100,000 lbs of fuel onboard and they were also transferring fuel when it happened.

A clue that they had put the gear in "retract" was the nose gear doors being open, they only open during the retract cycle (unless they were manually opened for gear pin access or ???) but I have not heard the official word as to what the actual chain of events were.
 
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jumbojim747
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 12:30 pm

When the PanAm aircraft that struck the lighting pilons on takeoff landed and everyone was out the aircraft started to sink backwards and ended up on its tail same as here.
It was not known to even Boeing that this would happen if part of the gear damaged or sheared off due to an accident.
Raising part of the main gear will result in the aircraft sitting on its tail.
Cheer
On a wing and a prayer
 
JC5280
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 12:52 pm

I have some up-close pictures that were sent to me by someone who works there. I think a mechanic took them but will send them to someone to post if someone can provide a hosting service for them.

J
 
apollo13
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RE: United 747 On Tail At SFO

Wed Aug 17, 2005 1:24 pm

I dont see why since it was OVER SEATTLE at the time, why did it not just divert to KSEA?!?!? Doesnt that make more sense that flying all the f*ck way back to SFO?