Boegas
Topic Author
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 9:34 pm

Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 2:29 am

Does anyone know why the "retro" Terminal 5 at JFK is closed and not in use?

and will it be in service again some day or was it closed permanently?
Regional collection supervisor for a box-company
 
TWFirst
Posts: 5752
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2000 5:30 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 2:32 am

There's a current thread here discussing jetBlue's plans to build a new terminal behind the historic Saarinen terminal. Terminal 5 is outdated and can't be used as is for a number of reasons.
An unexamined life isn't worth living.
 
AlitaliaMD11
Posts: 3704
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 5:19 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 3:00 am

Considering that it was the TWA terminal...


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Richard Austen



And Royal Jordanian another operator of the terminal moved to terminal 3 there really wasn't a need for it.

Jet Blue has used it as an overflow terminal with planes parked there and passengers being bussed to them.

Jet Blue will build there new terminal behind terminal 5 and use the historic terminal 5 as an entree.
No Vueling No Party
 
JFKviaPHX
Posts: 188
Joined: Tue Feb 24, 2004 1:31 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 4:12 am

When did they bus passengers to T5? I don't remember seeing that while working over there.

In order for T5 to be used and be efficient they needed to do a lot of work to it, inside and out. There were many problems that needed to be addressed before someone could run an operation out of there.
 
AlitaliaMD11
Posts: 3704
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 5:19 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 5:37 am

Quoting JFKviaPHX (Reply 3):
When did they bus passengers to T5?

I have seen it happen a couple of times. Jet Blue parks some of their planes on the tarmac and boards them there.
No Vueling No Party
 
SRT75
Posts: 204
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2005 2:42 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 5:45 am

T5 has been closed since TWA was bought out by AA. Jet Blue currently has the rights to use T5. They are planning construction of a "new" Terminal 5 which will incorporate some of the old T5.

T5 is a historical piece of architecture (don't know if it is "officially" a historic building). Therefore, the "spaceship" building will be preserved. Note from the picture in Post #2 that the TWA sign is STILL standing at T5!

I'm sure the boarded up T5 causes a lot of mixed feelings for former TWA employees.
 
Boegas
Topic Author
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 9:34 pm

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:04 am

I still don't understand why they have to build a new one instead of use the old one, it's sad such a great looking and famous building is just emty.

But who ownes the TWA building today?
Regional collection supervisor for a box-company
 
TWFirst
Posts: 5752
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2000 5:30 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:07 am

Quoting Boegas (Reply 6):
still don't understand why they have to build a new one instead of use the old one

1) It's too small
2) It doesn't have an adequate baggage system
3) It's too small
4) It's pretty, but not very functional or efficient

They can't significantly alter the main building and flight tubes because it's a legally protected landmark.
An unexamined life isn't worth living.
 
User avatar
STT757
Posts: 13200
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 1:14 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:11 am

Quoting Boegas (Reply 6):
I still don't understand why they have to build a new one instead of use the old one, it's sad such a great looking and famous building is just emty.

In a post 9-11 enviroment there's just no room for the huge equipment and space that the TSA uses today, it would require hundreds of Millions of Dollars to improve the situation. Instead B6 is going to build a brand new terminal behind T5 and use T5 for a club or something, it's cost prohibitive to bring the T-5 structure up to modern airport standards. The building was terribly over used by TWA, it out grew itself by the 1970s with Jumbo jets.

Quoting Boegas (Reply 6):

But who ownes the TWA building today?

The Port Authority..

One thing that I think gets lost on folks is just how small the structure actually is, it's the size of a restaraunt with two skinny tubs connecting to two other restaraunt sized structures.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
AlitaliaMD11
Posts: 3704
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 5:19 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:23 am

Quoting Boegas (Reply 6):
I still don't understand why they have to build a new one instead of use the old one, it's sad such a great looking and famous building is just emty.

They are going to keep the building, just add on behind it!

No Vueling No Party
 
BHMNONREV
Posts: 1209
Joined: Thu Aug 28, 2003 9:17 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:23 am

Quoting STT757 (Reply 8):
One thing that I think gets lost on folks is just how small the structure actually is, it's the size of a restaraunt with two skinny tubs connecting to two other restaraunt sized structures.

I would agree. As impressive as it is from the outside, the inside of the building left a lot to be desired. Certainly not designed to handle upwards of 20 Trans-Atlantic flights every day, with very small check-in and departure/gate areas. Customs and Immigration were a joke also. When this building was originally designed, there was no way to know of the massive explosion of air travel which was about to take place...

Still, it saddens me to think that the future view from those huge windows that overlooked the ramp will be of another terminal, instead of a twin-globed TWA 747....
 
User avatar
STT757
Posts: 13200
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 1:14 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:33 am

I would have loved it if they (the Port Authority) could have moved T-5 and the Oval section of Pan Am's World Port to a different part of the airport and convert them into museums with a decent hotel (Westin, Marriott, Hyatt etc..).

They could have pulled some old PA and TWA birds from the desert as well as move the Concorde from the Intrepid back to JFK for display.

They moved Newark's Historic Terminal One 1/2 Mile and incorporated it into a brand new Airport Administration/Police/rescue building.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
727LOVER
Posts: 6654
Joined: Tue Oct 09, 2001 12:22 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 6:59 am

Quoting AlitaliaMD11 (Reply 9):
They are going to keep the building, just add on behind it!

Then what becomes of T6? If T5 is too small and out-dated, isn't T6, opened in 1969(?) for National.
Love Trumps Hate
 
User avatar
STT757
Posts: 13200
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 1:14 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 7:10 am

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 12):
Then what becomes of T6? If T5 is too small and out-dated, isn't T6, opened in 1969(?) for National.

It will be torn down and a hard stand parking area will be built.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
kaitak744
Posts: 2086
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2005 1:32 pm

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 7:46 am

AlitaliaMD11, where did you get that picture?

Quoting STT757 (Reply 13):
Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 12):
Then what becomes of T6? If T5 is too small and out-dated, isn't T6, opened in 1969(?) for National.

It will be torn down and a hard stand parking area will be built.

The land at T-6 and the terminal area of T-5 will be torn down and used for a new T-5/6.
 
AlitaliaMD11
Posts: 3704
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 5:19 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 8:33 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 14):
AlitaliaMD11, where did you get that picture?

Google, but there are a couple of articales around that do have this picture. I think one in business weekly.
No Vueling No Party
 
exFATboy
Posts: 1887
Joined: Thu Jul 17, 2003 11:15 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:19 pm

Quoting 727LOVER (Reply 12):
Then what becomes of T6? If T5 is too small and out-dated, isn't T6, opened in 1969(?) for National.

T6 is outdated - although JetBlue has done a good job in remodeling and getting in new food/retail stores and the Oasis Spa, the building just feels, well, old inside. And JetBlue is nearing T6's limits.

(Of course, if you really want to see "outdated", look at Terminal 2!)

I believe that after the new T5 is completed, T6 will be torn down and replaced. Depending on how long that takes, it's possible that JetBlue may wind up occuping the new T6 as well.
 
jetblueatjfk
Posts: 1556
Joined: Sun Jan 02, 2005 4:42 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:29 pm

Well I hope later on they build a T-6. It will be weird when T6 in knocked down and T5 is jetBlue because The the airport is Terminals 1,2,3,4,5,7,8,9. And the PANYNJ said they want to get the airport down to I think 6 bigger terminals. But anyway so where will jetBlue passengers check-in. T5 is to small to check-in, will they build the check-in booths in the new terminal behind it and put some self check-in machines in the historic T5 along with a conference room and something else.

 airplane jetBlueAtJFK airplane 
 
User avatar
STT757
Posts: 13200
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 1:14 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 12:33 pm

Quoting JetBlueAtJFK (Reply 17):
And the PANYNJ said they want to get the airport down to I think 6 bigger terminals

That's why they only built 6 Airtrain terminals to serve 9 terminals, there are just too many terminals and they feel (rightfully so) that 6 Terminals is more than adequate. AA is consolidating into a single new terminal, B6 will consolidate T-6 and T-5 into a single new terminal, DL had plans (prior to 9-11) to tear down T-3 and consolidate their international flights into T4.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
kaitak744
Posts: 2086
Joined: Fri Jul 22, 2005 1:32 pm

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:07 pm

So, the new terminals are T1, T4, T5(future), and T8(future)

So that leaves T2, T3, and T7 still to be renovated (modernized). (since T9 will be with T8 and T6 will be with T5)

Any plans to renovate them^?
 
User avatar
STT757
Posts: 13200
Joined: Tue Mar 28, 2000 1:14 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:20 pm

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 19):
So that leaves T2, T3, and T7 still to be renovated

T7 under went a $200-400 Million Dollar renovation around 2000, it's in good shape for the amount of flights it handles.

As for T-2 and T-3 no chance, they are way too out dated and in-efficient to be modernized or renovated. DL stated they were going to spend something like $200 Million to improve the HVAC and baggage belts (both probably 40 years old) at T-3, however given their current situation I doubt that project has moved foward. It does not look as though DL will be investing in anything new for a long time in terms of facilities, if they do it would be in ATL but that's future speculation right now they have more pressing items to address.
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
User avatar
Revelation
Posts: 13849
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2005 9:37 pm

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:33 pm

In the other thread, it was pretty clear that the only commitment B6 made to T5 was to have a ticket counter or two there. The rest of T5 was left for some other unspecified use, such as a restaurant or a museum.
Inspiration, move me brightly! Light the song with sense and color.
Hold away despair, more than this I will not ask.
Faced with mysteries dark and vast, statements just seem vain at last.
Some rise, some fall, some climb, to get to Terrapin!
 
Fleet Service
Posts: 473
Joined: Wed Apr 12, 2000 11:58 am

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 1:52 pm

Quoting STT757 (Reply 13):
It will be torn down and a hard stand parking area will be built.

A sad day when that happens, National was a great airline.
Yes, I actually *do* work for an airline,how about you?
 
hawk44
Posts: 733
Joined: Mon Jan 10, 2005 3:54 pm

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Wed Aug 24, 2005 2:11 pm

Quoting STT757 (Reply 8):
One thing that I think gets lost on folks is just how small the structure actually is, it's the size of a restaraunt with two skinny tubs connecting to two other restaraunt sized structures.

I agree after seeing it for the first time I was shocked at how small the whole thing looked. It was nice to see the TWA sign still up though.

Hawk44
Never under estimate the power of US
 
Boegas
Topic Author
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 9:34 pm

RE: Why Is TWA Terminal 5 At JFK Not In Service?

Fri Aug 26, 2005 7:06 am

Next time I'll be in New York I´m gonna try to call the guy at PANYNJ (the one who's looks ater T5) and ask if he can open the building for a while so I can get some nice pictures  Smile ..... and if there's is enough time I´m gonna make a Mohito on a the bar, close my eyes in try to get the "retro"-feeling  Smile
Regional collection supervisor for a box-company