Springbok139
Topic Author
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US Carriers To South Africa?

Fri Sep 02, 2005 8:27 pm

I was wondering if any U.S. carrier is considering flights to South Africa.SAA have a few flights to the States and there are at least 4 flights a day from SA to the UK....are there really that few U.S. tourists interested in South Africa?
 
TonyBurr
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US Carriers To South Africa?

Fri Sep 02, 2005 8:46 pm

I do not think any of them are actively pursuing this route. With South African Airways coming into Star Alliance ( sometime this side of the next century) I would doubt UA would be considering it, althought they had the rights for the route.
 
tsnamm
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US Carriers To South Africa?

Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:31 pm

CO had some sort of "code share" with World Airways a few years ago with flights from EWR/JNB, in what was essentially a CO flight...I don't know if we still have the rights, but it would require a 777 for non-stop service, so I don't think it would happen anytime soon....
 
CV580Freak
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US Carriers To South Africa?

Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:35 pm

When you think about it Africa and the Middle East are hardly, if at all serviced by US registered airlines. Must be a huge potential.
One day you are the pigeon, the next the statue ...
 
flydubai
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US Carriers To South Africa?

Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:47 pm

Quoting CV580Freak (Reply 3):
When you think about it Africa and the Middle East are hardly, if at all serviced by US registered airlines. Must be a huge potential.

This is largely because of the geographical location of the Continents. Not many US airlines have planes with the sufficient range to reach the Middle East or part of Africa.

flyDUBAI
 
CXA330300
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US Carriers To South Africa?

Fri Sep 02, 2005 10:02 pm

AA: Codeshares with BA, not going to happen
SA)">UA: Star Alliance with SA, LH, too poor to make it happen
DL: Codeshares with SA
NW: Codeshares with KL
CO: Nothing much stopping them (they dont codeshare on any flights to South Africa), they just need more planes.
US: Codeshares with SA, LH, *A, no planes, no money anyway
AC/AA/UA/DL/B6/WN/US*/CO*/FI/BA/IB/AF/SK/LX/Sabena*/TK/LY/SA/MN/SW/AM/CE*/CX/CA/MU/JL/SQ/TG/MH/KA/5J
 
jmc1975
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US Carriers To South Africa?

Fri Sep 02, 2005 10:05 pm

It's too bad American hasn't jumped in and served MIA-CPT-JNB-CPT-MIA with a 777. There would be sufficient demand via MIA, however, daily service would require approximately 1.8 additional aircraft in the fleet.
.......
 
Springbok139
Topic Author
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Fri Sep 02, 2005 10:40 pm

It seems strange that in the 70's PanAm was flying 707's to JHB and now not one US carrier even comes close...even with South Africa's booming tourism trade.How the US don't fly to SA when countries like Qatar and Ethiopia do is hard to comprehend.....How about a JFK to Rio then a "quick" hop over to Cape Town?...
 
AirScoot
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Fri Sep 02, 2005 10:41 pm

The only US carrier in (relatively) recent history to fly to South Africa was USAfrica out of IAD in the mid 90's. I want to say they were using an MD-11 with a tech stop enroute. They didn't last very long though and I vividly remember having a small group stranded in Johannesburg when they went under and what we went through trying to get them back to the US.

One thing I do remember is they were attempting to tie in with United when they started up (even using Apollo if I remember right).

Anyone have any information on them?
 
BigGSFO
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Fri Sep 02, 2005 11:09 pm

It's my understanding that AA did conduct studies into flying to South Africa from MIA. I guess they determined it would not be feasible. It would appear that AA prefers to link the USA with destinations non-stop if possible (few exceptions: VVI, ASU, etc), so unless they could do MIA-CPT/JNB without restrictions, they will probably pass.

Now in my opinion, I would think an intermediate stop in REC or SSA on the way to South Africa would work for AA given their size in South America, but they probably won't get local rights between South America and South Africa. Just my assumption, I have no facts to go on.
 
Springbok139
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Fri Sep 02, 2005 11:26 pm

I read somewhere that SAA is the only airline in the world to fly over the south Atlantic...surely a route for AA wouldn't be a problem...
 
PHX Flyer
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Fri Sep 02, 2005 11:53 pm

I seem to remember that United was at some stage considering a routing from the West Coast (LAX, I believe) to Sao Paolo and on to Johannesburg. That flight would receive additional feed from UA flights from IAD and ORD, thus offering one-stop flights to South Africa from all major markets. Also, I think our air treaty with Brazil provides for 5th freedom routings - Varig offers fares for the LAX-NRT leg on their flight from GRU to Japan.
Since United continues to shift capacity to international routes, this may still be an option - provided the demand to/from South Africa is deemed strong enough.
 
2travel2know
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 12:53 am

Quoting Springbok139 (Reply 7):
How about a JFK to Rio then a "quick" hop over to Cape Town?...

That route will be much longer than a non-stop or via SID.
If DL ATL-GIG-ATL or the other ATL-GRU-ATL loads are poor, DL could consider - with minor schedule changes - flying to CPT instead of having that plane idle the whole day in Brazil.

Quoting BigGSFO (Reply 9):
Now in my opinion, I would think an intermediate stop in REC or SSA on the way to South Africa would work for AA given their size in South America, but they probably won't get local rights between South America and South Africa. Just my assumption, I have no facts to go on.

The slots for US airlines in the Brazil-USA Aviation bilateral treaty are all taken. Unless AA gets an special agreement to operate SSA or REC as destination or in-route to Southafrica, or if there's a new bilateral, We won't see AA fliying to other brazilan cities than GRU and GIG.
The Brazil-US bilateral allows 5th freedom so from the brazilian part there's no problem if AA wants to add CPT or JNB from GRU or GIG. Don't know from Southafrica, but Pan Am did fly GIG-CPT with B707 or B747 in the 70's.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
Reggaebird
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 2:10 am

Quoting Springbok139 (Reply 10):
I read somewhere that SAA is the only airline in the world to fly over the south Atlantic...surely a route for AA wouldn't be a problem...

I think that VARIG would challenge that statement!
 
2travel2know
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 3:21 am

TAAG Angola Airlines flies LAD - GIG - LAD
Malaysian may still be flying CPT - EZE - CPT
It seems RG no longer flies over the South Atlantic, they do some kind of code-share with SAA

Quoting Reggaebird (Reply 13):

Quoting Springbok139 (Reply 10): I read somewhere that SAA is the only airline in the world to fly over the south Atlantic...surely a route for AA wouldn't be a problem...

I think that VARIG would challenge that statement!
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
MAH4546
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 3:25 am

American Airlines conducted studies in 2000 to start Miami-South Africa service. While the market to fill the planes exists (O&D alone on Miami-South Africa is about 220 daily passengers), there are logistical issues with weight restrictions, ETOPS 207 (MIA-CPT can barely make it with ETOPS 180), crew rest, etc. When AA gets some 787s in the future, I think it is realistic to see them flying to South Africa from Miami.
a.
 
rootsair
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 3:27 am

Quoting Springbok139 (Reply 7):
It seems strange that in the 70's PanAm was flying 707's to JHB and now not one US carrier even comes close...even with South Africa's booming tourism trade.How the US don't fly to SA when countries like Qatar and Ethiopia do is hard to comprehend.....How about a JFK to Rio then a "quick" hop over to Cape Town?...



I totally agree with you. I was in Sa only 2 weeks ago, and beleive me, its a very welcoming country that does a big effort to show the world a different image or what was their's before. Thus more and more tourists are coming ....thus demand increases...Springbok jsut let me tell you that you are lucky to come from such an amazing country with all its cultures.

Regards

BM
A man without the knowledge of his past history,culture and origins is like a tree without roots
 
2travel2know
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 3:34 am

Quoting CXA330300 (Reply 5):
CO: Nothing much stopping them (they dont codeshare on any flights to South Africa), they just need more planes.

CO has 2 planes flying into GRU daily, one flies onto GIG while the other stays alldaylong in the tarmac.
Don't know that much about CO Brazilian schedule, but GRU-CPT-GRU may be a possibility with them. Also even if some connections won't work well it seems CO has CM flying codeshare with them via PTY into GRU too.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
MAH4546
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 3:43 am

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 17):
CO has 2 planes flying into GRU daily, one flies onto GIG while the other stays alldaylong in the tarmac.
Don't know that much about CO Brazilian schedule, but GRU-CPT-GRU may be a possibility with them. Also even if some connections won't work well it seems CO has CM flying codeshare with them via PTY into GRU too.

Huh? If CO had a tag-on flight to EWR-GRU that went onto CPT, then how could it not connect with the returning GRU-EWR flight? I sure hope it would connect, or there wouldn't be a plane to take people back to Newark. CO isn't going to fly CPT-GRU to misconnect with their own flights and connect with Copa.
a.
 
B777200
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 4:20 am

I think at the moment there are no large US Airlines flying anywhere in Africa. I understand that World Airways flies to Angola from Houston, but none of the large legacy carriers fly anywhere in Africa. New York City to Lagos must be a profitable route. I understand that Virgin Atlantic's flight from London to Lagos is one of their most profitable.

The extent of the legacy carriers venturing into Africa is Delta having codeshare flights with South African Airways. These flights to Atlanta and New York are daily, one of our South African fans can confirm that. Yields are also high on those routes, so there is potential for one of the United States legacy carriers to fly to Africa.

Greetings to All.
 
GreyGoose
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 5:05 am

Its a shame that the US carriers have not focused on the market. SAA is doing well on the routes - dailies to JFK (A343) and ATL (A346) and now 4/wk to IAD (B744). SAA also benefits from 5th freedom rights, especially on the JNB-DKR-JFK route. These routes tend to be some of SAA's most profitable long haul routes, given the lack of competition.

But I think for a US carrier to make this profitable, they need to fly into JNB; CPT doesn't have the high yield traffic to make this work (the leisure pax will mostly go for the cheaper routing via Europe). But given the distance and the altitude in JNB, I think only the A345 and 772LR could do it non-stop East-to-West. I would like to see SAA get the aircraft to do this non-stop, especially JNB-JFK. But given the lack of competition, no reason to bother at this point.
 
PITA333
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 5:54 am

Quoting Jmc1975 (Reply 6):
It's too bad American hasn't jumped in and served MIA-CPT-JNB-CPT-MIA with a 777. There would be sufficient demand via MIA, however, daily service would require approximately 1.8 additional aircraft in the fleet.

I agree, that kind of a route could be a big performer for AA if the task of getting the flight out could be possible. Like you said, they need 2 more 777s. Too bad thats not going to happen anytime soon, I'd like to see AA in AAfrica!
 
2travel2know
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 7:35 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 18):
CO isn't going to fly CPT-GRU to misconnect with their own flights and connect with Copa.

I'm reffering to CO Southafrica - Brazil (if they ever fly that route) will not connect with CM, but with their own IAH and EWR flights.

Quoting GreyGoose (Reply 20):
But I think for a US carrier to make this profitable, they need to fly into JNB; CPT doesn't have the high yield traffic to make this work (the leisure pax will mostly go for the cheaper routing via Europe).

If any US airline having planes idle in GRU or GIG airports daytime wants to fly them to Southafrica, CPT may be the better choice.. maybe not for the yields but because of the flying time GRU/GIG-CPT-GRU/GIG is less than to/from JNB (the airline could squeeze that flight more easily than a JNB in their schedule) and CPT doesn't have JNB altitude problem.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
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yowza
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 7:48 am

Quoting Flydubai (Reply 4):
Not many US airlines have planes with the sufficient range to reach the Middle East or part of Africa.

Range is not the issue, loads are.

Quoting Springbok139 (Reply 7):
It seems strange that in the 70's PanAm was flying 707's to JHB and now not one US carrier even comes close...even with South Africa's booming tourism trade.How the US don't fly to SA when countries like Qatar and Ethiopia do is hard to comprehend.....How about a JFK to Rio then a "quick" hop over to Cape Town?...

Back in the day Pan AM served Africa very well and went to bizarre places like Brazzavile (sp) and places that would not be at all viable these days like Kinshasa.

Given that most US carriers are in rough shape now is not the time for them to be venturing out to new pastures on what would be a costly new destination.

YOWza
 
rwsea
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 1:17 pm

I'd love to see DL take two 777s off of European services and start up ATL-JNB or ATL-CPT, or even ATL-JNB-CPT-ATL. The question arises of where to refuel though - maybe Accra or Lagos?

The 777s taken off of Europe could then be replaced by 764s.

I know, wishful thinking ....
 
b6sea
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 1:34 pm

I think once one of the airlines gets a 787 then you'll see interest in Africa re-emerge for the legacies. Otherwise CO doesnt have enough 777s and the other airlines are preocupied with other regions.

-Chans
 
MAH4546
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 1:47 pm

Quoting B6sea (Reply 25):
I think once one of the airlines gets a 787 then you'll see interest in Africa re-emerge for the legacies. Otherwise CO doesnt have enough 777s and the other airlines are preocupied with other regions.

You don't need a 777. Most of northern Africa is reachable with a 762, such as Lagos and Accra, two of the largest markets.

Dakar, which is arguably the biggest US-Africa market outside of South Africa and Egypt, is easily within the range of of a 757 from Newark and Miami. There is a healthy amount of traffic between Senagal and New York City and South Florida, and the US in general, and, IMO, CO and AA could have a field day flying EWR-DKR and MIA-DKR with 757s. In the case of AA flying MIA-DKR, they don't think "out of the box" enough to take the risk. CO could do really well with EWR-DKR, IMO, but they want to go into more European markets first.
a.
 
gt1
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 2:30 pm

I did get a rumor from a pilot that DL was looking at going to South Africa via South America. Supposedly DL got the route authority from Pan Am. I've never heard it again, and it's impossible to predict anything at DL these days, so I wouldn't bet on it.
 
MAH4546
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 2:36 pm

Quoting Gt1 (Reply 27):
Supposedly DL got the route authority from Pan Am.

They didn't. United has it, as it was part of the LatAm authorities.
a.
 
soups
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 9:04 pm

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 24):
or Lagos?

You can dream to see a US carrier at Lagos!!! Look at CO
Next destinations, Suarabaya, beirut, paris, Accra
 
SA7700
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sat Sep 03, 2005 11:39 pm

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 22):
If any US airline having planes idle in GRU or GIG airports daytime wants to fly them to Southafrica, CPT may be the better choice.. maybe not for the yields but because of the flying time GRU/GIG-CPT-GRU/GIG is less than to/from JNB (the airline could squeeze that flight more easily than a JNB in their schedule) and CPT doesn't have JNB altitude problem.

I know I am going a bit of the topic here, but IMMHO CPT most probably has sufficient yields to many international destinations. It is some carriers management, like the one at Airways Park in Jones Road (SAA) that seem to ignore it. They dropped CPT from the ATL routing, stating (From Flyssa.com) To optimise existing route networks, streamline operational costs and meet customer demands for flights out of Atlanta to Johannesburg

Meanwhile, back at the ranch, IIRC most pax on the JNB-CPT-ATL-CPT-JNB flights boarded and deplaned in CPT. Back in FRA, LH made plans and started up FRA-CPT-FRA. As usual, SAA Management not thinking outside of the box, suddenly also started up some CPT-FRA-CPT services; and are now going daily from September 12, 2005. It seems as if SAA Management is not very capable of coming up with their own ideas, always playing "follow-the-leader". When it came out that MIA officials were negotiating with a South African carrier to reopen the CPT-MIA-CPT route, it was not long before SAA made rumbles about a possible return to MIA - not at all impressed with another carrier pissing on their past territory.

While JNB will most probably always remain the hub for foreign airlines flying to South Africa, CPT should not be scorned. CPT just need to get their infrastructure 100% in place (construction is taking place at the moment) and most probably a lot more foreign carriers will be flying there directly. IMHO the yields are there and waiting to be utilised to the maximum.


Rgds

SA7700
When you are doing stuff that nobody has done before, there is no manual – Kevin McCloud (Grand Designs)
 
jmc1975
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sun Sep 04, 2005 4:50 am

Quoting PITA333 (Reply 21):
I agree, that kind of a route could be a big performer for AA if the task of getting the flight out could be possible. Like you said, they need 2 more 777s. Too bad thats not going to happen anytime soon, I'd like to see AA in AAfrica!

To add to that, the logistics of such a route might be beyond what AA would allow in their current business plan. This route would have to be dispatched in a similar way as British Airways old LGW-PHX-SAN route. For example the crews would be away from base for about 4 days to make it possible...they would fly MIA-CPT and then overnight to fly CPT-JNB-CPT, overnight again and fly the final leg of CPT-MIA. Also, if AA were to keep maintenance in-house, then it would need to be based in CPT where the engineers would fly to JNB and back everyday with the aircraft.
.......
 
b6sea
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sun Sep 04, 2005 4:57 am

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 26):
Quoting B6sea (Reply 25):
I think once one of the airlines gets a 787 then you'll see interest in Africa re-emerge for the legacies. Otherwise CO doesnt have enough 777s and the other airlines are preocupied with other regions.


You don't need a 777. Most of northern Africa is reachable with a 762, such as Lagos and Accra, two of the largest markets.

I was referring specifically to South Africa, sorry about the confusion (sometimes my mind goes faster than my typing skills allow).

-Chans
 
bsbisland
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sun Sep 04, 2005 9:18 am

About US carriers flying to South Africa through Brazil, that makes not much sense nowadays. Slot restrictions in Brazil would disencourage any airline to do that, and it´s actually shorter to fly via Europe than Brazil in most cases. Flying through SSA or REC would not make sense at all as I don´t think there would be any descent demand from NE Brazil to South Africa. The "tradicional" stops in Africa such as SID, LOS, etc are still the best choices in my opinion.
 
2travel2know
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sun Sep 04, 2005 11:18 am

Quoting BSBIsland (Reply 33):
About US carriers flying to South Africa through Brazil, that makes not much sense nowadays. Slot restrictions in Brazil would disencourage any airline to do that, and it´s actually shorter to fly via Europe than Brazil in most cases.

Slot restrictions are a problem for any new US-Brazil flights by US airlines, but they're no problem for tag-ons onto South Africa on existing US-Brazil flights, as said earlier, The US-Brazil aviation bilateral allows 5th rights.
Yes, in most cases, US-South Africa flights via Brazil (GRU/GIG) are longer than via LIS/MAD/SID/DKR for example.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
blrBird
Posts: 455
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sun Sep 04, 2005 12:02 pm

Is there a specific reason why US airlines are generally Africa shy! Where as EU airlines seem to have quite an extensive Africa network.  Confused
from star dust....
 
Whataboutme
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sun Sep 04, 2005 12:49 pm

What is the distance between GRU?GIG to JNB/CPT? What would the flight time be. Can an airline like CO who has a plane sitting all day in Brazil fly to CPT and back so they can go back to EWR?
 
SA7700
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sun Sep 04, 2005 3:35 pm

JNB-GRU SA205: Depart 10h20 Arrive 15h30 (Flying time 10h10min)
GRU-JNB SA206: Depart 17h30 Arrive 07h00+1 (Flying time 08h30)

According to the Great Circle Mapper JNB-GRU is 7452km (4630 miles). CPT to GRU is 6362km (3953miles).

IMHO CO won't be able to make it.


Rgds

SA7700
When you are doing stuff that nobody has done before, there is no manual – Kevin McCloud (Grand Designs)
 
MAH4546
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Sun Sep 04, 2005 3:46 pm

Quoting BlrBird (Reply 35):
Is there a specific reason why US airlines are generally Africa shy! Where as EU airlines seem to have quite an extensive Africa network.

The same reasons that EU airlines have a weak presence in LatAm and US airlines have extensive LatAm networks. The market is bigger to Europe and proximity.
a.
 
2travel2know
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Mon Sep 05, 2005 1:40 am

Quoting SA7700 (Reply 37):
According to the Great Circle Mapper JNB-GRU is 7452km (4630 miles). CPT to GRU is 6362km (3953miles).
IMHO CO won't be able to make it.

I agree GRU-JNB-GRU with CO may not work, however IMHO, CPT - with a quick turnaround and slight GRU arr/dep time changes - maybe.
CPT fits more as a tag-on to DL, either from GIG or from GRU (they fly twice daily ATL-GRU-ATL).
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
wdleiser
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Mon Sep 05, 2005 1:57 am

What if say a US carrier did this----> West-East they do (*insert major US airport here*) to JNB. Then East - West they do---> JNB->CPT(for fuel and maybe more passengers?)--->(*Insert major US airport*)

so

MIA-JNB

JNB-CPT-MIA for example.
 
SA7700
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Mon Sep 05, 2005 3:54 am

Quoting Wdleiser (Reply 40):
MIA-JNB

JNB-CPT-MIA for example.

Take into account that CPT-MIA is 7667 miles / 12339 km on the GCM. Most of the major US carriers largest planes are B772ER's. With 263 tonne MTOW; range will be around 11,037km. Well below the 12339km distance. Lastly, don't forget about ETOPS.

Even when SA flew from CPT-MIA, IIRC, the B744's had to refuel in SID.


Rgds

SA7700
When you are doing stuff that nobody has done before, there is no manual – Kevin McCloud (Grand Designs)
 
bsbisland
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Mon Sep 05, 2005 4:08 am

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 39):

If US carriers can fill the aircrafts to Brazil and can not add more frequency, that wouldn´t be interesting using their already restricted frequencies and even flying through Europe is faster (I don´t think it would be interesting for them either). That would be totally risky. I would love to see that, as an aviation fan, but in my opinion it´s just out of reality.
 
2travel2know
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Mon Sep 05, 2005 4:23 am

Quoting BSBIsland (Reply 42):
If US carriers can fill the aircrafts to Brazil and can not add more frequency, that wouldn´t be interesting using their already restricted frequencies and even flying through Europe is faster (I don´t think it would be interesting for them either). That would be totally risky. I would love to see that, as an aviation fan, but in my opinion it´s just out of reality.

US airlines can't add frecuencies to Brazil but they sure can add seats, or not? go-on from a B767 to a B777 or even a B747-400?
In order to really start to think flying Brazil-Southafrica, the US airlines have to look very closely to the Brazil-Southafrica yields first.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
bsbisland
Posts: 319
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Mon Sep 05, 2005 4:35 am

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 43):
US airlines can't add frecuencies to Brazil but they sure can add seats, or not? go-on from a B767 to a B777 or even a B747-400?

I don´t think they have the aircraft to put on such a route. I´m not too familiar with US carriers´ fleets but from what I´ve seen here, they have a shortage of those bigger aircrafts available.
 
Whataboutme
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Mon Sep 05, 2005 8:49 am

Well wasn't CO to start Newark to Lagos with a 767? What happened to that flight? Couldn't CO go from Lagos to CPT/JNB and back. Why can't an airline take a plane to Brazil and just use that plane to fly between CPT/JNB and Brazil. The codeshare that DL/CO would work wouldn't it? Both airlines can sell seats on that one flight and it wouldn't have to be a daily. 4 or 5 x's weekly would work. Let the passengers have a free layover in GRU or GIG. Maybe let the other US carriers sell seats on that flight so the flight would go out full. Maybe I am thinking weird here.
 
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RE: US Carriers To South Africa?

Mon Sep 05, 2005 9:05 am

Quoting Whataboutme (Reply 45):
Why can't an airline take a plane to Brazil and just use that plane to fly between CPT/JNB and Brazil. The codeshare that DL/CO would work wouldn't it? Both airlines can sell seats on that one flight and it wouldn't have to be a daily. 4 or 5 x's weekly would work. Let the passengers have a free layover in GRU or GIG. Maybe let the other US carriers sell seats on that flight so the flight would go out full. Maybe I am thinking weird here.

I like your thinking.
Sky Team airlines DL and CO (should I count CM with CO too?) fly daily to GRU. GRU gets DL from ATL (twice), CO from IAH, CO from EWR and CM from PTY (twice); plus DL and CM seem to have somekind of codeshare with GOL Airlines.
Even with this scenario, aren't enough passengers from those flights for a GRU-CPT-GRU tag-on daylight flight on a DL or CO aircraft?
I don't work for COPA Airlines!

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