stlgph
Posts: 8929
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:19 pm

AA Reduces In STL?

Sat Sep 10, 2005 5:04 pm

Looks like AA is...

1. Dropping second (evening) Richmond flight in November

2. Dropping Ft. Walton Beach in November


And schedule says

Indianapolis is dropped Oct. 28, but is still bookable on the website

Madison, WI is on an ER4?!
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
SESGDL
Posts: 2613
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2001 6:25 am

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Sun Sep 11, 2005 1:24 am

I don't think you'll see anything extreme happening with AA at STL. There will be a few flights dropped here, a few added there, etc. AA has got STL right where they want it. I expect that AA will build up the size of STL again with time, though it will never be the size that TW had it. I'd expect AA to eventually add more mainline service as well as some new destinations. STL's not going anywhere in the immediate future.

Jeremy
 
stlgph
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RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Sun Sep 11, 2005 1:27 am

I don't doubt you at all there. I've been saying more mainline will be gone within the next year or two. I just saw the schedule and was puzzled at a few things. I might be off to Richmond and went to check fares and times and noticed that second daily flight was no longer there.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
BHMNONREV
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RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Sun Sep 11, 2005 1:29 am

Quoting STLGph (Thread starter):
2. Dropping Ft. Walton Beach in November

I can't even understand how this route came to fruition in the first place. The only real demand I can see is for Air Force TDY traffic between Scott and Eglin, or a few Boeing employees going back and forth doing F-15 related work, but regardless there can't be that much. Maybe Mark can pipe in with some load numbers...

Quoting STLGph (Thread starter):
Madison, WI is on an ER4?!

MSN has long been a popular route from STL, going back to the TW and OZ days. Not sure why the demand is there though..
 
stl1326
Posts: 392
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 12:07 pm

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Sun Sep 11, 2005 1:49 am

VPS is not being dropped it's just going to Friday and Saturaday only. Also, both RIC flights are still in the schedule on the website and IND is also. I don't know where you got this information because the new AA timetables aren't aviailable to download yet. Are they?
 
iowaman
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Joined: Thu May 20, 2004 2:29 am

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Sun Sep 11, 2005 3:45 am

Quoting BHMNONREV (Reply 3):
MSN has long been a popular route from STL, going back to the TW and OZ days. Not sure why the demand is there though..

Along with other markets, such as DSM and CID, where TW used to run MD-80's to, I guess over the years people liked connecting in STL, and also I'm sure there is some business traffic from DSM and MSN to STL. It seems like DSM keeps getting upgrades to STL so it must be doing well. I'm kind of surprised myself AA doesn't start ERJ's from STL-OMA.. although WN has that route 3x daily I still think they could do it. Anyways, I'm not surprised MSN is getting ERJ's to STL.. business traffic couldn't really drive that in one day, and there is probably just enough connecting demand.. good news.
 
stlgph
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Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:19 pm

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Sun Sep 11, 2005 8:13 am

Quoting Stl1326 (Reply 4):
I don't know where you got this information because the new AA timetables aren't aviailable to download yet.

Go look.

Quoting Stl1326 (Reply 4):
VPS is not being dropped it's just going to Friday and Saturaday only.

until November.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
CIDFlyer
Posts: 1877
Joined: Wed Apr 13, 2005 7:19 am

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Sun Sep 11, 2005 11:41 pm

Quoting BHMNONREV (Reply 3):
. Dropping Ft. Walton Beach in November

I can't even understand how this route came to fruition in the first place

I was surprised by the route as well. I am still seeing it in the schedules on AA.com though for Feb. I heard it did fairly good on the weekends which is why it was dropped to just Fri and Sat. I would have though if anything, they would have started STL-PNS as PNS seems to be that regions main airport, and VPS, although very nice with its new terminal, is more of a secondary airport. Perhaps the ORD-PNS route siphoned traffic away from STL-VPS?
 
stl1326
Posts: 392
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 12:07 pm

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Mon Sep 12, 2005 1:36 am

Quoting CIDflyer (Reply 7):
I was surprised by the route as well. I am still seeing it in the schedules on AA.com though for Feb. I heard it did fairly good on the weekends which is why it was dropped to just Fri and Sat. I would have though if anything, they would have started STL-PNS as PNS seems to be that regions main airport, and VPS, although very nice with its new terminal, is more of a secondary airport. Perhaps the ORD-PNS route siphoned traffic away from STL-VPS?

I'm too seeing it still in the schedules on Friday and Saturday. I'm puzzled how he got this information, because today is when the new schedules are uploaded and all the flights are in the schedules on AA.com still. I've noticed though that the evening flight to RIC doesn't operate daily anymore. That to me is puzzling also because it is like every other day the evening flight is in the schedule.
 
GMUAirbusA320
Posts: 203
Joined: Thu Sep 02, 2004 8:52 pm

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Mon Sep 12, 2005 11:11 am

I have to say...STL looks like a ghost town compared to what TWA had it operating. I lived in STL right before the merger went through and caught a connecting flight from IAD-STL-BMI. That place was packed all day. I went to STL for business in May...shocked  boggled 
 
LambertMan
Posts: 1696
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2003 1:26 pm

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Mon Sep 12, 2005 11:27 am

Quoting GMUAirbusA320 (Reply 9):
I have to say...STL looks like a ghost town compared to what TWA had it operating. I lived in STL right before the merger went through and caught a connecting flight from IAD-STL-BMI. That place was packed all day. I went to STL for business in May...shocked

Geeze....these posts are becoming awfully familiar. Thank you for your input, however.  Yeah sure
 
midway7
Posts: 146
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2004 10:24 pm

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 12:25 am

Quoting GMUAirbusA320 (Reply 9):

You're not kidding. TWA was always packed at STL. Given its location and the jet service to so many midwestern destinations, it just made a good connection point for lots of people.

Here in SGF, TWA is missed big time...

Midway 7
 
LambertMan
Posts: 1696
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2003 1:26 pm

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 2:14 am

As far as I can tell, IND is still in the schedules. It wouldn't surprise me to see it dropped, as I've had to use it once or twice. I guess the the only thing that saves STL-IND is the walk up fares, which are about $1500 r/t. Last Thursday I attempted to buy a walkup fare to fly home for a wedding, and obviously the 1500 wasn't worth it.

The second daily to RIC have been out of the schedules for a couple weeks or so.

Concerning VPS, that is also still in the schedules as a F/S flight only.

Not sure where you are getting your schedules from.
 
mrstl
Posts: 353
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2005 9:58 am

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 2:22 am

Quoting Midway7 (Reply 11):



Quoting Midway7 (Reply 11):
You're not kidding. TWA was always packed at STL. Given its location and the jet service to so many midwestern destinations, it just made a good connection point for lots of people.

Here in SGF, TWA is missed big time...

I have to wonder how many passengers AA has lost in cities like SGF & MCI due to St. Louis being downsized. ORD and DFW are not as convenient as STL was. It baffles me that STL cannot support RJ service to MCI-- does anyone know if this has more to do with limiting the number of Ex-TWA people who reside in KC from reaching the fence around the STL base? I would be interested to know how WN does on this route- it seems like AA wrapped it in a bow and gave it to WN.
 
Tornado82
Posts: 4662
Joined: Thu May 26, 2005 10:19 am

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 2:28 am

Quoting LambertMan (Reply 10):
Geeze....these posts are becoming awfully familiar. Thank you for your input, however.

Don't worry, we get the same posts from the same few members about PIT frequently as well. We should start a support group, and it looks like we'll have some CVG members in the future as well.
 
stlgph
Posts: 8929
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:19 pm

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 3:33 am

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 14):
looks like we'll have some CVG members in the future as well.

the reductions at CVG are minute compared to the loss of the Lambert hub.

Quoting LambertMan (Reply 12):
Not sure where you are getting your schedules from.

Chautauqua.

Quoting MrSTL (Reply 13):
It baffles me that STL cannot support RJ service to MCI

for whatever the reason, the lowest fares offered on that route are on Delta via Cincinnati.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
Tornado82
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Joined: Thu May 26, 2005 10:19 am

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 3:38 am

Quoting STLGph (Reply 15):
for whatever the reason, the lowest fares offered on that route are on Delta via Cincinnati.

STL-CVG-MCI being the cheapest routing... hmmm... no wonder they're losing money at CVG.
 
SESGDL
Posts: 2613
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2001 6:25 am

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 3:59 am

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 16):
STL-CVG-MCI being the cheapest routing... hmmm... no wonder they're losing money at CVG.

I doubt that very many people fly that route, it's too far out of the way. It would be nearly as fast to drive from STL to MCI.

Jeremy
 
Orion737
Posts: 3044
Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2005 10:14 pm

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 4:12 am

Dont forget AA dropped the long standing international link between STL-LGW when they took over the much missed TWA.

Unfrtunatley there does not appear to be any hope of the link with London being reinstated.
 
stlgph
Posts: 8929
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:19 pm

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 4:39 am

Quoting SESGDL (Reply 17):
I doubt that very many people fly that route, it's too far out of the way. It would be nearly as fast to drive from STL to MCI.

I know, I just put that up there for a funtoid because it is something I noticed once. Southwest was running $90-ish roundtrip and I've found Delta for $70-ish roundtrip.

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 16):
STL-CVG-MCI being the cheapest routing... hmmm... no wonder they're losing money at CVG.

Delta actually -makes- money at Cincinnati.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
Tornado82
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Joined: Thu May 26, 2005 10:19 am

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 4:44 am

Quoting STLGph (Reply 19):
Delta actually -makes- money at Cincinnati.

Eh... not the way they're glooming up their press release for the CVG cuts. Personally I think CVG is a relatively convenient eastern-US connection, not quite as easy as CLE or PIT, but leaps and bounds over IAD, ORD, PHL, EWR, or ATL.
 
stlgph
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Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 4:19 pm

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 5:10 am

Quoting Tornado82 (Reply 20):
Eh... not the way they're glooming up their press release for the CVG cuts. Personally I think CVG is a relatively convenient eastern-US connection, not quite as easy as CLE or PIT, but leaps and bounds over IAD, ORD, PHL, EWR, or ATL.

CVG reductions are mainly to reduce Delta's system wide excess capacity problem and to speed up fleet simplification. Delta just simply overinflated its ego thinking everybody and their mom would fly Delta and overextended services on Comair and ASA. If Comair was able to make its own decisions, you'd see it about 25-30% smaller than it is now anyway.
if assumptions could fly, airliners.net would be the world's busiest airport
 
stl1326
Posts: 392
Joined: Sun Jun 05, 2005 12:07 pm

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 5:28 am

Quoting STLGph (Reply 15):
Quoting LambertMan (Reply 12):
Not sure where you are getting your schedules from.

Chautauqua.

But doesn't Trans States only operate this route?
 
midway7
Posts: 146
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 2004 10:24 pm

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 5:29 am

Quoting STLGph (Reply 21):

I love CVG, I think it's a great hub. More convenient than ORD, ATL, IAD, PHL, and EWR - barnone.

However based on its O&D and the size of Cincinnati, I think it fits the profile of the type of hub airlines are eliminating more than the type they are retaining and building on.

I hope it survives, but I see it going the way of STL & PIT in the future.

Midway 7
 
Okie
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Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2003 11:30 am

RE: AA Reduces In STL?

Tue Sep 13, 2005 6:15 am

Quoting Stl1326 (Reply 22):
But doesn't Trans States only operate this route?

No, the Junkstreams are operated by RegionsAir/Corporate Air on the afternoon flights STL-IND.

Okie