Glasgow
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Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:11 am

Does anyone know who currently operates the largest fleet?
 
gigneil
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:12 am

American does.

filler.

N
 
lazyshaun
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:13 am

Yep, AA by about 300 a/c.
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Glasgow
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:16 am

By 300! I had no idea!
 
FlagshipAZ
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:16 am

American, by far.
77 737-800
124 757-200
22 767-200
58 767-300
45 777-200
362 MD-80
34 Airbus A300
Not all of these aircraft are in service.
These are just what on the fleet roster.
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shamrock350
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:19 am

Just got an old book from 2002 and I added all the aircraft up and got 493! Mind you this was when the 60+ 727s were around.
 
lazyshaun
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:36 am

Airfleets says it has 601 a/c in service. I thought they had around 700 myself, so its probably not the biggest by 300 a/c, but possibly by 200?

Any airline who can contend for being 2nd in the list would probably only meet around 250-300 a/c.

BA have 234 not including franchises (e.g. CitiExpress, GeeBee Bmed, Comair. These would bring their total to over 300.)
AF have exactly 250
LH have 249.
So you see its pretty much around the 250 mark for other major carriers
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erikwilliam
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:39 am

Quoting Lazyshaun (Reply 6):
Any airline who can contend for being 2nd in the list would probably only meet around 250-300 a/c.

WN- (around)400
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bond007
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:43 am

Yeah, WN is around 425 and actually has the most daily flights of any airline (if you don't include regionals with mainline).


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lazyshaun
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 3:44 am

Oh yeah, I forget WN, sorry!
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ZSOFN
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 4:21 am

Didn't UA used to be 2nd? According to Airfleets United have 413 in active service.
 
satx
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 5:00 am

Quoting Bond007 (Reply 8):
Yeah, WN is around 425

WN has at least 439 aircraft according to the last post I saw mention it by OPNLguy (on 2005-09-11 16:28:27) and more 700's on the way still.
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erikwilliam
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 5:22 am

Quoting SATX (Reply 11):
and more 700's on the way still.

ehehehe, first time I read it i tought, what more 700 aicrafts to come?!

ehehe...ok ok.....B 737-700´s
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lightsaber
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 5:23 am

Not to nitpick, but as AE is owned by AA, shouldn't their fleet be added in? Or are we talking mainline only?

And its no doubt AA... viva EL Maddog!

Lightsaber
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UAcosCS
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 5:26 am

Quoting ZSOFN (Reply 10):
Didn't UA used to be 2nd? According to Airfleets United have 413 in active service.

UAL use to have close to 600

With the departure of DC-10's,727, and repoed airplanes we are close to 425 I believe.
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sovietjet
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 5:27 am

In 1989-1990 Aeroflot was by far the biggest in the world. Not anymore of course but here's a rough estimate.
650 Tu-134
750 Tu-154
400 Il-76
150 Il-62
80 Il-86
500 An-12
at least 1000 An-24/26
800 Yak-40?
100 Yak-42

plus various helicopters such as Mi-8/17, Mi-26, Ka-26, and airplanes like the An-2, An-28, An-30, possibly some Il-18 and An-8. All adds up to at least 6-7000 planes although with the An-2s it's probably closer to at least 10,000. Of course it was the only airline in the Soviet Union. I'd be interested to know how many planes all the major airlines in the US have all together.
 
Ari
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 5:30 am

How many planes does fedex have??don't they have loads of cessnas and stuff?!?!seems to take up loads of pages in my airlines 2005 book!

ari
 
ScottB
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:25 pm

As of June 30, Delta had 519 mainline aircraft, excluding the parked/subleased MD-11's. The Delta-owned Delta Connection carriers (Comair & ASA, which was recently sold to SkyWest) had over 300 aircraft combined.
 
N1120A
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:31 pm

Quoting Lightsaber (Reply 13):

Not to nitpick, but as AE is owned by AA, shouldn't their fleet be added in?

Not to nitpick a bit more, especially with someone as bright as you (name fits if you think about it saber Big grin), but MQ is owned by AMR Corp. which is also AA's parent. It is on a different certificate and has different labor contracts.

Also, according to AA, they have 710 active aircraft including 337 MD80s!! MQ has 286 total aircraft
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797
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 11:00 pm

Quoting FlagshipAZ (Reply 4):
American, by far.
77 737-800
124 757-200
22 767-200
58 767-300
45 777-200
362 MD-80
34 Airbus A300

So, as I see, it might not be in AA's plans to replace those MD-80s in a short period? I think they should start thinking about that, perhaps ordering more 738s. Also the A300s should be replaced, I flew one yesterday from MIA to CCS and, for the fifth time in my life, the flight was 1 hour delayed, this occasion due to hydraulic problems. For these, I don't have any airplanes in mind... Probably the 787???

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PHXinterrupted
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 11:04 pm

Quoting 797 (Reply 19):
Also the A300s should be replaced, I flew one yesterday from MIA to CCS and, for the fifth time in my life, the flight was 1 hour delayed, this occasion due to hydraulic problems.

I agree, their A300s are awful.
Keepin' it real.
 
TWA902fly
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 11:08 pm

Quoting 797 (Reply 19):
Also the A300s should be replaced, I flew one yesterday from MIA to CCS and, for the fifth time in my life, the flight was 1 hour delayed, this occasion due to hydraulic problems. For these, I don't have any airplanes in mind... Probably the 787???

I think the 787 might be a bit of a waste. It has range way beyond what AA needs to replace its A300 routes. What is the longest AA A300 route? im guessing JFK-somewhere in the caribbean maybe SDQ? so tahts what 5 hours max? you dont need a 787 for that. Possibly replace the A300s with more 767s and put 787s where the 767s used to be?

'902
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N328KF
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 11:42 pm

Quoting TWA902fly (Reply 21):
I think the 787 might be a bit of a waste. It has range way beyond what AA needs to replace its A300 routes. What is the longest AA A300 route? im guessing JFK-somewhere in the caribbean maybe SDQ? so tahts what 5 hours max? you dont need a 787 for that. Possibly replace the A300s with more 767s and put 787s where the 767s used to be?

How do you figure? The 787-3 is a drop-in replacement for the A300 and 767-200s, and the 787-8 is a drop-in replacement for the 767-200ERs and 767-300s.
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viasa
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Tue Sep 20, 2005 11:56 pm

You have forget FedEx Express!!!

Fleet (in service):

46 A300
56 A310
23 ATR42
4 ATR72
108 B727
??? C208
79 DC-10/MD-10
?? F27
45 MD-11
 
ssides
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:02 am

Quoting 797 (Reply 19):
Also the A300s should be replaced, I flew one yesterday from MIA to CCS and, for the fifth time in my life, the flight was 1 hour delayed, this occasion due to hydraulic problems. For these, I don't have any airplanes in mind... Probably the 787???

The A300s are cash cows for AA. They are perfectly suited for the high-density Latin American markets that AA dominates. They are especially profitable due to their high cargo capacity.

Sure, they'll be replaced sometime, but they are generally reliable. As long as AA is making money on them, they'll keep them.
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commavia
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:07 am

Quoting Ssides (Reply 24):
The A300s are cash cows for AA. They are perfectly suited for the high-density Latin American markets that AA dominates. They are especially profitable due to their high cargo capacity.

But they are operational pieces of cr*p, which is why AA will no doubt replace them with 787s as soon as it is economically feasible. The only reasons the A300s are still around is because there has not been -- until now -- a viable alternative with comporable cargo capacity, and AA is getting them on dirt-cheap leases from Airbus. The 787 will change the equation, though, when AA buys it.
 
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ZSOFN
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:11 am

Quoting Commavia (Reply 25):
But they are operational pieces of cr*p

Eh?
 
Olympus69
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:36 am

Quoting Erikwilliam (Reply 12):
Quoting SATX (Reply 11):
and more 700's on the way still.

ehehehe, first time I read it i tought, what more 700 aicrafts to come?!

ehehe...ok ok.....B 737-700´s

Your confusion is caused by your not quite perfect sentence structure. the correct English reads - "what, 700 more aircraft to come?"
 
commavia
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:39 am

Quoting ZSOFN (Reply 26):
Eh?

Just what I said -- the A300s are a maintenance and scheduling nightmare, as they are always breaking down or going inop for maintenance. On any given day -- take a look at the AA ramp around MIA, JFK or SJU -- you are almost guaranteed to see at least a few A300s sitting it out for maintenance issues. The planes handle cargo and bag volume well -- which is why AA keeps them, because it needs that in the Caribbean and Latin America -- but the planes are, technically, pieces of cr*p.
 
gigneil
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:47 am

I don't understand why AA has such poor luck with their AB6 fleet whilst FedEx and Lufthansa employees refer to theirs as the most reliable plane in their fleet.

Makes very little sense, unless AA really is just running them into the ground on those routes.

N
 
N1120A
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:47 am

Quoting TWA902fly (Reply 21):
I think the 787 might be a bit of a waste. It has range way beyond what AA needs to replace its A300 routes.

The 783 has basically identical range to the A300 with more cargo capacity
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FlagshipAZ
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 1:47 am

To 797 in reply 19...
Yes, American does have another 47 738s on order, and we'll start to see them beginning in 2010. The oldest MD-80 in the fleet, N203AA, is 22 years old this year, while the youngest MD-80, N984TW, is a mere 6 yrs old this year. So we can expect the the majority of the MD-80s to be with AA for quite awhile yet. The 787 is being studied by AA, probably the 787-3 for the A300 fleet replacement, which we'll start to see leaving the fleet within 5 yrs.
I expect AA to order around 35 787s within 3 yrs time.
Getting back to the 738s, I wouldn't be a bit surprised to see the remaining 47 on order to be delivered with winglets, fresh from the assembly line.
American also has 2 more 777s on order, one which will be delivered next year, while the last one sometime later in the decade.
Regards.
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Glasgow
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 1:51 am

Airline with the smallest fleet!

Or the most profitable airline?
 
ikramerica
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 2:17 am

Quoting FlagshipAZ (Reply 31):
Yes, American does have another 47 738s on order, and we'll start to see them beginning in 2010. The oldest MD-80 in the fleet, N203AA, is 22 years old this year, while the youngest MD-80, N984TW, is a mere 6 yrs old this year. So we can expect the the majority of the MD-80s to be with AA for quite awhile yet. The 787 is being studied by AA, probably the 787-3 for the A300 fleet replacement, which we'll start to see leaving the fleet within 5 yrs.
I expect AA to order around 35 787s within 3 yrs time.

This is my big argument for B to offer the 737/752 replacement sooner rather than later.

AA won't replace old MD80s with older tech/heavier 738s forever, but with the sizeable MD80 and 752 fleet they have, combined with WNs 737 fleet, a 797 would be profitable just between these two carriers alone over a span of 10-15 years and complete fleet renewal. 700-1000 planes right there, including the oldest 737NGs by the end of the replacement plan.

As for the A300, people who love Airbus can defend AAs jets all they want, but it doesn't change the reality that while AA is profitable with them due to favorable lease terms/lack of suitable replacement, they are maintenance hogs and have been since the beginning. My only two experiences with them were early in AAs life with them, and it involved a completely canceled flight EWR-MIA after sitting on the plane for 2 hours with the jetway pulled back, then coming back the next day only to be delayed for MX again. My experience isn't gospel, but then you read story after story of similar instances, and ask the AA staff what they think (unreliable piece of garbage is what I hear from them), and you can sing the A300 praises all you want, but just don't tell AA.

The 783/788 would be a good replacement for the A300/763, but I'm not sure AA wants to have a fleet of shorter range 787s, as it makes makes fleet rotation harder. How inefficient is the 788 going to be if it also does missions in the 2000 mile range regularly? 763ERs do this kind of service regularly going from a major city, to a hub, to Europe, back to a further hub, to another major city, etc., going 1000 miles, then 4000 miles, then 5000 miles, then 1000 miles, etc.
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N1120A
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 2:57 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 33):
older tech/heavier 738s forever

Older tech? The 737NGs are in most ways the most advanced technology aircraft in their class. Yes, I understand what you are saying as compares to the 737NNG/797/whatever, but that is not clear

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 33):
The 783/788 would be a good replacement for the A300/763, but I'm not sure AA wants to have a fleet of shorter range 787s, as it makes makes fleet rotation harder. How inefficient is the 788 going to be if it also does missions in the 2000 mile range regularly? 763ERs do this kind of service regularly going from a major city, to a hub, to Europe, back to a further hub, to another major city, etc., going 1000 miles, then 4000 miles, then 5000 miles, then 1000 miles, etc.

The thing is, AA has their A300s in a higher density configuration due to the nature of the traffic, and hauls lots of cargo on those routes. The 787 will be much like a 767 on steroids as far as its flexibility goes, but putting lower density, tanked 788s on those short routes will limit AA's profit margins. Given that they will have full commonality with the 788s, except for thrust levels and fuel tanks/MTOW, it should not be all that much of an expense for AA to run 783s along with 788s
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
Spike
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 3:12 am

Moave airlines has the most planes by far. Soon to increase the fleet too.
 
tockeyhockey
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 3:19 am

i remember when i used to get drunk on maddog 80/80 when i was a kid. that stuff is awesome!
 
lazyshaun
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RE: Airline With The Largest Fleet Size?

Wed Sep 21, 2005 3:47 am

If we include franchises, then BA will also be in the running:
Comair(Africa): 15 737s
GeeBee: 11 A320s
4 A321s
Bmed:4 A320s
3 A321s
Citiexpress ??

that totals BA's fleet to 271.

Does anyone know the amount of aircraft CitiExpress operate? Trying to get to it on BA's website is like trying to find a needle in a haystack...
I came. I saw. I conquered