PRGLY
Topic Author
Posts: 387
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 5:55 pm

Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Tue Sep 20, 2005 11:21 pm

Just checking DCS and found foll routes of COPA their plan to operate with their new EMB jets
PTY-CTG
PTY-BAQ
PTY-SJO-SAP
PTY-MGA-GUA
PTY-SAL and
PTY-GYE
can somebody confirm these plans and give more routes planned
P.S. - what routes TAME is going to use EMB 170 recently delivered
thanks
just fly - it is nice
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:19 am

I'm sure they'll use the E190 for CTG and ADZ.
I guess that:
the SJO-SAP-SJO may be an evenning flight;
their MGA-GUA-MGA has very good yields so I don't think they downgrade it from B737-700/800 (unless they add another PTY-GUA flight evennings);
PTY-SAL-PTY seem to be the new evenning flight;
PTY-GYE-PTY may be a morning flight (then one plane would fly UIO another GYE);
POS flights next year (don't know if w/BGI or via CSS) will sure be with E190; and
by word in Brazil - they'll fly MAO with E190 2-3 times per week (the aircraft has aslo range for PTY-BEL-PTY).
I'm still waiting for those extra PAP/KIN flights (either together or sepatated) -I can't belive they still operate twice weekly!!
Would like to see CM E190/170 someday in CUR, AUA, STI (or PAP), PUJ, BZE, GCM, MAR, PMV, VLN, PZO, IQT, AQP, VVI, LPB (!), FLL, TPA, PBI, JAX, MSY, MTY, GDL, TLC...
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
N77014
Posts: 812
Joined: Sat Apr 17, 2004 7:16 pm

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 4:52 am

What the E-jet allows is the possibility of serving markets with more frequency than currently possible on the B737. That, in turn should create the basis for multiple banks from PTY, with the E-jets feeding long haul destinations like LAX, MIA, EZE, etc.
A new life awaits you in the Off-World Colonies...
 
juventus
Posts: 2017
Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2004 11:12 pm

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 5:52 am

Do they have the range to operate to Guadalajara or Monterrey? I would like to Copa expand a bit in Mexico.
 
PRGLY
Topic Author
Posts: 387
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 5:55 pm

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 5:55 am

Thanks for replies, I only forgot to mention PTY-ADZ which is already in GDS
just fly - it is nice
 
Avianca
Posts: 5270
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 6:24 am

what about splitting the daily MDE and the daily CLO flight into two daily each destination with the EMB?

Or isnt it possible due restrictions? (bileteral between panama and colombia)?

regards
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
Southamerica
Posts: 2298
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 2:56 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 6:33 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 5):
what about splitting the daily MDE and the daily CLO flight into two daily each destination with the EMB?

You answered your own question, the current Colombia-Panama bilateral does not allow it.

Still PTY-CLO and especially PTY-MDE are two routes for which 2 daily E-190s are simply not enough. The demand on both routes, especially the latter, is simply outstanding year-round.




SOUTHAMERICA
 
Avianca
Posts: 5270
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 6:56 am

Quoting SOUTHAMERICA (Reply 6):
The demand on both routes, especially the latter, is simply outstanding year-round.

yeah I noticed that, international travellers to and from medellin uses a lot Copa to avoid BOG. I compared the last days the fares, I noticed that the fares from MDE are much higher than the inbound fares to MDE...

regards
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:09 pm

Quoting Avianca (Reply 5):
what about splitting the daily MDE and the daily CLO flight into two daily each destination with the EMB?
Or isnt it possible due restrictions? (bileteral between panama and colombia)?

It has been mentioned a lot in this forum that CM wants more frecuencies and destinations in Colombia.
The current bilateral only allow CM to fly 5 daily to Colombian cities - and it doesn't apply to ADZ, CTG and - if they ever feel like it - SMR.
That's the reason you don't see PTY > MDE, CLO, BAQ twice daily and no PTY >BGA, PEI.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
luisca
Posts: 1530
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2001 11:37 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:20 pm

Quoting SOUTHAMERICA (Reply 6):
You answered your own question, the current Colombia-Panama bilateral does not allow it.

Still PTY-CLO and especially PTY-MDE are two routes for which 2 daily E-190s are simply not enough. The demand on both routes, especially the latter, is simply outstanding year-round.

you would probably need 2 daily with the 800 and posibly a third daily with the EMB, its amaizing that these flights do better than the PTY-BOG route!
If it ain't Boeing (or Embraer ;-)) I ain't Going!
 
RCS763AV
Posts: 3645
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2004 1:22 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:25 pm

Quoting Luisca (Reply 9):
you would probably need 2 daily with the 800 and posibly a third daily with the EMB, its amaizing that these flights do better than the PTY-BOG route!

No. Not that much. And they do better b/c they are only 1 flight and dont have 2 AV flights competing.

Anyway, what about PEI are they still planning/rumouring the route or what?
EMB190 3x a week would be awesome.
 
Southamerica
Posts: 2298
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 2:56 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:30 pm

Quoting RCS763AV (Reply 10):
No. Not that much.

Yes, they do, on a per-flight basis.

Obviously the PTY-BOG route, as a whole, is more profitable than PTY-MDE and PTY-CLO because they fly 2 times a day to BOG and only 1 to MDE/CLO.

But take only 1 of the flights to BOG, and compare it with the flight to MDE, and indeed, as I said, on a per-flight basis, PTY-MDE is more profitable than PTY-BOG for CM.



SOUTHAMERICA
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 12:43 pm

Quoting Juventus (Reply 3):
Do they have the range to operate to Guadalajara or Monterrey? I would like to Copa expand a bit in Mexico.

Both may be within the range, GDL might have problems with the altitude when flying to PTY, MTY (around 4h10m) with the distance, it could be really pushing the range. Also if ever considered TLC as a back-up E190 flight to the Mexico DF area would have problems with the TLC-PTY because of the altitude.
I'll be amazed if CM would ever fly VVI in Bolivia (around 4h40m) with E190.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
masseybrown
Posts: 4413
Joined: Wed Dec 11, 2002 2:40 pm

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 1:40 pm

I believe the E190AR has a range of 2300nm. This range would allow flights from Panama to places such as Chicago, Washington, Manaus, Belem, Arequippa, Santa Cruz (Bo), almost all of Mexico, and everything in between. Phoenix and Brasilia are just outside the range from PTY.

I can't believe Copa ordered the AR model just to increase frequencies on short-haul routes.
 
PRGLY
Topic Author
Posts: 387
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 5:55 pm

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 3:57 pm

To cfy their schedule more below some details
EFF 15DEC CM803/804 PTY-BAQ-PTY 1140-1250/1640-1755
CM740/741 PTY-SAL-PTY1945-2049/0640-0933
EFF 20DEC CM202/203 PTY-ADZ-PTY 1053-1200/1235-1338
CM415/416 PTY-CTG-PTY 1433-1538/1640-1745
CM300/301 PTY-GYE-PTY 2000-2159/0710-0911
EFF 15MAY CM711/710 PTY-MGA-GUA-MGA-PTY 1932-2147/0600-1005
EFF 15JUN CM866/865 PTY-SJO-SAP-SJO-PTY 1954-2205/0622-1021
P.S. I ve checked all destinations that all of you proposed and found nothing else, but there must be some other flights (most probably not finalized yet) that will fill up 9 hours gap for airframes starting eff 15MAY and 15JUN.
Also ground time in BAQ of 3 hours and 50 minutes seems to be too long.
just fly - it is nice
 
juventus
Posts: 2017
Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2004 11:12 pm

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 8:01 pm

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 12):
Both may be within the range, GDL might have problems with the altitude when flying to PTY, MTY (around 4h10m) with the distance, it could be really pushing the range

Thanx for the info. I think both GDL and MTY would be good additions if they ever take place. MEX is too congested, some passengers hate transitioning through it.
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Wed Sep 21, 2005 11:41 pm

Quoting Juventus (Reply 15):
Thanx for the info. I think both GDL and MTY would be good additions if they ever take place. MEX is too congested, some passengers hate transitioning through it.

I fly to GDL via IAH, regardless of all that US inmigration/customs hassle! It feels so good as long I'm not flying thru MEX.
For MTY may proven a better destination to fly first, the MTY - Latinamerica traffic seem to be larger than GLD - Latinamerica.

I would like to know if those E190 do have the range to fly non-stop to PTY from such high altitude airports like TLC, AQP and LPB.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
luisca
Posts: 1530
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2001 11:37 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Thu Sep 22, 2005 2:45 am

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 16):
I would like to know if those E190 do have the range to fly non-stop to PTY from such high altitude airports like TLC, AQP and LPB.

LBP will probably be a new 73G route once they get the ones they recently ordered. Altough type has not been specified, even if they are all 738's (as rumored) they can free up some 73G's.

I would think they would want to star fliying to GIG, Brasillia, etc.
I am sure that their es a major expansion coming next year, why else would you buy 16 new airplanes (12 EMBs and 4 737)
If it ain't Boeing (or Embraer ;-)) I ain't Going!
 
luisde8cd
Posts: 2444
Joined: Thu Aug 12, 2004 12:02 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Thu Sep 22, 2005 2:59 am

MAR desperately needs more Intl. flights. Maracaibo is Venezuela's largest city after Caracas and is the oil capital of Venezuela. It is very painful for people flying to Maracaibo to connect in CCS because the international terminal is separated from the domestic terminal, so you have to walk from one terminal to the other alongside the airport road. Imagine the chaos of walking around 500meters with luggage and rain. Also by the time most US flight hts arrive late in the evening (8PM-12AM) there is no chance to connect to any domestic destination. So pax have to either sleep at the airport or find a hotel to spend the night.

I think a E190 or even a 73G service between PTY and MAR will work great.

Saludos desde Caracas,
Luis
 
MGA
Posts: 717
Joined: Wed Mar 02, 2005 4:58 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Thu Sep 22, 2005 3:22 am

They should explore the posablility of extending a small route system from MGA (as continuation flights). They could bring back the PTY-MGA-MEX route and maybe conect Honduras and Nicaraua again (only Atlantic serves the route at the moment with a turbo prop). Anyway, I hope to fly on the E190 soon, I think it is a great choice for their company mentality and direction.

MGA
Que viva el guaro, el dinero y los aviones!!!
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Thu Sep 22, 2005 5:52 am

Quoting Luisde8cd (Reply 18):
MAR desperately needs more Intl. flights.

I Agree.

Quoting Luisde8cd (Reply 18):
I think a E190 or even a 73G service between PTY and MAR will work great.

Mostlikely a E190 first, maybe daily.
Don't know the exact details of the Panama - Venezuela bilateral if CM could fly to unlimited destinations in Venezuela, but sure it'll be great to see them in VLN, BRM, PMV, BLA and PZO.. those destinations don't need daily PTY E190/170 service, but a daily PTY-VLN-BRM-PTY - who knows?.
Any Venezuelan wish to comment?
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
LipeGIG
Posts: 5048
Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 7:33 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Thu Sep 22, 2005 8:17 am

Quoting Luisca (Reply 17):
I would think they would want to star fliying to GIG, Brasillia, etc.
I am sure that their es a major expansion coming next year, why else would you buy 16 new airplanes (12 EMBs and 4 737)

Probably MAO (inside E190 range) as Copa could offer connections even to the US (and LAB nowadays do not run a daily MAO-MIA). I think that, to fly PTY-GIG, Copa will wait for the development on the agreement between Gol, AF, DL and CO. If they can use this agreement, and some 737NG could be released from the routes where the E-jets replaces them, so Copa will be in a strong condition to fly to Rio de Janeiro.
BSB could be an extension of MAO flight, or with Gol code-share MAO-BSB.

Rgds,
Felipe
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
 
RCS763AV
Posts: 3645
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2004 1:22 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Thu Sep 22, 2005 10:06 am

Quoting SOUTHAMERICA (Reply 11):

I meant that those markets dont need so much flights.

Quoting Luisde8cd (Reply 18):
MAR desperately needs more Intl. flights.

Agree.

They should also start AUA and CUR...theyre a popular destination for travellers around the world.
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Thu Sep 22, 2005 10:42 am

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 21):
BSB could be an extension of MAO flight, or with Gol code-share MAO-BSB.

Given the kind of market BSB is, I doubt those ambassadors, ministers, senators, foreign and brazilian officials travelling on missions to/from BSB would appreciate a MAO stop.
Weird as it may sound, BSB would be better served wth B737-700 from the evenning hub hour (1930h departure) which means a 0330h BSB arrival.
I guess for BSB, CM would require a B737-700 with 20 bussines seats !
If CM was to fly MAO - BSB they could use the E190, but that plane is better used flying PTY - MAO - PTY from the morning hub departures (1000h) just like they do with their daytime LIM.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
luisca
Posts: 1530
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2001 11:37 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Thu Sep 22, 2005 11:06 am

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 23):
Given the kind of market BSB is, I doubt those ambassadors, ministers, senators, foreign and brazilian officials travelling on missions to/from BSB would appreciate a MAO stop.
Weird as it may sound, BSB would be better served wth B737-700 from the evenning hub hour (1930h departure) which means a 0330h BSB arrival.
I guess for BSB, CM would require a B737-700 with 20 bussines seats !
If CM was to fly MAO - BSB they could use the E190, but that plane is better used flying PTY - MAO - PTY from the morning hub departures (1000h) just like they do with their daytime LIM.

I understand that Panama has to first resolve a bilateral with Brazil, because it is currently restricted to MAO and GUR?

Im sure with te recent bilateral between Brazil and Colombia, a bilateral between Panama and Brazil and Panama and Colombia should be coming soon
If it ain't Boeing (or Embraer ;-)) I ain't Going!
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Thu Sep 22, 2005 12:38 pm

Quoting Luisca (Reply 24):
I understand that Panama has to first resolve a bilateral with Brazil, because it is currently restricted to MAO and GUR?

You're right, but forgot to mention GIG too.
The bilateral says GRU, GIG and MAO.
CM flying to BSB, SSA, BEL, FOR, REC, CNF, CWB, POA, CGB, whereverelse in Brazil.. and 5th freedom (to where?) will happen after a new bilateral is signed (this may happen very soon since CM is an Embraer aircraft customer).
I would guess If CM - without a new bilateral - wants to fly to SSA, REC and FOR; Brazil will say OK.. Brazil is trying to promote tourism in their Northern States.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
PRGLY
Topic Author
Posts: 387
Joined: Wed Dec 01, 2004 5:55 pm

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Thu Sep 22, 2005 8:01 pm

Quoting PRGLY (Reply 14):
but there must be some other flights (most probably not finalized yet) that will fill up 9 hours gap for airframes starting eff 15MAY and 15JUN.

One gap seems to be filled. CM will start second daily EMJ flight to GYE as follows:
CM273/2 PTY-GYE-PTY 1145-1315/1615-1815
still searching to fill up gap for the frame starting 15may
all your suggestion checked but found nothing, further ideas please
just fly - it is nice
 
LipeGIG
Posts: 5048
Joined: Tue May 03, 2005 7:33 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Fri Sep 23, 2005 2:04 am

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 23):
Given the kind of market BSB is, I doubt those ambassadors, ministers, senators, foreign and brazilian officials travelling on missions to/from BSB would appreciate a MAO stop.

Please remember that nowadays they accept a stop on south (GRU or GIG), what CM will offer is a much more quickly connection. And if CM use to stop at MAO, it gives to ambassadors, ministers, a saving of at least 4 hours.
The Biz demand in BSB is strong but loads for RG domestic biz were always terrible (BSB is no more than 10% biz seats solds on RG network).
Also, 3:30 to 7 am is not a good time for connections at BSB, better a night flight (using the 10 AM connections from PTY).
MAO is a fast option as well as Rio, BSB as per the nowadays rules, need to wait for a new bilateral.

Felipe
New York + Rio de Janeiro = One of the best combinations !
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Fri Sep 23, 2005 2:45 am

Quoting LipeGIG (Reply 27):
The Biz demand in BSB is strong but loads for RG domestic biz were always terrible (BSB is no more than 10% biz seats solds on RG network).
Also, 3:30 to 7 am is not a good time for connections at BSB, better a night flight (using the 10 AM connections from PTY).

Even with the kind of BSB Biz passengers, one can't compare the Biz demand for domestic flights to/from BSB with a Biz demand on a international flight which may operate out of BSB, specially if that "dream flight" does offer lots of connecting possibilities at the airline's hub.
I'm guessing CM would better use a B737-700 for BSB if they were to fly PTY 1930 - BSB 0315+ // BSB 0530 - PTY 0930, 3 times per week to daily. I agree that those BSB times aren't the best for domestic connections and I don't know how many flights operate @ BSB between 0200 and 0630; but I would think at least the GYN passengers wouldn't mind those times that much.
An international flight @ BSB would also serve the GYN market.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
Avianca
Posts: 5270
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Fri Sep 23, 2005 3:54 am

Quoting Luisca (Reply 9):
you would probably need 2 daily with the 800 and posibly a third daily with the EMB, its amaizing that these flights do better than the PTY-BOG route!

the CLO-PTY and MDE-PTY are doeing so good due the function of PTY as a hub + they are offering good fares compared to Avianca to some southamerican citys (but still high...)

regards
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
Southamerica
Posts: 2298
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 2:56 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Fri Sep 23, 2005 4:18 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 29):
the CLO-PTY and MDE-PTY are doeing so good due the function of PTY as a hub + they are offering good fares compared to Avianca to some southamerican citys (but still high...)

That's only part of the success of the MDE/CLO-PTY routes. There's also quite a considerable amount of O&D traffic between Medellin/Cali and Panama City solely [again, more from Medellin]. Commercial activities make the planes go out full not only with passengers, but also with cargo.



SOUTHAMERICA
 
Avianca
Posts: 5270
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Fri Sep 23, 2005 4:23 am

Quoting SOUTHAMERICA (Reply 30):
That's only part of the success of the MDE/CLO-PTY routes. There's also quite a considerable amount of O&D traffic between Medellin/Cali and Panama City solely [again, more from Medellin]. Commercial activities make the planes go out full not only with passengers, but also with cargo.

thats true... what is intresting is that the german Airline LTU is coloading also freight on the CLO,MDE flights with origin of germany /europe. They send the freight on there flights to PUJ and than they truck the freight down to SDQ and make the interline to Copa and they are sending the freight on the flights via PTY.

regards
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Fri Sep 23, 2005 7:06 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 31):
what is intresting is that the german Airline LTU is coloading also freight on the CLO,MDE flights with origin of germany /europe. They send the freight on there flights to PUJ and than they truck the freight down to SDQ and make the interline to Copa and they are sending the freight on the flights via PTY

I would think that for sometime now, someone @ CM has been studying if PTY-PUJ-PTY E190/170 service might be profitable.
Panama and Dominican Republic do have open skies; To see PUJ, LRM, STI or POP in CM network? - It could happen.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
Avianca
Posts: 5270
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Fri Sep 23, 2005 7:09 am

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 32):
PUJ

would say PUJ would be the prefered new Dominican destination....

PUJ had a good cargo baseload + many leisure passengers from north south-america (colombia)

regards
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
Avianca
Posts: 5270
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Fri Sep 23, 2005 7:14 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 31):
They send the freight on there flights to PUJ and than they truck the freight down to SDQ and make the interline to Copa and they are sending the freight on the flights via PTY

I forgot, in the past when CM had still the B737 freighter, LTU had an exclusive ( I think weekly) cargo flight from SDQ to PTY and some other destinations....
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Fri Sep 23, 2005 7:27 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 33):
PUJ had a good cargo baseload + many leisure passengers from north south-america (colombia

CM seems to like business destinations better. The PUJ cargo traffic may look attractive and if they could get some PUJ O/D non-leisure traffic they may be set. That could be the case too if they want to fly to POP or STI.

Quoting Avianca (Reply 34):
I forgot, in the past when CM had still the B737 freighter, LTU had an exclusive ( I think weekly) cargo flight from SDQ to PTY and some other destinations....

I think CM really needs a cargo B737NG and if it's a -900 better for them.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
Southamerica
Posts: 2298
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 2:56 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Fri Sep 23, 2005 7:57 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 33):
PUJ had a good cargo baseload + many leisure passengers from north south-america (colombia)

Remember that AV already flies BOG-PUJ once a week; just the right amount of flights for the demand.



SOUTHAMERICA
 
EddieDude
Posts: 6175
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2003 10:19 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Fri Sep 23, 2005 12:36 pm

Does anyone think that maybe OAX, HUX, TGZ and CZM could work?
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Fri Sep 23, 2005 11:58 pm

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 37):
Does anyone think that maybe OAX, HUX, TGZ and CZM could work?

After CM is to fly daily to CUN and if they see a demand, I guess they will study CZM, HUX and MID.
Other than MTY and GDL, I would think they would study TLC and/or PBC (as MEX back-ups) plus BJX and ZCL (depending what kind of marktets those are)
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
luisca
Posts: 1530
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2001 11:37 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Sat Sep 24, 2005 12:58 am

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 38):
After CM is to fly daily to CUN and if they see a demand, I guess they will study CZM, HUX and MID.
Other than MTY and GDL, I would think they would study TLC and/or PBC (as MEX back-ups) plus BJX and ZCL (depending what kind of marktets those are)

From what I understand CM will downgrade the CUN route to an EMB190 that would free up a 73G for new flights, But Panama needs to move fast to secure a bilateral with Colombia and Brazil. Also I wonder if they ever plan on oppening Montevideo or Cordoba.

Also a little bird told me that LPB/Santa Cruz will be there next South American destination. The expansion between Colombia and PTY will probably be done thru Aerorepublica, which should start PTY-MED CLO PER flights soon.

To are Colombian Freinds, any news on fleet changes in Aerorepublica. Its always been romored that it would be EMB190-195, any info on that?
If it ain't Boeing (or Embraer ;-)) I ain't Going!
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Sat Sep 24, 2005 2:05 am

Quoting Luisca (Reply 39):
Also I wonder if they ever plan on oppening Montevideo or Cordoba.

The new Panama-Argentina bilateral makes room for CM flights to COR, MDZ and ROS; Don't know if they could add SLA and TUC too.
There seems to be a demand for international flights out of major Argentine cites and LA and LB just don't offer enough connections. I can't confirm this but it looks that 80% of LA's ROS-SCL-ROS traffic is connecting to/from Northamerica.
CM Argentine routes won't be E190, not even SLA is within PTY range.
There may be a market for MVD, but CM should be very cautious with B737-700 utilization there. The way the hub hours are set, a MVD flight would mean having a plane at least 7hours on the tarmac in Uruguay. If flown PTY-MVD would be the longest B737-700 regular commecial flight.
ASU from is another interesting possibility and a Panama-Paraguay bilateral was just signed some weeks ago.

Quote:
Also a little bird told me that LPB/Santa Cruz will be there next South American destination

E190 LPB - PTY non-stop? I don't think so. PTY-LPB-VVI-PTY w/E190 maybe,
PTY - VVI is within E190 range. But I think a PTY-AQP-LPB and a PTY-VVI both w/190 look more interesting... Would really like to know if a E190 could do CUZ-PTY non-stop.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
luisca
Posts: 1530
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2001 11:37 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Sat Sep 24, 2005 2:15 am

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 40):
E190 LPB - PTY non-stop? I don't think so. PTY-LPB-VVI-PTY w/E190 maybe,
PTY - VVI is within E190 range. But I think a PTY-AQP-LPB and a PTY-VVI both w/190 look more interesting... Would really like to know if a E190 could do CUZ-PTY non-stop.

It wouldnt be with a EMB but with a 73G, remember once the EMB start serving low yeild markets like CUN, CTG, ADZ a lot of 73Gs will be free, these will presumably be used to start new routes or add capacity to existing high yeild routes (SCL, EZE, GUR)

[Edited 2005-09-23 19:30:18]
If it ain't Boeing (or Embraer ;-)) I ain't Going!
 
EddieDude
Posts: 6175
Joined: Fri Nov 14, 2003 10:19 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Sat Sep 24, 2005 3:46 am

Can't believe CM is downgrading CUN. I would have thought that CM was the airline of choice for South Americans who want to fly to CUN because of the smart connection times and the attractive fares.
Next flights: MEX-LAX AM 738, LAX-PVG DL 77L, SHA-PEK CA 789, PEK-PVG CA A332, PVG-ORD MU 77W, ORD-MEX AM 738
 
Avianca
Posts: 5270
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Sat Sep 24, 2005 4:01 am

Quoting Luisca (Reply 39):
which should start PTY-MED CLO PER flights soon

arent they already selling seats on PTY-MDE ?

regarsd
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
Southamerica
Posts: 2298
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 2:56 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Sat Sep 24, 2005 4:34 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 43):
arent they already selling seats on PTY-MDE ?

They are. The flights were loaded a couple of weeks ago. AeroRepublica will operate a daily MD-8X on a triagle routing CLO-MDE-PTY-CLO as of Nov01. CM has obviously placed its code on the flights.



SOUTHAMERICA
 
Avianca
Posts: 5270
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Sat Sep 24, 2005 4:37 am

Quoting SOUTHAMERICA (Reply 44):
They are. The flights were loaded a couple of weeks ago. AeroRepublica will operate a daily MD-8X on a triagle routing CLO-MDE-PTY-CLO as of Nov01. CM has obviously placed its code on the flights.

yeah I noticed that some weeks ago, when I checked MDE-PTY-MDE fares...

AeroRepublica seems to be the cheapest in the colombia - panama market.
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
2travel2know
Posts: 2236
Joined: Sun Apr 10, 2005 7:05 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:11 am

Quoting EddieDude (Reply 42):
Can't believe CM is downgrading CUN. I would have thought that CM was the airline of choice for South Americans who want to fly to CUN because of the smart connection times and the attractive fares.

The CM CUN route suffers the same problems the flights to CTG, MCO and now ADZ do. Maybe goodloads but with poor yields. Those are leisure markets (except for passengers originating MCO). The E190 it's going to be ideal for those and all other "leisure" destinations CM may add.
The edge CM will have with its flights to CUN will be frequency - not if they fly there on a B737, frecuency = flexible trips for the passengers.
Another point to consider when it comes to CUN, many Latinamericans do need visas to go to Mexico.
I don't work for COPA Airlines!
 
Southamerica
Posts: 2298
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 2:56 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Sat Sep 24, 2005 5:38 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 45):
AeroRepublica seems to be the cheapest in the colombia - panama market.

That's the price of flying a triangle routing instead of nonstops from each MDE and CLO. But they don't have the aircraft availabiity to do it, and the recent additions to the fleet have been instantly programmed for an increased domestic operation.

The plans, as far as I know, is to see how the initial CLO-MDE-PTY route developes during the upcoming year's end, and, subject to results, we could see them flying MDE-PTY and CLO-PTY independently. In fact, they have also expressed interest in flying MDE-CLO, which is, among Colombia's trunk routes, the one which most feels the lack of a competitor like AeroRepublica. The numbers and passengers are there to support another carrier.



SOUTHAMERICA
 
luisca
Posts: 1530
Joined: Thu Aug 16, 2001 11:37 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Sat Sep 24, 2005 7:28 am

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 46):
Another point to consider when it comes to CUN, many Latinamericans do need visas to go to Mexico

That's not really a problem, getting a mexican visa is the easiest thing to do.

Quoting SOUTHAMERICA (Reply 47):
The plans, as far as I know, is to see how the initial CLO-MDE-PTY route developes during the upcoming year's end, and, subject to results, we could see them flying MDE-PTY and CLO-PTY independently. In fact, they have also expressed interest in flying MDE-CLO, which is, among Colombia's trunk routes, the one which most feels the lack of a competitor like AeroRepublica. The numbers and passengers are there to support another carrier.

I guess these flights will be in the morning bank to PTY, because CM's flights to MDE CLO are in the evening bank out of PTY.
If it ain't Boeing (or Embraer ;-)) I ain't Going!
 
RCS763AV
Posts: 3645
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2004 1:22 am

RE: Copa Proposed Routes With New EMB Jets

Sun Sep 25, 2005 8:20 am

Quoting 2travel2know (Reply 46):
The CM CUN route suffers the same problems the flights to CTG, MCO and now ADZ do. Maybe goodloads but with poor yields

Also, at least from Colombia and Venezuela, there are a nice number of charters to CUN which take away a lot of connecting pax.