797
Topic Author
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Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Sat Sep 24, 2005 12:25 am

Hello guys,

Probably this subject has already been discussed, but I couldn't find anything regarding to it.

Yesterday I met with 3 Venezuelan A.netters (Chiguire, Luisde8cd and BA747). Luis recently went to SXM and told me that he was behind the fence just when an AA 757 was about to take off. He decided to back off a little bit because he was with his little cousin, but a drunk guy stood at the fence waiting for the a/c to depart. Luis told me that when the a/c pushed the throttle, all the sand started to fly towards him. All those pieces of sand caused a little pain on him, but he also said that the drunk guy was screaming "It Hurts!". Supposedly, the heat coming out from the engines is very high and strong, and Luis compared to a huge hair-dryer blowing towards your face. Also he said that the water from the beach went back because the thrust caused like a hole due to its power.

So, my question is, if this powerful thrust was form a 757, how could a 747's be?

Could this actually burn your skin or cause serious damage?

Hope you guys say NO, because I'm dying to go to Maho Beach and stand behind a 747!!!  bouncy 

Oh, by the way, Luis told me that this can't be done:

http://www.flightlevel350.com/viewer.php?id=210

....And, that this is impossible (the part is the two guys holding to the fence when the AF A340 takes off):

http://www.flightlevel350.com/viewer.php?id=3296

Saludos!
Flying isn't dangerous. Crashing is what's dangerous!
 
ACYWG
Posts: 259
Joined: Thu Feb 17, 2005 7:20 am

RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Sat Sep 24, 2005 1:02 am

Quoting 797 (Thread starter):


So, my question is, if this powerful thrust was form a 757, how could a 747's be?

In theory it wouldn't be any worse really. The engines on a 747 aren't much more powerful, theres just more of them.
 
TPASXM787
Posts: 1667
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Sat Sep 24, 2005 1:08 am

I don't know that standing behind it is a great idea, but I doubt anything terribly serious would happen. So far as spotting and taking pics, there's no where else like it:

This is the Last Stop.
 
Venezuela747
Posts: 1374
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Sat Sep 24, 2005 1:08 am

The question you should be asking youself is it worth the pain........of course, it's a once in a lifetime opportunity

BTW, it has been discussed before here it is http://www.airliners.net/discussions...general_aviation/read.main/2193468

[Edited 2005-09-23 18:10:32]
ROLL TIDE!!!
 
JHSfan
Posts: 460
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Sun Sep 25, 2005 11:34 pm

Quoting 797 (Thread starter):
So, my question is, if this powerful thrust was form a 757, how could a 747's be?

Based on the Airplane Characteristics for Airport Planning manuals from Boeing for 747 and 757, I have made a picture showing the Jet engine exhaust velocity contours at takeoff thrust. Using page 151 in the 747-400 manual and page 113 from 757 manual I have merged the two footprints. Size is 72,7 KB, dimensions are 5541 x 2282 pixels and format is PNG. Blue is the contours forn 747 and green is for 757. Please notice that I have used data for the 757-200, not the -300. Feel free to make a picture with -300 instead.  Smile
A rough estimation of the distance from the fence at Maho Beach to a 747 or a 757 waiting to take off is 20-40 meters.
Jet engine exhaust velocity contours at takeoff thrust.

Quoting 797 (Thread starter):
Could this actually burn your skin or cause serious damage?

My answer concerning temperature, based on Boeing's manual, is NO, if the exposure to the exhaust do not last to long.

Yours in realtime
JHSfan
Look at me, I´m riding high, I´m the airbornmaster of the sky...
 
AlitaliaMD11
Posts: 3704
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Sun Sep 25, 2005 11:59 pm

I have experienced the blast of sand before at Lanzarote with an MD-11. You just have to turn around and face the ocean or duck behind something!

It doesn't hurt THAT much. I have also experienced it at JFK standing next to the take off line.

[Edited 2005-09-25 17:17:46]
No Vueling No Party
 
panaman
Posts: 398
Joined: Thu Sep 02, 1999 2:24 pm

RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 1:22 am

Its fine, watch out driving behind it. So toursit did that a few weeks ago and it damaged the rental car.
Sorry I moved from SXM, looking for a new house on Anguilla now!
 
AJO
Posts: 485
Joined: Fri Jan 21, 2005 9:55 pm

RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 4:02 am

There have been cases of injuries due to the jetblast of departing aircraft:
See the following thread:
SXM Liable For Injury Due To Jetblast (by AJO Mar 24 2005 in Civil Aviation)
bla
 
Guest

RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 4:37 am

Quoting 797 (Thread starter):
Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

No it isn't. You will die if you do it. I have heard stories of little girls being blown out in the ocean and eaten by mutant robot sea snakes in front of horrified onlookers.

It will rip your flesh clean off. That's why there's so many deformed monster skeleton people walking around St Maarten.

In other words, it's fine.

Go have fun.

B

[Edited 2005-09-25 21:39:31]
 
Airbuff
Posts: 136
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 4:48 am

Too funny, nonrevking.... Smile
Where am I going, and why am I in this handbasket?
 
ahlfors
Posts: 1281
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 10:12 am

I've stood behind B757s, A340s, and a B747 at SXM, and I must say that when standing right behind the centerline, the B757 packs the meanest punch... but man is it FUN!

I found that if you're right at the fence, it won't hurt much (keep your eyes closed though), though there might be a tiny bit of loose gravel, and I got a small cut once. However, if your closer to the sand, you get sand blasted, which a) hurts, and b) covers your body afterwards.

So as long as you are healthy and strong enough to hold your own weight, you should have a problem. The force is not as strong as gravity, so if you can hang from a horizontal bar for 15 seconds without letting go, it's not going to blow you away. But DO HOLD ON!

As for the heat, if you stand behind 10 in a row, your probably in for about the equivalent of a mild sunburn, so enjoy in moderation.
 
airbusfanyyz
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 10:18 am

I guess that depends on who's flying in that day.  Wink

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Kazim Alikhan - t.dot photography


apologies for the shameless plug.

Cheers,
Kaz
 
jetdeltamsy
Posts: 2688
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 10:19 am

Safe? No way. Thrilling? You bet!
Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
 
797
Topic Author
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 10:39 am

Quoting NonRevKing (Reply 8):

LOL!!!  bigthumbsup 
Flying isn't dangerous. Crashing is what's dangerous!
 
Longhornmaniac
Posts: 2967
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:01 pm

Quoting Ahlfors (Reply 10):
(keep your eyes closed though),

theoretically...if your at SXM, your going to do some amount of swimming. And in saltwater, if you plan to look at anything underwater, goggles are a good idea. Why not just stand there with goggles?!?!  Wink (you may look like a retard, but who the hell cares)
Cheers,
Cameron
 
797
Topic Author
Posts: 1386
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:51 am

RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:13 pm

Quoting Longhornmaniac (Reply 14):
Why not just stand there with goggles?!?! (you may look like a retard, but who the hell cares)

Ha! very smart idea! But you'd be the make-me-laugh of all the spotters there... So, imagine that someone takes a pic of a jet landing and accidentally your head comes up in the image, and eventually it's posted on A.net!  banghead   bomb  OUCH!

So... some people might care after all!!!

Saludos!
Flying isn't dangerous. Crashing is what's dangerous!
 
ANITIX87
Posts: 2958
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:18 pm

Quoting 797 (Thread starter):
Oh, by the way, Luis told me that this can't be done:

http://www.flightlevel350.com/viewer.php?id=210

....And, that this is impossible (the part is the two guys holding to the fence when the AF A340 takes off):

http://www.flightlevel350.com/viewer.php?id=3296

Then how were the videos made I wonder...

TIS
www.stellaryear.com: Canon EOS 50D, Canon EOS 5DMkII, Sigma 50mm 1.4, Canon 24-70 2.8L II, Canon 100mm 2.8L, Canon 100-4
 
Longhornmaniac
Posts: 2967
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2005 2:33 pm

RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:20 pm

Quoting 797 (Reply 15):
Quoting Longhornmaniac (Reply 14):
Why not just stand there with goggles?!?! (you may look like a retard, but who the hell cares)

Ha! very smart idea! But you'd be the make-me-laugh of all the spotters there... So, imagine that someone takes a pic of a jet landing and accidentally your head comes up in the image, and eventually it's posted on A.net! OUCH!

So... some people might care after all!!!

Saludos!

LOL, true, that would be quite embarassing. I'd roll over laughing if I saw somebody doing that. Maybe I'll be the first, hopefully I can make it to SXM sometime before I die.  Smile
Cheers,
Cameron
 
797
Topic Author
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Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:51 am

RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:35 pm

Quoting Longhornmaniac (Reply 17):
hopefully I can make it to SXM sometime before I die

I think SXM is a MUST place for all A.netters
Flying isn't dangerous. Crashing is what's dangerous!
 
MarshalN
Posts: 1474
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2005 9:39 am

RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:45 pm

Quoting 797 (Reply 18):
I think SXM is a MUST place for all A.netters

Standing in Kowloon City under the flight path, looking up through the buildings at the belly of a 744 about to land is almost just as good  Smile
 
September11
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 1:18 pm

this raises my question:

were there any airplane mishaps at SXM?

I did Airliners.net photo search -- there are no SXM incident photos (especially photos of jets after crash landing).

To me, looks like SXM is accident-free spot.
Airliners.net of the Future
 
Molykote
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 1:29 pm

Quoting September11 (Reply 20):
this raises my question:

were there any airplane mishaps at SXM?

I did Airliners.net photo search -- there are no SXM incident photos (especially photos of jets after crash landing).

To me, looks like SXM is accident-free spot.

I was told while in SXM (July '05) that the fence was hit twice by the same Air France pilot on approach. I have no other basis for touting this as true but I may have seen it mentioned on the a.net forums before.
Speedtape - The aspirin of aviation!
 
Runway31
Posts: 72
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 4:37 pm

As far as I am aware it is not compulsory to stand directly behind aircraft hanging on to the fence to get the full effect of the jet blast. It is therefore safe to say that if you use your brain it will tell you to stand back and keep away from the fence to ensure your safety.
 
JHSfan
Posts: 460
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Mon Sep 26, 2005 7:29 pm

Quoting September11 (Reply 20):
were there any airplane mishaps at SXM?

A Twotter crashed years ago  Sad Airdisaster.com
But since then SXM has not had any crashes  Smile

My conclusion is that Maho beach is not an unsafe place.
But we humans continue to be mortal.... nothing is going to change that EVER!

Quoting Molykote (Reply 21):
I was told while in SXM (July '05) that the fence was hit twice by the same Air France pilot on approach.

Maybe that AF pilot was a former French navy fighter pilot, used to land on aircraft carriers Big grin

- JHSfan
Look at me, I´m riding high, I´m the airbornmaster of the sky...
 
797
Topic Author
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Tue Sep 27, 2005 5:08 am

Quoting Longhornmaniac (Reply 17):
hopefully I can make it to SXM sometime before I die.

I told my uncle about it (he has a small airplane) and showed him the holding-fence video and the only thing he said was: We must take gloves!

Wohoooo!!!!  bouncy 
Flying isn't dangerous. Crashing is what's dangerous!
 
CaptOveur
Posts: 6064
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RE: Is It Safe To Spot At SXM?

Tue Sep 27, 2005 5:19 am

If you are too chicken just don't go.

I am guessing there are a few flights there a day.. go to the first one, get a feel for things, then determine where you want to stand.
Things were better when it was two guys in a dorm room.