md90fan
Posts: 2798
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 11:15 am

How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Tue Sep 27, 2005 10:32 pm

To date the MD-10 conversion/upgrade has only got one costumer and that has been FedEx (FX)  candle . How come no one else has brought it and why???  Confused . Maybe there are some potential customers??? like NW,JL, Biman but the foremost two are retiring there birds soon. Can someone help me out on this please???

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Chris Coduto
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Sokol Ymeri


-Devan  airplane 
http://www.devanwells.blogspot.com/
 
eatmybologna
Posts: 375
Joined: Sat Apr 30, 2005 3:21 am

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Tue Sep 27, 2005 10:38 pm

MD90fan,

what exactly does the conversion/upgrade entail. Is it a DC-10 to MD-10 changeover?

Thanks,

e-m-b
Isn't knowledge more than just the acquisition of information? Shouldn't the acquired information be correct?
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Tue Sep 27, 2005 10:43 pm

The reason FX did the MD-10 conversion is because they have large fleets of both MD-11s and DC-10s and wanted to have a common type rating among them so they didn't have to fly around with a third pilot. As a cargo carrier, they are able to fly older aircraft up to the last cycle as cargo doesn't care how old the plane is and they can charge basically whatever they want for fuel surcharges, as the whole industry will follow suit. Passenger carriers don't operate nearly the same sized fleets and are generally at the end of the life span for their DC-10s. This means there is little point in spending the millions on conversion, as there will not be a good ROI
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
EMBQA
Posts: 7798
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 3:52 am

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Tue Sep 27, 2005 10:44 pm

First, I think FedX owns the STC to the MD-10 conversion, so if another operator wanted do the conversion, they would need to pay FedX. Second, with so few DC-10's left flying in commercial service and their limited life span left in commercial service, the cost savings is not there to do it for the airline.

[Edited 2005-09-27 15:47:01]
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Tue Sep 27, 2005 10:55 pm

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 3):
First, I think FedX owns the STC to the MD-10 conversion, so if another operator wanted do the conversion, they would need to pay FedX.

Last I checked, SR Technics were the ones who do the conversion, not FedEx, so it is not only available to FedEx

Quoting Eatmybologna (Reply 1):
what exactly does the conversion/upgrade entail. Is it a DC-10 to MD-10 changeover?

Basically, the conversion is one to change the DC-10 cockpit from a fully analog, 3 crew flight deck to an EFIS glass flight deck with 2 crew. This cockpit is pretty much identical to that of the MD-11 and allows a common type rating (though many have said that the differences in flying dynamics between the two types are so great that they should still not have a common type rating)
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
md90fan
Posts: 2798
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 11:15 am

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Tue Sep 27, 2005 11:13 pm

Quoting Eatmybologna (Reply 1):
MD90fan,

what exactly does the conversion/upgrade entail. Is it a DC-10 to MD-10 changeover?

Well N1120 beat me to it. But yeah basically it is a cockpit upgrade available for the DC-10.
http://www.devanwells.blogspot.com/
 
EMBQA
Posts: 7798
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 3:52 am

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Tue Sep 27, 2005 11:21 pm

Quoting N1120A (Reply 4):
Last I checked, SR Technics were the ones who do the conversion, not FedEx

I never said FedX did the conversion, just that I thought they owned the STC on it. When the program first started in 1997, the planes were sent out to Goodyear, AZ. I was in Amarillo, TX when FedX started flying the retired AA DC-10's out of there to be converted. I also did a search and found that FedX owns an STC that allows them to convert their DC-10's to an 'EFIS' flight Deck. It's dosn't say a lot, but this might be it.

[Edited 2005-09-27 16:32:09]
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Tue Sep 27, 2005 11:38 pm

Quoting EMBQA (Reply 6):
Quoting N1120A (Reply 4):
Last I checked, SR Technics were the ones who do the conversion, not FedEx

I never said FedX did the conversion, just that I thought they owned the STC on it. When the program first started in 1997, the planes were sent out to Goodyear, AZ. I was in Amarillo, TX when FedX started flying the retired AA DC-10's out of there to be converted. I also did a search and found that FedX owns an STC that allows them to convert their DC-10's to an 'EFIS' flight Deck. It's dosn't say a lot, but this might be it.

FedEx may have an STC for the conversion, but that doesn't preclude others from applying for the same.
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
EMBQA
Posts: 7798
Joined: Sat Oct 25, 2003 3:52 am

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Wed Sep 28, 2005 12:06 am

Quoting N1120A (Reply 7):
FedEx may have an STC for the conversion, but that doesn't preclude others from applying for the same.

....and I never said other airlines are precluded from performing the conversion. Only that since FedX owns the STC, they must pay FedX a fee to use the STC. This is the same with the CFM-56 powered DC-8's. UPS bought the STC from the company that first started it. If you now want to convert your DC-8 to CFM-56's, you better call UPS and break out the check book.

[Edited 2005-09-27 17:13:08]
"It's not the size of the dog in the fight, but the size of the fight in the dog"
 
md90fan
Posts: 2798
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 11:15 am

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Wed Sep 28, 2005 7:57 am

Does anybody know if Omni Air Int'l (OY),Ceilos de Peru (A2), DAS Cargo(WD) might be potential costumers because they all operate a number of DC-10's???
http://www.devanwells.blogspot.com/
 
Avianca
Posts: 5283
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Wed Sep 28, 2005 8:00 am

Quoting MD90fan (Reply 9):
Does anybody know if Omni Air Int'l (OY),Ceilos de Peru (A2), DAS Cargo(WD) might be potential costumers because they all operate a number of DC-10's

I would say, no because the fleets are to small.

regards
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
flyf15
Posts: 6633
Joined: Tue May 18, 1999 11:10 am

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Wed Sep 28, 2005 8:09 am

I wonder if the USAF would look into this for their KC-10 fleet. Although, I somehow doubt it...
 
md90fan
Posts: 2798
Joined: Fri Jul 29, 2005 11:15 am

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Wed Sep 28, 2005 8:19 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 10):

I would say, no because the fleets are to small

I was thinking that when I posted because maybe these operators dont want to spend money on these aircraft as they may be replaced soon, with newer,more modern aircraft. But maybe the USAF will get some sort of avionics upgrade and/or engine up grade in the future sort of like what the Netherlands AF got Fokker to upgrade the cockpits oon their ex. UA KC/DC-10
http://www.devanwells.blogspot.com/
 
HAJFlyer
Posts: 1349
Joined: Fri Sep 16, 2005 7:34 pm

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:29 pm

OT:

Does anyone know whether the B727-100 conversion that UPS carried out (equipping the planes with RR Tay engines instead of PW JTD8s) worked out for them from an economical perspective ?


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Derek Hellmann



Considering that a substantial number of these aircraft are now parked in Roswell one would assume that UPS is not thoroughly satisfied with the performance of the B727-100 (QF)

Why did no other airlines with sizable B721 fleets (e.g. Amerijet)follow suit ?
 
LifelinerOne
Posts: 1501
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2003 10:30 pm

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Thu Sep 29, 2005 2:45 am

Quoting N1120A (Reply 4):
Last I checked, SR Technics were the ones who do the conversion, not FedEx, so it is not only available to FedEx

Stork Aerospace will be updating the Royal Netherlands Air Force's 2 KDC-10's and DC-10-30CF into a "glass" 2-men cockpit.

Cheers!  wave 
Only Those Who Sleep Don't Make Mistakes
 
Tod
Posts: 1709
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 6:51 am

RE: How Come No One Has Got The MD-10 Upgrade?

Thu Sep 29, 2005 3:01 am

Quoting N1120A (Reply 7):
FedEx may have an STC for the conversion, but that doesn't preclude others from applying for the same.

Technically it does not preclude anyone else from applying for an STC, but in practical terms it may be cheaper to pay FedEx a royality than to seek your own STC.

Popular Searches On Airliners.net

Top Photos of Last:   24 Hours  •  48 Hours  •  7 Days  •  30 Days  •  180 Days  •  365 Days  •  All Time

Military Aircraft Every type from fighters to helicopters from air forces around the globe

Classic Airliners Props and jets from the good old days

Flight Decks Views from inside the cockpit

Aircraft Cabins Passenger cabin shots showing seat arrangements as well as cargo aircraft interior

Cargo Aircraft Pictures of great freighter aircraft

Government Aircraft Aircraft flying government officials

Helicopters Our large helicopter section. Both military and civil versions

Blimps / Airships Everything from the Goodyear blimp to the Zeppelin

Night Photos Beautiful shots taken while the sun is below the horizon

Accidents Accident, incident and crash related photos

Air to Air Photos taken by airborne photographers of airborne aircraft

Special Paint Schemes Aircraft painted in beautiful and original liveries

Airport Overviews Airport overviews from the air or ground

Tails and Winglets Tail and Winglet closeups with beautiful airline logos