Boeing777/747
Topic Author
Posts: 543
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2001 6:07 am

Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Sun Oct 02, 2005 5:02 am

What's the future for PH-KBX Fokker 70? Shall the Dutch goverment keep on flying the Fokker 70 or shall it be replaced by a Boeing or Airbus?


Modified Airliner Photos:
Click here for bigger photo!
Design © Lila Design
Template © Lila Design

 
MH017
Posts: 1473
Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2005 4:17 am

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Sun Oct 02, 2005 5:09 am

It WILL stay with the Fokker F70 for the forseeable future, no replacement planned (as yet)...
don't throw away tomorrow !
 
keesje
Posts: 8747
Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2001 2:08 am

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Sun Oct 02, 2005 5:13 am

Purely objective something with transatlantic range should be more praticle.

However no one dares to explain the big sober dutch public why they have to spend 70 million on that while cutting other social / educational / healthcare budgets.

Media would immediately jump on it & place an interior photo next to an archive picture of a junky mother carrying a small kid.

We are an anti authoritarian society you see.
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
sabenapilot
Posts: 2442
Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2000 6:18 pm

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Sun Oct 02, 2005 5:30 am

And then to say that in Belgium, the southern neighbour of The Netherlands of roughly similar size and population, the governement has 2 A310s!!!

Kleine Belgen, grote toestellen! :p

sorry just couldn't resist!


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Ivan Coninx - Brussels Aviation Photography




View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Botterman Bram

 
User avatar
viasa
Posts: 1432
Joined: Sat Jun 18, 2005 10:29 pm

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Sun Oct 02, 2005 6:00 am

Why this speculations about a replacement of the F70?
 
Boeing777/747
Topic Author
Posts: 543
Joined: Thu Dec 20, 2001 6:07 am

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Sun Oct 02, 2005 6:05 am

True Keesje about that "anti authoritian society", but you are right a bigger plane for longer routes would be better. I think the Belgians do that better (I agree with Sabenapilot). Why isn't our Queen's plane under military registration? Why is our 1st Jet not wearing RNLAF roundels? We should be proud again to our military like the British and Americans for example!

Maybe it would be an idea the Queen takes a Fokker 100 with extra fuel tanks...?

Although I'm a big Fokker fan it looks a bit silly to see the Queen promoting a "dead" aircraft brand (the Dutch governement even blundered and failed to avoid bankruptcy of Fokker) instead she chooses for a European built plane Airbus. Where is the Europe-spirit?

http://www.vikingslides.com/Auction/APUserImages/U6F1EUXTMQJX.JPG

[Edited 2005-10-01 23:08:01]
 
keesje
Posts: 8747
Joined: Thu Apr 12, 2001 2:08 am

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Sun Oct 02, 2005 6:09 am

The dutch government has three of these:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Superaccipiter



(of course made sure they´re not comfortable)

they are used intensively and being upgraded constantly.

Quoting Sabenapilot (Reply 3):
Kleine Belgen, grote toestellen! :p

sorry just couldn't resist!

You asked for it..  Wink
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
BBADXB
Posts: 777
Joined: Mon Sep 03, 2001 11:13 pm

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Sun Oct 02, 2005 8:23 am

I love that aircraft. It has visited MLA often. And I like its livery as well. I hope that in the case of a replacement, it will be an Airbus, maybe an A319CJ.
 
kl5147
Posts: 286
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 4:58 am

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Sun Oct 02, 2005 7:17 pm

Quoting Viasa (Reply 4):

Maybe it's because 2 articles in the Dutch newspaper "Het Parool" from Saturday Oct. 1.

In one article the lay-out, the service, and operating costs of the KBX. (€ 3,8 mi. in 2005 and € 4.6 mi. in 2007, due to a major overhaul) are mentioned. It is also expected that the a/c will stay in service for another 20 years.

The other article is about being Rotterdam Airport (RTM/EHRD) momentarily the most used airport in NL for the KBX since Valkenburg (LID/EHVB) is closed last January. It is also mentioned that to ferry the KBX from/to its maintenance base AMS/EHAM to RTM/EHRD will cost at least € 40.000 in 2005.

A little off topic ........
Does anybody have a pic of the predecessor of the PH-KBX, Fokker F28 PH-PBX in it's first white livery?
"The world is just a click away!"
 
Glareskin
Posts: 1002
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 9:35 pm

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Sun Oct 02, 2005 7:41 pm

Quoting Sabenapilot (Reply 3):
Kleine Belgen, grote toestellen! :p

True, but Balkenende is driving a 140K Euro car while Verhofstad has a car budget of 60K Euro. (I wasn't aware of that until a Belgian told me. Was apparently a big issue in Belgium..)

Quoting Sabenapilot (Reply 3):
Belgium, the southern neighbour of The Netherlands of roughly similar size and population

11 Million vs 16 Million, difference is 5 million which makes 45%of your population! That is very rough indeed.  Wink
Ofcourse, it proves your point even more!

Quoting Keesje (Reply 2):
Purely objective something with transatlantic range should be more praticle.

So, what about the DC-10's you pointed out yourself?
There's still a long way to go before all the alliances deserve a star...
 
sabenapilot
Posts: 2442
Joined: Sat Feb 26, 2000 6:18 pm

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Sun Oct 02, 2005 9:07 pm

Quoting Glareskin (Reply 9):
Balkenende is driving a 140K Euro car while Verhofstadt has a car budget of 60K Euro

You are aware that contrary to the Netherlands, Belgium has no less than 7 governments, all equally important according to the federal constitution, be it the Belgian federal government or 'just' the government of the German speaking community, and that each PM has a similar car budget?

With all these governments, each of them with constitutionally guaranteed 'verdragsrecht' , i.e. the right to sign international bilateral accords, no wonder we need a whole fleet of VIP planes: 2 A310s, 3 EMB145s and a bunch of Falcons.

Anyway, just making some fun here, don't take any of this serious!
 
Glareskin
Posts: 1002
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 9:35 pm

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Mon Oct 03, 2005 3:35 am

Quoting Sabenapilot (Reply 10):

So the next time a Belgian friend starts about Bak-ellende's 140.000 Euro car again at leat I can counter that Belgian's PM's have cars for 420.000 Euro...  Big grin
There's still a long way to go before all the alliances deserve a star...
 
whitehatter
Posts: 5180
Joined: Sat Jun 12, 2004 6:52 am

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Mon Oct 03, 2005 3:40 am

That Fokker 70 is probably in as good a condition as the day it was made.

Royal and Government passenger aircraft don't get the usage airliners do, so it's probably got very few hours on the airframe. Being a F70 it's also remarkably quiet which is another plus.

If it ain't broke, why fix it? Longhaul capacity can always be chartered in from Privatair or KLM if needed. Tony Blair uses Privatair or BA if anything bigger than a 146 is required.
Lead me not into temptation, I can find my own way there...
 
aviopic
Posts: 2423
Joined: Sat Mar 13, 2004 7:52 pm

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Fri Oct 14, 2005 6:55 am

Quoting KL5147 (Reply 8):
Fokker F28 PH-PBX in it's first white livery?

F28-Mk.1000 ex PBX(cn.11045) is now PK-RJW flying for PT POS Ekspres Prima.

View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © TK



Quoting KL5147 (Reply 8):
In one article the lay-out, the service, and operating costs of the KBX. (€ 3,8 mi. in 2005 and € 4.6 mi. in 2007, due to a major overhaul)

BS, no major overhaul is required.

Willem
The truth lives in one’s mind, it doesn’t really exist
 
LifelinerOne
Posts: 1497
Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2003 10:30 pm

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Fut

Fri Oct 14, 2005 8:07 am

Our government transportation by air has always been an interesting issue, but let me try to sum it up how it's being done here nowadays.

We have our "Papa Bravo X-Ray"


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © John Davies - CYOW Airport Watch



This is the governments main transportplane for short haul flights and can be chartered by cabinet members as well the royal family. Ministers have priority above the Royal Family, except when the Queen or her son are to do an official state visit. Maybe funny to mention that the PH-KBX has been traveling around the globe and that our crownprince is certified to fly the plane. To keep his license he regurly flies as a pilot at KLM Cityhopper. When the Queen is to go on a state visit, the PH-KBX is flown ahead and the Queen follows on KLM and arrives at a nearby airport in another country to adapt at local time and climate. The last leg of the journey is done on the Fokker.

When the Queen is out of town with the Fokker and urgent transport is needed for a minister, he or she can ask 334 sq of the RNLAF to see if they have anything available. Mostly used is the Gulfstream 4 V-11:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Tim Dwyer



This sleek looking jet is also traveling around the world and is also used to get the general staff around. When the PH-KBX is in maintenance or out of town with a minister, the Queens travel office (The Royal Stables) can also call the airforce to charter the plane, which has been the case. Maybe nice to know that the Gulf has also been used to fly Dutch commandos quickly and rather quietly to some places. The V-11 is also used to fly cabinet members to long haul destinations where KLM isn't flying.

If the V-11 is unavailable and quick transport maybe needed for a short flight, the RNLAF also uses both Fokker 50's U-05 and U-06:


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Willem Honders


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Roberto Benetti



So, KLM, PH-KBX and the RNLAF combined are our way transport our bigshots! There were some talks on selling the Fokker for a plane that can fly larger distances, but these talks ended somewhere in 2002. As with the old F28, I think the F70 will be here for at least another 10-15 years.

Hope this helps!!

Cheers!  wave 
Only Those Who Sleep Don't Make Mistakes
 
kl5147
Posts: 286
Joined: Sun Aug 07, 2005 4:58 am

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Sat Oct 15, 2005 2:35 am

Quoting Aviopic (Reply 13):
F28-Mk.1000 ex PBX(cn.11045) is now PK-RJW flying for PT POS Ekspres Prima.

Thankz Aviopic
It is a white livery indeed,  Smile but not the one I was looking for.
I meant the livery in which the PBX was delivered in Feb. 1972
"The world is just a click away!"
 
LJ
Posts: 4112
Joined: Wed Nov 17, 1999 8:28 pm

RE: Royal Dutch Flight F70, PH-KBX. What's Its Future?

Sat Oct 15, 2005 6:16 am

Quoting Aviopic (Reply 13):
When the Queen is to go on a state visit, the PH-KBX is flown ahead and the Queen follows on KLM

Or Martinair (as she did a few years ago on a state visit to Japan)....