kaitak744
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Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 6:55 am

I recently downloaded Google Earth, which is a satellite imagery program. The photos are pretty new (updated in 2005). When I zoomed in on Tokyo Narita Airport, I saw some major construction vehicles and a massive dirt clearing where the 3rd runway should be. Does anyone know if they actually are finally building the runway?
 
petera380
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 7:37 am

I don't believe they are building a 3rd runway. The building of the second runway took ages and finally had to be shorten because someone wouldn't see his land. If you look at the Google image you can see his house with the second runway on side and the remains of what should have been the rest of the runway on the other side of his house!
 
kaitak744
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 8:05 am

Yea, but the third runway is a diagonal one, in between the terminals and the maintainence facilities. And there is major work going on there. so something is probably being built.
 
bill142
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 8:17 am

When I was there in 2003 they were building T1 South. I would imagine that, being 2 years on it would be completed or close to being competed as most of the external structure appeared to be in place.
 
ktachiya
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 9:25 am

Quoting Bill142 (Reply 3):
I would imagine that, being 2 years on it would be completed or close to being competed as most of the external structure appeared to be in place

I was on the plane that was taxiing to rwy 34L last week. It apparently seemed like they were extending T1 to accompany more planes. I think I have an idea as to where you are saying that the new rwy is going to be built. Isn't that near the Sierra 4 gateway? Because if you look at a birds-eye view of the airport, it seriously looks like a cross-wind rwy. The thing is, it's a txy for now. And I am sure they'd have problems with noise, etc, farmers, and it'll end up in a tomato fight if they try to open it.

So I wouldn't be too optimistic about anything happening to NRT.

That's why I am one of those that thinks that HND should take care of anything in the long-term.
Flown on: DC-10-30, B747-200B, B747-300, B747-300SR, B747-400, B747-400D, B767-300, B777-200, B777-200ER, B777-300
 
N79969
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 9:51 am

They are simply extending the second runway to make it long enough to accommodate longer distance flights with heavier airplanes. Currently departures are limited to a perimeter of destinations.
 
Jet-lagged
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 10:06 am

They are not building a third run-way at Narita. I looked at the photo and think that those could be taxiways linking what was supposed to be the end of the newer, second runway. A month or two ago the news media reported that the airport authority had given up on extended the second runway in the originally intended direction (to the east I guess) and would go the other way (to the west I guess) which is the less effective solution. There are still some 7 farmers who are holding out on selling their land to allow the project to finish. And you can see, for example,the second runway and the taxiway to the side have chunks missing.

On a political note, I've always felt this is absurd that such a small number of persons could block what is essentially the second international runway for world's second largest economy. Certainly individuals' rights must be respected, but think of the countless hours (millions) wasted by persons delayed at the airport due to having only one major runway, or wasted fuel burnt polluting the environment. The time and money spent fighting about this could have gone to worthy causes for those in need. In this case the balance of the individual vs. the society as a whole is way out of whack.
 
andahuailas
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 10:18 am

Its not a third runway, they are adding taxiways now that the remodeling/extension of T1 is almost finished. The taxiways will allow planes to go between runways without existing restriction of traffic direction.
 
kaitak744
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 10:36 am

Quoting Jet-lagged (Reply 6):
On a political note, I've always felt this is absurd that such a small number of persons could block what is essentially the second international runway for world's second largest economy. Certainly individuals' rights must be respected, but think of the countless hours (millions) wasted by persons delayed at the airport due to having only one major runway, or wasted fuel burnt polluting the environment. The time and money spent fighting about this could have gone to worthy causes for those in need. In this case the balance of the individual vs. the society as a whole is way out of whack.

I totally agree. But both runways are used for landings. However, the airport operates on single runway take off (on the longer one).
 
MarshalN
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 10:48 am

Quoting Jet-lagged (Reply 6):
On a political note, I've always felt this is absurd that such a small number of persons could block what is essentially the second international runway for world's second largest economy.

Agreed, except that it's the third international runway, unless you're a die hard Tokyoite and doesn't think KIX is an international runway :p

I would've thought that there must be some sort of eminent domain rights for the government to condemn such land? I mean, the Chiba voters can't be THAT powerful....
 
Jet-lagged
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:11 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 8):
I totally agree. But both runways are used for landings. However, the airport operates on single runway take off (on the longer one).

Even, then, I usually seem to land on the older, longer one. Even when I fly ANA, in which case we have to taxi all the way back to the new terminal. I wish the new runway was used more!

Quoting MarshalN (Reply 9):
Agreed, except that it's the third international runway, unless you're a die hard Tokyoite and doesn't think KIX is an international runway :p

You are right! KIX, plus other international gateways, do exist and operate, but outside of near Asia carriers seems to have limited success opening and maintaining flight there. Heck, even the domestic carriers suffer some fiscal pain to economically maintain flights at KIX, compared to the old Osaka airport.

Quoting MarshalN (Reply 9):
I would've thought that there must be some sort of eminent domain rights for the government to condemn such land? I mean, the Chiba voters can't be THAT powerful....

Yeah. And, think about other the new airports recently built in Asia on land - Guangzhou, Bangkok, KL, Pudong. They have not had such difficulties in securing the land needed in full.
 
MaverickM11
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 12:02 pm

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 2):
Yea, but the third runway is a diagonal one

I know what you're talking about...that's been there forever...before even the second runway was built. I'm not sure what the intention was for it since it does look like it could serve as a runway but it's never been anything but an additional taxiway between Terminals One and Two.
E pur si muove -Galileo
 
QANTAS077
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 1:41 pm

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 8):
I totally agree. But both runways are used for landings. However, the airport operates on single runway take off (on the longer one).

incorrect, both runways are used for takeoff but 34R/16L is used for shorthaul departures only. the position your talking about also has a motorway running underneath it, i doubt very much that they'd be building a runway ontop of a major motorway!
 
kaitak744
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 2:34 pm

Quoting QANTAS077 (Reply 12):
i doubt very much that they'd be building a runway ontop of a major motorway!

That's not really an obstacle. The build runway bridges everywhere.
 
bill142
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 2:47 pm

Quoting Jet-lagged (Reply 10):
Yeah. And, think about other the new airports recently built in Asia on land - Guangzhou, Bangkok, KL, Pudong. They have not had such difficulties in securing the land needed in full.

Could that be because their constitutions allow the forced sale of land to government where as Japan dosn't?
 
Jet-lagged
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 6:06 pm

Quoting Bill142 (Reply 14):
Could that be because their constitutions allow the forced sale of land to government where as Japan dosn't?

I don't know. Your elucidation would be most welcome. Share with us, please.


BTW, I was at Haneda today for spotting (the first time!). It was very telling to see that beyond the northeast runway was . . . . water! Tokyo Bay. Haneda seems a natural for expansions and international flights, if the political inertia can be overcome.

Cheers!
 
stirling
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 7:25 pm

Quoting Jet-lagged (Reply 15):
BTW, I was at Haneda today for spotting (the first time!). It was very telling to see that beyond the northeast runway was . . . . water! Tokyo Bay. Haneda seems a natural for expansions and international flights, if the political inertia can be overcome.

Having not been there myself, I must rely on things like Google Earth as well to build my own perception.

Water (=) Space

Why not leverage this as has been done in other places in Asia to produce an airport facility; without restriction and truly world-class; opening Japan to the level of domestic and international air traffic that suits the demand? I know, that's just crazy talk......

But it certainly appears to the uneducated that the answer to Tokyo's constrictive air policies appear to be in the water of Toyko Bay.

A guy can dream can't he?
Delete this User
 
petera380
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 9:18 pm

I'm sure I read somewhere that a third runway will be built parallel and on the water side of HND. Incidentally have a look at NGO with Google Earth, see anything unusual?
 
zvezda
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Sun Oct 02, 2005 10:48 pm

Quoting Jet-lagged (Reply 6):
On a political note, I've always felt this is absurd that such a small number of persons could block what is essentially the second international runway for world's second largest economy. Certainly individuals' rights must be respected, but think of the countless hours (millions) wasted by persons delayed at the airport due to having only one major runway, or wasted fuel burnt polluting the environment. The time and money spent fighting about this could have gone to worthy causes for those in need. In this case the balance of the individual vs. the society as a whole is way out of whack.

I think the fault there was deciding to build an airport at Narita. Haneda could and should have been expanded as necessary.
 
kaitak744
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 3:58 am

Quoting Zvezda (Reply 18):
I think the fault there was deciding to build an airport at Narita. Haneda could and should have been expanded as necessary.

Well, Henada had a southwest terminal (all on land) and was Tokyo's only airport for a long time. But now, it would be too hard to have Tokyo's domestic and international flights all in one airport. It would probably make it bussier than London Heathrow.
 
MarshalN
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 6:29 am

Quoting Jet-lagged (Reply 10):
You are right! KIX, plus other international gateways, do exist and operate, but outside of near Asia carriers seems to have limited success opening and maintaining flight there. Heck, even the domestic carriers suffer some fiscal pain to economically maintain flights at KIX, compared to the old Osaka airport.

IIRC KIX had the highest landing fees in the world. Now they're expanding the airport, but I would assume it's still god-awful expensive? Anyone knows?

Quoting Jet-lagged (Reply 15):
BTW, I was at Haneda today for spotting (the first time!). It was very telling to see that beyond the northeast runway was . . . . water! Tokyo Bay. Haneda seems a natural for expansions and international flights, if the political inertia can be overcome.

From what I know Narita was built to try to develop Chiba, which was at that point a bunch of farmlands. They believed that it was worth investing all the money into a new airport to build up the region, even though Hanada was perfectly ok for further expansion. Hong Kong did the same thing with Chek Lap Kok, except that KaiTak really wasn't fit for any more expansion and they had to find a new spot for an airport.
 
QANTAS077
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 7:29 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 13):
That's not really an obstacle. The build runway bridges everywhere.

it's an obstacle when the country is prone to large earthquakes...  Wink
 
vincewy
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 9:27 am

Quoting Jet-lagged (Reply 15):
BTW, I was at Haneda today for spotting (the first time!). It was very telling to see that beyond the northeast runway was . . . . water! Tokyo Bay. Haneda seems a natural for expansions and international flights, if the political inertia can be overcome

Greeting:

My very first post, haved lurked here for a long time. I've been itching to know why Japan hasn't developed and built a world class airport for Tokyo/Greater Tokyo areas, considering what ICN, HKG, KUL, SIN, and BKK have done. Looking at those 2 photos (sorry if they don't work as I just learned how to use the forum)


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Jean
View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Jean



You can clearly see that they can expand and reclaim lands toward Tokyo Bay almost infinitely with current infrastructure in place too, ie making the underground passage detour for a mega (or 2) terminal(s) toward the bay, instead of building a brand new airport at Narita, which is not only slot constrained, but also curfew (who came up with the silly curfew hours). Unlike KIX, which is far away from the land, HND's reclaimed land will definitely be more stable since it's next to the land.

There's already a discussion on the way for Haneda expansion, you can read it here, yup, no curfew, of course if this comes to reality, it would kill NRT, KIX, and even NGO. I remember back in the 70s when Narita opened, CI was barred from using NRT and had to use HND, it turnd out to be a blessing for CI, passengers can connect from almost any point in Japan to TPE and HNL. In Taiwan, someone can fly to HND and gets things done, return to TPE the same day, impossible if you go through NRT.

If HND becomes Japan's gateway, I wonder if NRT will suffer the same fate as YMX and becomes a cargo airpot, where all passenger traffics go back to YUL.
 
centrair
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:05 am

Quoting Vincewy (Reply 22):
it would kill NRT, KIX, and even NGO

I am not sure why you think this?
KIX is suffering as it has few Domestic connections.
NGO has always been a strong Domestic market and has a very strong International Business market. The new NGO has just combined the two into one modern facility.
If they allowed more international into HND yes NRT would suffer big time.

This is why NGO has become successful. It is the only Major international airport in Japan that has a strong domestic to International connection. We get traffic from northern Japan. People will fly via NGO to international destinations because they don't need an extra day in Tokyo to make the transfer between HND and NRT.

Because of this threat NRT will be reducing its landing fees for planes 737 and smaller. KIX is also going to lower its landing fees. Soon ITM will not be restricting landing of certain aircraft (noise rules). You might see more HND-KIX flights popping up.

HND currently is the destination for all International Charter flights to Tokyo. There are a few scheduled international flights. I believe they are HND-SEL (old Kimpo) operated by KE and JL.
Yes...I am not a KIX fan. Let's Japanese Aviation!
 
nrtfan
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:33 am

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 19):
But now, it would be too hard to have Tokyo's domestic and international flights all in one airport. It would probably make it bussier than London Heathrow.

That's a bit of an understatement. HND is already virtually equal to LHR in passenger count. In 2004, LHR had 67.3 million and HND had 62.3 million, according to this link. A hypothetical HND handling all current NRT traffic would far exceed any current passenger count, though obviously that's unrealistic.

Incidentally I'm a "fan" of NRT just because I have such great memories of the many trips I made in and out of there when I lived in Japan--certainly not because of the almost 2-hour trek to get out there. I'm all in favor of expanding HND.
 
vincewy
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:37 am

Quoting Centrair (Reply 23):
I am not sure why you think this?
KIX is suffering as it has few Domestic connections.
NGO has always been a strong Domestic market and has a very strong International Business market. The new NGO has just combined the two into one modern facility.

I probably should be more specific, it'll affect NGO less than KIX and NRT, for regional Asian carriers the cities won't matter much, but for long haul carriers, if they have a choice of where to fly, they'd pick Tokyo over any other cities if they can only fly to one city.

Also curious, is KIX still sinking? Or has it stabilized? If they want to make KIX viable, they need to shut down ITM and move all domestic flights to KIX (just my opinion of course). Govt can then use and/or sell those lands for other city developments. Use the $$$$$$$$ to repay the debt of KIX.

Quoting Centrair (Reply 23):
HND currently is the destination for all International Charter flights to Tokyo. There are a few scheduled international flights. I believe they are HND-SEL (old Kimpo) operated by KE and JL

Right, add NH and OZ unless they pulled out, all 4 airlines use 744s, each is awarded once daily, it makes me wonder if they have choice, would they pull most of the NRT-ICN flights and move toward HND-SEL?
 
Slarty
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:52 am

Nartia?

Naw ... that was a new movie about Narnia ... lol

PS -- you shouldn't drink'n post!

[Edited 2005-10-03 03:53:14]
 
N1120A
Posts: 26467
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:04 am

Quoting N79969 (Reply 5):
They are simply extending the second runway to make it long enough to accommodate longer distance flights with heavier airplanes. Currently departures are limited to a perimeter of destinations.

The destinations are limited to how far the aircraft can fly with the loads the runway will allow. With its proposed performance, the 788 could likely fly intercontinental non-stops from the shorter runway

Quoting Kaitak744 (Reply 8):
However, the airport operates on single runway take off (on the longer one).

Both runways are available for take off. The short runway is one of the main reasons NW decided to base 757s at NRT

Quoting Vincewy (Reply 25):
Quoting Centrair (Reply 23):
HND currently is the destination for all International Charter flights to Tokyo. There are a few scheduled international flights. I believe they are HND-SEL (old Kimpo) operated by KE and JL

Right, add NH and OZ unless they pulled out, all 4 airlines use 744s, each is awarded once daily, it makes me wonder if they have choice, would they pull most of the NRT-ICN flights and move toward HND-SEL?

Incheon now has the SEL code while Kimpo has GMP (for Gimpo)
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
MarshalN
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:19 am

Quoting Vincewy (Reply 25):
Also curious, is KIX still sinking? Or has it stabilized? If they want to make KIX viable, they need to shut down ITM and move all domestic flights to KIX (just my opinion of course). Govt can then use and/or sell those lands for other city developments. Use the $$$$$$$$ to repay the debt of KIX.

From what I have read, yes, it's still sinking. I think the assumption is basically that it will eventually sink into water. Sort of weird planning if you ask me, but I suppose the Japanese government has weird planning priorities all along. I agree -- KIX right now is just a big international gateway for people going to Kansai, and not much else. Also, their rail link to Osaka is sub-par, at best. I really wish they have a dedicated train that goes fast to Osaka instead of the slow thing that I took. If there was a faster option, then it must be only available infrequently because when I asked they didn't tell me about it (Airport Express in HKG is so nice  Smile).
 
hoons90
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:20 am

Quoting N1120A (Reply 27):
Incheon now has the SEL code while Kimpo has GMP (for Gimpo)

SEL: Metro/city code for Seoul, includes both GMP and ICN. (Just like CHI for Chicago, NYC for New York, LON for London etc)

ICN: Incheon Int'l Airport

GMP: Gimpo Int'l Airport
The biggest mistake made by most human beings: Listening to only half, understanding just a quarter and telling double.
 
ContinentalFan
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RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:22 am

Quoting Jet-lagged (Reply 15):
I don't know. Your elucidation would be most welcome. Share with us, please.

From what I've read on the Narita runway issue, Japan's governments (central, local) don't have power of eminent domain, where they can seize property without the consent of the owners, at least with respect to certain kinds of property, hence the long standoffs with the farmers.

Compare this to the US, and I assume in many other jurisdictions, where such a power is assumed, to the point where the Fifth Amendment of the US Constitution's includes a clause prohibiting government takings without compensation.
 
vincewy
Posts: 533
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2005 8:32 am

RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 2:41 pm

Quoting MarshalN (Reply 28):
From what I have read, yes, it's still sinking. I think the assumption is basically that it will eventually sink into water. Sort of weird planning if you ask me, but I suppose the Japanese government has weird planning priorities all along. I agree -- KIX right now is just a big international gateway for people going to Kansai, and not much else

Ouch! What's the point of building another runway and terminal then? The expansion area is even further away from the land (deeper), I've read a geology article (will link if I find them), doing this will only accelarate the sinking of KIX. It's bad enough KIX (phase one) is a sunk cost, it's even worse when you incur incremental cost (phase two).

Now back to the topic

Quoting NRTfan (Reply 24):
That's a bit of an understatement. HND is already virtually equal to LHR in passenger count. In 2004, LHR had 67.3 million and HND had 62.3 million, according to this link. A hypothetical HND handling all current NRT traffic would far exceed any current passenger count, though obviously that's unrealistic.

Incidentally I'm a "fan" of NRT just because I have such great memories of the many trips I made in and out of there when I lived in Japan--certainly not because of the almost 2-hour trek to get out there. I'm all in favor of expanding HND

One way to solve this issue w/o killing NRT would be, IMO, start expansion of HND with only one mega terminal, charge hefty premiums to land at HND for INT'L flights, move all charter flights to NRT (I'm surprised they let charters there, should've been the other way around), assuming these are leisure flights which travelers aren't time sensitive, this will also open up a lot of slots at NRT, allowing many foreign carriers to move in which can't afford to or don't want to pay HND fees. If HND landing fees are high, NRT will not lose all of the traffics. Of course if both HND and NRT become slot constrained even after those expansions, they should build another terminal.
 
Carpethead
Posts: 2565
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2004 8:15 pm

RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Mon Oct 03, 2005 5:57 pm

Quoting Vincewy (Reply 25):
Right, add NH and OZ unless they pulled out, all 4 airlines use 744s, each is awarded once daily, it makes me wonder if they have choice, would they pull most of the NRT-ICN flights and move toward HND-SEL?

JL, NH, OZ, & KE all operate two dailies between GMP and HND. JL with 743, KE with 744, OZ with 333, & NH with 763s.

Quoting ContinentalFan (Reply 30):
From what I've read on the Narita runway issue, Japan's governments (central, local) don't have power of eminent domain, where they can seize property without the consent of the owners, at least with respect to certain kinds of property, hence the long standoffs with the farmers.

Compare this to the US, and I assume in many other jurisdictions, where such a power is assumed, to the point where the Fifth Amendment of the US Constitution's includes a clause prohibiting government takings without compensation.

Correct, Japan does not have eminent domain laws, hence the current predicament at NRT.

Nagoya and Osaka-Kobe metroplexes are big enough that some form of international flying will always be viable whether HND and/or NRT get their act together.

Sometimes I wonder the situation at HND/NRT is just the Japanese government way of keeping tabs of growth whether it be domestic or int'l and protecting NH & JL. Nagoya & Osaka are large markets but nowhere near the potential of Tokyo. With staffing rules and pay rates sky high for both legacy airlines in Japan, I'd figure they ARE the highest cost airline in the world. With an implosion of less expensive to run foreign carriers the big gorillas at NH and JL could fall.

Back to the third runway at NRT. It seems most of the third runway can be built but about 1/3 of the way on the left-side facing the northerly direction, there is a single dwelling. That's a minor but substantial obstacle if one is to have flights ops on the runway. Also NRT has been building additional ramps immediately to the south of this runway, and all that concrete pored would be for naught.
Just last month NAA has decided to consider extending the 2nd runway to the north for a length of 2,500m. Thus, the runway will be short of the motorway. The time of construction has been quoted at 6 years from the start, but that seems very long.
 
vincewy
Posts: 533
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2005 8:32 am

RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Fri Oct 07, 2005 7:21 am

Well found couple images/article concerning HND, looking at the map, it seems like HND can expand and build 2 more terminals without EVEN RECLAIMING LANDS TOWARD TOKYO BAY

http://www2s.biglobe.ne.jp/~ito-nori/spot/spot_hnd2e.htm#image

http://www.metro.tokyo.jp/ENGLISH/PROFILE/POLICY/policy8.htm

One large piece of land between Runway 34L and 04, another just on the other side of new maintenance facility. If you reclaim the same size of land toward Tokyo Bay just like KIX, you can probably build 2 more terminals, making it bigger than LHR.

I've heard in the past, govt tried to discourage centralization of Metro Tokyo areas by moving INT'L flights toward NRT and KIX, that doesn't seem to work, most still want to go through HND.
 
mandala499
Posts: 6458
Joined: Wed Aug 29, 2001 8:47 pm

RE: Nartia Building Their 3rd Runway

Fri Oct 07, 2005 4:08 pm

I'm sure I read somewhere that a third runway will be built parallel and on the water side of HND. Incidentally have a look at NGO with Google Earth, see anything unusual?

Old Nagoya? Excessively wide apron... for tandem parking... Then you got the extremely narrow terminal complex, and then yes, some buildings/complexes intrude to the airport like rough edges! Hmm, isn't that the place where they build Japan's F15s?

What else? Hmm, parking lots in the middle of a padi-field?  Smile


Qantas077,
I don't think they would have build most of the bridges in Japan if Earthquakes were the problem... The bridge linking Centrair and KIX to the mainland? Just look at Haneda, there are a couple of motorways underneath a bay, and a runway at the same time :P

---

Btw, the 3rd runway is designed and built as a runway, whether they'll use it as a runway or not, it's a different matter.

Regarding Haneda...
I wonder why they needed to rip out 2 runways and make one cross runway just a couple of hundred meters nearer to the terminal... UNLESS, the obstacle clearance needed...

Here's an idea for expansion at HND...
build another runway left of 34L... almost like the original 33/33R (is 33L the parallel taxiway that was next to 33R?)  Smile

Use the space to the left of that runway and inbetween 04 for maintenance and Cargo.

Cargo can go on the roads that was used by the old terminals to the South and North West.

By clearing the central area off the cargo and maintenance, you can shove all the terminals you can fit next to the current T1 & T2.

Then if U need more runways, just build over the bay again  Smile

Mandala499
When losing situational awareness, pray Cumulus Granitus isn't nearby !

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