Avianca
Topic Author
Posts: 5274
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 7:45 am

Hi all,

I just checked for random dates the loads on the FRA-NRT flights (JL,KZ,LH)

the flights seems more than good booked.


Lufthansa German
Flight: 710
Departs
Frankfurt Am Main (FRA)
October 15
1:45 pm Arrives
Tokyo (NRT)
October 16 (Next day)
7:40 am Notes
Cabin class: F3 A3 C0 D0 Z0 Y0 B0 M0 H0 Q0 V0 W0 S0
Meal:
Distance: 5836 mi
Stops: non-stop
Flight Time: 10:55
Boeing 747Boeing 747


All Nippon Airways
Flight: 210
Departs
Frankfurt Am Main (FRA)
October 15
8:45 pm Arrives
Tokyo (NRT)
October 16 (Next day)
2:50 pm Notes
Cabin class: F0 A0 J0 C0 D0 Z0 W0 S0 Y0 B0 H0 M0 K0 G0
Meal:
Distance: 5836 mi
Stops: non-stop
Flight Time: 11:05
Boeing 747-400Boeing 747-400


Japan Airlines
Flight: 408
Departs
Frankfurt Am Main (FRA)
October 15
9:05 pm Arrives
Tokyo (NRT)
October 16 (Next day)
3:20 pm Notes
Cabin class: F0 C0 D0 I0 S0 Y0 B0 H0 Q0 M0 N0 K0
Meal:
Distance: 5836 mi
Stops: non-stop
Flight Time: 11:15
Boeing 747-400Boeing 747-400

_____________________________

All Nippon Airways
Flight: 210
Departs
Frankfurt Am Main (FRA)
October 16
8:45 pm Arrives
Tokyo (NRT)
October 17 (Next day)
2:50 pm Notes
Cabin class: F0 A0 J0 C4 D0 Z0 W0 S0 Y0 B0 H0 M0 K0 G0
Meal:
Distance: 5836 mi
Stops: non-stop
Flight Time: 11:05
Boeing 747-400Boeing 747-400


Lufthansa German
Flight: 710
Departs
Frankfurt Am Main (FRA)
October 16
1:45 pm Arrives
Tokyo (NRT)
October 17 (Next day)
7:40 am Notes
Cabin class: F0 A0 C0 D0 Z0 Y0 B0 M0 H0 Q0 V0 W0 S0
Meal:
Distance: 5836 mi
Stops: non-stop
Flight Time: 10:55
Boeing 747Boeing 747


the flights are all operated with B747 and are full, any chane to see a JL, KZ or LH double daily on the route?

also the flights from MUC seems more than full


Lufthansa German
Flight: 714
Departs
Munich (MUC)
October 16
3:30 pm Arrives
Tokyo (NRT)
October 17 (Next day)
10:00 am Notes
Cabin class: C0 D0 Z0 Y0 B0 M0 H0 Q0 V0 W0 S0
Meal:
Distance: 5849 mi
Stops: non-stop
Flight Time: 11:30
Airbus A340Airbus A340


Lufthansa German
Flight: 714
Departs
Munich (MUC)
October 17
3:30 pm Arrives
Tokyo (NRT)
October 18 (Next day)
10:00 am Notes
Cabin class: C0 D0 Z0 Y0 B0 M0 H0 Q0 V0 W0 S0
Meal:
Distance: 5849 mi
Stops: non-stop
Flight Time: 11:30
Airbus A340Airbus A340


would be nice if LH would at least the MUC flight upgrade to the B747-400.

I know they have no B747-400 flights from MUC, but it wouldnt be a big problem as they could operate FRA-NRT-MUC-NRT-FRA.


regards
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
A350
Posts: 1012
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 6:40 am

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 7:50 am

LH will upgrade the FRA-NRT service to A380s when they come, for sure. I also can imagine them to send more connecting traffic via ZRH instead of FRA in the future.

A350
 
Avianca
Topic Author
Posts: 5274
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 7:57 am

Quoting A350 (Reply 1):
LH will upgrade the FRA-NRT service to A380s when they come, for sure

yes thats true, but there is still some time they get the A380.
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
JoFMO
Posts: 1840
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:55 am

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 8:20 am

The bilateral with Japan is very restrictive. LH doesn't have more rights into NRT. LH has two dailies to NRT and both Japan carriers have one daily flight each from NRT. And from what I heard they are not very eager on new flights to Germany, so there is also no chance for LH.
But the A380 on FRA-NRT is very likely. I think to remember that any LH official even has mentioned that.
 
Avianca
Topic Author
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Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 8:23 am

Quoting JoFMO (Reply 3):
The bilateral with Japan is very restrictive. LH doesn't have more rights into NRT.

this is what I thought... so they should upgreade the MUC flight to the B744 or at least to the A346... what about the rights that LTU had in the past from DUS?

regards
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
JoFMO
Posts: 1840
Joined: Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:55 am

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 8:26 am

Has LTU ever served Japan? I have no clue. They fly to China. On some days to Shanghai and the others to Beijing, but will finish the route end of October.
 
Avianca
Topic Author
Posts: 5274
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 8:31 am

Quoting JoFMO (Reply 5):
Has LTU ever served Japan

I am not 100% sure if they served, at least the flights were ready and plnd.
I think a 5 weekly service.
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
Sabena332
Posts: 14938
Joined: Wed May 09, 2001 3:57 am

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 8:33 am

Quoting JoFMO (Reply 5):
Has LTU ever served Japan?

LTU never had scheduled flights to Japan.

There were a few charters, even one with Adolf Edmund Stoiber onboard, I saw on TV that he flew on LTU to Tokio (and back) to watch the final of the football world championship 2002.

Patrick
NZ1's mother is a disgusting crack-whore and his father is a worthless alcoholic!
 
Avianca
Topic Author
Posts: 5274
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 8:37 am

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 7):
Adolf Edmund Stoiber onboard, I saw on TV that he flew on LTU to Tokio (and back) to watch the final of the football world championship 2002

 Silly  Silly  Silly and did he enjoy the crappy LTU serive ?
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
Sabena332
Posts: 14938
Joined: Wed May 09, 2001 3:57 am

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 8:38 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 8):
and did he enjoy the crappy LTU serive ?

Better than flying Lufthansa, eh?

Patrick
NZ1's mother is a disgusting crack-whore and his father is a worthless alcoholic!
 
Avianca
Topic Author
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RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 8:45 am

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 9):
Better than flying Lufthansa, eh?

 crazy 
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
A350
Posts: 1012
Joined: Tue Nov 30, 2004 6:40 am

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 8:50 am

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 7):
Adolf Edmund Stoiber onboard

That's great  laughing  Welcome to my RU list!

A350
 
Avianca
Topic Author
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RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Sun Oct 09, 2005 10:46 pm

Quoting Sabena332 (Reply 7):
LTU never had scheduled flights to Japan.

at least I know they had plnd it from DUS, and promoted it to the travell agencies... but it seems that it never happened. Sad

regards
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
Carpethead
Posts: 2566
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2004 8:15 pm

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Wed Oct 12, 2005 7:44 am

NRT-MUC is six weeklies with A343. It can't be upgraded to 744 or A346 because those flights require landing on the short-runway.
The chances of new entrants under the current circumstances about zero due to slot restrictions at either end.
 
Avianca
Topic Author
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RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Wed Oct 12, 2005 7:47 am

Quoting Carpethead (Reply 13):
It can't be upgraded to 744 or A346 because those flights require landing on the short-runway.

intresting information, is the incoming slot for the flights restricted to the short-runway? other question how long is the short-runway because if a A343 can land than it would be also no problem for bigger aircrafts like the 744 or the A346, or?

regards
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
N1120A
Posts: 26468
Joined: Sun Dec 14, 2003 5:40 pm

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Wed Oct 12, 2005 7:51 am

Quoting Carpethead (Reply 13):
NRT-MUC is six weeklies with A343. It can't be upgraded to 744 or A346 because those flights require landing on the short-runway.
The chances of new entrants under the current circumstances about zero due to slot restrictions at either end.

A 744 or an A346 can easily land on the shorter runway at NRT, they just can't make FRA after taking off from it
Mangeons les French fries, mais surtout pratiquons avec fierte le French kiss
 
LAXintl
Posts: 20183
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Wed Oct 12, 2005 8:01 am

Quoting Avianca (Reply 14):
intresting information, is the incoming slot for the flights restricted to the short-runway? other question how long is the short-runway because if a A343 can land than it would be also no problem for bigger aircrafts like the 744 or the A346, or?

Narita slots awards are indeed based on usage of either the "A" main 16R/34L runway or the "B" 16L/34R new runway. The newer runways is a mere 2180meters long and is restricted to B777/A343/MD11 or smaller equipment. Strict adherence to slotted runway is required.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
Avianca
Topic Author
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RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Wed Oct 12, 2005 8:04 am

Quoting Laxintl (Reply 16):
The newer runways is a mere 2180meters long and is restricted to B777/A343/MD11 or smaller equipment.

thanks for the quick info!

I can not imagine that the 6xweekly A343 LH flight from MUC to NRT is sloted to the shorter-runway, as N1120A pointed out, the full A343 can not make it nonstop to germany.

regards
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
LAXintl
Posts: 20183
Joined: Wed May 24, 2000 12:12 pm

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Wed Oct 12, 2005 8:28 am

Quoting N1120A (Reply 15):
A 744 or an A346 can easily land on the shorter runway at NRT,

Nope.. The Narita operating rules clearly state no A346/B747 operations allowed on the 16L/34R runway. The B747 limitation is also listed in the Jeppesen pages. Restriction is primarily due to taxiway wingtip/outboard engine clearance issues.
From the desert to the sea, to all of Southern California
 
Carpethead
Posts: 2566
Joined: Mon Aug 02, 2004 8:15 pm

RE: Any Chance For New FRA-NRT Service?

Wed Oct 12, 2005 12:20 pm

MD11s, DC10s, & 773s are also not allowed to use the shorter runway unless in an emergency. I have heard MD-11s and DC-10s using the shorter runway in an emergency such as when the longer-runway is closed but I have yet to hear other aircraft types mentioned using the shorter runway.

Technically the runway is long enough for use by the 744; as SXM sees 744 ops even though it's slightly shorter than 2,180.