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mariner
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Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Sun Oct 16, 2005 6:14 am

Pan Am has ended all flights at Portsmouth, it seems:

http://www.seacoastonline.com/news/10142005/business/67938.htm

Which would leave SFB to SJU as it's only flight.

But I'm confised - the airline has approval to fly 727's - why would they be looking for approval for more 727's?

Is the license limited?
aeternum nauta
 
wjcandee
Posts: 5123
Joined: Mon Jun 05, 2000 12:50 am

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Sun Oct 16, 2005 6:29 am

These guys started out with a unionized "mainline" carrier and a "commuter" sub that they added later. They apparently tried to boot the union pilots by switching the flying to the sub, which is why Pan Am is now "Boston and Maine", and the "connection" is flying 727s. So they only have 3 727s on the certificate of the entity that is doing the flying. With the demise of Transmeridian, they've kept those 3 aircraft pretty busy in the last several weeks, and apparently think that if they could add some of the (former) Pan Am 727s to the B&M certificate, then they'd be able to pick up even more business.

Obviously, the pissed-off pilot's union is trying everything it can to screw with them, hence the complaints about fitness and stuff. For all I know, the complaints are deserved, but the pilot's union is definitely all over them.

Hope that helps.
 
georgiabill
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RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Sun Oct 16, 2005 12:33 pm

Well actually they have said they are indefinitely suspending service from Portsmouth. They blamed rising fuel costs and low advanced bookings. Gee wouldn't they have been wiser to make 737-300's the workhorse of their fleet? Well done for ruining a great aviation name!
 
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chrisnh
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RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Sun Oct 16, 2005 1:05 pm

At least a real airline, Allegiant, will be flying out of PSM starting later this year. The message should be 'Welcome Allegiant and good riddance Pan Am.' Like most airlines, the workers are fine & upstanding people; it's the suits--in this case Railroad suits masquerading as airline suits--have caused all the bad press the carrier has suffered. Press that has been richly deserved.
 
Fleet Service
Posts: 473
Joined: Wed Apr 12, 2000 11:58 am

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Sun Oct 16, 2005 1:09 pm

Listen...I hear Juan Trippe making turns for thirty knots...

Pan Am could have made a go of it as an LCC had they decided to start operations in a market larger than Portsmouth New Hampshire.

NYC could have supported them better than PSM...
Yes, I actually *do* work for an airline,how about you?
 
tbear815
Posts: 689
Joined: Thu Jun 12, 2003 12:14 pm

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Sun Oct 16, 2005 1:20 pm

It's really too bad the Pan Am name has been dragged through the mud once again. Juan Trippe's pride and joy is becoming like the Braniff rolling failure. Why do such names have to cycle down through poor management to become synonymous with failure? Is there something endemic in the Airline industry to set these great airlines up for failure?

People often rise to positions above their qualifications and, afraid to ask for assistance, they ruin everything for everyone else. A sad commentary on our business practices today. And it's everywhere in all industries. Just one man's opinion. May Pan Am rest in peace again (and again, and again)....
 
georgiabill
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Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2003 11:53 pm

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Sun Oct 16, 2005 2:10 pm

RIP PAN AM! Hopefully if the so called management has a moment of lucid thought they will seek out someone more qualified to own the venerable Pan AM name and they restore it as a name respected in aviation! Just my hope. I hate to think everyones last image was this ridiculous reincarnation of a proud old airline pioneer. May Juan Trippe also find peace when it ends.
 
INTENSS
Posts: 310
Joined: Mon Aug 30, 2004 9:25 am

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 2:34 am

Quoting Georgiabill (Reply 6):
I hate to think everyones last image was this ridiculous reincarnation of a proud old airline pioneer.

Do you remember the image of this once proud old airline during its last years in the late 80's through '91? It wasn't much better....

I hope they get approval for the added 727's.

-Rich
 
7e72004
Posts: 3440
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 12:15 am

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 2:36 am

Pan AM III reminds me of the many reincarnations of Braniff *lol*  Smile
The next generation of aircraft is just around the corner!
 
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kc135topboom
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RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 3:14 am

Doesn't PA still have their maintenance base at PSM?
 
irelayer
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Joined: Wed Jul 06, 2005 4:34 pm

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 3:28 am

Quoting Georgiabill (Reply 2):
Well actually they have said they are indefinitely suspending service from Portsmouth. They blamed rising fuel costs and low advanced bookings. Gee wouldn't they have been wiser to make 737-300's the workhorse of their fleet? Well done for ruining a great aviation name!

They might also want to improve their website a little bit. It is a mess. Most LCC's or smaller airlines use the web as an equalizer but Pan Am's booking engine is terrible and they are not listed on any major sites either...which doesn't help.

-IR
 
srbmod
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Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2001 1:32 pm

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 6:47 am

Quoting linked article (Thread starter):
Allegiant, which services what it considers to be underutilized markets, said it plans to run one round trip four days a week (Monday, Thursday, Friday, and Sunday) on 150-seat McDonnell Douglass 800 series jets.

Once again, the media screws up an a/c type. An MD-800 must be a pretty long T-tailed a/c.........


This version of Pan Am is a joke and I hope they do go belly up. Perhaps another airline should take up the name and do it some justice.
 
BigGSFO
Posts: 2213
Joined: Sun Jun 12, 2005 5:27 am

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 6:49 am

So I wonder if there is busniess plan out the for Pan Am IV...

 Smile
 
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spinkid
Posts: 1346
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RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 6:55 am

Quoting 7E72004 (Reply 8):
Pan AM III reminds me of the many reincarnations of Braniff *lol*

Braniff II and Braniff III were never even this bad
 
Cadet57
Posts: 7174
Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2005 2:02 am

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 7:02 am

Is this company really that bad, I mean, whats wrong wiht this airline? Service? Safety? Fleet?
Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
 
nkops
Posts: 2153
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 10:09 am

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 7:07 am

Quoting Srbmod (Reply 11):
Perhaps another airline should take up the name and do it some justice.

I doubt it... I don't think the railroad boys in PSM will ever sell the name...

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 14):
Is this company really that bad, I mean, whats wrong with this airline? Service? Safety? Fleet?

Yes.... on all counts
:evil:
 
PHLBOS
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Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 6:38 am

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 7:13 am

From the article:

Beck said Pan Am will resume passenger flights from Florida to Puerto Rico on Nov. 17 and it continues to run charters and smaller-plane commuter service from Pease to Bedford, Mass.

Let me get this straight: PA III is stopping all 727 flights from PSM but is still allowing Clipper Connection turboprop operations from BED to PSM. Am I missing something here?  confused 

Is there that much of a market demand to keep the PSM-BED commuter service as a stand-alone entity?
"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981
 
nkops
Posts: 2153
Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2005 10:09 am

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 7:27 am

If I'm not mistaken, although I can be... I believe Boston-Maine is running TTN-BED-PSM... they took over the old Shuttle America route out of Trenton. The TTN-BED did very well for SA in the Saabs, and was doing decent on BMA last I heard (which was about a year ago). However, it would not surprise me if they pulled the plug on that too.
:evil:
 
Cadet57
Posts: 7174
Joined: Mon Jul 25, 2005 2:02 am

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 7:29 am

Quoting PHLBOS (Reply 16):
Is there that much of a market demand to keep the PSM-BED commuter service as a stand-alone entity?

Can BED be considered a BOS alternative?, and PSM a MHT alternative?, not thatd it need one....
Doors open, right hand side, next stop is Springfield.
 
PHLBOS
Posts: 6504
Joined: Thu Apr 01, 2004 6:38 am

RE: Pan Am 3 - Beginning Of The End?

Mon Oct 17, 2005 9:28 am

Quoting Cadet57 (Reply 18):
Can BED be considered a BOS alternative?, and PSM a MHT alternative?, not thatd it need one....

Sadly, BED has had major NIMBY issues ever since the original Shuttle America (flying Dash8s) started flights there many years ago. They went absolutely ballistic when USx (pre-Shuttle America aquisition) considered PHL-BED flights... US originally backed off but ultimately got in when they bought Shuttle America in 2001-2002. One could only imagine what would happen if WN ever sought out BED.

I'm sure the NIMBYs at Bedford & Lexington would love to see the Clipper Connection die as well. Most of the NIMBY complainers are the newer yuppie residents that probably paid a fortune to buy the real estate. The older residents will tell you that things were more noisier when BED was still a fully-operational Air Force Base.

What really killed BED in terms of scheduled service (besides US taking over Shuttle America) was WN coming to MHT and LCCs like FL and later B6 setting up shop in BOS. The BED advantage greatly eroded as a result.
"TransEastern! You'll feel like you've never left the ground because we treat you like dirt!" SNL Parady ad circa 1981

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