klmcedric
Posts: 696
Joined: Mon Dec 29, 2003 11:19 pm

KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Thu Oct 27, 2005 9:07 pm

Just read a "blue note" (note from management summarizing business)
that the load factors developments for the BBJ service to IAH which is set
to start in three days look very encouraging, which leads me the other
information I got.
If these plans prove to be successful KLM will purchase it's own BBJ's and
fly this (and other potential) route with it's own metal and crews.
This could happen as soon as early 2007. Looking forward to these new
developments.
 
lexer
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Joined: Thu Sep 01, 2005 10:21 pm

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Thu Oct 27, 2005 9:24 pm

Good news, thanks. This seems to be the trend now?

New airlines like Eos and Maxjet (on JFK-STN) will start to offer business only flights. The concept is being embraced and seems a good one, especially if business fares can be offered at a low/reasonable price.

Wasn't there a similar service to the US to/from Dusseldorf?
 
keesje
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RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Thu Oct 27, 2005 9:29 pm

I think KLM strategy with the BBJ is different from LH, AF, EOS & Maxjet.

KLM is adding WBC capasity & frequencies to existing destinations at minimum costs.

The others are offering additional city pairs for business class only to their network.
"Never mistake motion for action." Ernest Hemingway
 
Glareskin
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RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Thu Oct 27, 2005 9:30 pm

Quoting Lexer (Reply 1):
Wasn't there a similar service to the US to/from Dusseldorf?

Yes, it is Privat Air by Lufthansa. I'm not sure but I think they operate DUS - EWR and DUS - ORD.
There's still a long way to go before all the alliances deserve a star...
 
klmcedric
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RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Thu Oct 27, 2005 9:38 pm

On a sidenote, some more interesting info about KL's 737 fleet that some
of you might not know yet.
In the course of 2006 all the 737-300 and -400 will get the seats that are
now in the -800 and -900 and the latter will get completely new seats.
And now it comes,hold something so that you don't fall off your chair,
KL claims that the new seats are designed in such a way that they allow
a pitch decrease without loss off kneespace. The cushion's are thinner and
the traytables are a new design.This means that the last six row of seats
will go from the already small 31" to 29"!!!
 
Joost
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Joined: Wed Apr 20, 2005 8:27 pm

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Thu Oct 27, 2005 10:21 pm

Quoting KLMCedric (Reply 4):
KL claims that the new seats are designed in such a way that they allow
a pitch decrease without loss off kneespace. The cushion's are thinner and
the traytables are a new design.This means that the last six row of seats
will go from the already small 31" to 29"!!!

Although 29" seems like very small, there is indeed a big difference between 29" and 29". I found at that the seats in the easyJet 319s are offering good legroom, despite being just 29". Also, the old (reclining) seats of FR are not too bad at 29", whereas the new (non-recling) FR seats are very bad on the legroom at 29".

You mention that it will only be at the last 6 rows. Will they introduce a concept of different on-board comfort levels, by putting the take-off fare people in the back of the plane, just like SAS Snowflake?
 
lucianflyboy
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RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Thu Oct 27, 2005 10:29 pm

Quoting Glareskin (Reply 3):
Yes, it is Privat Air by Lufthansa. I'm not sure but I think they operate DUS - EWR and DUS - ORD.

They do operate DUS - EWR, DUS - ORD and MUC - EWR.

From what I've heard the service is very good and personalized.

 wave 
 
sk601
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RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Fri Oct 28, 2005 12:06 am

Quoting KLMCedric (Reply 4):
KL claims that the new seats are designed in such a way that they allow
a pitch decrease without loss off kneespace. The cushion's are thinner and
the traytables are a new design.This means that the last six row of seats
will go from the already small 31" to 29"!!!

This not good news!  Sad The KLM manager who brought up this idea and statement should quit his job and start making up fairytales for "De Efteling" (Dutch themepark); he can become very rich.
 
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STT757
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RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Fri Oct 28, 2005 12:17 am

There are three Privatair flights from EWR to:

DUS (A319LR), MUC (BBJ), ZRH (BBJ).
Eastern Air lines flt # 701, EWR-MCO Boeing 757
 
Checo77
Posts: 1263
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RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Fri Oct 28, 2005 7:08 am

Quoting SK601 (Reply 7):
Quoting KLMCedric (Reply 4):
KL claims that the new seats are designed in such a way that they allow
a pitch decrease without loss off kneespace. The cushion's are thinner and
the traytables are a new design.This means that the last six row of seats
will go from the already small 31" to 29"!!!

This not good news! The KLM manager who brought up this idea and statement should quit his job and start making up fairytales for "De Efteling" (Dutch themepark); he can become very rich.

I think I doesn´t matter. In Intra-European flights, the flight are so short that you don´t care about legroom. and if they offer competitive fares and GREAT service (as usual), everything should be fine.
Just my opinion,
Adam
Czech Boeing lover living in Lima
 
n808nwatmsp
Posts: 168
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 12:54 am

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Mon Oct 31, 2005 7:48 am

Found this off Flytecomm...

Airline- Klm Royal Dutch Airlines
Flight Number- 663
Departure City (Airport)- Amsterdam, Netherlands (EHAM)
Departure Time- 10/30/2005 02:38 PM
Arrival City (Airport)- Houston, TX (IAH)
Arrival Time- 10/30/2005 05:57 PM
Remaining Flight Time- 01:14
Aircraft Type- Boeing 737-700
Current Altitude- 40,000 feet
Current Groundspeed- 501 mph
Flight Status- In Flight

Could this be it?  hyper 
 
COfaninBOS
Posts: 284
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RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Mon Oct 31, 2005 12:25 pm

I just landed at IAH tonight on a 73G from BOS around 7:30. Saw the plane for the first time at Terminal D. It's always nice to see a new livery around all those golden globes!
 
MAH4546
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RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Mon Oct 31, 2005 12:33 pm

Quoting Keesje (Reply 2):
I think KLM strategy with the BBJ is different from LH, AF, EOS & Maxjet.

KLM is adding WBC capasity & frequencies to existing destinations at minimum costs.

The others are offering additional city pairs for business class only to their network.

Air France does not offer an all-C product. Air France's A319LRs are configured with coach and business class, and while the flights are considered under the "Dedicate" program, there is no difference in service from a regular long-haul flight, it just happens to be on an A319.
a.
 
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ERJ170
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RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Mon Oct 31, 2005 12:35 pm

I apoligize to everyone, but I have to ask..

does anyone think that a Privatair flight RDU-MUC, RDU-AMS, &/or RDU-ORY would work?

How much does seats on these flights average?

Thanks!
Aiming High and going far..
 
lamedianaranja
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Joined: Mon Nov 08, 2004 1:21 am

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Mon Oct 31, 2005 5:48 pm

The first flight left yesterday with all 44 seats occupied  thumbsup  Everything went perfect but for a few glitches in Codeco, KLM's departure system. The starboard window seat is called D in Codeco but F on board... caused some confusion but was solved easily of course.
I wish that all skies were orange and blue!!
 
jwenting
Posts: 9973
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RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Mon Oct 31, 2005 7:40 pm

Watched it being prepped at Schiphol yesterday. Spent a LONG time at the gate.
Hatches open, closed, open again, closed again, repeated several times as stuff was added and removed again from the hold only to be put back again a bit later.

All seemed a bit unorganised. Could be because 737 handlers have little experience working aircraft to US immigration regs maybe.
I wish I were flying
 
BestWestern
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Joined: Fri Sep 08, 2000 8:46 pm

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Mon Oct 31, 2005 7:53 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 12):
Air France does not offer an all-C product. Air France's A319LRs are configured with coach and business class, and while the flights are considered under the "Dedicate" program, there is no difference in service from a regular long-haul flight, it just happens to be on an A319.

I will be surprised if AF/KL don't standardise around the Dedicate product concept.
You are 100 times more likely to catch a cold on a flight than an average person!
 
jasond
Posts: 648
Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2009 5:23 am

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Mon Oct 31, 2005 8:29 pm

I love this concept. Going transatlantic in a BBJ / A319LR is a brilliant concept. It's the sort of thing that makes this business interesting and Privatair and partners should be congratulated.
 
A340Spotter
Posts: 1741
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2003 9:52 am

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Mon Oct 31, 2005 8:39 pm

Anyone in the know have an answer for whether or not you can ride as a non-rev on it? Business class ZED fares are available on KLM, but one of our co-workers mentioned that IAH told people no non-revs to start. Thinking of flying back from AMS-IAH next week and giving this a eager look!
"Irregardless, it's a Cat III airplane, we don't need an alternate!"
 
SAS-A321
Posts: 348
Joined: Thu Mar 14, 2002 11:44 pm

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Mon Oct 31, 2005 9:06 pm

Do you think that in the future it will be normal to have coach only and business only flights?
It's Scandinavian
 
sk601
Posts: 896
Joined: Sat Jun 11, 2005 11:46 pm

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Mon Oct 31, 2005 11:47 pm

Quoting A340Spotter (Reply 18):
Anyone in the know have an answer for whether or not you can ride as a non-rev on it? Business class ZED fares are available on KLM, but one of our co-workers mentioned that IAH told people no non-revs to start. Thinking of flying back from AMS-IAH next week and giving this a eager look!

Non-rev travel is NOT allowed on KL663. Only duty travel is accepted.

Also staff with business class priority are not allowed to travel with a staff ticket on the Privatair flight. (KL staff has either c or m class travel priority; depending on your position, for example a captain or a ceo has c-class priority whereas groundstaff or fa's have m-class; with a few exceptions)

btw if KL would allow staff travel, it will be very difficult to get on, it seems that it is a good move from KL, today's flight was booked 95%; OK after two days of flying it's to early to say it is successfully, but it's promising

[Edited 2005-10-31 15:52:36]

[Edited 2005-10-31 15:53:05]
 
CRJ900
Posts: 1945
Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2004 2:48 am

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Tue Nov 01, 2005 1:44 am

Quoting KLMCedric (Reply 4):
In the course of 2006 all the 737-300 and -400 will get the seats that are
now in the -800 and -900 and the latter will get completely new seats.
And now it comes,hold something so that you don't fall off your chair,
KL claims that the new seats are designed in such a way that they allow
a pitch decrease without loss off kneespace. The cushion's are thinner and
the traytables are a new design.This means that the last six row of seats
will go from the already small 31" to 29"!!!

Doesn't KLM have 188 seats in their 739s (189 being max. allowed)? If so, what's the point of squeezing 36 pax seated in the rearmost seats? Are KLM introducing a new biz-class seat that need more space, hence relocating galleys or closets to the rear of the cabin?
Come, fly the prevailing winds with me
 
jwenting
Posts: 9973
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2001 10:12 pm

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Tue Nov 01, 2005 2:00 am

there's no reallocating galleys or toilets in a 739, but more space for a business class seat means less room for economy seats left and I doubt they want to reduce the number of paying cattle.
I wish I were flying
 
kl662
Posts: 114
Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2005 4:39 pm

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Wed Nov 02, 2005 4:55 am

Curious what their break-even load factor is for this flight. Was hanging around terminal D last night at IAH (bad thunderstorms delayed my flight) and saw KL664 getting ready for departure. Counted 8 passengers getting on during boarding. Dunno how busy Monday nights are IAH-AMS, but presumably things'll pick up as the flight establishes itself.
 
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drerx7
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RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Wed Nov 02, 2005 5:01 am

Quoting KL662 (Reply 23):
Curious what their break-even load factor is for this flight. Was hanging around terminal D last night at IAH (bad thunderstorms delayed my flight) and saw KL664 getting ready for departure. Counted 8 passengers getting on during boarding. Dunno how busy Monday nights are IAH-AMS, but presumably things'll pick up as the flight establishes itself.

You sure about that?

Quoting SK601 (Reply 20):
btw if KL would allow staff travel, it will be very difficult to get on, it seems that it is a good move from KL, today's flight was booked 95%; OK after two days of flying it's to early to say it is successfully, but it's promising
Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
 
kl662
Posts: 114
Joined: Thu Jan 20, 2005 4:39 pm

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Wed Nov 02, 2005 6:04 am

Quoting Drerx7 (Reply 24):
You sure about that?

I didn't see KL663 arrive, so have to take SK601's word on the 95%. However, the return KL664 boarded in about 45 seconds...
 
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drerx7
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RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Wed Nov 02, 2005 6:11 am

Ahh--that makes sense then.
Third Coast born, means I'm Texas raised
 
AF022
Posts: 1638
Joined: Fri Dec 26, 2003 10:41 pm

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Wed Nov 02, 2005 8:03 pm

Quoting SAS-A321 (Reply 19):
Do you think that in the future it will be normal to have coach only and business only flights?

Longhaul all-economy flights? No way.
 
FlySSC
Posts: 5186
Joined: Tue Aug 12, 2003 1:38 am

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Wed Nov 02, 2005 8:43 pm

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 12):
Air France does not offer an all-C product. Air France's A319LRs are configured with coach and business class

Right. 28 J / 54 Y

Quoting MAH4546 (Reply 12):
there is no difference in service from a regular long-haul flight, it just happens to be on an A319.

Not exactely.
The service in Y is the same.
The service in J is slighly different, less sophisticated, because of the lack of storage in the Galleys and weight restrictions.

There is also no Duty Free sales on board those flights.


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Photo © Richard Koot

 
klmflyer
Posts: 127
Joined: Tue Feb 03, 2004 8:15 pm

RE: KL Privat Air AMS-IAH Already Promising!

Thu Nov 03, 2005 12:33 pm

I'll be flying AMS/IAH on KL663 (BBJ) next Sat 12NOV and will post a complete trip report with notes and pics.