Chiguire
Topic Author
Posts: 1848
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 5:11 pm

Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Sat Oct 29, 2005 12:16 am

It's finally over. After about three years of cooperation Aeropostal and Air Europa stop their codeshare agreement on MAD-CCS-MAD.

The contract for these five weekly services ends on Nov. 1st already. The fact itself is not surprising. After it was already finished on 1st of May 05 it was extended again until 1st Feb 06.
But it is surprising that it happens now.

Air Europa looses its connections to BOG and PMV, and Aeropostal looses a significant number of passengers on CCS-LIM and CCS-BOG as well as on the planned CCS-SJO.

Here some pics from better times:

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Photo © Ariel Shocron
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Photo © Marlo Plate - Iberian Spotters



Let's see how they both react and solve the problems caused. Maybe UX uses Conviasa for BOG and PMV ? And maybe VH puts an own flight ? I heard there are some nice DC10 from S3 around.....
 
RICARIZA
Posts: 2023
Joined: Sat Apr 02, 2005 7:56 am

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Sat Oct 29, 2005 12:36 am

Isn't this an opportunity for Santa Barbara?
I miss ACES, I am proud of AVIANCA & I am loyal to AMERICAN
 
IberiaA319
Posts: 585
Joined: Sun Sep 04, 2005 5:40 pm

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Sat Oct 29, 2005 12:38 am

Why did they stop their codeshare agreement?? Lack of profit maybe??

Without this codeshared flight, Aeropostal will lose many many Europe-bound passengers. Their office in Madrid, located in Calle Princesa, 17, has not much sense now with this situation.
 
Chiguire
Topic Author
Posts: 1848
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 5:11 pm

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Sat Oct 29, 2005 1:04 am

Quoting RICARIZA (Reply 1):
Isn't this an opportunity for Santa Barbara?

Sure ! Finally they are the only Venezuelan airline offering flights to Spain.
But don't forget that Santa Barbara is not very strong with connections within Latinamerica.
The only destinations they can sell out of MAD are CCS and UIO/GYE. The other way round they can only sell MAD as they have no European partner.
I still consider Aeropostal as stronger if they had an own CCS-MAD service.

And now, after the end of UX cooperation I guess this option has again come closer....
 
USADreamliner
Posts: 1211
Joined: Sat Sep 17, 2005 1:33 pm

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Sat Oct 29, 2005 1:12 am

Maybe Aeropostal is looking for another spanish airline,Spanair,Air Comet Plus.
 
Chiguire
Topic Author
Posts: 1848
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 5:11 pm

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Sat Oct 29, 2005 1:19 am

Quoting USADreamliner (Reply 4):
Maybe Aeropostal is looking for another spanish airline,Spanair,Air Comet Plus.

...Iberia.
 
airportmanager
Posts: 448
Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2001 1:49 am

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Mon Oct 31, 2005 12:19 am

Now in UIO, we dont have Aeropostal nor Air Euopa any longer. Any news on what will happen?
 
Chiguire
Topic Author
Posts: 1848
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 5:11 pm

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Mon Oct 31, 2005 2:28 am

Quoting Airportmanager (Reply 6):
Now in UIO, we dont have Aeropostal nor Air Euopa any longer. Any news on what will happen?

Aeropostal was suffering heavy losses. No clue about Air Europa. Looks like IB is too strong.
 
IBERIA747
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RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Mon Oct 31, 2005 4:23 am

Quoting Airportmanager (Reply 6):
Now in UIO, we dont have Aeropostal nor Air Euopa any longer.

What?...has Air Europa cancelled their service to Quito?.

I was really happy for them the day they started flights to Quito. In fact, I was really looking forward to fly that route soon since I have a sister living there since 2001. Been there twice and have always flown IB so I was thinking about flying KLM or Air Europa in my next trip.
¡¡VIVA ESPAÑA!!
 
georgiabill
Posts: 753
Joined: Sat Mar 01, 2003 11:53 pm

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Mon Oct 31, 2005 6:40 am

Could Aeropostal be considering launching their own service? If so what would they use 767's, A310's A332's?
 
797
Posts: 1386
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:51 am

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Mon Oct 31, 2005 10:09 am

Quoting Chiguire (Thread starter):
The contract for these five weekly services ends on Nov. 1st already

Isn't this the opening day for S3 to start operations with their 767s!!! Big grin
What a coincidence. I heard UX had extremely high prices on this route, so I guess It's better they left.
Aeropostal has two options now.... Renew their fleet and add more services, or send their aircrafts to Mojave!

Saludos!
Flying isn't dangerous. Crashing is what's dangerous!
 
Chiguire
Topic Author
Posts: 1848
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 5:11 pm

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Mon Oct 31, 2005 4:58 pm

Quoting 797 (Reply 10):
What a coincidence. I heard UX had extremely high prices on this route, so I guess It's better they left.

UX didn't stop. That would have been OK, but they continue by themselves, without codesharing with VH.
 
797
Posts: 1386
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:51 am

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Tue Nov 01, 2005 1:40 am

Quoting Chiguire (Reply 11):
UX didn't stop. That would have been OK, but they continue by themselves, without codesharing with VH.

Ohh! I get it now, sorry!!!

So, the one who goes out loosing is Aeropostal! Too bad for them. However, if they try to get an aircraft to fly to MAD, I dont think it's a good idea. Another carrier flyinig this route would be ridiculous...

Saludos!
Flying isn't dangerous. Crashing is what's dangerous!
 
Chiguire
Topic Author
Posts: 1848
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 5:11 pm

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Tue Nov 01, 2005 1:46 am

Quoting 797 (Reply 12):
However, if they try to get an aircraft to fly to MAD, I dont think it's a good idea. Another carrier flyinig this route would be ridiculous...

Well it depends. I guess UX will also get some problems on this route now. They loose the connections from CCS. I think they will be away soon.
And if Aeropostal makes a good job, e.g. extends the flights over MAD to other European airports then they have a good chance.

BTW 797: where is the S3 763 ??
 
797
Posts: 1386
Joined: Wed Aug 10, 2005 8:51 am

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Tue Nov 01, 2005 2:06 am

Quoting Chiguire (Reply 13):
BTW 797: where is the S3 763 ??

Chiguire, I don't know!
My cousin went yesterday to CCS because he had a flight to PMV. I told him to look for it and he didn't see a thing.
Their flights are supposed to start tomorrow, but I haven't heard anything about it, not even in the local newspapers.

Do you have any info?

Saludos!
Flying isn't dangerous. Crashing is what's dangerous!
 
Avianca
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Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Sat Nov 05, 2005 8:07 am

Quoting USADreamliner (Reply 4):
Air Comet Plus.

Air Plus Coment could start flights and VH code-share on the flights. I think A7 is doing a good job on there other SouthAmerican routes (LIM,BOG,EZE). They could start with the A310 instead of the much more bigger 742 that they are using to BOG,LIM,EZE, + they could offer some conections from MAD to other European citys that they are serving.

regards
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
Fermarta
Posts: 202
Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 4:17 am

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Sat Nov 05, 2005 8:15 am

Quoting IBERIA747 (Reply 8):
What?...has Air Europa cancelled their service to Quito?.

Now they codeshare with Iberia on this route.
Otros vendrán que bueno te harán
 
Chiguire
Topic Author
Posts: 1848
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 5:11 pm

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Sat Nov 05, 2005 8:23 pm

Quoting Avianca (Reply 15):

Air Plus Coment could start flights and VH code-share on the flights.

In general the idea of a cooperation with A7 is good, especially because of the A7 feeder in Europe.
But as far as I know the traffic rights between Spain and Venezuela allow 2 airlines from each country to operate 7 weekly each. So from Spanish side those frequencies are filled with IB and UX. From Venezuelan side there is only S3.
So IF they do something with A7 it could only be with VH flightnumber.
But at least this is an option. And the A310 would be OK.
In fact there was already one A310 in VH colors in the past. But due to ETOPS problems it never took off to Europe:

MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © Eduardo Moreau
MyAviation.net photo:
Click here for bigger photo!
Photo © Eduardo Moreau

 
Avianca
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Joined: Tue Jan 25, 2005 5:33 am

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Sat Nov 05, 2005 8:27 pm

Quoting Chiguire (Reply 17):
But as far as I know the traffic rights between Spain and Venezuela allow 2 airlines from each country to operate 7

is this the cause that AirMadird never started the anounced services to CCS?

regards
Avianca
Colombia es el Mundo Y el Mundo es Colombia
 
Chiguire
Topic Author
Posts: 1848
Joined: Sat Sep 25, 2004 5:11 pm

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Sat Nov 05, 2005 8:33 pm

Quoting Avianca (Reply 18):

is this the cause that AirMadird never started the anounced services to CCS?

I think not... they wanted to fly from TFN and I think this is kind of open skies. But, please, I am not sure about these traffic rights. Maybe there is someone else here who knows the facts.
 
civilav
Posts: 293
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 8:51 am

RE: Air Europa And Aeropostal Divorced

Sun Nov 06, 2005 5:34 am

Chigüire,

The bilateral treaty between Spain and Venezuela allows for up to 3 airlines from each country, not two. It was signed in 2000 and came into being in 2001. That enabled operations from Air Europa. The third designated Spanish carrier was Spanair but never ever took up the rights. I have not seen any official statement from the Spanish Foreign Ministry requesting authority for Air Madrid to start services to Venezuela and fill in the gap left by Spanair.

On Venezuela's side, designated carriers were Avensa (now defunct), Santa Barbara airlines and Aeropostal. This last airline, despite having traffic rights to the UK, France, Germany, Netherlands and Switzerland, never ever bothered to fly with its own planes and just opted for a code share agreement with Air Europa on the Caracas-Madrid leg. This was abrogated, on the Spanish side, as far back as November 2004 after a very difficult personal relationship between the owners of both airlines.

For your information, Los Rodeos (TFN) is not usually regarded as the international airport for Tenerife. That is the role assigned to Reina Sofia (TFS) and Avensa services used to be handled from there.
Now, S3 has an exclusive right to use it as its owners are from the Canary Islands, are influential in local government through Coalición Canaria and own the only real competitor to Binter Canarias (Islas Airways). Remember Venezuela is very much regarded by the people of the Canary Islands as the "8th Island" (no secret that at one point in the 50s and 60s there were more inhabitants living in Venezuela from the Canary islands than in the islands themselves !) and the González family gets preferential treatment in very many ways.

Hope this clears some of the points you raise and I repeat what I said in another thread: Aeropostal's problems begin and end with Mr. Ramiz.

Greetings from Cancún !