n471wn
Posts: 1373
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 12:23 am

No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:24 am

Unless there is one that has not been reported, we are all witnessing a remarkable achievement of the 737NG. I see no hull losses since its first flight in February of 1997. This is a truly amazing record for this aircraft. While we all know that the age of a well maintained aircraft is not a statistical indicator of an increased probability of an accident, the fact of the matter is that the 737NG is setting new records on the length it has been in airline service with no hull losses (due to any cause).
 
NYC777
Posts: 5083
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 3:00 am

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:27 am

Even better is that the 777 hasn't has a single loss and it's been flying a lot longer.
That which does not kill me makes me stronger.
 
n471wn
Posts: 1373
Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2003 12:23 am

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:29 am

yes but fewer numbers
 
A319XFW
Posts: 1519
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2005 5:41 am

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:31 am

You're tempting fate here! lol
 
JetMaster
Posts: 583
Joined: Tue Sep 27, 2005 7:46 am

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:34 am

Quoting NYC777 (Reply 1):
Even better is that the 777 hasn't has a single loss and it's been flying a lot longer.

It's the number of cycles which matters.


Regards,
JM
The Journey is my Destination
 
Luis777
Posts: 81
Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2004 3:16 am

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:43 am

Quoting Dbba (Thread starter):
(due to any cause).

The 737 Next Generation as many modern airplanes has the next features:

- Enhanced Ground Proximity Warning System (reduce CFITs)
- Predictive Windshear System and Automatic Radar (avoid bad weather)
- EECs (overspeed engine protection)
- Advanced FMS (reduce high workloads)

Most 737-NG operators have good maintenance records and they give extensive training to the flight crews. If you have the money to buy a 737NG of course you have the money for training and maintenance. You have to take care of an investment of 40-50 millions USD.

Regards

LG
 
User avatar
litz
Posts: 1918
Joined: Wed Dec 24, 2003 6:01 am

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 2:53 pm

All the money in the world doesn't help you if your flight crew does something stupid ...

Case in point ... the recent Air France accident.

State of the art airplane; world class airline.

Airplane in ditch.

- litz
 
seven3seven
Posts: 272
Joined: Wed Apr 27, 2005 6:55 am

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 3:36 pm

Quoting Litz (Reply 6):
All the money in the world doesn't help you if your flight crew does something stupid ...

So Litz, you're the newest monday morning quarterback.

You obviously have ALL the info on the accident.

You obviously have thousands of hours in an airline cockpit.

You probably have investigated countless accidents.

You have ALL the answers, you must be a god.
My views are mine alone and are not that of any of my fellow employees, officers, or directors at my company
 
jbmitt
Posts: 504
Joined: Fri Jan 18, 2002 3:59 am

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 4:25 pm

yeah litz..what was the weather like when Air France crashed.. I can't remember any idea?
 
User avatar
HAWK21M
Posts: 29929
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2001 10:05 pm

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 5:06 pm

Amazing Feat,considering the Numbers built & flying.
Anyone having a list of Incidents on the B737NGs though.

regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
TheSonntag
Posts: 4328
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:23 pm

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 9:04 pm

While I sometimes think these statistics can change from one day to another (like the many 737-200 crashes this year which didn't really help the 737s accident statistic which doesn't change that it is a very safe airplane), especially visible with Concorde, I think it is a great achievement. The same applies for the A330 (I crash during flight tests), 777, A340 (it was close, but no fatalities, which is great), A319 and A321 (some of those had hull losses, but none had fatal accidents).

But the real safety improvement are to be seen as soon as these airplanes are sold to Africa as 2nd hand airframes. I fear that we will see crashes of A320s and 737s then, as well, even though I don't hope it will happen. Nevertheless, I guess avionics are much better and more ergonomical than 30 years ago, so its fair to say that a 777 is safer than a 747-100 (which is safe, already)
 
dkny
Posts: 558
Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2004 6:00 pm

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 9:32 pm

Quoting TheSonntag (Reply 10):
But the real safety improvement are to be seen as soon as these airplanes are sold to Africa as 2nd hand airframes

I am sure there have been far more accidents outside of Africa than in Africa.....
 
User avatar
HAWK21M
Posts: 29929
Joined: Fri Jan 05, 2001 10:05 pm

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 11:11 pm

Quoting Dkny (Reply 11):
Quoting TheSonntag (Reply 10):
But the real safety improvement are to be seen as soon as these airplanes are sold to Africa as 2nd hand airframes

I am sure there have been far more accidents outside of Africa than in Africa.....

I think what Sonntaf is saying is that the reasons for the crashes in certain countries are because of them not following the rules.
regds
MEL
I may not win often, but I damn well never lose!!! ;)
 
Boeing Nut
Posts: 5078
Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2001 2:42 am

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 11:19 pm

Quoting Seven3seven (Reply 7):
All the money in the world doesn't help you if your flight crew does something stupid ...

So Litz, you're the newest monday morning quarterback.



Quoting Jbmitt (Reply 8):
yeah litz..what was the weather like when Air France crashed.. I can't remember any idea?

There is a famous saying -

A superior pilot is one who uses his/her superior judgement to avoid situations that would require the use of his/her superior skills.
I'm not a real aeronautical engineer, I just play one on Airliners.net.
 
TheSonntag
Posts: 4328
Joined: Wed Jun 15, 2005 7:23 pm

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 11:30 pm

Quoting Dkny (Reply 11):
is that the reasons for the crashes in certain countries are because of them not following the rules.

Exactly, I didn't want to bash Africa at all, but lets look at the facts: If you see how many accidents are happening in Africa and other "poor" regions and compare to how many flights there are taking place, and if you compare the European, Australian, US-American or Asian accident statistics, you will unfortunately see that the accident rate is extremely high, although Europe had some accidents this year, as well (Air France, even if it happened in Canada, Helios, the crash at sicily, much more than we usually see).

So most accidents happen in regions where there is not spent nearly as much money on crew training, maintenance and other safety features, and these areas use older airplanes as they are cheaper. So when the A320s and 737s get affordable there in 10 or so years, I expect higher accident rates, even though I hope that this will not be the case. But a 40 year old 737NG without maintenance (in the year 2038) is likely to crash, as well.

So as good as the accident rates for modern airliners are, also considering that air traffic today has grown extremely compared to the 70s, it is still to be seen how the accident rate will be over 20 or 30 years. I am sure it will be better than for the already safe MD80s, 737classics, A300s or 747classics, but its too early to judge the safety.
 
D5DBY
Posts: 120
Joined: Sat Aug 20, 2005 8:38 am

RE: No 737NG Hull Losses

Sat Nov 05, 2005 11:35 pm

about that AF crash....beacuse the bad weather the flight crew landed a little far down the runway....and it was a very close call about if they would go-around or not, and they was thinking about that for some time...like 1 sec or something..and then they decided to late that they would try to stop the AC on the rainy runway.....speculation

but the investigation will just ask the flight crews about it....so its just to sit back and wait for the canadian report....

[Edited 2005-11-05 15:43:03]

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