Cessna172RG
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AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Thu Nov 17, 2005 6:11 pm

Ok, in response to the AS 737-800 thread that was posted earlier this week that discussed AS getting ETOPS planes...

After conversing from nearly the horses mouth...

AS is ordering ETOPS equipped 737-800s. But, before you count the new routes, take into account how many are being ordered, and how many MD-80s are in the fleet. If you know the numbers you may see a replacement theory in progress before certain new routes to HNL or NRT or CTS come about. While we'd all love to non-rev to Japan or Hawaii, that is just a rumor.

As for Horizon...

For the next few weeks, Horizon has leased a CRJ-700 with a totally white scheme. No, it is not 604QX, but a totally different jet, that can hold 70 PAX and three galleys and two LAVS, versus one LAV and one galley.

For the Q400s... Horizon is planning to either aquire them and expand or aquire them and get rid of some Q200s. They are looking at using them on routes such as SEA-YYJ (now a strictly Q200 route) or SEA-YLW (which can be oversold often) and possibly SEA-PUW-LWS-SEA (another high yield route). QX is also looking at covering some AS flights, thus relieving AS birds to expand and fly new/different routes. Such ideas are to replace current AS flights on SEA-GEG, SEA-PDX, etc. Horizon already flies a lot of former AS flights out of PDX, including PDX-SFO, PDX-BUR, etc.

Some good news for Californians...

New routes are under the scope for QX. Horizon is looking at expanding its LAX operations to such places as Palm Springs, Modesto, and a few other airports, using the new Q400s. Mexico is also under the gun. QX is contemplating flying to business destinations in Mexico, rather than leisure destinations. Nothing is solid yet, but don't expect QX to start a new service to PVR.

Horizon is also keeping its ears open to other contract flying deals, such as what they currently do for Frontier.

Anyways, that's the latest scuttlebutt. Enjoy and let the comments flow!
Save the whales...for dinner!!!
 
A330323X
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Thu Nov 17, 2005 6:20 pm

Quoting Cessna172RG (Thread starter):
AS is ordering ETOPS equipped 737-800s.

ETOPS is, of course, considerably more complicated than just ordering the equipment for the plane.

Quoting Cessna172RG (Thread starter):
New routes are under the scope for QX. Horizon is looking at expanding its LAX operations to such places as Palm Springs, Modesto, and a few other airports, using the new Q400s. Mexico is also under the gun. QX is contemplating flying to business destinations in Mexico, rather than leisure destinations. Nothing is solid yet, but don't expect QX to start a new service to PVR.

QX doesn't have, and couldn't get, the authority for LAX-PVR even if it wanted it.
I'm the expert on here on two things, neither of which I care about much anymore.
 
Trvlr
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Thu Nov 17, 2005 6:28 pm

Yet more evidence that QX is positioning itself to take over from American Eagle at LAX...

Quoting A330323X (Reply 1):

QX doesn't have, and couldn't get, the authority for LAX-PVR even if it wanted it.

Just out of curiosity, what three U.S. airlines fly LAX-PVR?

Aaron G.
 
A330323X
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Thu Nov 17, 2005 6:57 pm

Quoting Trvlr (Reply 2):
Just out of curiosity, what three U.S. airlines fly LAX-PVR?

Alaska and Mesa (for HP/US Express) currently fly it. None of the the third designations for U.S.-Mexico routes have been given out yet, as the agreement isn't yet in force, but the applications have already been made; United and Delta applied for the third LAX-PVR designation. Since the deadline already passed, Horizon obviously couldn't get it now, but they would never have been awarded it had they applied, since Alaska already holds one of the designations.
I'm the expert on here on two things, neither of which I care about much anymore.
 
loisencroach
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Thu Nov 17, 2005 9:41 pm

Thanks for the great info.

Quoting Cessna172RG (Thread starter):
Horizon is looking at expanding its LAX operations to such places as Palm Springs, Modesto, and a few other airports, using the new Q400s.

Did you hear if Santa Rosa/Sonoma County was one of the prospects? It would be fantastic if they could start that service around the Feb/Mar. 2006 timeframe.
 
FlightOpsAB
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 12:53 am

Quoting A330323X (Reply 1):

ETOPS is, of course, considerably more complicated than just ordering the equipment for the plane.

Of course, it will take a little bit of time for AS to implement an ETOPS program (i.e. Mx, Dx, pilot training changes), then do a bunch of proving flight and then get certified ETOPS. It will take even longer, because they will have to be certified 180 minutes ETOPS in order to fly the legs that you mentioned
 
ASFlyer
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 2:09 am

Quoting Cessna172RG (Thread starter):
While we'd all love to non-rev to Japan or Hawaii, that is just a rumor.

As is this entire thread. Though I will say this, management has all but confirmed, in several public forums, that they are eyeballing Hawaii for service to begin in the forseeable future. The ETOPS only add fuel to that. If they were just replacing the MD80's with the new 800's then they wouldn't necessarily have to be ETOPS equipped, as the MD's are not. They are equipping these planes for ETOPS for a reason, and they don't need to do it to make the flying to CUN/MCO/MIA quicker. They could accomplish that without ETOPS. It's a costly process and they wouldn't spend the money if they didn't need to.....
 
as739x
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 4:50 am

A330: read the article. It say you will NOT see QX flying LAX-PVR. They will be doing business destinations. If QX hit Mexico, look for Monterry and Hermosillo, though there are a few other cities within range but are small. Horizon lack the CR7's to do to many destinations and as said in the article, LAX is lacking and very difficult to get more space. Working at LAX for 3 weeks now I see how problematic this airport is for AS with only 6 mainly usable AS/QX gates (though we can have more gates during certain hours).


ASSFO
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 5:07 am

Quoting Cessna172RG (Thread starter):
AS is ordering ETOPS equipped 737-800s. But, before you count the new routes, take into account how many are being ordered, and how many MD-80s are in the fleet. If you know the numbers you may see a replacement theory in progress before certain new routes to HNL or NRT or CTS come about. While we'd all love to non-rev to Japan or Hawaii, that is just a rumor.

There are only 26 MD-80s in the fleet, meaning at least 9 of the 35 new -800s will be additional lift, not replacement lift.

Also, you have to remember there are options for an additional 65 more, meaning there is a LOT of new additional lift potentially available down the line.

But as others have already opined, the company has publicly stated they ARE evaluating options such as Hawaii. At this point, the question of AS serving the Hawaii market is more a matter of not if, but WHEN.

Furthermore - having spoken with senior management about this yesterday - the company looks at the -800 as their growth vehicle for the future, but has looked at the -900ER as well.
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geg2rap
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 8:45 am

Quoting Cessna172RG (Thread starter):

For the Q400s... Horizon is planning to either aquire them and expand or aquire them and get rid of some Q200s. They are looking at using them on routes such as SEA-YYJ (now a strictly Q200 route) or SEA-YLW (which can be oversold often) and possibly SEA-PUW-LWS-SEA (another high yield route). QX is also looking at covering some AS flights, thus relieving AS birds to expand and fly new/different routes. Such ideas are to replace current AS flights on SEA-GEG, SEA-PDX, etc. Horizon already flies a lot of former AS flights out of PDX, including PDX-SFO, PDX-BUR, etc.

Not into PUW since the Q400 was banned from landing there because neighbors said it was "too loud"
sure makes Xmas fares expensive for college students
 
Boeing744
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 10:12 am

Thanks for all the info. I have been waiting a long time to hear about all this.

Quoting Cessna172RG (Thread starter):
Horizon is planning to either acquire them and expand or acquire them and get rid of some Q200s. They are looking at using them on routes such as SEA-YYJ (now a strictly Q200 route) or SEA-YLW (which can be oversold often)

OK... I agree with you that the Q400s would be suitable for SEA-YYJ. It will be very cool to see (or maybe fly) on a few of these. However, I doubt that they will send a Q400 to YKA. The service now is only seasonal with 1/day frequency. I think QX sometimes has problems filling these flights, and the city of Kamloops has to guarantee a break even flight. I have heard that the only reason QX is still flying this route is because Kamloops is supporting it financialy. Would it be more logical to send a CRJ to YKA instead of a Q400?
 
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:17 pm

Quoting Boeing744 (Reply 10):
Would it be more logical to send a CRJ to YKA instead of a Q400?

IIRC, the Q400 eats the CRJs lunch economically speaking on stage lengths under 500 miles. The CASM for the CRJ would be far higher (and therefore less profitable at any load) than the Q400 at any load.
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flyingnanook
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 1:22 pm

Quoting Cessna172RG (Thread starter):
For the next few weeks, Horizon has leased a CRJ-700 with a totally white scheme. No, it is not 604QX, but a totally different jet, that can hold 70 PAX and three galleys and two LAVS, versus one LAV and one galley

Maybe I'm just having a brain fart (in which case, I should open the window), but where do the extra galleys and lav fit with 70 seats? Don't QX's CRJ-700's already hold 70 people? How did they squeeze these extra amenities on?
Semper ubi sub ubi.
 
rwsea
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 3:05 pm

Quoting Geg2rap (Reply 9):
Not into PUW since the Q400 was banned from landing there because neighbors said it was "too loud"
sure makes Xmas fares expensive for college students

Ugh. PUW could use some more capacity, as the current 4x daily flights are very full, and the fares are ridiculous (around $450 for a 280 mile flight!). These flights must be some of the highest yielding in the QX system, as they mostly attract only business travel heading to the universities. What's sad is that most students at WSU/UI have to drive to GEG to get a reasonable airfare.

On a related note, does anyone know how the new DL LWS-SLC is doing?
 
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 3:48 pm

Quoting Cessna172RG (Thread starter):
Such ideas are to replace current AS flights on SEA-GEG, SEA-PDX, etc.

Except that only QX flies the SEA-PDX flights, and reducing AS capacity out of Spokane in favor of QX capacity would be murder, tomorrow the GEG-SEA route is over sold by 105 seats and the SEA-GEG route is over sold by 85 seats. (This is not a one time occurrence either, it is a very common thing.) Taking away the MD80 and 737 service from Spokane would not be a good thing, if anything more AS service needs to be added to that market, not replaced by Q400s.

[Edited 2005-11-18 08:13:39]
 
SUPRAZACHAIR
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 8:19 pm

Quoting Boeing744 (Reply 10):
However, I doubt that they will send a Q400 to YKA.

Hmmm... I seem to remember loading more than a handful last year....
 
CRJ900
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 8:37 pm

Quoting FlyingNanook (Reply 12):
Quoting Cessna172RG (Thread starter):
For the next few weeks, Horizon has leased a CRJ-700 with a totally white scheme. No, it is not 604QX, but a totally different jet, that can hold 70 PAX and three galleys and two LAVS, versus one LAV and one galley

Maybe I'm just having a brain fart (in which case, I should open the window), but where do the extra galleys and lav fit with 70 seats? Don't QX's CRJ-700's already hold 70 people? How did they squeeze these extra amenities on?

Lufthansa CityLine use this config on their CR7s, with one lav and half-cart sized galley up front and a half-cart sized galley in the rear + standard lav. The rear cargo hold becomes smaller as the cabin is lengthened by the equivalent of one more seat row. I think that most pax on LH CityLine routes only carry small bags and laptops as they are biz-people, so no need for big luggage holds.

My $0.02  Smile
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SUPRAZACHAIR
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 8:59 pm

The aft cargo pit is around 100cubic feet smaller and loses about 1000lbs of cargo capability. The aircraft if N290RB, for those interested. Its slated to finished its acceptance check the 21st. We'll see if that happens.
 
CRJ900
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 10:56 pm

Why has QX leased a CR7 with a different interior anyway?

Are they upping the inflight service level which will lead to more pax needing to use the can...?  Smile
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USAIRWAYS321
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Fri Nov 18, 2005 11:02 pm

Quoting RwSEA (Reply 13):
What's sad is that most students at WSU/UI have to drive to GEG to get a reasonable airfare.

Very true.

I'm confused as to how they banned the Q400 when there are private jets, as well as the Frontier A319 that the football team charters for away games in and out of PUW (and right over my dorm -- I don't think it's too loud, go figure) on a fairly regular basis.

[Edited 2005-11-18 15:02:28]
 
Arrow
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sat Nov 19, 2005 12:42 am

Quoting USAIRWAYS321 (Reply 19):
I'm confused as to how they banned the Q400

Is the Q400 that loud? I thought the whole point of those big, six-bladed windmills was to get more push at lower RPMs, and therefore less noise. I can't believe it's louder than a jet, or even a Q200 with the 4-blade props. And the thing goes straight up on take-off, so I can't imagine noise would be an issue much beyond the end of the runway

Anyone at QX comment on this?
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as739x
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sat Nov 19, 2005 5:06 am

I don't believe this is the reason YKA doesn't get the Q400. I'll do some research.

ASLAX
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as739x
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sat Nov 19, 2005 5:12 am

Supra:

It ca't be N290RB. Thats is a Bizjet registered to Wells Fargo.

N290RB
Aircraft Serial Number : 10029
Aircraft Manufacturer : BOMBARDIER INC
Model : CL-600-2C10
Engine Manufacturer : GE
Model : CF34 SERIES
Aircraft Year : 2001
Owner Name : WELLS FARGO BANK NORTHWEST NA TRUSTEE
Owner Address : 299 S MAIN ST 12TH FL
: MAC U1228-120
SALT LAKE CITY, UT, 84111
Type of Owner : Corporation
Registration Date : 10-Dec-2004
Airworthiness Certificate Type : Standard
Approved Operations : Transport


ASLAX
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
A330323X
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sat Nov 19, 2005 7:34 am

Quoting AS739X (Reply 7):
A330: read the article. It say you will NOT see QX flying LAX-PVR.

Uh, no kidding.  Yeah sure

Quoting AS739X (Reply 22):
It ca't be N290RB. Thats is a Bizjet registered to Wells Fargo.

N290RB
Aircraft Serial Number : 10029
Aircraft Manufacturer : BOMBARDIER INC
Model : CL-600-2C10

I hate to break it to you, but that's a CRJ-700. And Wells Fargo is among the world's largest aircraft lessors and trustees.
I'm the expert on here on two things, neither of which I care about much anymore.
 
as739x
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sat Nov 19, 2005 8:12 am

BOMBARDIER INC
Model Name : CL-600-2C10
Aircraft Type : Fixed Wing Multi-engine
Engine Type : Turbojet
Aircraft Category : Land
Number of Engines : 2
Number of Seats : 22
Max. Gross Weight : 20,000 lbs or over
Aircraft Code : 1390015



If proved wrong this is the plane, I bow to your superior knowledge.

ASLAX

[Edited 2005-11-19 00:16:15]
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
A330323X
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sat Nov 19, 2005 12:13 pm

Dude, a CL-600-2C10 is a CRJ-700. I don't know where you got the 22-seat number, but it's wrong.

I know, how about you take a look at the registration for N600QX, for example, at http://registry.faa.gov/aircraftinquiry/NNumSQL.asp?NNumbertxt=600QX. Look at what's listed as the model, and who's listed as the owner.

And look at the a.net picture of the plane, and see what's listed as the plane's model.


View Large View Medium
Click here for bigger photo!

Photo © Vladimir Kostritsa



As for N290RB, take a look here for that plane's history. I haven't the slightest idea whether QX will be leasing it, but I do know that it's a CRJ-700.
I'm the expert on here on two things, neither of which I care about much anymore.
 
as739x
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sat Nov 19, 2005 3:36 pm

Well in your demeaning way I except that I was wrong 330. Please see my IM. We'll leave it at that.

Just to clairfy guys. There are no restriction on the Q400 at YKM. I spoke with a QX Dispatcher and 2 airports, Lewiston and San Francisco, are the only cities QX will not/can not fly the Q400 into.

ASLAX
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
copaair737
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sat Nov 19, 2005 5:52 pm

It would be really cool to see QX in MOD. I think that the service could be supported, as LAX service has always seemed to be a demand there, at least when I lived there, and I lived there for most of my life. Would it be possible that QX would start PDX if LAX was successful? I'd rather see LAX than anything else though.

-Copa
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as739x
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sun Nov 20, 2005 4:52 am

Copa: Nice to see you here man.

I think MOD-LAX is not a matter of if, but when! Now the service being terminated to PIH, hhmmm! Maybe an available plane. The DH8 would be a great plane to run MOD-LAX and PSP-LAX. The STS service seems to be anyone's guess. The Q400 is perfect.

Let you know if I hear anything.

ASLAX
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
cschleic
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:24 pm

Having once spent 4+ hours in a QX CRJ-700, an additional lav is needed. Even a two hour flight needs more. Bigger ones would be good, too, but that's probably not in the cards. With those planes flying longer and longer routes, two is a necessity. There are other planes out there that carry less than twice the people but have three times the lavs.
 
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:38 pm

Quoting Copaair737 (Reply 27):
Would it be possible that QX would start PDX if LAX was successful? I'd rather see LAX than anything else though.

I'd love to see PDX as well, but for now, will take it one step at a time. Los Angeles is the priority right now.

Personal Observation:
In my profession I talk to at least 20 business-people a day. And every day I find at least one person or more, either just returning, or planning a trip to Portland.

Quoting AS739X (Reply 28):
Let you know if I hear anything.

And what am I? The bald-headed step-child?
 cheeky 

Quoting Copaair737 (Reply 27):
I lived there (MOD) for most of my life.

When and why did you leave?
Delete this User
 
as739x
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sun Nov 20, 2005 2:05 pm

Stirling: Anything but my man!


ASLAX
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
Cessna172RG
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sun Nov 20, 2005 3:06 pm

Yeah, the beef on the new QX CRJ-700 is that the aft cargo wall was moved further aft, allowing room for the extra lavs, galleys, while maintaining the 70 seat quota.

And a Q200 sounds the same as a Q400...or maybe the Q400 is quieter because they seem to gain more altitude quicker as they climb. Many times I've seen a Q400 way over my head at Seattle. And then I've seen a Q200 fly quite a bit lower a moment later.

Hey, with the right "noise abatement" and maximum climb proceedures, it's not noisy at all. Then again, you've got all of those NIMBY people. It's amazing, you build an airport years before, like during a war, that is used for war training. Then, the war ends, and people start moving in. More and more people start living there and they need air service. Then, they bite the feeder's hand (metaphorically speaking) and complain about it. The Cessna 150 that I learned to fly in is a lot louder than a Q400!!! Well...almost!!!
Save the whales...for dinner!!!
 
suv
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Sun Nov 20, 2005 4:10 pm

Quoting Cschleic (Reply 29):
Having once spent 4+ hours in a QX CRJ-700, an additional lav is needed. Even a two hour flight needs more. Bigger ones would be good, too, but that's probably not in the cards. With those planes flying longer and longer routes, two is a necessity. There are other planes out there that carry less than twice the people but have three times the lavs.

Huh? I don't know of any QX flight that is 4+ hours. Clarify the rest please...it makes no sense.

Suv
 
TWAAF9
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Mon Nov 21, 2005 3:04 am

Quoting Cschleic (Reply 29):
Having once spent 4+ hours in a QX CRJ-700, an additional lav is needed. Even a two hour flight needs more. Bigger ones would be good, too, but that's probably not in the cards. With those planes flying longer and longer routes, two is a necessity. There are other planes out there that carry less than twice the people but have three times the lavs.

The longest QX-operated CRJ-700 flight is DAY-DEN. Most days it comes in right about three hours.
Ahh, the power of SABRE...
 
cschleic
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Mon Nov 21, 2005 3:52 am

The long CRJ flights were PDX-SFO-Tucson, one-stop in SFO. But with weather delays, they tried quick turns in SFO so nobody got off for a break (about 1/2 were going through). Between that and 30 minutes in line at SFO, total time was 4+ hours. Actually, it was twice since it was same story both ways. The CRJ's climb fast and are good for a short flight, but cramped up that long was horrible.
 
as739x
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Mon Nov 21, 2005 5:37 am

Last I check the longest CR7 flight was SAT-SFO. If someone can check the numbers since I am not at work yet. Skywest has run SAT/AUS-SFO, both at the time were the longest CRJ flights.


ASLAX
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
timeair
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Mon Nov 21, 2005 10:52 am

Quoting Boeing744 (Reply 10):
I doubt that they will send a Q400 to YKA

Ran the Q400 last year and got slaughtered!...

Quoting Boeing744 (Reply 10):
Would it be more logical to send a CRJ to YKA instead of a Q400?

Ya, and leave half of the passengers baggage behind...you average 3 pces for every pax loaded ex YKA during ski season.
You can't get there from here.
 
md90fan
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Mon Nov 21, 2005 10:59 am

Also YYZ-IAH is up there and the DFW-BUF/SYR
http://www.devanwells.blogspot.com/
 
as739x
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Mon Nov 21, 2005 11:29 am

United Express

SAT-SFO Flt: 6379 3 hrs. 49 min. CR7

That's damn close to 4 hours given they can get a hold inbound to SFO at the time frequently.

ASLAX
"Some pilots avoid storm cells and some play connect the dots!"
 
copaair737
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Mon Nov 21, 2005 2:59 pm

Stirling: I left Modesto in around 2003 to go out and travel after school was over. I went down to Central and South America (mostly Colombia), and then I came up to Northern California for College. What part of Modesto are you from?

-Copa
Livin' on Reds, Vitamin C, and Cocaine
 
QXFLYINGCOUG
Posts: 87
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RE: AS Etops Rumors And QX News, Hold Your Horses!

Mon Nov 21, 2005 5:17 pm

It is WAY too expensive to fly out of PUW when you are a college student! I only live three hours away in Wenatchee (EAT) and I doubt we'll be getting any new routes (like GEG-EAT which there should be) there any time soon so I'm left driving. All of my friends who live on the west side of the state all they do is complain about how far it is to drive and how they can't fly because it's too much and their daddy won't give them his credit card.

It would be kind of cool to see the Q400 landing in PUW because I love it when the Q200's fly over my dorm. Is the Q400 that loud? We had F9 A319's landing at PUW when they were being chartered by WSU and UI. I didn't think they were too loud... then again I like airplane noise the !

--oh yeah bring the Q400 to EAT, they oversell our 5 flights a day all the time!--
--GO COUGS--