brightcedars
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10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Tue Nov 22, 2005 10:18 pm

Emirates Airlines of Dubai (UAE) has announced a large order for Boeing 777s at the Dubai Air Show last weekend.

However, they are one of few airlines with Thai Airways to cramp people at the back of the tube in a 10-abreast economy seating layout.

Do you expect that to change with the extension of the Boeing 777-300ER fleet or not? I hopefully guess and assume the 777-200LRs may come to provide a more relaxing back-of-the-tube seating option than 10-abreast.

I guess passengers will hope more B777s will not mean more sardine cans!
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SA7700
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Tue Nov 22, 2005 10:22 pm

That is were I am definitely price insensitive. If 9-abreast on a B744 is uncomfortable, what the heck must 10-abreast feel like?


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EI747SYDNEY
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Tue Nov 22, 2005 10:25 pm

According to people that have actually flown the 300ER with Emirates, they say that there is plenty of legroom and you would hardly notice any difference except for the seat width.

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BestWestern
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Tue Nov 22, 2005 10:27 pm

This topic has been done to death over the last few weeks and months and is becoming boring beyond belief. Why not perform a search.
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A360
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Tue Nov 22, 2005 10:28 pm

If they use the 772LR's to ultra long haul, and they will, then I expect them to put 9 abreast in eco.

As fot the 77W's... I don't have too much hope... it'il probably be 10 abreast.

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A360
 
7LBAC111
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Tue Nov 22, 2005 10:28 pm

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 3):
s topic has been done to death over the last few weeks and months and is becoming boring beyond belief. Why not perform a search.

Are we feeling a little bit snappy today BWBig grin

Valid point though...

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brightcedars
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Tue Nov 22, 2005 10:30 pm

Quoting BestWestern (Reply 3):
This topic has been done to death over the last few weeks and months and is becoming boring beyond belief. Why not perform a search.

Because this is an opportunity for EK to introduce either a sub fleet of 777-300ERs or make up the entire fleet to a new standard. A factor that was not really discussed before.
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egghead
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Tue Nov 22, 2005 11:23 pm

I have flown both EK777s and UA777. I'll take EK777's 10 seats any day over UA's 9. I don't know what UA was thinking when they put 5 seats in the center isle.
 
FlySSC
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 12:22 am

Nothing beats a good 2x4x2 in an A340 or 2x3x2 in a B767 !!!  Wink
 
whitehatter
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 12:24 am

Quoting EI747SYDNEY (Reply 2):
According to people that have actually flown the 300ER with Emirates, they say that there is plenty of legroom and you would hardly notice any difference except for the seat width.

It would depend on whether it's a high or low density configured aircraft as well. The HD configured ones pack them in like sardines and that does impact on overall comfort.
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pavlin
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 1:45 am

It actually isn't so tight 10 abreast. It is more than on regular buses. Why don't they have 1st class? It is because some people must have comfort and increase the CO2 emission sky high, only because their asses need more room to fart
 
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drerx7
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 1:55 am

Quoting SA7700 (Reply 1):
If 9-abreast on a B744 is uncomfortable, what the heck must 10-abreast feel like?

Uh...what are you talking about? You must be living in the 70s--has anybody ever configured a 744 with 9 abreast in econ?
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ikramerica
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 1:56 am

Quoting FlySSC (Reply 8):
Nothing beats a good 2x4x2 in an A340 or 2x3x2 in a B767 !!!  

Actually 1-2-2 in the 767 F cabin beats it.  Wink
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 2:04 am

Quoting Egghead (Reply 7):
I have flown both EK777s and UA777. I'll take EK777's 10 seats any day over UA's 9. I don't know what UA was thinking when they put 5 seats in the center isle.

You have got to be kidding me!!.....10 abreast on a T7 is ridiculous. i am by no means big but having flown Thai DEL-BKK that was beyond a joke. UA chose that configeration as the considered thay on reflection more people travel in Two's or a family of four or maybe five.
 
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 2:12 am

Quoting SA7700 (Reply 1):
If 9-abreast on a B744 is uncomfortable, what the heck must 10-abreast feel like?

The last airline that had a 9 abreast (or a 3-4-2) configuration in a 747 was Swissair, who finally went for the traditional 3-4-3 configuration in 1980.

Incidentally, the 3-4-2 configuration on a 747 was never uncomfortable. The seats were wide, and back in the '70s seat pitch on even the lousiest of airlines was a comfortable 34 inches.
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airxliban
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 2:14 am

I think I made the calculation a while ago about this...it translates into a 1cm narrower seat, not THAT big a deal.
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Vasu
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 4:44 am

Quoting Jaysit (Reply 14):
The last airline that had a 9 abreast (or a 3-4-2) configuration in a 747 was Swissair, who finally went for the traditional 3-4-3 configuration in 1980.

Any photos of a 747 in a 9-abreast layout??
 
codeshare
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 4:51 am

I had an occasion to travel aboard a 772ER with 10 abreast layout:


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Photo © Krzysztof Skowronski [epwa_spotters]



But for a 3-4-3 in the tube? Must feel like a can of sardines.
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jaysit
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 5:21 am

Quoting Vasu (Reply 16):
Quoting Jaysit (Reply 14):
The last airline that had a 9 abreast (or a 3-4-2) configuration in a 747 was Swissair, who finally went for the traditional 3-4-3 configuration in 1980.


Any photos of a 747 in a 9-abreast layout??

http://www.airliners.net/open.file/139808/M/
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Lufthansa747
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 5:45 am

Quoting BrightCedars (Thread starter):
However, they are one of few airlines with Thai Airways to cramp people at the back of the tube in a 10-abreast economy seating layout.

TG has 3-4-3 on REGIONAL B777-200, code 777. They are being refurbished to 3-3-3 with AVOD, code 772. Upcoming 777-200ER and current 777-3D7s have a spacious 3-3-3 layout.

TG 777 3-4-3 is really bad, much worse than EK.
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Ncfc99
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 5:49 am

I flew an EK T7 DXB-BNE and return in 10 abreast economy. I am over 6ft (180cm) tall and about 15st(210lb). It was not uncomfortable. I can accept the seat width, I would rather have more pitch.
 
karan69
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 5:52 am

Quoting UAL777UK (Reply 13):
You have got to be kidding me!!.....10 abreast on a T7 is ridiculous. i am by no means big but having flown Thai DEL-BKK that was beyond a joke.

I have flown on their 773 As and 772ERs and they are pretty comfortable and comparable to the SQ and MH 773 and 772s i have been on respectively.
Infact the 773s of EK have a 34 inch pitch.
 
IL76
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 5:55 am

The 747 has a 26cm wider cabin than a 777. With 10-abreast, that is one inch per seat wider.
As an example, one trip I flew AMS-SIN on a 777 and SIN-AMS on a 747 (both SQ). The 747's seats were way smaller and more uncomfortable than the 777's 3-3-3 seats. Also leg space in the 777 was more generous. Knowing an airline flies their 777's in a 10-abreast layout will make me buy a ticket on another airline. (similar like I would never fly Air Transat with 9 abreast Airbuses for example)

E
 
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 5:57 am

Quoting Karan69 (Reply 21):
they are pretty comfortable and comparable to the SQ

There is no comparison whatsoever between SQ and EK 777 seating for me.

Quoting Karan69 (Reply 21):
Infact the 773s of EK have a 34 inch pitch

Why does this come up every time here? Even EK.com says it's 33". It's ok but doesn't help much if the seat is too narrow.
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SA7700
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 8:58 am

Quoting Drerx7 (Reply 11):
Uh...what are you talking about? You must be living in the 70s--has anybody ever configured a 744 with 9 abreast in econ?



Quoting Jaysit (Reply 14):
The last airline that had a 9 abreast (or a 3-4-2) configuration in a 747 was Swissair, who finally went for the traditional 3-4-3 configuration in 1980.

My mistake, I am sorry! It must be the jetlag combined with space deprivation and complete stupidity that has kicked in.  embarrassed 


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drerx7
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:18 am

Quoting SA7700 (Reply 24):
My mistake, I am sorry! It must be the jetlag combined with space deprivation and complete stupidity that has kicked in.

HAhahahah---try 380 29" pitch and 10 abreast seats in a DC10. Sun Country flt 9 and 10 IAH-LAS-IAH 1996 for me crowded 
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N1120A
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:18 am

Quoting Egghead (Reply 7):
I don't know what UA was thinking when they put 5 seats in the center isle.

They were thinking that the people on the sides would be more comfortable and that families would be more easily sat together in the center, and you could still give people aisle seats. Given that UA was the launch customer, I think it can be said "what were the 3-3-3 airlines thinking"
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drerx7
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:24 am

Besides--their DC10 fleet was in a 2-5-2 config--why wouldn't they have gone that route--especially since they were the launch customer.
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A360
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 9:30 am

Quoting N1120A (Reply 26):
They were thinking that the people on the sides would be more comfortable and that families would be more easily sat together in the center,

Families of 5 people? I think you'il probably find more families of 3 people and much more families of 4 people.

If almost all the others went for 3-3-3 I guess the right question is what was UA thinking about, and not the opposite.  Wink

It's understandable... they were the 1st costumer... but now time has shown that 3-3-3 is better/preferred by passengers. Otherwise airlines would opt for 2-5-2.

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PanAm747LHR
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 11:01 am

What EK has done is quite reasonable. They have added a seat per row, slightly decreasing seat width, but allowing them to substantially increase pitch. I think many people would agree that indeed pitch is of greater importance than width. The difference in width is barely noticable, however an extra 2-3 inches of pitch makes a huge differnce! Keep up the good work EK!

Nick
 
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 11:50 am

Quoting AirxLiban (Reply 15):
I think I made the calculation a while ago about this...it translates into a 1cm narrower seat, not THAT big a deal.

Yes it is a big deal. Every millimeter and extra cubic millimeter counts in Y-class. This is coming from a rather skinny person.
Have you ever tried 3-4-3 in 777s? Tolerable for one/two hour domestic hops in Japan but not anything longer.
 
SA7700
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 1:39 pm

Quoting Carpethead (Reply 30):
Yes it is a big deal. Every millimeter and extra cubic millimeter counts in Y-class.

I totally agree with you. I flew JNB-SYD on a QF B744 on Sunday night. I got one of the dreaded middle seats on the left side, seated between 2 other blokes. It was sheer hell, especially when the guy at the window seat starting snuggling up to me during the night.... I mean for heaven's sake, he could have cuddled the bloody window, instead I was his "victim".

When dinner was served, I thought that I would give it a try, knowing that it would proof to be a difficult task. I was right and politely refused "breakfast" the following afternoon at 13h45, an hour before we landed in SYD.


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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 2:57 pm

Quoting EI747SYDNEY (Reply 2):
According to people that have actually flown the 300ER with Emirates, they say that there is plenty of legroom and you would hardly notice any difference except for the seat width

For me that is so true.
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lazybones
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 3:09 pm

Quoting Carpethead (Reply 30):
Yes it is a big deal. Every millimeter and extra cubic millimeter counts in Y-class. This is coming from a rather skinny person.
Have you ever tried 3-4-3 in 777s? Tolerable for one/two hour domestic hops in Japan but not anything longer.

Try 3 x 8 hours flights back to back on an Emirates 777 with a 2 year old flying MEL-> DBX -> LHR. Its not the width of the seat its that 3-4-3 crap that kills me. If you travel as a couple you always get that odd person on the end, who usually crashes out just when you need a pi**. Give me the standard Bus layout or a 767 any day!!

As for anything less than 10 a breast in econ on a T7 or 744, never seen it on BA/Virgin/SAI/Emirates or Qantas

Quoting Egghead (Reply 7):
Nothing beats a good 2x4x2 in an A340 or 2x3x2 in a B767 !!!

Heard that!!

IMHO - Emirates A345 gives the best confort levels i've ever seen.  Smile
 
rdwelch
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RE: 10 Abreast In Economy For Emirates' New 777s?

Wed Nov 23, 2005 4:51 pm

My take is that people are getting bigger (I'm 6'2" 250 -beefy) and even with the focus for CASM, it seems prudent to keep your PAX comfy on the Intl flights. By no means am I suggesting a 10/30/60 F/B/Y class config. Let's just say with the newer a/c coming and the lauded efficiency of said a/c, we could get a better comfort config.

Just my opine. Rog.
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