wdleiser
Posts: 865
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2004 9:32 am

TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 4:10 am

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051130/...on_go_ca_st_pe/passenger_screening


This is good news, finally their stupid idiotic rules are starting to be loosened up!
 
airtran737
Posts: 3221
Joined: Mon Apr 05, 2004 3:47 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 4:29 am

So we're going back to September 10th 2001 again? We needed to relax the rules a bit, but this may not be they way to do so. They could have let lighters back on, or relaxed the shoe searches, but letting sharp objects back on is not the solution.
Nice Trip Report!!! Great Pics, thanks for posting!!!! B747Forever
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 4:36 am

Quoting Wdleiser (Thread starter):
This is good news, finally their stupid idiotic rules are starting to be loosened up!

Now, if I could leave my SHOES on when I go through security that will something to appreciate.

""Though the new list of prohibited items hasn't been finalized, certain sharp objects won't be on it, the official said, including scissors less than 4 inches long and wrenches and screwdrivers less than 7 inches long.

Air Transport Association spokesman David Castelveter said the industry has been briefed on the plan and supports it.""


Ha Ha Ha . . . not finalized yet. Hell, the TSA hasn't finalized anything since they came to be an entity . . . I would imagine it will be months - MONTHS - before the "list" is finalized . . . and then of course, when it gets to the field, there will be a thousand interpretations of said list, and once again (rather, stil) no consistency in the infamously inconsistent (and useless might I add) TSA screenings.

Screwdrivers less than 7 inches long and scissors less than 4 inches long. Sure, why not. I could do as much damage with my Mont Blanc as that screwdriver . . .

Remember - watch out for those Grandmothers with their knitting needles!

"What we believe, as does the TSA, is that we should be focusing on what poses the greatest risk," Castelveter said

Well, no crap?

Do you think perhaps the TSA light bulb might finally illuminate??? Even dimly? Actually start paying attention to what matters?
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
airbazar
Posts: 6867
Joined: Wed Sep 10, 2003 11:12 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 4:37 am

Quoting AirTran737 (Reply 1):
So we're going back to September 10th 2001 again? We needed to relax the rules a bit, but this may not be they way to do so. They could have let lighters back on, or relaxed the shoe searches, but letting sharp objects back on is not the solution.

Somehow I don't think a Scissor will be enough to break open the cockpit door.
Furthermore, a broken glass bottle is far more dangerous as a personal weapon and those have always been allowed onboard.
 
c680
Posts: 428
Joined: Sat Apr 23, 2005 6:03 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 4:37 am

Ahhh the effficiency and power of big government at its best!

This was a silly rule from day 1.

It is almost as stupid as extra screening for one way passengers.
My happy place is FL470 - what's yours?
 
wdleiser
Posts: 865
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2004 9:32 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 4:39 am

I think preventing access to the cockpit is really all that truly needs to be done. Small pocket knifes are not going to do any harm to the flight, no more harm thatn a strong person grabbing someone by the neck and breaking their neck.

Box cutters are a nono as not even kids under 18 are allowed to buy them here in the states. Toe nail clippers pose no real threat too. As long as those items cannot make its way up to the cockpit I believe all is safe. Big knifes.... are a nono, have a rule like no more than for inches.
 
zvezda
Posts: 8891
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 8:48 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 4:44 am

Glad to see a little bit of the silliness ending. Perhaps I won't be hassled for 20+ minutes whenever the Terrorist Support Agency notices my 5 inch hemostat -- which is 25-30% of the time.  Yeah sure
 
AC773
Posts: 1700
Joined: Wed Nov 30, 2005 6:03 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 6:26 am

Quoting Wdleiser (Thread starter):
This is good news, finally their stupid idiotic rules are starting to be loosened up!

Ah crap, just after they confiscated my Swisscard (Even after I left the knife insert at home)
Better to be nouveau than never to have been riche at all.
 
LeonB1985
Posts: 690
Joined: Sun Apr 03, 2005 9:21 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 6:41 am

Quoting Airbazar (Reply 3):
Somehow I don't think a Scissor will be enough to break open the cockpit door.

No, but you can do some mean paper cutting and shock people with intricate origami... Big grin
From the construction site that is better-known as London Heathrow Airport
 
MarshalN
Posts: 1474
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2005 9:39 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 6:57 am

Seriously, a nice thick piece of paper in the proper hands (a glossy magazine cover will do) can do a lot of damage if you hit someone, say, on their neck. Little scissors for hair/nail trimming won't do jack. It just adds time to the security check line, wear out the screeners, and "cries wolf" to the point where if there is a real threat, they might just ignore it or pass it off as "oh, another one".

Stupid rules...
 
SA7700
Posts: 2940
Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2003 9:38 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 7:57 am

Certainly this is going to free up their time to break more locks on locked baggage and ramage through pax personal belongings - just for the fun of it?

I was not impressed when I finally got to Chicago and found my locks broken and my suitcase in disarray, after I rechecked it at IAD on arrival into the States. For heavens sake, the suitcase went through security in SYD and JNB without any alarm! It must have been the little bag of washing powder and huge pile of dirty laundry that raised the alarm....  sarcastic 


Rgds

SA7700
When you are doing stuff that nobody has done before, there is no manual – Kevin McCloud (Grand Designs)
 
Fly764
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2005 11:08 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 8:15 am

I don't think letting sharp objects like scissors on board is good at all. Yes, it will still be hard to get into the cockpit, but what about other passengers and the F/A's?
 
4Left
Posts: 77
Joined: Sun Mar 28, 2004 12:07 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 9:28 am

1. Who brings a screwdriver onboard and why?
2. Same for scissors?

Are they someone's binky?
Planes aren't busses, put service back into the air!
 
DeltaMIA
Posts: 1622
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2004 11:53 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 9:36 am

They should be allowed on board. No one will be commandeering an aircraft with scissors in today's era of commercial aviation. The traveling public and flights crews will no longer be threatened by scissors.
It's a big building with patients, but that's not important right now.
 
airfoilsguy
Posts: 3485
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 7:28 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 9:51 am

Why do people feel the need to bring scissors, tools, or knives on a plane in the first place? Leave all that sh*t at home. Bottom line; when people start showing up at the airport with less crap the lines will go faster. Thus the less crap the incompetent TSA has to look at during screening the faster screening will be.
It's not a near miss it's a near hit!!
 
AAgent
Posts: 540
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2001 11:41 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:05 am

Quoting FLY764 (Reply 11):
I don't think letting sharp objects like scissors on board is good at all. Yes, it will still be hard to get into the cockpit, but what about other passengers and the F/A's?

Those other passengers will likely give the unruly passenger a thorough beat down. The terrorist would be lucky to survive the passenger onslaught.

Quoting 4Left (Reply 12):
1. Who brings a screwdriver onboard and why?
2. Same for scissors?

Well, lots of mechanics fly aboard aircraft that are traveling to repair specialized equipment, hence it is quite logical that a person of this occupation would want to have a screwdriver and/or other tools onboard. Why would this person want to take it onboard as opposed to check it you may ask? Well, just like other business traveler's, the tools of their trade are very important to them and they don't want to run the risk of a checked bag not showing up on time. This type of traveler is actually quite common.

Scissors...a million flying grandmothers out there want to knit, sew, crochet, do needlepoint, etcetera and they would very much like to have their scissors with them. Again, if they tried anything foolish, they'd be lucky to survive the other passengers attacking without hesitation.

Common sense is finally starting to make it's way back to the post 9/11 screening checkpoints. Thank goodness.

Best Regards,
AAgent
War Eagle!
 
piercey
Posts: 2188
Joined: Sat Nov 12, 2005 11:07 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:07 am

Whatever, just tell me when they get rid of these idiots.  Wink

Private Companies with good training being overseen by the government - the way to go  Wink
Well I believe it all is coming to an end. Oh well, I guess we are gonna pretend.
 
Kahala777
Posts: 1513
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2005 7:28 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:15 am

The American government and another idiotic and ill planned decision. I guess Bush, and Mineta have decided that we need to pretend that we are living the date 10-September, 2001 all over again. Unfortunately, if something happens again, we have no one to blame but the powers that allowed these objects back on the planes again. Bad move America... Bad move!

KAHALA777
 
brokenrecord
Posts: 747
Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2005 6:45 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:16 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 2):
Remember - watch out for those Grandmothers with their knitting needles!

Yes, because they may knit an Afghan.
 
Kahala777
Posts: 1513
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2005 7:28 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:20 am

Quoting Brokenrecord (Reply 18):
Yes, because they may knit an Afghan.

Good One!

 yes 


KAHALA777
 
Mir
Posts: 19093
Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2004 3:55 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 2:45 pm

Quoting Brokenrecord (Reply 18):
Yes, because they may knit an Afghan.

 rotfl 

I'm not quite sure I like the idea of small knives being allowed on again, but other than that I suppose I'm fine with it.

-Mir
7 billion, one nation, imagination...it's a beautiful day
 
goaliemn
Posts: 320
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:46 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 10:49 pm

I work on computers every now and then inside the sterile area of the airport. I can't bring any tools with me, even tho I don't have a boarding pass. This will definately help me out if they actually do decide to allow things like screwdrivers and hex wrenches through.

That will be much easier than trying to hunt someone down to escort my tools through, or hoping someone in the computer office has the tools I need handy.
 
md80fanatic
Posts: 2365
Joined: Tue Apr 13, 2004 11:29 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Thu Dec 01, 2005 11:39 pm

Quoting Kahala777 (Reply 17):
The American government and another idiotic and ill planned decision. I guess Bush, and Mineta have decided that we need to pretend that we are living the date 10-September, 2001 all over again. Unfortunately, if something happens again, we have no one to blame but the powers that allowed these objects back on the planes again. Bad move America... Bad move!

You have obliquely touched on one of my concerns. Not that I am concerned about any of the items now allowed on aircraft.

Let's say something does happen, and a passenger takes his 7 inch screwdriver and rushes the cockpit. Even if the passenger harms no one and does not penetrate the door, what will be the result of the passenger's action? A PERMANENT ban on all these items that have been recently re-allowed to fly. A permanent ban is what the government has wanted (it's in the patriot act)....it is the public outrage that has forced them to recede a little.

Sounds like they may play another thesis, antithesis, synthesis manuever...in order to cast these silly cartage rules in stone, once and for all.
 
smcmac32msn
Posts: 1661
Joined: Thu May 13, 2004 9:25 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 1:50 am

Quoting SA7700 (Reply 10):
It must have been the little bag of washing powder and huge pile of dirty laundry that raised the alarm.... sarcastic

I think they were going to try to do your laundry for you, but couldn't get the washing machine to work.

Quoting Airfoilsguy (Reply 14):
Why do people feel the need to bring scissors, tools, or knives on a plane in the first place? Leave all that sh*t at home.

I'm sure mechanics and other people who have to carry that stuff for their jobs would love to hear you say that. Some people have to travel "on the job" and need some of that stuff with them.
Hey Obama, keep the change! I want my dollar back.
 
BMIFlyer
Posts: 8065
Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2004 7:11 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 1:57 am

Quoting Airbazar (Reply 3):
Somehow I don't think a Scissor will be enough to break open the cockpit door.

No, but they are effective at cutting peoples throats, as we already know  Sad

This whole rethink is a bad Idea.

Let us leave the current restrictions as they are, but also allow us to wear shoes again thru security.


Thanks


Lee
Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own
 
supa7E7
Posts: 1360
Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2004 2:05 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 2:19 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 2):

Now, if I could leave my SHOES on when I go through security that will something to appreciate.

Remember the shoebomber?

Quoting SA7700 (Reply 10):
I was not impressed when I finally got to Chicago and found my locks broken

FYI, you are *never* supposed to lock your suitcase flying in the USA. Doing so will guarantee a detailed search. Also, outside countries are not trusted to uphold TSA "standards." All bags are treated as dirty goods by TSA when entering the country and are searched again as needed.
"Who's to say spaceships aren't fine art?" - Phil Lesh
 
SA7700
Posts: 2940
Joined: Thu Dec 18, 2003 9:38 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 2:38 am

Quoting Supa7E7 (Reply 25):
FYI, you are *never* supposed to lock your suitcase flying in the USA. Doing so will guarantee a detailed search. Also, outside countries are not trusted to uphold TSA "standards." All bags are treated as dirty goods by TSA when entering the country and are searched again as needed.

I am so glad that you put TSA standards between hyphens. IMHO there are lots of other countries that had higher security standards pre-911, than the current TSA standards are this stage. Please note, I am critizising the "system", not Americans as such. Anyway, I have bought TSA approved locks now.

Quoting Smcmac32msn (Reply 23):
I think they were going to try to do your laundry for you, but couldn't get the washing machine to work.

 rotfl 


Rgds

SA7700
When you are doing stuff that nobody has done before, there is no manual – Kevin McCloud (Grand Designs)
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 7:29 am

Quoting Brokenrecord (Reply 18):
Yes, because they may knit an Afghan.

 rotfl 

Quoting MD80fanatic (Reply 22):
Let's say something does happen, and a passenger takes his 7 inch screwdriver and rushes the cockpit. Even if the passenger harms no one and does not penetrate the door, what will be the result of the passenger's action? A PERMANENT ban on all these items that have been recently re-allowed to fly.

Permanent ban my  butthead . Permanent asswhipping from the other 100-200 passengers aboard that flight. This is post-9/11, let 'em give it a try, see how long it takes for the first former Marine or soldier (or active), or anyone else for that matter to wail on him like a step child. If it happened aboard a flight on which I was traveling, you'd have to get in line behind me and take the left overs.

Quoting Supa7E7 (Reply 25):
Remember the shoebomber?

Yes, yes, yes I remember. And I also remember laughing out loud and pointing at the follishness and insanity if watching many passengers take off their SANDLES to run them through an airport x-ray. It's a ridiculous thing, and you will not convince me otherwise.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
RAMPRAT980
Posts: 584
Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2005 1:06 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 7:49 am

I am not wasteing my energy on this thread. Enough said
With gun control there can be no democracy.. With gun control there can be no Freedom
 
access-air
Posts: 1576
Joined: Thu Sep 21, 2000 5:30 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 7:57 am

Yes,
And some one could also hurt someone with a plastic fork or knife....
You could easily stab someone in the eye with it or inflict nasty cuts...How about ink pens??? I think I learned in my advanced first aide class many moons ago that a bick pen could be substituted for use to do an emergency tracheotomy if neccessary. If someone is desperate enuff to try anything sinister they are gonna do it. No amount of preparedness can help that.
If we could plan for everything, then there wouldn't be a need for any FAA Regulations because we could anticipate every scenerio in aviation!!!
Only God has that kind of knowledge.
The only way to be completely 100 percent safe so that no one could try anything you'd have to vacumm pack each passenger in plastic...or put them all in straight jackets. I dont see that as any bit practical...However, after having had dealt with the looneys that run TSA and Airlines over the years, a straight jacket just could be the order of the day!!!!!! (I am of course joking here!!!)
Alot of the restrictions that were put in place were "knee-jerk" sort of a ban everything and we'll sort it out later.
I think its good to re-examine the banned items on the list and be realistic about introducing them to the aircraft cabin. That's what we need to do...

Access-Air
Remember, Wherever you go, there you are!!!!
 
wdleiser
Posts: 865
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2004 9:32 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 8:17 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 27):
Permanent ban my butthead . Permanent asswhipping from the other 100-200 passengers aboard that flight. This is post-9/11, let 'em give it a try, see how long it takes for the first former Marine or soldier (or active), or anyone else for that matter to wail on him like a step child. If it happened aboard a flight on which I was traveling, you'd have to get in line behind me and take the left overs.

Nice terminology about stepchildren!

What if they someone stabs a passenger?
But also, what if someone goes and grabs a passenger by the neck and twists it killing them instantly?
What if I throw my shoe at an FA knocking her unconsious or she dies because she hits her head against an armrest on the way down.
 
turnit56N
Posts: 230
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:13 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 9:12 am

Quoting Airfoilsguy (Reply 14):
Why do people feel the need to bring scissors, tools, or knives on a plane in the first place?



Quoting AAgent (Reply 15):
Scissors...a million flying grandmothers out there want to knit, sew, crochet, do needlepoint, etcetera

....and it's not just grandmothers. I know a lot of FAs and some pilots that like doing embroidery on trips. It's a popular past-time that doesn't take up much room. Quite a few FAs in my pad are looking forward to being able to take their scissors along on long trips.

Anyway, the real terrorists are going to be using nonmetallic weapons that are a lot more effective than a pair of small scissors or a screwdriver.
Aviation is not so much a profession as it is a disease.
 
airfoilsguy
Posts: 3485
Joined: Sun Oct 09, 2005 7:28 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 9:51 am

My grand father has an antique gun collection. Should he be allowed to bring that in the plane so he can polish them. Come on people your hobbies can wait till you are on the ground. As for people who need to bring tools with them while traviling, there is a large storage area below the seating area that is called the cargo hold. I am sure your tools will fit there.
It's not a near miss it's a near hit!!
 
deltagator
Posts: 6170
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 9:56 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 9:52 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 2):
Now, if I could leave my SHOES on when I go through security that will something to appreciate.

Florsheim, Johnston & Murphy, and French Shriner all offer "airport friendly" shows. I wear them every week and pass through with no problem.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 2):
"What we believe, as does the TSA, is that we should be focusing on what poses the greatest risk," Castelveter said

I could wish for profiling passengers based on ethnicity but then that would make sense and heaven forbid the good old US guv'mint do something correctly.

Quoting 4Left (Reply 12):
1. Who brings a screwdriver onboard and why?

Some of us who have technical jobs and might have the need to unscrew something when we get to where we are going (insert witty comments here guys about screwing things.) I bet the amount of screwdrivers that Lowe's and Home Depot have sold since 9/11 have skyrocketed. I know I have had to go to one more than once when I get to a client's site.

Quoting FLY764 (Reply 11):
I don't think letting sharp objects like scissors on board is good at all. Yes, it will still be hard to get into the cockpit, but what about other passengers and the F/A's?

What is to keep me from stabbing you with my pen, or the dull metal butter knife from First Class? What about cracking your skull by kicking you in the head with my size 14 shoes? Or strangling you to death with my huge hands or the 8' Ethernet cord I travel with in my backpack? Do you want me to leave Their are many ways to kill folks without things classified as "weapons" by some government pencil pusher.
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 11:31 am

Quoting Wdleiser (Reply 30):
What if they someone stabs a passenger?

Don't read more into my post than was said . . . I don't think anyone needs screwdrivers or anything of the sort on a plane . . . I was only responding to the issue of attacking a cockpit door/rushing the cockpit, etc.

Quoting Wdleiser (Reply 30):
What if I throw my shoe at an FA knocking her unconsious or she dies because she hits her head against an armrest on the way down.

Then you get your ass kicked by passengers like me AND you go to jail for murder . . . .

C'Mon Wd, you can do better than what if me to death can't you?

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 33):
Florsheim, Johnston & Murphy, and French Shriner all offer "airport friendly" shows. I wear them every week and pass through with no problem.

Understood. Not my point. The "non-mandatory, voluntary" removal of shoes period is the point. In ANC, you're guaranteed a secondary screening if you keep them on. What is so voluntary about that?

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 33):
I could wish for profiling passengers based on ethnicity but then that would make sense and heaven forbid the good old US guv'mint do something correctly.

Profiling based on ethnicity is wrong. Profiling based on probable threat is right. It should already be happening. But the government is too chicken to do their jobs right.
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
wdleiser
Posts: 865
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2004 9:32 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 2:49 pm

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 34):

Profiling based on ethnicity is wrong. Profiling based on probable threat is right. It should already be happening. But the government is too chicken to do their jobs right.

The government does not want to hear about stories of racial profiling. The "guv'ment" does not want any more bad pres than it already has. (which is has alot of i might say)
 
goaliemn
Posts: 320
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:46 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Fri Dec 02, 2005 10:46 pm

Quoting Airfoilsguy (Reply 32):
As for people who need to bring tools with them while traviling, there is a large storage area below the seating area that is called the cargo hold. I am sure your tools will fit there.

You, apparently, have never had luggage lost.. I play hockey. I've had my gear lost many times while traveling. If I have time, I ship some of my gear ahead, but I sometimes get afew hours notice to go catch a flight and play. I know many people that do repairs get less than that for notice, and can't sit for a day waiting for replacement tools to be shipped.

Quoting Airfoilsguy (Reply 32):
My grand father has an antique gun collection. Should he be allowed to bring that in the plane so he can polish them.

If he can pass a background check and skills training, I have no qualms with people with guns on board. More people to help protect the airplane is a good thing.
 
deltagator
Posts: 6170
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 9:56 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Sat Dec 03, 2005 12:03 am

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 34):
Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 33):
I could wish for profiling passengers based on ethnicity but then that would make sense and heaven forbid the good old US guv'mint do something correctly.

Profiling based on ethnicity is wrong. Profiling based on probable threat is right. It should already be happening. But the government is too chicken to do their jobs right.

Probable threat is what I should have said. Thank you for correcting me. Of course the probable threat is the stereotypical Arab as a terrorist. I hate to point out the obvious but it was 19 Saudis that overtook the planes on 9/11 and not a nun, grandmother, and my 9 year old neice (who I have alll seen get the TSA riot act.) I've said it before and I'll say it again. Look for the terrorist, not for the weapon. Until we get over this fear of offending people we aren't fixing anything and just giving a false sense of security.

Quoting ANCFlyer (Reply 34):
The "non-mandatory, voluntary" removal of shoes period is the point. In ANC, you're guaranteed a secondary screening if you keep them on. What is so voluntary about that?

Ah yes. Do it one way or the other but get the routine correct TSA. Atlanta had that going for a while. Before I got the airport friendly shoes I travelled in tennis shoes. I stepped up to the screeening in ATL and the TSA dingbat "suggested" I remove my shoes. I asked if I didn't remove them would I be subject to additional screening. She said she couldn't tell me but again suggested that I should remove my shoes for the voluntary screening. I made a remark about how it wasn't voluntary if the only way I could avoid additional screening was to take them off. Again, looking for the weapon and not the terrorist.
"If you can't delight in the misery of others then you don't deserve to be a college football fan."
 
ANCFlyer
Posts: 21391
Joined: Mon Nov 15, 2004 3:51 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Sat Dec 03, 2005 12:46 am

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 37):
I hate to point out the obvious but it was 19 Saudis that overtook the planes on 9/11 and not a nun, grandmother, and my 9 year old neice (who I have alll seen get the TSA riot act.) I've said it before and I'll say it again. Look for the terrorist, not for the weapon. Until we get over this fear of offending people we aren't fixing anything and just giving a false sense of security.

And we have a WINNER! We should be taking lessons from the Israelis. And screw who we offend. Don't like it, don't fly. I carry a badge and have more than once gotten the TSA treatment. Don't even get me started on that crap . . .
FOR THOSE THAT FOUGHT FOR IT, FREEDOM HAS A FLAVOR THE PROTECTED WILL NEVER KNOW OR UNDERSTAND
 
VS747SPUR
Posts: 365
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2005 6:35 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Sat Dec 03, 2005 12:55 am

I do not agree with this at all. I still think any sharp blade/edge whatever size can put an aircraft in danger. Although some small blades might not be enough to get in control of the cockpit, it can certainly by used to threaten crew/passengers into doing things. I hope its not forgotten that there are still some dangerous people out there.

I accept there are some things that have always been allowed on board could harm someone, but not to the extend to a blade.
I do not see why anything has to be changed ?

VS747SPUR
Fly DL
 
goaliemn
Posts: 320
Joined: Fri Sep 02, 2005 9:46 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Sat Dec 03, 2005 3:00 am

Quoting VS747SPUR (Reply 39):
I accept there are some things that have always been allowed on board could harm someone, but not to the extend to a blade.

First class has gone back to metal knives.. plus someone can do quite a bit of damage with a pen, or with just their hands if they are well trained..

This reminds me of an onion article afew years ago.. "FAA bans all passengers on flights" They made the point that all hijackings involved passengers, so by banning them, there shouldn't be any hijackings.
 
jetdeltamsy
Posts: 2688
Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2000 11:51 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Sat Dec 03, 2005 3:33 am

Quoting Wdleiser (Thread starter):
This is good news, finally their stupid idiotic rules are starting to be loosened

I completely disagree.

Screwdrivers, scissors, wrenches and other like items serve no purpose being carried in a passenger cabin. And with more and more people traveling in chemically induced altered states, I think it is prudent to keep such items out of their reach.

It puts all of us at risk for injury.

It would be nice if we lived in a perfect world where everyone behaved themselves. But the reality is that we do not. The "valium and alcohol" defense is unacceptable, especially when other people get hurt.
Tired of airline bankruptcies....EA/PA/TW and finally DL.
 
wdleiser
Posts: 865
Joined: Thu Apr 22, 2004 9:32 am

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Sat Dec 10, 2005 3:10 am

Quoting Jetdeltamsy (Reply 41):
Screwdrivers, scissors, wrenches and other like items serve no purpose being carried in a passenger cabin. And with more and more people traveling in chemically induced altered states, I think it is prudent to keep such items out of their reach.

It puts all of us at risk for injury.

It would be nice if we lived in a perfect world where everyone behaved themselves. But the reality is that we do not. The "valium and alcohol" defense is unacceptable, especially when other people get hurt.

Well, there was an AA flight where there was a fire above the cabin, and a man with a pocket knife was able to saw through the ceiling which enabled the F/A to spray the extinguisher up towards the fire and thus putting it out. Had knifes been banned back then, that plane would most likely of crashed or killed many people from smoke or burning them.
 
User avatar
scbriml
Posts: 13357
Joined: Wed Jul 02, 2003 10:37 pm

RE: TSA To Allow Scissors And Tools Again!

Sat Dec 10, 2005 3:26 am

Quoting DeltaGator (Reply 33):
I could wish for profiling passengers based on ethnicity but then that would make sense and heaven forbid the good old US guv'mint do something correctly.

Please don't forget who perpetrated the second worse terrorist act on US soil.
Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana!

Who is online