CMK10
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Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:26 am

Last night I was watching the excellent film "Bullitt" and there's a scene at San Francisco Airport (the best part of the movie of course). During that scene Pan Am is calling the departure of a flight with the routing "New York and Rome". Was Pan Am flying transcontintental routes at that point?
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AirCop
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:32 am

Yes and no, they flew transcontinental from JFK and SFO. The 707's couldn't go to the far east non-stop so they flew to SFO to refuel and provide connections to other points. They couldn't carry JFK/SFO passengers only.
 
stirling
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:54 am

Quoting Cmk10 (Thread starter):
Last night I was watching the excellent film "Bullitt" and there's a scene at San Francisco Airport (the best part of the movie of course). During that scene Pan Am is calling the departure of a flight with the routing "New York and Rome". Was Pan Am flying transcontintental routes at that point?

Everyone makes special note of the car chase scenes, but to me, it's the SFO scenes that make the movie!

And as Aircop mentioned, the announcement heard is more or less for the benefit for the passengers arriving from Hawaii who disembarked to stretch their legs, or for those originating passengers ticketed SFO-(JFK)-FCO, or for passengers making a connection in NYC to Europe or the Caribbean.
The only other flight from the west was from Tokyo....but that arrived in the morning....and not at night as portrayed in the movie.

One last thing, I am to understand the announcements and everything else was "real", meaning: nothing was staged for the benefit of the movie...what you see is a real slice of life.
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rootsair
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:54 am

Quoting AirCop (Reply 1):
They couldn't carry JFK/SFO passengers only.

Why not? Thought only US airlines were allwed to carry passangers within the US
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DETA737
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:57 am

Quoting RootsAir (Reply 3):
They couldn't carry JFK/SFO passengers only.

Why not? Thought only US airlines were allwed to carry passangers within the US

Before 1978 routes in the U.S. were highly regulated and only certain airlines could carry pax on specified routes. Because Pan Am was the international airline of the U.S. they were not allowed to carry passengers within the continental U.S. or sell tickets on those routes. They were allowed however to carry pax to and from Alaska, Hawaii, Puerto Rico and other U.S. outlying territories to the continental U.S.
 
simairlinenet
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Thu Dec 08, 2005 11:51 am

The route was HNL-SFO-JFK. From memory, it was timed to also feed into international flights from JFK. I have 1967 and 1970 timetables if anyone wants more information, but not here, so not for a few weeks.
 
PanAm747
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Thu Dec 08, 2005 1:10 pm

http://www.airchive.com/Timetables%2...%20Compressed/PAmap6903%20COMP.jpg

Great site for checking on memorabilia and routings. This particular timetable shows a number of transcontinental routes, including SFO-JFK.
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ss278
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Thu Dec 08, 2005 1:32 pm

Pan Am could carry traffic on their transcon SFO/LAX/JFK flights only if they were continuing on to Europe/South America or Asia. Stopovers were permitted.

Thus if a passenger was flying from San Francisco to Rome, he/she could board Pan Am in SFO, fly to New York and spend a few days there if they wished, then continue on to Rome. Strictly local traffic, i.e. SFO/JFK was not allowed.
 
timz
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Fri Dec 09, 2005 4:06 am

Wasn't "Bullitt" made in 1967? PA flew SFO-JFK in 1968, but maybe not in 1967.

Offhand I'm guessing they didn't have an SFO-JFK-FCO direct flight in that era. SFO-LHR-FCO is possible, tho.
 
DETA737
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Fri Dec 09, 2005 6:22 am

Quoting Timz (Reply 8):
Offhand I'm guessing they didn't have an SFO-JFK-FCO direct flight in that era. SFO-LHR-FCO is possible, tho.

Pan Am did have SFO-JFK and JFK-FCO at the time, no LHR-FCO flights though.
 
tomindc
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Fri Dec 09, 2005 6:48 am

I'm not totally sure of the year, but I remember a business trip DCA/JFK/SFO on PanAm. The JFK departure was on a 747SP on its way to Hong Kong with the stop in SFO. Terrific flight as I wasn't initially booked on that flight but made it with carry-on luggage, and they upgraded me from Y to J!
 
semsem
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Fri Dec 09, 2005 7:10 am

I flew Pan Am from New York to Hong Kong in 1972. JFK to San Francisco and then change of plane to Hong Kong via Tokyo. The flight continued to Bangcock (LOL I can't spell it.)

The service was "crappy." The food was "crappy" too in economy.
 
AirCop
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Fri Dec 09, 2005 10:06 am

Quoting Tomindc (Reply 10):

That had to be after deregulation in 1978. If memory serves me right the 747SP came on line in 1976.
 
isitsafenow
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Fri Dec 09, 2005 10:16 am

TIMz...Steve drove a 68 Mustang...that rules out 67.
safe(your resident Mustang professional) LOL.....
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BOAC911
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Sat Dec 10, 2005 6:23 am

In the film Bullitt, the Pan Am flight leaves SFO for Rome at around 7 pm. Initially, McQueen believes that that the man they're looking for (Mr. Ross) is on the Rome flight, but in the last moment he has a hunch and calls ground control and asks for the London flight to be stopped (it is already taxiing or about to begin its take off run). If Pan Am ever had a SFO-FCO flight at that time, it would have in all likelihood been via SEA, LHR, or maybe JFK. SFO-LHR nonstop was barely possible for the 707-300, but was already being operated regularly at that time. JFK is unlikely b/c the flight would have arrived at JFK at 3 am (Unlikely) In the movie, the script (or at least McQueen's dialogue) gives us the impression that we are clearly dealing with two separate flights (SFO-LHR and SFO-FCO) In other words, something is inconsistent. This particular sequence would have worked perfectly at JFK, especially in view of the fact that several Pan Am 707s are seen lining up for take-off. But somehow I think the San Francisco schedules were adapted for purposes of the script. Additionally, I'm convinced that Pan Am also paid for a promotional consideration. Perhaps Mr. Peter Yates could help us out?
 
timz
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RE: Did Pan Am Fly SFO-JFK In 1968?

Sat Dec 10, 2005 7:54 am

I was wrong-- in 10/68 PA did have a flight 800/110 TYO-HNL-SFO-JFK-FCO, but it left SFO at 0900. The flight number changes at JFK, but it doesn't mention a plane change.