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jedward
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CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 7:24 am

HOUSTON, Dec. 8 /PRNewswire-FirstCall/ -- Continental Airlines (NYSE: CAL) today issued the following bulletin to update employees about negotiations with its flight attendants' union, the International Association of Machinists (IAM):

Continental Airlines is pleased to confirm that, as reported by the National Mediation Board (NMB), the company has reached an agreement with the IAM covering the company's flight attendants.

Continental's Chairman and CEO Larry Kellner personally joined the talks today, along with Robert Roach, Jr., the general vice president, transportation of the IAM.

"I want to thank the IAM leadership and its negotiating team for working together with Continental to get this deal done within the deadline set by the National Mediation Board," said Larry Kellner, Continental's chairman and chief executive officer. "Now, we must go forward and get this agreement ratified."

The IAM is preparing detailed communications to its membership explaining the agreement, which is subject to ratification by the flight attendants. The company is not releasing details of the agreement in order to allow the union to communicate directly with its members. Results of the ratification process are expected in January 2006.

Talks between Continental Airlines and the IAM resumed earlier this week at the offices of the NMB in Washington, D.C. The NMB had stated this was a final bargaining session and that failure to get this agreement could have resulted in a release from mediation.

Today's agreement between Continental Airlines and the IAM, along with previously announced pay and benefit reductions for other work groups, concludes the negotiation process with all Continental's domestic employees.

SOURCE Continental Airlines
12/08/2005

CONTACT: Corporate Communications of Continental Airlines, 1-713-324-5080, or corpcomm@coair.com

5974 12/08/2005 17:07 EST http://www.prnewswire.com
As Christ died to make men holy, let men die to make us rich. --S.C.
 
dutchjet
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 7:28 am

Great news.......it seems as if CO has avoided a potentially difficult situation. Congrats to all concerned - the CO f/a's can have peace of mind and the CO management can focus on the business of running the airline and, hopefully, making some money.

By the way, a few analysts are predicting that CO will turn a profit during the 2007 calender year. Lets hope so.
 
ARGinLON
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 7:36 am

Does anybody know what was on the table for negotiation apart from salary reductions?
 
dutchjet
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 7:39 am

Crew Rest issues were on the table, as well as pension security.
 
FlyGuyClt
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 7:43 am

I envy the CO flight attendants. They maxed out more than the NWA flight attendants and their company only wanted $82 million a year. NWA has gotten $117 million and wants a total of $195 million a year. OUCH !


Safe Flying  

[Edited 2005-12-09 00:15:05]
Florida Express, Braniff II and ......
 
ARGinLON
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 7:45 am

Quoting Dutchjet (Reply 3):
Crew Rest issues were on the table, as well as pension security.

I heard this as well. I believe they take 4 business class seats on a 772? Would they go down to two? Or to 6/8 in economy?
 
ikramerica
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 8:00 am

It should be zero BF seats for non pilots. Give up rows of 3 Y instead of they need to lie down, but it's silly to sacrifice a BF seat for an F/A.
Of all the things to worry about... the Wookie has no pants.
 
dutchjet
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 8:07 am

Quoting ARGinLON (Reply 5):

I heard this as well. I believe they take 4 business class seats on a 772? Would they go down to two? Or to 6/8 in economy?

Generally, the F/As do not get a BF seat, there is a curtained off area in the Y section of the aircraft for crew rest.....we do not yet know what was agreed to, the terms of the new agreement will not be made public until the union reps disclose the deal to the F/As. The more important issues were money and pension security, the crew rest issue was secondary and my guess is that crew rest provisions will not change greatly with the new contract.
 
slider
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 8:16 am

The pension thing was a real tough one, from the first round---at the root of the issue is that the group is infighting right now and there is a mixed confidence in the IAM. Many FAs voted the previous deal down strictly because the IAM would have managed their pensions.

Also, it was divided between EWR vs IAH and the system and junior VS senior. Minimum hours requirement was also a deal.

If it were just about a pay cut, I think the deal would have been done ages ago.

Now the pay part will be a bigger hit because of having had the 7 month delay in getting a deal cut.

I'm glad they reached a TA, but I'm not counting those chickens until it's ratified. Just because the IAM came to an agreement doesn't mean the membership will. Thorny indeed.
 
CO767FA
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 8:30 am

Quoting FlyGuyClt (Reply 4):
I envy the CO flight attendants. They maxed out more than the NWA flight attendants and their company only wanted $82 million a year. NWA has gotten $117 million and wants a total of $195 million a year. OUCH !

Thanks, but remember the 80's and early to mid-90's? All network carriers had much more lucrative contracts then the current CO agreement and we have yet to see the new T/A.

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 6):
It should be zero BF seats for non pilots. Give up rows of 3 Y instead of they need to lie down, but it's silly to sacrifice a BF seat for an F/A.

You really are unbelieveable. Go back to writing something you know about!
 
luv2fly
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 8:38 am

Quoting Ikramerica (Reply 6):
It should be zero BF seats for non pilots. Give up rows of 3 Y instead of they need to lie down, but it's silly to sacrifice a BF seat for an F/A.

What is good for the goose is good for the gander as well. F/A are actually working during the flight and not sitting for the whole flight, if any one deserves it more, the F/A does if you ask me.
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
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EA CO AS
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 8:46 am

Why aren't CO's 772s equipped with the crew rest facilities that Boeing offers?
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
CO767FA
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 8:52 am

Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 11):
Why aren't CO's 772s equipped with the crew rest facilities that Boeing offers?

The company wanted to use after market vendors, but they didn't meet the FAA standards for safety. The company promised to install them after they were FAA approved, but then decided the cost was to great.
 
CLEfan
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 9:02 am

Some details leaking out: http://yahoo.reuters.com/financeQuot...05-12-08_23-39-15_n08149855_newsml

"The four-year tentative deal preserves the pay scale for current flight attendants, boosts the top base pay rate to $50 an hour and includes a no-furlough clause, the union said."
 
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EA CO AS
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 9:29 am

Quoting CO767FA (Reply 12):
Quoting EA CO AS (Reply 11):
Why aren't CO's 772s equipped with the crew rest facilities that Boeing offers?

The company wanted to use after market vendors, but they didn't meet the FAA standards for safety. The company promised to install them after they were FAA approved, but then decided the cost was to great

I've not seen any cost estimates, but I'd have to imagine that installing proper crew rest facilities would be less expensive in the long run than using BusinessFirst or even main cabin seats that could have been used for revenue-generating customers.

Unless the weight penalty was too much, that is. I suppose that's a possibility as well.
"In this present crisis, government is not the solution to our problem - government IS the problem." - Ronald Reagan

Comments made here are my own and are not intended to represent the official position of Alaska Air Group
 
RAMPRAT980
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 9:47 am

Membership still has to vote on the offer. Lets see if the ratify or blow out the contract. Choose wisely F/A's
With gun control there can be no democracy.. With gun control there can be no Freedom
 
FutureFO
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 9:54 am

RampRat,


Exactly the pont I was going to make. It is now up to the members to vote on the TA, they are the ones ultimately responsible for their futures.


Sean from MCO and IND
I Don't know where I am anymore
 
CO767FA
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 9:58 am

Quoting RAMPRAT980 (Reply 15):
Choose wisely F/A's

We did with the last T/A and I'm sure we will again.
 
Cory6188
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 10:07 am

Quoting CO767FA (Reply 17):
We did with the last T/A and I'm sure we will again.

Does that mean that you're automatically not in favor of it?

Or does it mean that you're going to evaluate it to see if its fair and then vote?
 
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jedward
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 1:53 pm

Quoting CO767FA (Reply 12):
The company wanted to use after market vendors, but they didn't meet the FAA standards for safety. The company promised to install them after they were FAA approved, but then decided the cost was to great.

Did you happen to see if there has been any update on crew rest in the new TA? As it seems to me, from my plush armchair, the crew rests would be a true win-win; crew gets better accommodations and CO has four more J seats for to sell.

Regardless, best of luck to you CO767FA as well as your fellow FAs  Smile
As Christ died to make men holy, let men die to make us rich. --S.C.
 
SJU767
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 9:48 pm

Well something is not right with this. In the first two dep out of SJU F/A's were all standing in the front galley and were been very rude and uncooperative with the agnts. They were just very, very picky with carry on bags, catering etc. I think Its going to be a bad week for all of us. This F/A's are typically very nice to us and very familiar with the station as the normally do this route..
 
ARGinLON
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Fri Dec 09, 2005 10:21 pm

Quoting JEdward (Reply 19):
Did you happen to see if there has been any update on crew rest in the new TA? As it seems to me, from my plush armchair, the crew rests would be a true win-win; crew gets better accommodations and CO has four more J seats for to sell.

As you said, I believe this issue was sorted in this way. I am sure CO management wanted to get those four seats one way or the other...
 
ramerinianair
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Sat Dec 10, 2005 3:06 am

Luv2Fly,
Why shouldn't the Pilots get a BF seat? You said that the FA are "accually working the entire flight" - Two things - 1. The pilots aren't? They are SAFELY flying your A$$ to the destination, don't you want a well rested professional at the controls? and 2. It depends on what airline you are talking about, about half the time (if not more) CO FA are sitting on their butts in the galley.
CO should put BF seats behing the curtain instead of Y seats. The 767s and 77s no longer do domestic runs, they should change those seats now! Adding 4 BF seats instead of 9 Y seats would allow the same amount of people to rest in better seats. The seats would be close but, they would sell a hell of a lot more revenue.
SR
W N = my Worst Nightmare!!!!!
 
luv2fly
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Sat Dec 10, 2005 3:28 am

Quoting Ramerinianair (Reply 22):
Luv2Fly,
Why shouldn't the Pilots get a BF seat? You said that the FA are "accually working the entire flight" - Two things - 1. The pilots aren't? They are SAFELY flying your A$$ to the destination, don't you want a well rested professional at the controls? and 2. It depends on what airline you are talking about, about half the time (if not more) CO FA are sitting on their butts in the galley.

What I am saying, as you read it wrong! Both deserve a BF seat! The pilots are not running up and down the aisle serving passengers or picking up and dropping off requested items. They the FA's are actually moving around and working.

don't you want a well rested professional at the controls? Yes they are at the controls, sitting down for the whole flight. What I do not want them to do behind the controls, is fall asleep!
You can cut the irony with a knife
 
slider
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Sat Dec 10, 2005 3:31 am

Quoting CO767FA (Reply 17):
We did with the last T/A and I'm sure we will again.

If your concern is displeasure with the IAM, then you need to vote for this TA, then change unions.

There won't be a better deal. Period. And you're barking up the wrong tree if you think there will be.
 
EWRATC
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Sat Dec 10, 2005 3:33 am

Quoting Ramerinianair (Reply 22):
Why shouldn't the Pilots get a BF seat?

Because the scab infested pilot ranks of continental had to vote their pay reductions into effect or they could lose their jobs. If that happened it would be hard to get a job as a scab. Since your are so smart and are studying airline management you would know that. You would also know that CO's 777's have pilot bunks. The fa's get 4 bf seats on flights blocked over 8 hrs. As far as the FA's sitting on their a$$ in the galley you try working a 14hr flight and see if you can stand the whole flight. I was a pilot and I have sat on my ass in the cockpit for hrs and I did not need a first class seat. Sleeping in my own seat was good enough. But you are studying airline mgt you already knew that. Keep up the good work with your management ideas you posted you will be a ceo in no time.

Quoting Ramerinianair (Reply 22):
CO should put BF seats behing the curtain instead of Y seats. The 767s and 77s no longer do domestic runs, they should change those seats now! Adding 4 BF seats instead of 9 Y seats would allow the same amount of people to rest in better seats. The seats would be close but, they would sell a hell of a lot more revenue.
Contact Departure
 
calpilot
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Sat Dec 10, 2005 3:45 am

Just for the record, of the 5200 pilots at CO, there are only around 400 left that crossed the picket line in '83.

How many SCABS are left in ATC, that crossed, and how much have they infested the tower cabs in the USA?
 
CO767FA
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Sat Dec 10, 2005 4:36 am

Quoting Slider (Reply 24):
If your concern is displeasure with the IAM, then you need to vote for this TA, then change unions.

There won't be a better deal. Period. And you're barking up the wrong tree if you think there will be.

It amazes me how my comments are instantly taken by you to mean that I will be voting "no". I will vote based on the merits of the contract and your concerns are of no consequence in my decision.

Do you recall the "threats" the company made to all employees prior to the f/a's voting down the last T/A? If so, learn from that venture (your airline management); we are strong enough to know when we are being hood winked (by either the company or union) and while some will make bad decisions regarding the new T/A, many more will independently read, evaluate and vote according to what makes sense for them.

Quoting Cory6188 (Reply 18):
Does that mean that you're automatically not in favor of it?

Or does it mean that you're going to evaluate it to see if its fair and then vote?

Cory6188, read the above statement and I think it will be clear as to how I will decide to vote.
 
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mbm3
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Sat Dec 10, 2005 5:58 am

Quoting EWRATC (Reply 25):
You would also know that CO's 777's have pilot bunks.

If you are referring to Overhead Crew Rest, then I believe you are incorrect. IIRC CO has not retrofitted any of their 777s with this feature and thus the need to use BF seats.
Let Me Tell You, Landing A 772ER Is Harder Than It Looks!
 
ARGinLON
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Sat Dec 10, 2005 6:08 am

So what are the FAs giving to the company then? Salaries, pensions, profit sharing... all remain the same. So...what did CO get from the FAs?

(I wonder how annoyed Airport staff may feel right now..)
 
9844
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Sat Dec 10, 2005 11:55 am

Ya sounds like the company caved in............. lesson learned from this 21 year employee.


All you mechanics and related. This MEANS THAT AIR MIC WILL NOT TAKE ANY PAY CUTS AND JUST FOR THE RECORD. A TOPPED OUT WRENCH IN GUAM AND THE NWA CAL SCABS IN SAIPAN MAKE $35 AN HOUR TACK ON .85 CENTS FOR THEIR IBT PENSION {PAID BY THE COMPANY} THAT $35.85 AN HOUR. LETS ALSO NOT FORGET THAT THEIR MED COSTS THEM ALMOST HALF OF WHAT WE PAY $160 A MONTH INCLUDES DENTAL.....

The flt attendants taught me a thing or two
 
globaldude
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Sat Dec 10, 2005 12:05 pm

The only flights that FA's get BF seats are those that are blocked over 8 hrs AND on the 777 ( 757/767 have 3/4 coach seats)

ALL 777 in CAL fleet have PILOT CREW BUNKS

The FA's signed an agreement with the company many years ago, in the last contract, to have FA bunks installed, they never were, THAT is why the BF seats on the 777 were offered to the FA's, because of the contract violation.

IRO pilots on 777, while deadheading are given a coach seat, but are first to bumped into an open BF seat. On 757/767 coach seats are blocked for pilot crew rest just as they are for FA's, HOWEVER a seat will be awarded to pilot in BF before upgrades if available for pilot crew rest. FA's are NEVER allowed BF seats on any a/c other than 777.
 
9844
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Sat Dec 10, 2005 12:09 pm

Ive only seen the FA in BF from NRT to EWR and IAH. None going through GUM HNL IAH....In fact they use the last row in the back.


my two cents
 
supa7E7
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Sat Dec 10, 2005 12:13 pm

Using 2 or 3 BF seats for crew is horribly stupid. If BF is full 30% of the time, that's an average of 1 lost BF customer per flight (or so) or about $3000 one-way. That much money could pay ALL the FAs salaries and part of the cockpit crew as well.

There is a reason why that's an extremely rare practice... probably best not to poop on the airline's prime revenue generator.
"Who's to say spaceships aren't fine art?" - Phil Lesh
 
CO767FA
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Mon Dec 12, 2005 8:28 am

Quoting Supa7E7 (Reply 33):
Using 2 or 3 BF seats for crew is horribly stupid. If BF is full 30% of the time, that's an average of 1 lost BF customer per flight (or so) or about $3000 one-way. That much money could pay ALL the FAs salaries and part of the cockpit crew as well.

There is a reason why that's an extremely rare practice... probably best not to poop on the airline's prime revenue generator.

We are currently working under a contract that expired nearly 1 year ago and that was in effect for 4 years. Originally, the company and union agreed to having 3rd market crew bunks installed, but when they didn't pass the FAA certification, the company and union agreed to the present policy of 4 BF seats.

One of the reasons I voted against the last T/A was due to the crew rest issue. This T/A appears to address those concerns in a satisfactory manner, but until I see the fine print, I'll reserve any further comment on the BF seat issue.
 
RAMPRAT980
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RE: CO FA's Reach New Contract

Wed Dec 14, 2005 1:26 am

Quoting ARGinLON (Reply 29):
So what are the FAs giving to the company then? Salaries, pensions, profit sharing... all remain the same. So...what did CO get from the FAs?

(I wonder how annoyed Airport staff may feel right now..)

I, for one, am happy for the F/A's. Stood their ground. However topping out at 50 per hour won't sit well with other work groups. ie: If the F/A's get that much then I am worth 2x that..yada yada yada. I could see the IAM/TWU using their propaganda machine(s) to try to get CO ramp workers believing they could get a contract the same as the F/A's got/offered.
With gun control there can be no democracy.. With gun control there can be no Freedom